Certs: Money or Learning?

Bl8ckr0uter

So I was wondering, do you guys do certs for the joy of learning or for money (or both)? If you knew you could get your "dream job" with only a few certs (or degrees) rather than a larger number (Dynamik) do you think you would still do them?

msteinhilber

I don't have a whole lot of certs, but I've gone through a lot of books and it isn't uncommon for me to pickup two or three new titles every month. I do it mostly because I just enjoy reading and learning more about the field since it interests me. I can't imagine myself not reading up as much as I do - but to more directly answer you question, yes I would still do them. Even if I didn't enjoy it as much as I do and it was more of a fiscal motivation behind it I'd keep up with it, even if I had my dream job.

Obtaining one's dream job and falling behind on your skills is the ultimate path to once again preceding job with dream.

Synthros

I do it for both reasons. Right now, though, the pursuit of money outweighs the pursuit of knowledge. At the moment, I would say that 60% of my reasoning is for the money and 40% is for gaining the knowledge. If things turn around and the certs pay off for me from a salary perspective, I think those numbers will transpose.

earweed

How are you defining dream job? For some people it may be as simple as being a decently paid desktop support guy. For others they may see their dream job as something that pays a lot with a lot of responsibility and hours and stress but more money.

Bl8ckr0uter

earweed wrote: »

How are you defining dream job? For some people it may be as simple as being a decently paid desktop support guy. For others they may see their dream job as something that pays a lot with a lot of responsibility and hours and stress but more money.

I suppose I will leave that up to the reader.

MentholMoose

Currently I am doing them primarily for learning. They help me stay on track and focused on learning, and basically provide a framework for studying various topics. However, I really hope that the time and money I'm spending eventually pay off.

earweed

Bl8ckr0uter wrote: »

I suppose I will leave that up to the reader.

And yes I was being redundant bookending more pay and money. Was thinking of you the whole time.

Back to the subject, I never had a cert or thought of getting a cert until I started at WGU. I had always stayed abreast of technology through reading and computers were a hobby until then. I think IT will be a good place to have a job where I might actually enjoy what I do.

erpadmin

There is one cert I would do for the joy of learning. I would include it on my resume ONLY to show I do have network knowledge.

That would be the CCNA. Not looking to work at a NOC, or any of that. Just want it because I know I could do it. I don't have any plans for it right now or even within 2 years. I may even do it in retirement, who knows.....lol. But it's definitely on my bucket list.

Every other cert that I get, the EA, and perhaps the PMP, would be strictly for work/eventual work. But the CCNA is something I do respect and like very much.

Well before you were a CCNA, I remember when it was only offered as one test. They made it an easier deal by splitting it up into two, like an A+ exam. I know that was a good while ago.

earweed

The CCNA is a cert I'm going after when WGU is done and that one is for both the knowledge and for the possibility it'll help land a better job .

mikedisd2

Certs go in hand with experience. Ideally you'd want both; no point having one holding you back.

No such thing as a dream job. Once it's attained, I'm looking for the next rung on the ladder.

Bl8ckr0uter

erpadmin wrote: »

Well before you were a CCNA, I remember when it was only offered as one test. They made it an easier deal by splitting it up into two, like an A+ exam. I know that was a good while ago.

They still do. I did the 1 test route. I honestly think it was easier to do it that way but that's just me.

chrisone

Do it for three reasons, in no particular order...

interest/education
money/career
ego

docrice

I had a similar conversation with a friend about this yesterday. For him, a CCIE would be an ultimate pinnacle of achievement. I'd want one of those too, but even then I'd still be studying and perhaps going for more certs because I wouldn't want to remain too Cisco-centric. While much of infosec rests on the network side, you still need to understand other aspects of an IT infrastructure (as well as the non-technical stuff) to have a good wrap / perspective on things. Plus the fact that the pace of technology demands keeping up if you want to stay relevant.

But for me right now, I think the money vs. knowledge debate comes down to 50% towards each. The knowledge is important, but job security is just as crucial right now. Little resume trophies only help your chances at moving up.

