What's changed?

markzab

Ok, I'll try to make a long story short for my first post...

It's nearing the end of 2000. I already have my CCNA, CCDA, and I just passed my 4th and final test for my CCNP. Woo-hoo! Oh wait, the tech market just crashed. It's ok, I have my CCNP and about a years worth of contract experience working with Cisco...I should be fine...

4 months later, no jobs out there. Market dead. I decide to go back to college and find myself 2 years later in the mortgage business. I love it and have been doing mortgages over the past 4+ years. I have my own shop right now. I haven't even said the word "router" in probably 6 years...

So about a month ago a couple of buddies and I are typing our names into google to see what comes up. Obviously with a name like Mark Zabludovsky I don't expect to see much. BOOM, 10+ pages of threads from back in like 2000 when I used to post all over groupstudy.com. So I start reading some of my comments from the past and am amazed at how LITTLE I know what the hell I was talking about back then. I guess 6-7 years wipes a lot of the memory away...

Never-the-less I find myself excited/intrigued and I'm contemplating getting back into the business. I always loved it before but had to look in other directions due to the way the market was back then. I've been doing some research and have realised some things may have changed (obviously). What I am more concerned with are the cretifications, books, structures.

I remember right after I passed my NP there was talk that they were going to break the NP into different sub-tests. For example a security NP, a framework NP, etc. There wasn't going to be a single CCNP cert anymore if I remember correctly. I also remember a rumor that the CCDA was going to be discontinued. Did this happen? Also, I'm seeing that there is more than one CCNA test now? An INTRO and some other one? Is the INTRO like an easier version of the real thing? Do most people skip that one?

Sorry for all the questions. Just trying to feel things out again. How is the market doing? Is it hard to Cisco certified individuals to find jobs like it was when the tech market crashed?

I'm sure I have more questions but I think that's enough to start out with. I really just wanted to check in and say hi. I miss this stuff.

Ed Rooney

The tech job market crashed? We didn't notice here inside the beltway.

I'm trying to hire 2 people and I'm having a p****r of a time finding people that I would even bring in for an interview.

markzab

Don't you remember in 2000 when all the internet companies finally fell through? It was actually a stock crash and all the tech companies took a big hit. I was a contractor in PHL/NJ area back then and the jobs just seemed to disappear. Go figure after I had decided to go back to school a few months later I heard things started to pick back up.

Ed Rooney

markzab wrote:

Don't you remember in 2000 when all the internet companies finally fell through? It was actually a stock crash and all the tech companies took a big hit. I was a contractor in PHL/NJ area back then and the jobs just seemed to disappear. Go figure after I had decided to go back to school a few months later I heard things started to pick back up.

Oh, yeah. I was working at a privately held healthcare company then. I remember it was dried up then, but I wasn't really looking.

markzab

Any input on some of the questions I posted above? I'm about to order Lammle's book from Amazon but the whole INTRO and ICDN (I think that's it) thing confuses me. Are there now 2 tests...or still just one?

mikej412

Hum.... CCNP, tech Crash. Mortgages.... um.... Hey, if you're looking for a career change -- how about becoming a lawyer!

Let's see.... INTRO/ICND is the 2 test option for the CCNA now, but there is still the single CCNA 640-801 exam option available. The INTRO exam material overlaps a lot with the CompTIA Network+ material.

The Security Specializations did turn into a professional level certification, the CCSP. And that has been updated once since.

From 2000.... the CCNP was probably changed... and then just recently changed again.

There was a CCDA update -- and there is a new updated exam scheduled to come out soon.

They've added the Professional Voice Certification -- the CCVP.

If you get nostalgic, check out the Cisco Certification web page for the current lineup of Cisco's General Certifications and Specialist Certifications.

You can check out the exam options for the CCNA from that link. You can compare the exam blueprints for the INTRO/ICND exams vs the CCNA. But since you've already been "Cisco'ed" -- forget IPX and go for the single exam.

Ed Rooney

markzab wrote:

Any input on some of the questions I posted above? I'm about to order Lammle's book from Amazon but the whole INTRO and ICDN (I think that's it) thing confuses me. Are there now 2 tests...or still just one?

Both. You should just take the 801 test. Much of the material hasn't changed from 507 or whatever you took.

CCDA exam is changing, but the cert is still around. I personally think they should get rid of the design track and incorporate it into the N track. They could put all of the CIT stuff in with the other exams and then make design the 4th CCNP exam.

Job market is kicking, but you need to have some other skills besides networking. Certs aren't as big anymore, bachelor's is required for a lot of senior jobs, but experience talks. The big things now are project management, hipaa, sox, voip and stuff like that.

markzab

mikej412 wrote:

Hum.... CCNP, tech Crash. Mortgages.... um.... Hey, if you're looking for a career change -- how about becoming a lawyer!

I literally just fell out of my chair laughing...

Guess what I initially went back to college for.

Good call.

markzab

Ed Rooney wrote:

markzab wrote:

Any input on some of the questions I posted above? I'm about to order Lammle's book from Amazon but the whole INTRO and ICDN (I think that's it) thing confuses me. Are there now 2 tests...or still just one?

