no work experience but have the knowledge

How do you defend when applying for a job when you don't have a working experience but you have the knowledge. Let's say HR requires experience with Exchange, you don't have the experience but you have the knowledge gained through self study, is it advisable to apply anyway. I would really love to apply for something more challenging but I don't have the experience, so how do you sell yourself?

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Bl8ckr0uter

ladiesman217 wrote: »

How do you defend when applying for a job when you don't have a working experience but you have the knowledge. Let's say HR requires experience with Exchange, you don't have the experience but you have the knowledge gained through self study, is it advisable to apply anyway. I would really love to apply for something more challenging but I don't have the experience, so how do you sell yourself?

How do you know you have the knowledge if you don't have experience on it? How do you know if you can really fight if you haven't been battle tested?

IMO you can't really say you have the knowledge. You can say you have labbed it up and you are familiar with exchange but there is a difference between playing with something at home and doing something at work. Well at least for most people :
Lab Overview

BTW don't wait, apply now if you wish. You aren't just magically going to get battle tested experience. There has to be a battle, you have to be in it!

ajmatson

Take a chance and explain what you know in the interview. Be confident, tell them if you don't know something but that you want to learn. I did and it paid off big last Friday.

ehnde

Have you set up an exchange server at home (in your lab) in a range of different scenarios and configurations? I'd call that experience.

Bl8ckr0uter

ehnde wrote: »

Have you set up an exchange server at home (in your lab) in a range of different scenarios and configurations? I'd call that experience.

I would be careful of putting lab knowledge on a resume. I might bring it up in an interview but I wouldn't put it on your resume. I have set up BGP and multiarea OSPF routing at home, would I put that on a resume? Probably not.

erpadmin

Bl8ckr0uter wrote: »

How do you know you have the knowledge if you don't have experience on it? How do you know if you can really fight if you haven't been battle tested?

IMO you can't really say you have the knowledge. You can say you have labbed it up and you are familiar with exchange but there is a difference between playing with something at home and doing something at work. Well at least for most people :
Lab Overview

BTW don't wait, apply now if you wish. You aren't just magically going to get battle tested experience. There has to be a battle, you have to be in it!

I actually agree with this. Exchange involves much more than labbing with it. I have seen have most Exchange environments that have at least a two-node active/passive cluster with shared storage, something that is difficult (not impossible) to do in a home environment. I would focus more on familiarity of Exchange as opposed to "experience" and then see if you can negotiate your salary on the low-end. I understand Exchange 2007/2010 has changed a lot since 2003...mainly that it's now in a 64-bit environment now. My own shop has been promising we'll go toward Exchange for the past 10 years, but meanwhile it's still on the antiquated VAX with SMTP/POP3. (No IMAP...lol). In any event, to the OP, as Bl8ck has suggested, I would also recommend you apply, but focus more on familiarity and not "experience", but impress upon them how familiar with it you are through your labbing. If sold correctly, it can't hurt.

earweed

I agree with the other posters here. You don't really have experience but if you have home labbed it then either mention that in the interview or even in the cover letter. The big thing is that you APPLY for these jobs. You'll never get experience with exchange until you are put into a real working exchange environment.

apr911

Another point to make is regarding anything you may have read about exchange in doing your self-study...

As with most technologies and as many here will probably tell you, there is the Microsoft (or other manufacturer) way to implement it and then there is the real world way to implement it.

Some of the most experienced Admins I know dont have and cannot pass their MCSE/MCITP courses because while they have the knowledge to set it up in a real world environment, they cant do it the "Microsoft Way"

Also, it is impossible to truly simulate real world problems with any technology...

So book and lab work does not equal experience.

docrice

My use of the terms "knowledge" and "experience" will differ a bit from how others relate to them here.

One of the big reasons why knowledge and experience are somewhat mutually exclusive is because an IT environment (even small ones) can involve a lot of moving parts, and each environment will be somewhat unique.

