I am really impressed *never mind*

jibbajabba

Edit : *never mind*

dynamik

Awesome. I'm glad I'm not the only one that's going to get sued

tiersten

dynamik wrote: »

Awesome. I'm glad I'm not the only one that's going to get sued

You're worried about getting sued when you're going to be drugged and tattooed when in Chicago? Priorities man!

Oh and Gojamba needs to learn to crop or resize screenshots...

astorrs

My god you people sure ignore NDAs when they're not related to cert exams.

dynamik

tiersten wrote: »

You're worried about getting sued when you're going to be drugged and tattooed when in Chicago? Priorities man!

Are you kidding!? I'm looking forward to it

tiersten wrote: »

Oh and Gojamba needs to learn to crop or resize screenshots...

He just likes to show off his resolution. I bet he's really on like a 12" display and has to paste four screenshots together in Photoshop to come up with that

astorrs

Gomjaba wrote: »

"only" limitation : You cannot power-on a virtual machine inside the virtual ESX Cluster - which is I suppose fair enough considering (see the error)

Sure you can, minor change to the VMX file and VT enabled in the BIOS and you're good. The boys over at Xtravirt did a walk-through of the process again for 4.0 How to Install VMware ESX 4.0 on Workstation 6.5.2 as a VM | Xtravirt

JDMurray

Gomjaba wrote: »

"only" limitation : You cannot power-on a virtual machine inside the virtual ESX Cluster - which is I suppose fair enough considering (see the error)

I was starting to get a "barber shop mirror" headache about the existential possibilities until I read this limitation.

dynamik

Hm? You can get VMs going inside of a virtualized ESX machine. Check astorrs' link.

tiersten

astorrs wrote: »

My god you people sure ignore NDAs when they're not related to cert exams.

Yup. Bit strange IMO.

tiersten

dynamik wrote: »

Are you kidding!? I'm looking forward to it

Kinky...

jibbajabba

tiersten wrote: »

Oh and Gojamba needs to learn to crop or resize screenshots...

dynamik wrote: »

He just likes to show off his resolution. I bet he's really on like a 12" display and has to paste four screenshots together in Photoshop to come up with that

Sorry, not a show-off, but I work with 30" at home and work for years now .. keep forgetting the resolution issue ...

JDMurray wrote: »

I was starting to get a "barber shop mirror" headache about the existential possibilities until I read this limitation.

http://myitforum.com/cs2/blogs/cnackers/archive/2009/06/09/installing-vmware-workstation-inside-of-a-esx-based-virtual-machine.aspx

Haven't tried it yet though (bottom of the article)

astorrs wrote: »

My god you people sure ignore NDAs when they're not related to cert exams.

tiersten wrote: »

Yup. Bit strange IMO.

What the feck are you guys talking about ? You lost me there really ...

Edit: Thought it was a public beta for a moment .. never mind ...

JDMurray

Gomjaba wrote: »

Installing VMware Workstation inside of a ESX based virtual machine - Chris Nackers Blog

Haven't tried it yet though (bottom of the article)

This article is on running workstation inside of ESX, not the other way around like I was pondering. However, I can certainly give this a try at work tomorrow and let you know.

bertieb

astorrs wrote: »

My god you people sure ignore NDAs when they're not related to cert exams.

What do YOU mean YOU people?

*Sorry, had to get a Tropic Thunder quote in there somewhere after reading Claymoore posting elsewhere about going full retard

jibbajabba

I would just appreciate that if people make mistakes / post stuff they shouldn't do that "people" just say so and spare the arsy replies ...

Not everyone is trying to break the NDA on purpose ..

darkerosxx

Spare astorrs, he comes from the land of Canada and I'm sure he gets "you people" a lot more than we do. Plus, I'm guessing he actually IS Canadian, so he can't help it.

astorrs

darkerosxx wrote: »

Spare astorrs, he comes from the land of Canada and I'm sure he gets "you people" a lot more than we do. Plus, I'm guessing he actually IS Canadian, so he can't help it.

What you talking aboot, eh?

Gomjaba, I apologize for my arsy reply. I just found it amusing that a couple people were posting about the Workstation private beta on a board that takes NDA's pretty seriously; of course it was an honest mistake on your parts, I just enjoyed the irony.

dynamik

I still contend that mine was basic Windows 7 functionality; I was more excited about that than anything specific to Workstation.

HeroPsycho

bertieb wrote: »

What do YOU mean YOU people?

*Sorry, had to get a Tropic Thunder quote in there somewhere after reading Claymoore posting elsewhere about going full retard

Full retard bit = funniest comedic bit in years...

