Getting another 60 days out of ESXi

JDMurray

Please Sir, May I Have Some More Virtual Days?

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blargoe

Sweet...

vCole

Awesome!

RTmarc

Why would you need another 60 days? ESXi is free. VMware gives you a license key for it when you download it.

blargoe

Because any extras are disabled once you put in the "free" key (VCB, etc)

JDMurray

ESXi is free to download and use in its full capacity for 60 days only. After 60 days, ESXi looses some of it's funcitonality, including VI API write access and its ability to be managed by SNMP, VirtualCenter Server, and (I think) VI Client. You need to purchase a license for vSphere or vCenter Server to remove the 60-day counter.

I'm not an expert on VMWare product licensing, so somebody correct me on this if I'm wrong somewhere.

blargoe

You should be able to use VI Client I think, but not be able to use anything that ties to vCenter.

snadam

blargoe wrote: »

You should be able to use VI Client I think, but not be able to use anything that ties to vCenter.

Ill 2nd that. You can still use VI client after adding your free license key. Im doing so as we speak

JDMurray

When/where do you get the free license key? I've downloaded ESXi 3.5.0 U3 and U4 several times and I've never seen license keys in an email or on the page.

dynamik

You should get it when you register here: https://www.vmware.com/tryvmware/index.php?p=free-esxi&lp=1

UnixGeek

snadam wrote: »

Ill 2nd that. You can still use VI client after adding your free license key. Im doing so as we speak

I'll 3rd that. ESXi makes for a nice lab box.

Jordus

what the hell?

so its not free, its "free".

VMware's days are numbered if they keep dancing around with half-truths.

I'll stick to hyper-v for my test labs, works fine and isnt cut off at the knee.

tiersten

Jordus wrote: »

what the hell?

so its not free, its "free".

There is a paid and a free feature set. They're not the same. You just don't get VirtualCenter.

Jordus wrote: »

I'll stick to hyper-v for my test labs, works fine and isnt cut off at the knee.

I'm going to complain to Microsoft that I don't get the full version of Windows Server 2008 with my copy of Hyper-V.

astorrs

Jordus wrote: »

I'll stick to hyper-v for my test labs, works fine and isnt cut off at the knee.

Some would disagree with you there...

dynamik

Jordus, have you compared the features of the "free" version of ESXi to Hyper-V?

Jordus

tiersten wrote: »

I'm going to complain to Microsoft that I don't get the full version of Windows Server 2008 with my copy of Hyper-V.

That doesnt begin to compare and you know it.

Also, is VMware ok with this 60 day extension or does it violate their EULA?

JDMurray

Jordus wrote: »

Also, is VMware ok with this 60 day extension or does it violate their EULA?

VMWare has complete control over what the repair feature of their ESXi installer does. Performing a repair resets the 60-day counter because VMWare's product marketing people want it to. VMWare has been very good about catering to the hobbyist community with freebies and this is one way that they do it.

tiersten

JDMurray wrote: »

VMWare has complete control over what the repair feature of their ESXi installer does. Performing a repair resets the 60-day counter because VMWare's product marketing people want it to. VMWare has been very good about catering to the hobbyist community with freebies and this is one way that they do it.

If you're crazy enough to actually do this in a production environment then you've got bigger problems than VMware getting annoyed with you

tiersten

Jordus wrote: »

That doesnt begin to compare and you know it.

The free version of Hyper-V is Microsoft Hyper-V Server 2008 and its a version of Windows Server 2008 which has been "cut off at the knee". If you're justified in complaining that the free version of ESXi doesn't have the full functionality of the paid product then I don't see why the free version of Hyper-V shouldn't come with all of the paid Windows Server 2008 features.

In both cases, the respective companies are just trying to expand market share. If you like their free product then they hope you'll consider upgrading and paying for the full product. ESX/ESXi is VMware's core enterprise product and if they gave the whole thing away for free, who would bother buying it? It is the same with Hyper-V and Windows Server 2008. Microsoft want you to go wow! Hyper-V is sweet! I'm gonna buy Windows Server 2008.

Jordus

tiersten wrote: »

The free version of Hyper-V is Microsoft Hyper-V Server 2008 and its a version of Windows Server 2008 which has been "cut off at the knee". If you're justified in complaining that the free version of ESXi doesn't have the full functionality of the paid product then I don't see why the free version of Hyper-V shouldn't come with all of the paid Windows Server 2008 features.

In both cases, the respective companies are just trying to expand market share. If you like their free product then they hope you'll consider upgrading and paying for the full product. ESX/ESXi is VMware's core enterprise product and if they gave the whole thing away for free, who would bother buying it? It is the same with Hyper-V and Windows Server 2008. Microsoft want you to go wow! Hyper-V is sweet! I'm gonna buy Windows Server 2008.

