To those of you with employers that pay for your training/schooling/certification....

Squished

.....all I have to say is take advantage of every last dollar of it until the day you leave. Working 8 years at a non profit has taught me numerous life experiences that I'll have forever to share as stories at an interview, but having a training budget of $0 year after year has been detrimental to my professional development as an IT Professional. Now before you comment I could have spent my own money on myself, my wife is a public school teacher and me working at a non-profit doesn't exactly mean the floodgates of money are coming in this house. With a 7 month old at home it's especially tight. I convinced my employer to give me $2000 towards training/certification so I'm trying to get as much done as possible just to give me a baseline then I'll supplement myself afterward after I land a new job.

As a hiring manager, those of you that call certain certifications a waste of time or no value, you couldn't be more wrong. Any investment in yourself stands out on a resume, especially if they are up to date.

that is all!

GirlyGirl

Squished wrote: »

.....all I have to say is take advantage of every last dollar of it until the day you leave. Working 8 years at a non profit has taught me numerous life experiences that I'll have forever to share as stories at an interview, but having a training budget of $0 year after year has been detrimental to my professional development as an IT Professional. Now before you comment I could have spent my own money on myself, my wife is a public school teacher and me working at a non-profit doesn't exactly mean the floodgates of money are coming in this house. With a 7 month old at home it's especially tight. I convinced my employer to give me $2000 towards training/certification so I'm trying to get as much done as possible just to give me a baseline then I'll supplement myself afterward after I land a new job.

As a hiring manager, those of you that call certain certifications a waste of time or no value, you couldn't be more wrong. Any investment in yourself stands out on a resume, especially if they are up to date.

that is all!

I am kinda going through something like that right now. Just the opposite kinda.

As we speak, if I left my employer today I would owe them over 11k.

The catch is, with most employers if you are reimbursed for educational benefits or paid educational benefits up front you have obligations. Those obligations tend to be a service to the employer. My service is 1 year. Not 1 year from the point I press play on OnDemand or 1 year from the day I take a certification test. It is 1 year from the point the money hits my bank account. No, it is not 1 calendar year either. Here is an example:

1. Deposit hits 2/26/2018. I am obligated to stay until 2/26/2019.

2. Deposit hits 5/14/2018. I am obligated to stay until 5/14/2019.

4. Deposit hits 7/2/2018. I am obligated to stay until 7/2/2019.

It's a vicious cycle that's really hard to get out of. It's like you are stuck at the company forever. Truth be told, I have an account setup for when I leave. I have money set aside for the time in which I will possibly leave. I look at every training and class I have taken as professional development. I look at a class like, would I pay for it out of my pocket? Does it have a return of investment? What's the hits on the job boards? If those answers don't come back promising I don't have the company pay for it. Why? Because I'll end up paying for it when/if I leave. So, not having education reimbursement is a double edged sword. You have to take the good with the bad. It is only a great situation if you plan on doing several years with the company. In IT, with experience, certifications, education, and training it's hard to stay with a company several years. It's always going to be opportunities for more money. ...


So, look at it from someone in my shoes. If I left today I'd owe my company over 11k. If I get fired I owe over 11k. No matter how you cut the cake the company is winning.

Squished

GirlyGirl wrote: »

I am kinda going through something like that right now. Just the opposite kinda.

As we speak, if I left my employer today I would owe them over 11k.

The catch is, with most employers if you are reimbursed for educational benefits or paid educational benefits up front you have obligations. Those obligations tend to be a service to the employer. My service is 1 year. Not 1 year from the point I press play on OnDemand or 1 year from the day I take a certification test. It is 1 year from the point the money hits my bank account. No, it is not 1 calendar year either. Here is an example:

1. Deposit hits 2/26/2018. I am obligated to stay until 2/26/2019.

2. Deposit hits 5/14/2018. I am obligated to stay until 5/14/2019.

4. Deposit hits 7/2/2018. I am obligated to stay until 7/2/2019.

It's a vicious cycle that's really hard to get out of. It's like you are stuck at the company forever. Truth be told, I have an account setup for when I leave. I have money set aside for the time in which I will possibly leave. I look at every training and class I have taken as professional development. I look at a class like, would I pay for it out of my pocket? Does it have a return of investment? What's the hits on the job boards? If those answers don't come back promising I don't have the company pay for it. Why? Because I'll end up paying for it when/if I leave. So, not having education reimbursement is a double edged sword. You have to take the good with the bad. It is only a great situation if you plan on doing several years with the company. In IT, with experience, certifications, education, and training it's hard to stay with a company several years. It's always going to be opportunities for more money. ...


