Negotiating Salary

xenodamus

At what point in the interview process does salary negotiation normally take place? Before or after they contact your current employer?

When asked, the HR rep I'm talking to said after they verify my employment they'll do a salary quote and then an offer. Is this how it normally works?

I just assumed I would have a concrete number and offer before I broke the news to my boss.:

tpatt100

My experience was they made a verbal offer once they decided they were interested in you. For my current job they called my last employer and verified what I made and added on top of that for their initial offer.

mikedisd2

tpatt100 wrote: »

My experience was they made a verbal offer once they decided they were interested in you. For my current job they called my last employer and verified what I made and added on top of that for their initial offer.

I'd be very surprised and annoyed if my current employer revealed to anyone what my salary is. What you currently earn should have no influence on what you make in the next job. Otherwise, if you're underpaid in this job, you'll still be underpaid in the next one, assuming you are progressing your career.
Incidentally, I've moved from desktop to systems engineer but still get paid support wages. Think they'll give me a 10-15k raise? When I jump ship there's no way I'm accepting less than a sys eng salary.

Anyway, they should only be calling the people you have listed as a reference. Why would they call your current employer?

ColbyG

I need a firm offer including salary before you mention anything to my current employer.

tpatt100

mikedisd2 wrote: »

I'd be very surprised and annoyed if my current employer revealed to anyone what my salary is. What you currently earn should have no influence on what you make in the next job. Otherwise, if you're underpaid in this job, you'll still be underpaid in the next one, assuming you are progressing your career.
Incidentally, I've moved from desktop to systems engineer but still get paid support wages. Think they'll give me a 10-15k raise? When I jump ship there's no way I'm accepting less than a sys eng salary.

Anyway, they should only be calling the people you have listed as a reference. Why would they call your current employer?

They had to for a background investigation. I signed a consent form agreeing to credit,criminal, background etc, etc. HR contacted me to verify and I consented. The offer letter they gave me after the verbal offer was only good once the background investigation was done.

I did not mind because due to the work I do I was used to it, plus they gave me 10K more than my last job so I did not even have to negotiate since I accepted what they offered.

RobertKaucher

xenodamus wrote: »

At what point in the interview process does salary negotiation normally take place? Before or after they contact your current employer?

When asked, the HR rep I'm talking to said after they verify my employment they'll do a salary quote and then an offer. Is this how it normally works?

I just assumed I would have a concrete number and offer before I broke the news to my boss.:

No, not normal. Most places understand that looking for a new job could cause issues at your current one. If the offer is not good enough for you, then what? Go back to your current job and suddenly get laid off?

rage_hog

I would not care if my boss knew I was looking for a new job. I'd like to see him squirm around a little bit. Maybe he could make a counter offer. If he asks you why, tell him you don't make enough money. If he makes an offer tell him he needs to come up with more to even be in the picture. Make him work for it. Tell all of them they have the lowest bid so far and you wanted them to know so they can have a chance to counter.

xenodamus

I work 2 jobs, one of them part time. So, I talked to that boss and gave HR the go ahead to call. I told her I didn't want my full time employer involved until I recieved an offer though. She was ok with that.

As a side note, I'm not familiar with the term "salary quote". Does that just mean a preliminary, unofficial salary offer?

BradleyHU

i thought that companies only where able to call your employer(have them contact hr, not your mgr) to confirm if you have been employed there and that was it.

and all this talk about let ya boss know you looking for a new gig so you can get more money, is crazy. once they know you're looking, even if they hit you with a counter offer, in the back of their head, they'll know you'll jump ship @ the chance of a job with more pay, so they'll probably get rid of you before that happens. thats just asking for too much trouble.

dales

BradleyHU wrote: »

i thought that companies only where able to call your employer(have them contact hr, not your mgr) to confirm if you have been employed there and that was it.

and all this talk about let ya boss know you looking for a new gig so you can get more money, is crazy. once they know you're looking, even if they hit you with a counter offer, in the back of their head, they'll know you'll jump ship @ the chance of a job with more pay, so they'll probably get rid of you before that happens. thats just asking for too much trouble.

+1 it seems pure and utter suicide to mention to your current employer that your looking elsewhere, once you've mentioned that they have a nice easy target for some cost savings, especially if you have been there a few years, they can hire somebody else to do the job at the bottom of your payscale especially in the current financial climate.

Never ever mention that you are looking elsewhere, its just asking for a P45 and you may not have anything lined up to go to next.

rage_hog

BradleyHU wrote: »

all this talk about let ya boss know you looking for a new gig so you can get more money, is crazy.

?.? I guess this is where we separate the men from the boy's. Stand up like a man and talk like a man. Or, or scurry about in the shadowed corners of life as a nervous mouse.

Hyper-Me

rage_hog wrote: »

?.? I guess this is where we separate the men from the boy's. Stand up like a man and talk like a man. Or, or scurry about in the shadowed corners of life as a nervous mouse.

I stood up to my last employer and asked for more money. They tried to bluff me. I warned them i'd find more money elsewhere. They tried to bluff me.

In the end, they didnt care and I left and found more money.

The point is, though, that doing what I did would more than likely leave someone out of a job more than it would a hefty raise.

rage_hog

I agree, I just dont need to be paraphrased. If you "read" what I said, I made no mention of going off and informing the boss that you are looking.

pwjohnston

mikedisd2 wrote: »

I'd be very surprised and annoyed if my current employer revealed to anyone what my salary is.

Ya, no kidding. I've heard that legally, the only thing they're allowed to ask when calling a previous employer is for confirmation that you worked there and what your position was.