JDMurray

OK, I followed the instructions in this blog article for installing VMWare Workstation in a guest OS running in ESXi. My host was ESXi 3.5.0 U4 and my guest OS was Windows Vista Ultimate SP2.

I was able to install VMWare in the guest OS, create a VM, and edit the .vmx file as required. However, when I tried to start the VM, I received the expected, "You may not power on a virtual machine in a virtual machine" message. I looked in the VM's log files but didn't see anything that indicated a specific problem. My conclusion is that the instructions in the blog article are insufficient to achieve the article's claim.

If anyone else wants to duplicate my experiment, here are some clarifications on the blog article's instructions that you'll need:

• Orca is an editor for Microsoft Installer (.msi) files. Orca is only distributed with the Windows Installer 4.5 SDK or the Microsoft Windows Software Development Kit (SDK). If you install the Windows SDK, you only need to select the Windows Installer SDK for installation and not all SDKs in the package. I recommend downloading the Windows Installer 4.5 SDK because it is the latest release.

• Once the Installer SDK is installed, you'll need to run the oraca.msi package to actually install Orca. This will be either C:\Program Files\Windows Installer 4.5 SDK\TOOLS\orca.msi or C:\Program Files\Microsoft Platform SDK\Bin\Orca.msi depending which SDK you installed.

• Only after Orca is installed will you see the "Edit with Orca" menu item when you right-click a .msi file.

• In addition to the .msi file, be sure to transfer all of the subfolders over to the guest OS too. Run the .msi file to install VMWare Workstation on the guest OS.

• After installing and rebooting, create a new VM using the "I will install the operating system later" option. Also, don't select the "Power on this virtual machine after creation" option.

• The values of the monitor_control settings in the .vmx file require double quotes ("TRUE") like all the other values in the file.

• If you have not already entered a valid license key into VMWare Workstation, you will be required to do so before the VM may be powered-on.

astorrs

JDMurray wrote: »

However, when I tried to start the VM, I received the expected, "You may not power on a virtual machine in a virtual machine" message.

What kind of CPU are you using and do you have VT and NX enabled in the BIOS?

JDMurray

astorrs wrote: »

What kind of CPU are you using and do you have VT and NX enabled in the BIOS?

VT and NX enabled in VMWare Workstation's BIOS? I didn't think to check that. Heck, if VMWare doesn't want VM-in-VM action in its products all it needs do is not support virtualization in its own VM BIOS. But that would mean Windows 7's virtual XP compatibility feature wouldn't work when Windows 7 was running in Workstation either.

astorrs

JDMurray wrote: »

VT and NX enabled in VMWare Workstation's BIOS? I didn't think to check that. Heck, if VMWare doesn't want VM-in-VM action in its products all it needs do is not support virtualization in its own VM BIOS. But that would mean Windows 7's virtual XP compatibility feature wouldn't work when Windows 7 was running in Workstation either.

LOL no I meant on the physical PC. VM-in-a-VM only works with very specific CPUs.

cnackers

JDMurray wrote: »

OK, I followed the instructions in this blog article for installing VMWare Workstation in a guest OS running in ESXi. My host was ESXi 3.5.0 U4 and my guest OS was Windows Vista Ultimate SP2.

I was able to install VMWare in the guest OS, create a VM, and edit the .vmx file as required. However, when I tried to start the VM, I received the expected, "You may not power on a virtual machine in a virtual machine" message. I looked in the VM's log files but didn't see anything that indicated a specific problem. My conclusion is that the instructions in the blog article are insufficient to achieve the article's claim.

If anyone else wants to duplicate my experiment, here are some clarifications on the blog article's instructions that you'll need:

• Orca is an editor for Microsoft Installer (.msi) files. Orca is only distributed with the Windows Installer 4.5 SDK or the Microsoft Windows Software Development Kit (SDK). If you install the Windows SDK, you only need to select the Windows Installer SDK for installation and not all SDKs in the package. I recommend downloading the Windows Installer 4.5 SDK because it is the latest release.

• Once the Installer SDK is installed, you'll need to run the oraca.msi package to actually install Orca. This will be either C:\Program Files\Windows Installer 4.5 SDK\TOOLS\orca.msi or C:\Program Files\Microsoft Platform SDK\Bin\Orca.msi depending which SDK you installed.

• Only after Orca is installed will you see the "Edit with Orca" menu item when you right-click a .msi file.

• In addition to the .msi file, be sure to transfer all of the subfolders over to the guest OS too. Run the .msi file to install VMWare Workstation on the guest OS.

• After installing and rebooting, create a new VM using the "I will install the operating system later" option. Also, don't select the "Power on this virtual machine after creation" option.