So, look at it from someone in my shoes. If I left today I'd owe my company over 11k. If I get fired I owe over 11k. No matter how you cut the cake the company is winning.

The way I would look at that......is the 11k you owe worth more or less than what you could you make at your next job with those certifications and training? As long as the number is less, YOU win.

In a situation like mine with a $0 budget, I lose every time. I end up being a slave to the employer because I'm worthless elsewhere.

It's certainly a tough cycle.

Squished

Also, the fact you can get 11k in the hole is impressive! I would like even $2,500 a year to continue my education. My next role I'm certainly negotiating it right into the package.

SteveLavoie

Well, in my company, if my employer pay for a major training(>1000$), he require 3 years of service. He split the value of all money injected into the training (salary, expense, training tuition etc.) by 36, and if you leave before, you owe him the balance. In my case, I had many training, and a few years ago, I was the end of all my training debt, I got offered another training (surely a way to ensure I would stay), but I declined. It was a red alarm for him, that I could jump ship and the start of a real nice discussion

Squished

SteveLavoie wrote: »

Well, in my company, if my employer pay for a major training(>1000$), he require 3 years of service. He split the value of all money injected into the training (salary, expense, training tuition etc.) by 36, and if you leave before, you owe him the balance. In my case, I had many training, and a few years ago, I was the end of all my training debt, I got offered another training (surely a way to ensure I would stay), but I declined. It was a red alarm for him, that I could jump ship and the start of a real nice discussion

Hah! too funny

UnixGuy

I've been in both situation, definitely choose a company that pays for training ( I ask companies in the interview if they pay for training and if so, what kind of training they pay for)

Luckily my last few employers didn't expect you to stay when they pay for training but very few actually paid for SANS so...I still pay for some of my training..If I want to learn something I will learn it, nothing stops me

Cisco Inferno

sorry about that, but what prevented you from buying a used book for $15?

E Double U

In the beginning of my career I paid for everything out of the pocket which put a dent in my savings. For the past few years I've had employers that put up money for training, books, and exams so I have taken advantage of every last cent and will continue to do so.

Squished

Cisco Inferno wrote: »

sorry about that, but what prevented you from buying a used book for $15?

Absolutely nothing at all and I have many books. Much of my higher level IT skills are self taught, uncertified skills acquired from books and Google. When the exams are hundreds of dollars a piece and the lab trainings are equally expensive, It becomes cost-prohibitive.

Kinet1c

Squished wrote: »

Absolutely nothing at all and I have many books. Much of my higher level IT skills are self taught, uncertified skills acquired from books and Google. When the exams are hundreds of dollars a piece and the lab trainings are equally expensive, It becomes cost-prohibitive.

It's an investment in your career.

Danielm7

SteveLavoie wrote: »

Well, in my company, if my employer pay for a major training(>1000$), he require 3 years of service. He split the value of all money injected into the training (salary, expense, training tuition etc.) by 36, and if you leave before, you owe him the balance. In my case, I had many training, and a few years ago, I was the end of all my training debt, I got offered another training (surely a way to ensure I would stay), but I declined. It was a red alarm for him, that I could jump ship and the start of a real nice discussion

Three years is a crazy amount of commitment for that. At my workplace, tuition reimbursement is paid at a max of 5250 a year, and you owe for a year after that. Training isn't as frequent as some but there isn't a payback schedule. If you can talk them into a SANS class, then you can leave a week after you passed the cert and be free and clear.

I work with a lot of people who have no degree at all, or maybe just an AS from tech school, who have been here for 6+ years and have always been afraid to take advantage of the tuition reimbursement for fear they'd be tied to the company for a few years.

