frys rejectd me cuz my shoulderlength hair is unprofessional

jacktheripper994465221 · February 2006

ok first off. i applied at frys. got a call back, they didnt leave a name or store nothing. they left their number. so i had to go online and double check the # and it matched frys

i walked into frys, looked around and said "oh well these other guys have pretty long hair and they look like crap, i have a much better chance at getting hired"

so after waiting about 30 minutes for my interview, the first words out of the ladies mouth is "i have to tell you someone"...pauses "you can't work here with that hair , you have to cut it and make it look professional"

i go uh... "what about the other guys"

dumb interview lady.. "oh, they have long hair but they make it look professional"

so i go OK fine, ill cut it just to shut her up.

she says alright what position do you want?

at this point, i feel like telling her off and walking out the door knowing its on my application so i say "pc tech" and she replies with "let me walk over to the tech manager"...

another 10 minutes later... "oh sorry we don't have any positions , would you like to work as a cashier?"
----

WHAT KINDA BS is that?? i get insulted for COMBINING my barely sholder length hair, while other guys there have dreads and afros?

i just finish passing my A+ ..im all hyped to get a tech job

and she has the guts to ask me to work for minimum wage as a cashier?

FRYS COMPUSA AND BEST BUY ARE A JOKE.

certificationjourney [ban · February 2006

That sucks. You're not missing on anything special since these retail tech jobs suck anyway.

OpenSource · February 2006

At least you've gotten a response... I've yet to get a response from anyone. Anytime I try to talk to someone in the store or via e-mail/phone, I receive no help because everything is electronic and no one has any idea about who is applying for what or when or where or know anything the person applying.

Anyway... I had a similar experience a few months back with my single lone interview since I moved in October. That was with FedEx, and I left their interview because they want me to shave my clean groomed goatee, yet they will allow jewelry, earings and a mustache without issue... Corporate hypocriscy and sheer BS is absurd these days...

- Joey

kalebksp · February 2006

Well, I think Fry's is very lucky they didn't hire you. Company's have made me angry before too, and for real reasons, not your absurd perceived insults. Luckily, I, like many other people, have the ability to remain professional when interacting with businesses.

Also, A+ is an entry level cert, and you probably won't make much more than minimum wage, especially without on the job experience. My last job I started out at minimum wage processing fish, because I had no experience, but once they realised that I could be more valuable to the company working in IT I was moved and given a good raise.

keatron · February 2006

If I might I'll throw in a word of advice. And please don't take this as a slam or an insult.

First of most successful companies are successful because they have either created or duplicated a formula/system. It is their system not yours. I own a company and professionalism is something that has to be maintained without question. I will point however that professionalism to some extent depends on the eyes of the beholder. In your case these eyes belonged to the person you were asking to hire you (because you applied for the job, they didn't randomly call you up). In some cases you might be able to write a letter to someone higher up the chain of command. But most likely, you don't have a leg to stand on. You basically just called out half of that specific market segement (Frys, CompUSA, and Bestbuy), which is certainly not a good way to start in the industry. I personally would never discriminate against a person based on just their hair style (3 of my guys have below shoulder hair). Also, while I sincerely congratulate you on obtaining your A+ it certainly doesn't automatically mean you'll get a job. You've truely made a good start by taking the steps to obtain the certification, but my advice would be to simply tone it down a bit and humble yourself a little more.

Good luck and best wishes.

Keatron

jim_stasz · February 2006

keatron wrote:

If I might I'll throw in a word of advice. And please don't take this as a slam or an insult.....
Keatron

Well said. I'd like to also add to that. I would take a trainable monkey with a great attitude than the smartest tech in the world with a chip on their shoulder. No matter what you do/say the attitude shows through.

The world isn't fair. The rules aren't fair. Would you have been against getting a haircut if it meant getting the job? Is yes, you would have been better saying something like, "May I schedule now some of the Tech Managers time for after I get a haircut?" rather than, "What about those other guy..." Maybe those other guys had haircuts for their interviews and then grew it back out after they got hired?

fondue · February 2006

I echo what Keatron wrote with one more bit of information. Prep yourself for hard/dumb questions prior to the interview. Based on your comments regarding hair length you should have been prepared to answer the question instead of deflecting the question to others.

"i have to tell you someone"...pauses "you can't work here with that hair , you have to cut it and make it look professional"

i go uh... "what about the other guys"

dumb interview lady.. "oh, they have long hair but they make it look professional"

Instead of "what about the other guys" your response could have been, "I will comply with all company rules and policies regarding hygiene".