UnixGuy

rage_hog wrote: »

I would not care if my boss knew I was looking for a new job. I'd like to see him squirm around a little bit. Maybe he could make a counter offer. If he asks you why, tell him you don't make enough money. If he makes an offer tell him he needs to come up with more to even be in the picture. Make him work for it. Tell all of them they have the lowest bid so far and you wanted them to know so they can have a chance to counter.

with the current economy, where a lot of highly qualified people are unemployed, I don't think this is a good idea at all

rage_hog

UnixGuy wrote: »

with the current economy, where a lot of highly qualified people are unemployed, I don't think this is a good idea at all

I'll tell you right now, no one should ever down you for trying to better your self. You need to look out for you and stop worrying what your little pion manager thinks is good for you. Anyone with half a brain should already know you will most likely be checking out other jobs. If not, they have never met some of the Blue Falcons I have. CL, CD, right buddy? Get a grip.

Devilsbane

tpatt100 wrote: »

My experience was they made a verbal offer once they decided they were interested in you. For my current job they called my last employer and verified what I made and added on top of that for their initial offer.

Thats interesting. In Minnesota at least the only thing you are allowed to say is dates of employment and whether you are eligable to be rehired. Anything else can get you sued.

Paul Boz

Sometimes the only way to get more money out of your employer is to make them feel the squeeze of another company's grasp on you. On the other hand, that call may be enough to push you out of your current job if you're not in high standing.

UnixGuy

rage_hog wrote: »

I'll tell you right now, no one should ever down you for trying to better your self. You need to look out for you and stop worrying what your little pion manager thinks is good for you. Anyone with half a brain should already know you will most likely be checking out other jobs. If not, they have never met some of the Blue Falcons I have. CL, CD, right buddy? Get a grip.

It's not about what he thinks is best for me, it's about being careful.

I'll be looking okay, but unless I have a better job offer in my hand, then no need to go to employer and tell him you're looking.

Get a better job, then go and start negotiating..

Forsaken_GA

rage_hog wrote: »

I'll tell you right now, no one should ever down you for trying to better your self. You need to look out for you and stop worrying what your little pion manager thinks is good for you. Anyone with half a brain should already know you will most likely be checking out other jobs. If not, they have never met some of the Blue Falcons I have. CL, CD, right buddy? Get a grip.

Well, that's just it - if management had half a brain, I probably *wouldn't* be looking for a new job. And if my boss is the petty, spiteful, vengeful type, there's really no need to go announcing I'm looking for other employment until I have an offer letter in hand and I can politely tell him to <BLEEP!> himself when he starts trying to be petty, spiteful, and vengeful

Devilsbane

Paul Boz wrote: »

Sometimes the only way to get more money out of your employer is to make them feel the squeeze of another company's grasp on you. On the other hand, that call may be enough to push you out of your current job if you're not in high standing.

A former college professor told me that it is ok to be looking around. It's nice to know what your worth, and that is how you will get your biggest raises. It is ok to tell them Hey, company xyz offered me x amount of money to do this. They might be able to match it, or they might attemt to match it. But this is what his advice was, don't expect to talk the talk if you can't walk the walk.

In other words, don't get an offer for more money at a job you don't want and try to use that to get a raise. Be fully prepared to take that job if your current employer doesn't at least bend.

Also the wording is important. Don't say "Company X offered me this, if you can't match it I'm out of here". Try something more along the lines of "I was just curious to find out what I'm worth. I interviewed with company x and they offered me a job making x. I really like working for this company and would like to stay here, but my family could really use that extra money."

BradleyHU

humble2007 wrote: »

A former college professor told me that it is ok to be looking around. It's nice to know what your worth, and that is how you will get your biggest raises. It is ok to tell them Hey, company xyz offered me x amount of money to do this. They might be able to match it, or they might attemt to match it. But this is what his advice was, don't expect to talk the talk if you can't walk the walk.

In other words, don't get an offer for more money at a job you don't want and try to use that to get a raise. Be fully prepared to take that job if your current employer doesn't at least bend.

Also the wording is important. Don't say "Company X offered me this, if you can't match it I'm out of here". Try something more along the lines of "I was just curious to find out what I'm worth. I interviewed with company x and they offered me a job making x. I really like working for this company and would like to stay here, but my family could really use that extra money."

The problem with doin that is, companies might see it as "you'll bolt if you can find that pays more than they are willin to pay you, then you'll bolt" and they'll try to cut their loses ASAP. I would str8 up ask for my raise, and give an amount but not tell them about an offer i have in hand, and if they can't or wont give you that salary....then DEUCES!!!

veritas_libertas

ColbyG wrote: »

I need a firm offer including salary before you mention anything to my current employer.

and in writing...

Paul Boz

You should never threaten your boss with taking a new job offer if you don't have the balls to walk. If you ask for more money and threaten to go somewhere else and don't you're screwed for life at that company.

iDShaDoW

Yeah, I'm kinda surprised that one guy would tell someone to grow some balls and let your boss know you're job hunting for more money.

Most people aren't in a position financially where they can take that sort of a risk, especially in this economy.

Not a good gamble unless you're extremely good at what you do and do something that only a handful of people in the whole country can do.

BradleyHU

iDShaDoW wrote: »

Yeah, I'm kinda surprised that one guy would tell someone to grow some balls and let your boss know you're job hunting for more money.

Most people aren't in a position financially where they can take that sort of a risk, especially in this economy.

Not a good gamble unless you're extremely good at what you do and do something that only a handful of people in the whole country can do.

hence why i didnt respond....
i'm not about to get into an e-argument w/someone over this...its stupid...