Chris:/*

For the knowledge because I love to learn and this career is also my passion. The certifications really allow me to get closer to the jobs I love and reach my goals. Once that is done the money will come but I would rather love what I do than love the money I earn since I will spend a good portion of my life working.

stuh84

Knowledge first, getting the dream job second, money third.

I need to get paid more, as I'm certainly underpaid for what I do and what I know, but I've been working on that side of things before I started looking at certs. Certs now just solidify what I know, help me learn, and get me further.

In a sense, what I'm after with certs is helping myself to get the right job, one which is a constant challenge, but not because of human factors, more because its interesting, new, developing etc, the whole lot, so I'm trying my best to get as much knowledge, experience and insight as possible along the way. The fact that them kind of jobs also go hand in hand with being paid more is just a bonus to me.

UnixGuy

Primarily for the joy of learning, sense of progress, career/personl satisfaction...but all will should lead to more financial stability/security (depends on how you sell yourself + other circumstances).

marco71

70% - money/career
30% - others (interest, ego)

I didnt find the dream job in the last 10 yrs, hope I'll find it soon because I'm gettin' old

blargoe

For me, today, certs are a means to keep me employable at or above my current career level.

erpadmin

Bl8ckr0uter wrote: »

They still do. I did the 1 test route. I honestly think it was easier to do it that way but that's just me.

Yes, but that's why I said it was only offered as one test when I started in IT back in the 90s.

The fact that you did the one test deal for the CCNA really tells me a lot of about your aptitude (and for you, more importantly, prospective employers... ) That is definitely a sell for you, as many folks do find the two test deal easier than the one.

Though I personally don't discredit those who earned a CCNA taking the two exams.....the prep work alone is enough to be commended.

veritas_libertas

marco71 wrote: »

70% - money/career
30% - others (interest, ego)

I didnt find the dream job in the last 10 yrs, hope I'll find it soon because I'm gettin' old

+1

Why would I want to spend money on the certification if it doesn't benefit me financially? On the other hand I do plan to read books on RFID+, CWAP, and some other non-vendor certifications because I like how certification books are written.

jamesleecoleman

Chris:/* wrote: »

For the knowledge because I love to learn and this career is also my passion. The certifications really allow me to get closer to the jobs I love and reach my goals. Once that is done the money will come but I would rather love what I do than love the money I earn since I will spend a good portion of my life working.

I feel the same way but I don't work. I think I will really like being in IT.

Bl8ckr0uter

Interesting answers guys. Just to throw my hat in, it is about 95/10 Money/Knowledge and I don't think that will ever change. If I knew I could get my "dream job" without certs I probably wouldn't do them.

rogue2shadow

At this point its 60/40; knowledge vs. money. I'm a very simplistic guy for the most part but I like new tech toys every now and then. The certs keep me on my toes and give me something to be proud of. In terms of cert study material in general, there has been quite a few other certs I've have technically "studied" for but are not going to take because they are not on my desired career path; the knowledge in and of itself is invaluable with or without the paper.

earweed

Bl8ckr0uter wrote: »

Interesting answers guys. Just to throw my hat in, it is about 95/10 Money/Knowledge and I don't think that will ever change. If I knew I could get my "dream job" without certs I probably wouldn't do them.

Maybe a Bl8ckr0uter math cert trek is in order here...lol

jahsoul

For me, it's both. It all really goes hand and hand. I'm not about to sit up here and say that I get certs for the pure joy of learning, but I understand that what I know will get me far and certs are tangibles of what I have learned. I learn to get paid. Trust me, no one is going to be taking their MCITP:EA to stay desktop support and why would they? Most focus on certs for career advancement; that's it. If you study for the pure joy of learning, why get a cert? I'm just saying. *shrugs*

Just to clarify, I'm studying CCNP material for my CCIE foundational studies. Does this constitute as learning for the joys of learning? lol

Bl8ckr0uter

earweed wrote: »

Maybe a Bl8ckr0uter math cert trek is in order here...lol

Nope I meant literally 95/10 (not 5). To me the pressure to get more money is so much it can be debilitating when I know I am not getting more of it (hence the 105 percent not 100 percent like a normal human).