The hiring person must likely sees the following happening.

Mgr. - "Hey burzumaske, can you help fix that PC?"
burzumaske - "What about the other guys, why don't they?"

jmc724 · February 2006

"you can't work here with that hair , you have to cut it and make it look professional" ---->>> Get a hair cut, shape up or shape out

Uncle Sam wants you....

jacktheripper994465221 · February 2006

screw that place , they can keep their professional people that just walk around and give no customer service.

i already have an interview set up with COMPUCOM, and they are willing to pay for my CERTS.... and the classes to prepare for the certs...

and 75% college tuition..

so why bother with fry's? its just as bad as any other retail store, certified or not.

btw, compucom didn't give a rats a$$ about my hair.

TeKniques · February 2006

Personally I think long hair on guys in the work place that deals with the public face to face does look unprofessional in some ways. Nothing grosses me out more when I walk into a Dennys or an IHOP and I see a guy cooking with his hair in some net.

Back when I just got out of high school I had earings and an eyebrow ring and employers told me flat out that I couldn't wear them because it looked unprofessional. So instead of getting all mad and being an idiot, I took them out and have never put them back in.

woodworm · February 2006

I'm amazed that they can be so discriminating in the US actually (I assume your in the US!). Although companies are like that in the UK if they actually told you that they wouldn't employ you because of your hairstyle they would be in court so quick it's unbelievable (hence why they would find another legal excuse to not employ you!) - and rightfully so, telling someone they can't have a job because of a hairstyle is so petty anyway - and in no way professional.

You should only be judged on your ability to do your job, that includes your technical skills as well as your attitude, etc.

kalebksp · February 2006

woodworm, I completely disagree, while I don't necessarily think long hair is unprofessional, I do believe companies should have the right to employ or not employ whoever they want. (Unless it's just bigotry.)

If an employer had an interview with a person that was very good in their field and had an okay attitude, but never took a shower. That prospective empolyee would fit your standards, yet should a company have to employee someone that smells like BO all day?

Perhaps not the most eloquent example, but I hope it gets the point across.

By the way, I'm not equating long hair with bad hygiene.

keatron · February 2006

woodworm wrote:

You should only be judged on your ability to do your job, that includes your technical skills as well as your attitude, etc.

Be careful with such comments. I don't judge people "only" on their ability to do the job, I also base it off how they fit into the system, and their potential for growth. I don't hire people who are looking to stay in the same position and not grow/advance. In my business we talk to and meet with mostly tenured CIO's and most of these people tend to be anywhere from 30 to 50 and are usually somewhat reserved and conservative. Most of them are very clean cut and expect the same from us as consultants. In the end it doesn't matter about how you think your hair doesn't matter. What matters is what will most of my clients think? And also keep in mind that what YOU think your abilities are might not always match up with what the person interviewing thinks your abilities are. For the most part you have to establish a comfortable communication channel to get the conversation going in a direction to allow you to highlight and point out some of your skills and maybe even lead up to the interviewer asking you questions to test your skills. But my friend you never even made it to that point. It doesn't matter if you work for Frys or Compucom. Eventually you still might face the same thorn again. Imagine that the regional VP of Compucom is visiting your store with President of Compucoms biggest client. The client sees you and makes a comment to the Compucom VP about your hair and your attitude. What do you think the end result will be? Probably a message coming down through the chain telling you to cut your hair. Yes, I know it sounds petty. One day when you're a billionare, you can dress how you want, do what you want, and project any image you want. But if you work for me and my company there's a certain image I want projected to everyone who interacts with one of my employees. If you can't be a key part in that effort, then keep steppin.

jim_stasz · February 2006

burzumaske91 wrote:

screw that place.....btw, compucom didn't give a rats a$$ about my hair.

Someone give me the monkey with the good attitude because this has nothing to do with long hair.

eurotrash · February 2006

seriously, what is more important to you: long hair or a job?

i have long hair and piercings but i fully expect to have to put on a more 'professional' look once i start looking for a job in IT.

JDMurray · February 2006

woodworm wrote:

I'm amazed that they can be so discriminating in the US actually

The Fry's Electronics in Southern California seems to discriminate in favor of hiring very attractive Asian, Hispanic, and Indian women. I realize that most of employees are minorities and school kids because Fry's doesn't pay very well, but there is definitely a bias towards hiring very nice looking young women at the Fry's near me (one of their business success secrets?). I've never noticed the hair length of the male employees, but I've never seen anyone who looked unprofessional (although I have been treated unprofessionally). Still, I usually buy my hard/software from NewEgg.com.