As for the OP, I get funding issues, but not everything costs thousands of dollars. No idea what they do in IT but even something like an MCSA or CCNA can be budgeted for over a period of a few months for a couple hundred dollars total. Maybe I'm just a little salty over this after hearing a guy at a party over the weekend complain that he's forever trapped at his job because his company won't give him 5K a year for IT training.

Squished

Danielm7 wrote: »

Three years is a crazy amount of commitment for that. At my workplace, tuition reimbursement is paid at a max of 5250 a year, and you owe for a year after that. Training isn't as frequent as some but there isn't a payback schedule. If you can talk them into a SANS class, then you can leave a week after you passed the cert and be free and clear.

I work with a lot of people who have no degree at all, or maybe just an AS from tech school, who have been here for 6+ years and have always been afraid to take advantage of the tuition reimbursement for fear they'd be tied to the company for a few years.

As for the OP, I get funding issues, but not everything costs thousands of dollars. No idea what they do in IT but even something like an MCSA or CCNA can be budgeted for over a period of a few months for a couple hundred dollars total. Maybe I'm just a little salty over this after hearing a guy at a party over the weekend complain that he's forever trapped at his job because his company won't give him 5K a year for IT training.

100% agree. Training classes unfortunately are expensive. I do learn by reading/seeing on my own, but sometimes it's nice to have a structured class to follow along with and ask questions during. Those are expensive. Trust me, I know more than anyone there is no excuse for the situation I'm in at the moment and working to dig myself out of. I've got a long road ahead of me to make up time, but I'll do the best I can as I can, especially with a 7 month old in the house.

All I'm trying to say, in general, is that if your employer offers training or tuition reimbursement and you aren't taking advantage of it each year, you're crazy! Even if it's money to attend a conference or something related to your career, totally worth it. As I look around prospective new employers, I'm seeing it offered less and less as part of the benefits packages I've been looking at. Certainly going to be a negotiating point on the next offer.

McxRisley

So I don't see companys giving you money with an obligation to stay for an extra year or so as them winning. From a financial perspective, you are the one who is winning. Think about it, they just fronted you money with 0% interest and if you stay for the agreed upon amount of time, you owe them NOTHING. So you essentially are getting a FREE loan, this type of deal would make bankers have a stroke.

I have been on both sides of the spectrum, paying out of pocket for training and having my employer pay for my training. It's never fun to have to pay back a large sum of money but if its an investment in yourself and it helps you make that next step towards your goal, then it is worth every penny.

Squished

McxRisley wrote: »

So I don't see companys giving you money with an obligation to stay for an extra year or so as them winning. From a financial perspective, you are the one who is winning. Think about it, they just fronted you money with 0% interest and if you stay for the agreed upon amount of time, you owe them NOTHING. So you essentially are getting a FREE loan, this type of deal would make bankers have a stroke.

I have been on both sides of the spectrum, paying out of pocket for training and having my employer pay for my training. It's never fun to have to pay back a large sum of money but if its an investment in yourself and it helps you make that next step towards your goal, then it is worth every penny.

Even if I had an obligation to pay back the money, I'd still do it. Especially if I knew the next gig I got would have me making more in the first year than what i owed to my previous employer. No brainer 0% interest free loan is right.

josephandre

McxRisley wrote: »

So I don't see companys giving you money with an obligation to stay for an extra year or so as them winning. From a financial perspective, you are the one who is winning. Think about it, they just fronted you money with 0% interest and if you stay for the agreed upon amount of time, you owe them NOTHING. So you essentially are getting a FREE loan, this type of deal would make bankers have a stroke.

I have been on both sides of the spectrum, paying out of pocket for training and having my employer pay for my training. It's never fun to have to pay back a large sum of money but if its an investment in yourself and it helps you make that next step towards your goal, then it is worth every penny.

pretty much. I've twice now successfully negotiated for a new company (that I was qualified for due to the training/certs from the previous) to give a sign on bonus to cover any outstanding tuition owed. Getting 11k in the hole is crazy.