Now when I start Calc II then a math trek will be in order.

I think this has me covered though:
Khan Academy

earweed

I really enjoyed Calc II but of course I took it back in the "old days" before the internet and online tutorials. It just takes a lot of practice.

RobertKaucher

I do the certs for the learning, which is wht I try to participate in as many beta exams as I can. I am motivated to learn by several factors. Only one of thos is money. Partially it is the compulsive need to learn more, or else I migth be forced to sit an think about my life and where would that get me? 72 hour hold on the psych ward of the local hospital for sure!

Here is my motivation:

* Progressing professionally.
* Because I love to learn and help others learn.
* Ego, I like feeling smart - be it true or not.
* Challenge: I enjoy challenging myself to go past were I am now (related to all the above).
* Change: I get bored easily and it is a way to keep myself entertained.

I don't believe that there is a 1 = 1 relationship between certs and money. When I first got my MCSE I kept looking for jobs that were where I thought I belonged professionally (money and technology) but the people doing the hiring did not see it that way. I kept thinking that if I only got cert X then I would get the kind of job I wanted. It did not pan out, but that sort of mind set drove me to get my MCDST, MCSE:Security, Security+ and MCITP:EA in a very short amount of time. But once I calmed down and began focusing on what I was doing (experience and professional portfolio) things got better and I got noticed more. My certs started to matter more because I was able to back them with experience and a more mature internal knowledgebase.

jahsoul

RobertKaucher wrote: »

I don't believe that there is a 1 = 1 relationship between certs and money. When I first got my MCSE I kept looking for jobs that were where I thought I belonged professionally (money and technology) but the people doing the hiring did not see it that way. I kept thinking that if I only got cert X then I would get the kind of job I wanted. It did not pan out, but that sort of mind set drove me to get my MCDST, MCSE:Security, Security+ and MCITP:EA in a very short amount of time. But once I calmed down and began focusing on what I was doing (experience and professional portfolio) things got better and I got noticed more. My certs started to matter more because I was able to back them with experience and a more mature internal knowledgebase.

That's a key issue. Most people don't know how to use certs as a supplement and as a tangible aid for knowledge progression. How many people can honestly say that they have certs that are totally unrelated to their career path and sit back and wonder why they have it? That's honestly why I don't read the "hottest certs" list. I don't care what's hot. I just care what is in line with my career goals.

Your last 2 sentences should be written in stone because everybody want this cert and that cert without really analyzing how it helps advancement. For example, a guy working here said something about an MCDST. We don't have a help desk. People call the NOC so what real benefit would it have. Or at my last job, someone said that they were going to get an A+ just to get it because it was the last year it would be a lifetime cert. Why?

*I hope all that made sense..lol*

Paul Boz

Money, clout, knowledge, advancement, etc.

RobertKaucher

jahsoul wrote: »

That's a key issue. Most people don't know how to use certs as a supplement and as a tangible aid for knowledge progression. How many people can honestly say that they have certs that are totally unrelated to their career path and sit back and wonder why they have it? That's honestly why I don't read the "hottest certs" list. I don't care what's hot. I just care what is in line with my career goals.

Your last 2 sentences should be written in stone because everybody want this cert and that cert without really analyzing how it helps advancement. For example, a guy working here said something about an MCDST. We don't have a help desk. People call the NOC so what real benefit would it have. Or at my last job, someone said that they were going to get an A+ just to get it because it was the last year it would be a lifetime cert. Why?

*I hope all that made sense..lol*

I have a number of certs not really related to my career path because I got them in beta and found the topics interesting. I also like to keep things kind of broad from a knowledge perspective because you never know what might come along. About 9 months ago I was looking at a position that was asking for SQL Server database development and Windows 7 deployement. Well, it just so happens that I had my MCITP: DBA and had completed the MCITP: Enterprise Desktop Admin 7 when it was in beta. I was certain I was the only person in my area with those two in combination. I never received even a call back about it, but I suspect it was because of the recruiter more than the match. That would have been cool.