JASON123 · February 2006

I just wanted to throw in my 2 cents in. I think many here are making a bold assumption that she looked unprofessional, just because she has shoulder length hair. Maybe she did look unprofessional, but there is a chance that she was well cut and dressed. If we are talking about acting unprofessionally, we could mention Fry's. First, they should have mentioned their company name, the manager's name, and their telephone number. It is not asking much for a manager or employee to have enough pride to leave their company name. Next, she shouldn't have to wait 30 minutes for a interview just to be told immediately that she needs to cut her hair, especially since it seems that it is a double standard with the men. I have rarely seen a man with long hair look professional. Also, I have never seen a man with dread locks look professional. The manager could have shown some couth and mention later that hygiene is a concern for them. Also, as a manager deciding to interview her, she should have known what positions are open. Finally, it shouldn't take the manager ten minutes to find out if there are any pc tech positions open. I understand that companies have a right to say what they want to say, but they should exercise judgement. The manager clearly didn’t get it either, on the part that most, not all, people going for tech positions will not take the cashier job if no tech positions are open. You wouldn’t assume that a person applying for a managerial position there would take a cashier job. Unfortunately, things like this do happen burzumaske91. I had an incident, in which a human resource manager showed interest in hiring me for my college break. I called and left a message and also emailed her my resume, which she told me earlier to do. After a couple of days of getting no reply, I left a follow up message. She then emailed me back, but when I called her up to mention my thankfulness and interest in the position, things changed. She told me that she noticed I have been calling and if I wanted to get a hold of a manager to just leave a message. The fact is that I did leave a message, but she never called at one point for a week. Later, she found out that I knew the CEO personally, and very well. Even after things changed and she found out that I did know the CEO, I decided not to take a job with that company. Things sometimes have a way of turning around. Hold in there burzumaske91. Finally, everyone gets frustrated and needs to blow off steam. I'm sure most of you have gotten frustrated and angry because of an interview gone bad and ended up blowing off steam to someone about how awful it was. That doesn’t make you any less professional. That is what burzumaske91 is doing, and this forum should be a safe place where people can vent some of their frustration.

kalebksp · February 2006

I'm curious if you even read what people are saying here. First off, I'm pretty sure that burzumaske91 is a he, not a she. If your reference to hygiene is because of my post, that was an example and had nothing to do with burzumaske91. I'm going to skip through most of the other stuff that you said because what I can decern it's a bunch of nonsense. Finally, this is a professional forum for people that want to get and dispense advice on technology certifications, not a "whine about things to make myself feel better" forum.

JDMurray · February 2006

JASON123 wrote:

I have rarely seen a man with long hair look professional. Also, I have never seen a man with dread locks look professional.

Ouch!

Please look at my old O'Reilly home page and tell me if I look professional or not way back in 1998 with my long hair a dreadlock in my beard. I associated with many "professional" people when I looked like this and never received any complaints.

http://www.oreilly.com/www/centers/gff/jdm/index.htm

keatron · February 2006

Umm. How many of those people were you being interviewed by for a position within the company?

jacktheripper994465221 · February 2006

OK first of all ...umm.im a guy. not a chick?
i comb my hair nicely thanks. i am clean shaved.
i had my hair buzzed for the past 7 years.. im GLAD i actually get to enjoy my hair now. if fry's doesnt want to give me a chance.. I could seriously careless. i just wanted to post my hilarious experience.

and by the way i agree with the southern california fry's discrimination

not only do they hire 500+lb people who look like yokozuna, but they have atleast 90% + asian, indian, and mexican staff.

yet you go into best buy and compusa, and they are all white

whatever guys, i should have never applied at a retail job anyways.

retail companies don't give a damn if you can fix a computer or not, they just care if you can overcharge people and sell stuff. my tech skills are better off at a comany who actually appreciates my A+ and repair skills, and will help me progress.