SteveLavoie

If we try to come back to the OP question, I think that you can train by yourself with a minimum of money invested. I use Pluralsight (299$/year) and Safaribooksonline(399$/year). My boss pay Pluralsight and I pay out of my pocket for Safaribookonline. Most of the time, Pluralsight course are at least as good as the average trainer. So in my case, it replaced most of the Windows training for a very modest fee.

So no excuse

Squished

SteveLavoie wrote: »

If we try to come back to the OP question, I think that you can train by yourself with a minimum of money invested. I use Pluralsight (299$/year) and Safaribooksonline(399$/year). My boss pay Pluralsight and I pay out of my pocket for Safaribookonline. Most of the time, Pluralsight course are at least as good as the average trainer. So in my case, it replaced most of the Windows training for a very modest fee.

So no excuse

I had never heard of either until I visited this site. They are on my list to investigate.

SteveLavoie

If you meet an employer who dont want to pay 299$ / year for your training... Prepare your resume ASAP.

NetworkNewb

Membership to ACM: https://www.acm.org/

$99 a year and get full access to SafariBooksOnline and SkillSoft. Insane deal!

Update: 25% off that $99 atm too... https://campus2.acm.org/public/qj/keep_inventing/qjprofm_control.cfm?promo=DA4SCA

Just used that link to sign up myself. Was paying $40 a month just for SafariBooksOnline before this!

Squished

SteveLavoie wrote: »

If you meet an employer who dont want to pay 299$ / year for your training... Prepare your resume ASAP.

7 years of a $0 budget. This was the first year I was able to receive $2k.

Squished

NetworkNewb wrote: »

Membership to AMC: https://www.acm.org/

$99 a year and get full access to SafariBooksOnline and SkillSoft. Insane deal!

WOW. Great deal. Definitely looking into this! Thanks!

josephandre

safaribooks is a gold mine.

i can't get over how much high quality content is on there.

JustFred

Choose for the paid training, try not to go over the training budget, keep an eye on that and you will be in good shape.

ThePawofRizzo

I've been on both sides of the coin: times my employer would not pay for any training, cert exams; times they'd pay for maybe the exam, if you pass, but not study material or courses; and times where they'd pay for at least one course, college tuition, etc. Thankfully, the last few years I've been fortunate to have the latter benefits, and it truly is like having money in my wallet, because I've paid for the training out of my own pocket when I've had to do so.

Having a track record of taking the initiative for education, whether tech school, certifications, or college has definitely kept me employable. To those that have these benefits paid for, use them. I work with a lot of techs who simply don't bother, and it has nothing to do with not having the money for the books or tests from my employer. Rather it is simple laziness. But when the company starts considering layoffs, these same techs know their resume is a bit thin and are concerned for their jobs.

N7Valiant

If you can fit training anywhere into your 60+ hour weekly work activities, then by all means.

Pseudonym

Squished wrote: »

Absolutely nothing at all and I have many books. Much of my higher level IT skills are self taught, uncertified skills acquired from books and Google. When the exams are hundreds of dollars a piece and the lab trainings are equally expensive, It becomes cost-prohibitive.

Lab training expensive?

Microsoft server ISOs are free. Packet tracer is free. I'm sure there are many more examples.

I'm not buying this. I've never had work pay for my certs. I pay for everything, and I do it on a budget. But guess what? I still do it.

Squished

Pseudonym wrote: »

Lab training expensive?

Microsoft server ISOs are free. Packet tracer is free. I'm sure there are many more examples.

I'm not buying this. I've never had work pay for my certs. I pay for everything, and I do it on a budget. But guess what? I still do it.

Cost is relative to life circumstances.

Pseudonym

Do you drink alcohol? Go out with friends on occasion? Smoke? Not insinuating that you do.

I'm just saying there's almost always a way to make something work if you want it enough.

Squished

Pseudonym wrote: »

Do you drink alcohol? Go out with friends on occasion? Smoke? Not insinuating that you do.

I'm just saying there's almost always a way to make something work if you want it enough.

D. None of the above! I didn't realize IT people could make friends.

Pseudonym

No, we're all confined to basements and are only allowed out at night.