Both. You should just take the 801 test. Much of the material hasn't changed from 507 or whatever you took.

CCDA exam is changing, but the cert is still around. I personally think they should get rid of the design track and incorporate it into the N track. They could put all of the CIT stuff in with the other exams and then make design the 4th CCNP exam.

Job market is kicking, but you need to have some other skills besides networking. Certs aren't as big anymore, bachelor's is required for a lot of senior jobs, but experience talks. The big things now are project management, hipaa, sox, voip and stuff like that.

What about security. I remember when they were talking about making the security NP cert I was thinking I'd get into that one. I guess I just figured there'd always be a need for network security. I think the hardest thing for me will be getting that first job...all over again. It'd look silly to have a resume showing my past 4 years of mortgage experience and then network experience from 6-7 years ago. I'd rather just leave it out and start fresh, ya think?

mikej412

markzab wrote:

I literally just fell out of my chair laughing...

Hey -- I figured that if you are cursed, maybe some good could come out of it

If you're thinking of getting back on the router, then check out the CCNA Forum FAQ for book suggestions. You might want to warm up with the Sybex 5th (check the CD for NAT material) and then decided if you need a total refresher -- the Odom CCNA Library.

markzab

mikej412 wrote:

markzab wrote:

I literally just fell out of my chair laughing...

Hey -- I figured that if you are cursed, maybe some good could come out of it

If you're thinking of getting back on the router, then check out the CCNA Forum FAQ for book suggestions. You might want to warm up with the Sybex 5th (check the CD for NAT material) and then decided if you need a total refresher -- the Odom CCNA Library.

Yeah, I went through that. There was one name I remembered after all these years and it was Lammle's. If I'm not mistaken I used to read all of his books for all of my tests. The thing I was most proud of was that I never failed a test. Passed the CCNA, CCDA, and all 4 CCNP tests on the first shot. I'm just a bit scared now after going cold turkey all this time if the end result will be the same.

I think to be safe I'll go over Sybex thuroughly and then use the Press as a skim book before the test. Couldn't hurt.

markzab

By the way...is there a difference between this book:

Sybex 4th edition Deluxe

Or this one:

Sybex 5th Edition

Other than the obvious fact that one is hardcover and the other is paperback of course. Does the hard cover come with any extra CD's or anything to warrant the higher price?

[note: moderator hates scrolling and edited the original long URLs to use descriptive label links]

mikej412

4th edition has the downloadable NAT Chapter & some updates

and the deluxe part of that is probably "Leading-edge exam preparation software, including the CCNA Virtual Lab, Gold Edition, as well as Sybex's custom test engine, electronic flashcards, and the entire book in PDF"

The biggie there was the CCNA Virtual Lab I think.

The 2nd link is the 5th edition with the NAT Chapter hopefully on the CD.

I'll change the long URLs links to the "obvious names" links -- which should confuse everyone who doesn't read this closely.

Either version is still good, as long as you get the updates (4th) or read the stuff on the CD (5th).

Ed Rooney

4th ed. deluxe is not worth the extra $40 or so. Get 5th and spend that money on Boson's CCNA test #3.

markzab

Thanks Mike.

It's reviews like this that bug me out in regards to getting Lammle's book though...

"This 5th edition book has WAY too many typographical technical errors to be a reliable, sole study guide. If you are a complete novice, do not even consider this book because you will not have enough background to determine what and where the errors are. I have personally sent in errata updates to Sybex in July & Aug. 2006 and they have yet to update the errata. (It is now Dec. 2006.)

This book is already out-of-date because the CCNA exam was updated (2005 update) AFTER this book was published.

If you can ignore all of the errors (especially those in Chapter 3), there is a lot of good information and shortcuts presented in this book; hence the 3 stars. Mr. Lammle is obviously a VERY knowledgeable professional in regards to Cisco networking. It is unfortunate that Sybex failed to live up to those professional standards in presenting his material.

If you must study for your CCNA exam now, and you need to purchase a study guide, I STRONGLY suggest that you purchase the 2 Cisco CCNA Self-Study Exam Certification Guides. They are up-to-date with the 2005 updates. Otherwise you can wait for the 6th Edition of this book that is due to be published in March 2007. I just hope Mr. Lammle demands the highest standards of proofreading from Sybex BEFORE it is published."

Makes me think I should go ahead and just get the Cisco press books. Maybe I'm just reading too much into it.

markzab

Ed Rooney wrote:

4th ed. deluxe is not worth the extra $40 or so. Get 5th and spend that money on Boson's CCNA test #3.

Was planning on that. I remember using Bosons in the past. Strange that an older edition of a book costs more than the newer one.

markzab

I ordered the 5th addition this morning guys. I appreciate the help last night.

markzab

Got my book just now. Woo-hoo!

One of the things that I was hesitant about was people complaining about Lammle's book in regards to it not covering NAT.

Ironically when i took the book out of the plastic I opened it up to just a random page. The page number was 95 and in big bold letters it read Introduction to Network Address Translation (NAT).

Go figure.