No its not even close to being the same because ESX is a hypervisor is a hypervisor is a hypervisor. Its not a full fledge operating system that can do tens of thousands of different things like Server 2008 is.

Yes, Hyper-V is also a role in Server 2008 but its a standalone product as Hyper-V server as well. The only functionality you lost in running JUST hyper-V server (as far as the virtualization stuff goes) was the ability to form a cluster. Which is going to be remedied in Hyper-V Server R2.

The day that the paid version of ESX is a standalone full fledge server OS that has 30 more roles than just being a hypervisor is the day your argument will hold any weight.

Basically what it boils down to is this:

Hyper-V server has some features that always stay there, there are additional features you can utilize if you purchase SCVMM. (but these are features of SCVMM, not Hyper-V)

ESX Server has a lot of features, some of which are gone if you DONT purchase their hypervisor manager software.

MS is adding features, vmWare is reducing features because you didnt pad their pocket.

is ESX the superior hypervisor? Probably, but that isnt the point of this discussion.

tiersten

Jordus wrote: »

No its not even close to being the same because ESX is a hypervisor is a hypervisor is a hypervisor. Its not a full fledge operating system that can do tens of thousands of different things like Server 2008 is.

Doesn't matter. I'm comparing them on a free and paid version basis. I never compared them on a feature basis. Hyper-V or ESX may be better. I'm not making either argument here. Hyper-V is a cut down version of Server 2008. Why doesn't Microsoft give me the full version of Server 2008 for free?

Jordus wrote: »

so its not free, its "free".

You're complaining about the same thing. The free version of ESXi doesn't contain everything that the paid version of ESX does.

Jordus wrote: »

Hyper-V server has some features that always stay there, there are additional features you can utilize if you purchase SCVMM. (but these are features of SCVMM, not Hyper-V)

It is the same for ESXi. The paid features are part of VirtualCenter which you need to purchase. ESXi on the free license loses its ability to be managed to VirtualCenter.

Jordus wrote: »

ESX Server has a lot of features, some of which are gone if you DONT purchase their hypervisor manager software.

Hyper-V has a lot of features, some of which are gone if you DONT purchase their hypervisor manager software.

Jordus wrote: »

MS is adding features, vmWare is reducing features because you didnt pad their pocket.

The "underdog" is giving you more features to gain market share from the current market leader.

Jordus

tiersten wrote: »

Doesn't matter. I'm comparing them on a free and paid version basis. I never compared them on a feature basis. Hyper-V or ESX may be better. I'm not making either argument here. Hyper-V is a cut down version of Server 2008. Why doesn't Microsoft give me the full version of Server 2008 for free?.

apple to oranges. ESX is a hypervisor, its not totally free. Hyperv is a hypervisor, its totally free.

tiersten wrote: »

Hyper-V has a lot of features, some of which are gone if you DONT purchase their hypervisor manager software..

Wrong. Those are features of SCVMM, not HyperV. As its described in thsi thread, you lose features of ESX (not VirtualCenter) by not purchasing ESX.

tiersten wrote: »

The "underdog" is giving you more features to gain market share from the current market leader.

The underdog will likely end up trouncing the "upperdog" if the "upperdog" doesnt evolve.

astorrs

Jordus wrote: »

Yes, Hyper-V is also a role in Server 2008 but its a standalone product as Hyper-V server as well. The only functionality you lost in running JUST hyper-V server (as far as the virtualization stuff goes) was the ability to form a cluster. Which is going to be remedied in Hyper-V Server R2.

Actually that's not true. The free version of Hyper-V server is also limited to:

- 16 logical CPUs
- 32GB of physical RAM

The current free version of ESXi is "limited" to:
- 64 logical CPUs
- 1TB of physical RAM

Now R2 will likely do away with all those limits on the free version of Hyper-V, but the reason for that is the limited adoption (does anyone actually know of a single user of the free version of Hyper-V?) and Microsoft's need to break into the market further.

astorrs

Jordus wrote: »

apple to oranges. ESX is a hypervisor, its not totally free. Hyperv is a hypervisor, its totally free.

Wrong. Those are features of SCVMM, not HyperV. As its described in thsi thread, you lose features of ESX (not VirtualCenter) by not purchasing ESX.

The underdog will likely end up trouncing the "upperdog" if the "upperdog" doesnt evolve.

ESXi is totally free, there are no time limits and you receive a lifetime product key when you sign up to download it. You also get a free 60 day evaluation of some of the paid features. That is because there is no difference between the free and paid versions of the hypervisor - a simple license key activates everything.

You loose nothing by not purchasing. You don't gain advanced features like high availablity (clustering), VMotion (live migration), DRS, etc without purchasing - same holds true currently for Microsoft. Only Citrix provides live migration for free.