Webmaster · February 2006

jdmurray wrote:

Please look at my old O'Reilly home page and tell me if I look professional or not way back in 1998 with my long hair a dreadlock in my beard.

http://www.oreilly.com/www/centers/gff/jdm/index.htm

Maybe we should turn this into a poll.

jacktheripper994465221 · February 2006

watching an Iron Maiden DVD today inspired me to create a time machine and go back to the 1980s and look for a job. maybe back than id be 'professional'.

but than again. A+ didn't exist.

oh by the way
http://www.oreilly.com/www/centers/gff/jdm/index.htm

that picture reminds me of Phil from Pantera during "reinventing the steel" era

JDMurray · February 2006

Webmaster wrote:

jdmurray wrote:

Please look at my old O'Reilly home page and tell me if I look professional or not way back in 1998 with my long hair a dreadlock in my beard.

http://www.oreilly.com/www/centers/gff/jdm/index.htm

Maybe we should turn this into a poll.

Oh, ha ha.

JDMurray · February 2006

burzumaske91 wrote:

that picture reminds me of Phil from Pantera during "reinventing the steel" era

No, Phil never smiles.

http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1453044/20020325/story.jhtml
http://www.nndb.com/people/623/000026545/

TheShadow · February 2006

jdmurray wrote:

JASON123 wrote:

I have rarely seen a man with long hair look professional. Also, I have never seen a man with dread locks look professional.

Ouch!

Please look at my old O'Reilly home page and tell me if I look professional or not way back in 1998 with my long hair a dreadlock in my beard. I associated with many "professional" people when I looked like this and never received any complaints.

http://www.oreilly.com/www/centers/gff/jdm/index.htm

Most impressive JD were you a stunt double for zz top. Since you are in OC I guess that must be the Anaheim Frys that you are talking about. I normally go into the Industry one but your comments are still valid. By the way you realize that since you are a software developer none of this counts. Lots of people don't trust short hair and clean shaven programmers; one or the other but not both.

I guess many forget gates original crew of photo or Jobs and Woz etc.

Webmaster · February 2006

Definitely wouldn't hire Phil, well maybe as a security guard during the night, when nobody should see him anyway.

Anyway, if you are applying for a job in which you will have direct contact with customers for example, the dresscode and desired appearance is often more strict than if you are working in the back. A suit and a tie can make a lot of difference, regardless of your hair length. But in the end it's the employer who decides, and even if they won't tell it as bluntly as above, they still can reject you solely for the long hair. I guess you just have to ask yourself if it is worth it.

Reminds me of a similar situation I had myself:

www.techexams.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=8451

Paperchaser · February 2006

So you passed huh. Certified!!!! buyeah!! alright man just hang in there youll get a job soon I know it. The fact of the matter is 9 out of ten jobs expect you to portray some time of professional image. Even a fast food place expects this while paying at minimum wage. I know of a couple driving tech jobs in monster.com where you got a company car and all you do is drive to a customers place and fix the problem. It starts at about 15 dollars and hour and they pay for gas. All you got to do is wear a white collar shirt and tie. All right burzu certified!!! late and howz your beavis face!!

JDMurray · February 2006

TheShadow wrote:

Since you are in OC I guess that must be the Anaheim Frys that you are talking about.

Fountain Valley, actually, near the headquarters for D-link and Kingston Technologies. That's probably the one Paperchaser goes to as well.

strauchr · February 2006

Can you post a photo of how your hair looks? Long hair can be professional, but maybe yours looked rough or unsightly. And its ok to say you think your hair looks ok but maybe it really doesn't (broken mirror maybe

)

Anyhow I do understand what your going through because I once had long hair back in the 90's and felt that I should be able to have long hair if I want. However you do realise soon that employers have the choice to hire you or not also so why limit your opportunities?

I always thought it was unfair how its acceptable for women to have long hair but for men its considered unprofessional no matter how well groomed it is. Kinda like men having to wear suits and ties while women wear pretty much whatever they want.

So I'd say have a think about it. Don't be a sell out and cut your for a job if you really want to keep you hair but then think of opportunities you might miss out on. And remember, its not just a company interviewing you, you are also interviewing them. Its fine for people to say get any job you can but if you can hold out do it, get the right one that fits you. You will be much happier.

And that has got to seriously suck being offered a cashier job. I consider that an insult not matter how inexperienced you are!

jacktheripper994465221 · February 2006

im trying to get out of the hell hole drug store i work at doing cashier, obtaining my A+ was like... the key to the gate.

yes i did take it as an insult when she offered me a cashier job, knowing its minimum wage.

no i don't have any pictures of myself.

i could careless about fry's now, there are better oppurtunities out there.

frys rejectd me cuz my shoulderlength hair is unprofessional

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