• The values of the monitor_control settings in the .vmx file require double quotes ("TRUE") like all the other values in the file.

• If you have not already entered a valid license key into VMWare Workstation, you will be required to do so before the VM may be powered-on.

Hey, took forever to get activated on this forum before i could respond to you.

Sorry some of my info was hazy, i re-read it and cleaned some of the blog post up. I was trying to post things from memory.

The blog is really 2 parts, one part is modifing VMware workstation or VMware server installations to allow you to install them inside a VM. The 2nd part is about tweaking VMX files.

Now, i know for a fact, that you can run ESX server inside of VMware workstation using the information provided for a test environment. You should be able to take the same information and run VMware workstation on a ESX based host as well. However, your probably gonna need some very specific hardware and probably need to change a few more settings or play around with various CPU settings.

You also probably need to play around with various templates as well, since i've seen several recommendations to start with a Red Hat Linux template as opposed to an Windows template. (Whether it's creating a ESX test environment or attempting VMware workstation inside ESX)

I planned to provide the information merely as a starting point, not as a complete walk through guide. So i apologize for not being more clear on that.

JDMurray

astorrs wrote: »

LOL no I meant on the physical PC. VM-in-a-VM only works with very specific CPUs.

My physical PC is already running ESXi 3.5.0, so it's a foregone conclusion that my hardware supports virt. Do you know which CPUs support it?

cnackers wrote: »

However, your probably gonna need some very specific hardware and probably need to change a few more settings or play around with various CPU settings.

You also probably need to play around with various templates as well, since i've seen several recommendations to start with a Red Hat Linux template as opposed to an Windows template. (Whether it's creating a ESX test environment or attempting VMware workstation inside ESX)

I'd like to know what the specific CPUs and specialized hardware is to check if it's outside of my budget. And I'm currently using ESXi and VI Client only, so VC and templates are not available to me. Also, ESX-inside-Workstation-VMs is not useful to me; Workstation-inside-ESXi-VMs is what I'm after.

Thanks for any input you guys can give.

tiersten

JDMurray wrote: »

My physical PC is already running ESXi 3.5.0, so it's a foregone conclusion that my hardware supports virt. Do you know which CPUs support it?

You can run ESX with a CPU that doesn't have the virtualization extensions. What CPU do you have...

astorrs

JDMurray wrote: »

My physical PC is already running ESXi 3.5.0, so it's a foregone conclusion that my hardware supports virt. Do you know which CPUs support it?

Intel Core 2 and above or AMD Athalon 64 X2 AM2/Phenom and above

I believe you'll also need to be running vSphere (ESXi 4.0) to do what you're trying to do.

Hunterprime

Acutally only the AMD Athalon 64 X2 AM2/Phenom and above have across the board support for hardware Virtualization. Intel has not been consistent on which of their CPU's support it.

How many Intel CPUs will fail the XP Mode test in Windows 7? | Ed Bott’s Microsoft Report | ZDNet.com has a list of Intel Desktop CPU that support it.

Also most Motherboards and systems out of the box do not have the tech turned on in the BIOS.

Funny that this was the thing to cause me to stop lurking and post.

Slowhand

Hunterprime wrote: »

Acutally only the AMD Athalon 64 X2 AM2/Phenom and above have across the board support for hardware Virtualization. Intel has not been consistent on which of their CPU's support it.

How many Intel CPUs will fail the XP Mode test in Windows 7? | Ed Bott’s Microsoft Report | ZDNet.com has a list of Intel Desktop CPU that support it.

Also most Motherboards and systems out of the box do not have the tech turned on in the BIOS.

Funny that this was the thing to cause me to stop lurking and post.

I sense a great disturbance in the Schwartz. A presence I've not felt since. . . ten seconds ago.

Good to see ya here finally, Hunterprime. When you get back to the IT pit, get back to work! Err. . . I mean, let's go grab some lunch.


For those of you still following the story, the new character introduced sits about three feet away from me and is my IT counterpart the game company we work for.

astorrs

Hunterprime wrote: »

Acutally only the AMD Athalon 64 X2 AM2/Phenom and above have across the board support for hardware Virtualization. Intel has not been consistent on which of their CPU's support it.

Thanks Hunterprime for linking to that. I knew a few models didn't support it, but I had no idea there were so many (everyone I've bought in the past 3 years has, but then again that's why I'm buying them )

JDMurray

And have a look at this thread: http://www.techexams.net/forums/virtualization/43646-not-all-intel-cpus-support-virtualization.html

jibbajabba

Well I have tried all sorts of config changes to get a vm inside a vm but gave up ... I finally got a couple of spare server plus WUDSS san so I can setup a real test cluster ..