I would say that vSphere is an evolution. It set the bar a few miles higher for the competition; VMware isn't a slouch, the new features introduced there are phenominal.

dynamik

Jordus wrote: »

apple to oranges. ESX is a hypervisor, its not totally free. Hyperv is a hypervisor, its totally free.

You're acting like they're identical because they're both hypervisors. Like I subtly hinted at earlier, do some research as to what you're actually getting. Hyper-V doesn't do things like memory ballooning last I checked

Jordus wrote: »

Wrong. Those are features of SCVMM, not HyperV. As its described in thsi thread, you lose features of ESX (not VirtualCenter) by not purchasing ESX.

What features are you referring to? HA, Vmotion, DRS, etc. all require VC.

Jordus wrote: »

The underdog will likely end up trouncing the "upperdog" if the "upperdog" doesnt evolve.

I take it you haven't looked at vsphere yet...

tiersten

Jordus wrote: »

apple to oranges. ESX is a hypervisor, its not totally free. Hyperv is a hypervisor, its totally free.

Fine. If you prefer to do it this way.

Free ESXi is a cut down version of ESXi. It doesn't come with VirtualCenter.
Free Hyper-V is a cut down version of Server 2008. It doesn't come with SCVMM.

If you expect the full version of ESXi including VirtualCenter features for free then I expect the full version of Hyper-V including SCVMM features for free. Both are hypervisors and both have a management application which adds features.

Jordus wrote: »

Wrong. Those are features of SCVMM, not HyperV. As its described in thsi thread, you lose features of ESX (not VirtualCenter) by not purchasing ESX.

Cloning is part of VirtualCenter. It was part of VirtualCenter before they even made the free ESXi release. VirtualCenter isn't free. You can do it like JD did and make a script or work around it via the VI Client by copying vmdk files in the datastore browser.

The free version of ESXi loses two things. The ability to be managed by VirtualCenter and the ability to do write operations via SNMP. I don't see either one being a particularly big problem.

Losing the ability to be managed via VirtualCenter isn't a big loss since you'd have a proper ESXi license if you have VirtualCenter.

Losing the ability to do write operations via SNMP is a little annoying if you want to use RCLI but you can do everything via VI Client anyway. You just can't script it.

Jordus

astorrs wrote: »

Actually that's not true. The free version of Hyper-V server is also limited to:

- 16 logical CPUs
- 32GB of physical RAM

The current free version of ESXi is "limited" to:
- 64 logical CPUs
- 1TB of physical RAM

Now R2 will likely do away with all those limits on the free version of Hyper-V, but the reason for that is the limited adoption (does anyone actually know of a single user of the free version of Hyper-V?) and Microsoft's need to break into the market further.

I know more people using the free version of Hyper-V than i do that have 1TB of RAM in a server

I like playing Devils Advocate, its fun and often times a good learning experience.

astorrs

Jordus wrote: »

I know more people using the free version of Hyper-V than i do that have 1TB of RAM in a server

I like playing Devils Advocate, its fun and often times a good learning experience.

My point is the 32GB limit is pretty strict especially given that Hyper-V has no memory overcommitment technologies. Assuming 16 logical CPUs in the host and only 2GB of RAM is assigned to each VM you are limited to 16 VMs per host. That's not great when compared to what you could achieve by using the free version of ESXi (same 16 logical CPUs with a conservative estimate of 3 VMs per core = 48 VMs each could have 2GB of memory for a total of 96GB). To achieve the same scale with free Hyper-V you would need to buy 2 additional servers...

Jordus

astorrs wrote: »

My point is the 32GB limit is pretty strict especially given that Hyper-V has no memory overcommitment technologies. Assuming 16 logical CPUs in the host and only 2GB of RAM is assigned to each VM you are limited to 16 VMs per host. That's not great when compared to what you could achieve by using the free version of ESXi (same 16 logical CPUs with a conservative estimate of 3 VMs per core = 48 VMs each could have 2GB of memory for a total of 96GB). To achieve the same scale with free Hyper-V you would need to buy 2 additional servers...

Or you could look at it as the cost of a server with the capability and amount of ram at 96GB would be about the same cost as 2 servers with 32 GB ram.

Granted, youd still be at 32 VMs with Hyper-V but you atleast wouldnt be running a single point of failure.

tiersten

Jordus wrote: »

Or you could look at it as the cost of a server with the capability and amount of ram at 96GB would be about the same cost as 2 servers with 32 GB ram.

A 32GB limit is a feature now?

tiersten

Jordus wrote: »

Or you could look at it as the cost of a server with the capability and amount of ram at 96GB would be about the same cost as 2 servers with 32 GB ram.

It'd be 3x 32GB server not 2x.