The client system OS has the kernel, processes, memory allocation features, security compartmentalization, disk(s), applications with various privilege levels, and a multitude of configuration possibilities. There's also the big bag of water sitting between the keyboard and chair who might not understand what an "any" key is.
The server-side can have the same parts as above, plus administration restrictions, policy settings, storage considerations, etc..
Then you get into the AD DS side with DCs, certificate services, trusts, etc..
And then there's the underlying network infrastructure. Sky's the limit here.

So while having book / lab knowledge is a good start, it's experience that helps hone and discipline your approach and understand of how all these parts work together simultaneously in a cohesive, functional matter within an enterprise and make good planning / configuration decisions accordingly. Books cannot teach you this. The only way to learn it is through frequent and repetitious hands-on (plus the occasional mistakes which hopefully don't lead to an outage). This is why experience is so prized within the IT industry because it demonstrates the prior application of knowledge to produce value within an organization. Experience produces a degree of wisdom from lessons learned.

Candidates new to the industry generally don't start out managing critical back-end functions like mail unless it's a very small or casual business. But as others have said, apply anyway. Maybe they're just not getting candidates they can trust, and trust isn't just about being technically-capable. Besides, I've seen cases where a potential candidate was brought in for an interview, didn't quality for that particular position, but HR / the hiring manager decided they had a position somewhere else in the department that was a more appropriate fit. So get your foot in the door. They might determine you may be good for a junior Exchange position.

I don't know what your current industry experience level is, but if you've already done some systems / network administration work, then it might be easier to get your foot in the Exchange management door.

PremierCisco

Hi all,

If I were you, I would apply to your local schools and volunteer your services, thats how im doing it.

Especially in this climate, schools are looking out for people to look after their networks.
Having said that, i would'nt suggest going into a school or any organisation and mess around with their network if you dont have the correct knowledge to look after the network.
If you dont know how to fix a problem, dont go screwing up their network. Network with other professionals to find the solution.

Regards

Premiercisco

it_consultant

A note about exchange 'experience' vs 'lab experience'. I go through this with people I interview, a lot of exchange 'experience' is based on very limited tasks that junior or help desk admins were allowed to do at whatever company they worked for.

What is more useful to me when evaluating candidates is knowing exactly what they are able to do in Exchange, and gauge their willingness to learn it in depth. Things like judgement, patience, perseverance, etc become much more important than what they do or don't know. When it comes to my Exchange servers, I would rather teach someone fresh than take bad habits that were taught by other people or companies.

Thats the long way of saying that even if your experience is limited, if you show a good fundamental understanding of a system and a willingness to learn, you would be surprised how many people would be willing to give you a chance.

Hypntick

it_consultant wrote: »

Thats the long way of saying that even if your experience is limited, if you show a good fundamental understanding of a system and a willingness to learn, you would be surprised how many people would be willing to give you a chance.

One of the best bits of feedback I ever got on an internal interview was when I was asked if I knew this bit of tech I said no I do not and that was it. Well during the feedback phase with my supervisor he suggested that next time i'm asked something similar to respond with "No I do not, can you tell me more about it? I would love to learn." That line (or something similar) has worked wonders in interviews, it gets a nice dialog going and shows that yes you do want to learn this stuff and allows you to ask even more questions.

SteveLord

Yes, you should always put forth an effort to show interest in the job. Don't just let them question you, ask them lots of questions about the work, the technology they're using, special projects going on or planned for future, etc.

One of the best tips I received from a longtime friend in IT.

That...and knowing the company. Often one of the first questions you get is "So what do you know about our company?"

myedjo24

When I was in the job market, I generally just applied for anything I knew I could do whether or not I have the qualifications they wanted. My current job wanted a Bachelors degree (which I don't have) and four years direct experience (which I only had 3) or 8 years direct experience with out a degree. I felt that I had enough knowledge on what they wanted me to do based on my miminal experience even though I didn't have the actual experience they wanted. I don't really know how I would approach the job market if I had zero work experience (my 3yrs IT experience was from the military) and just had knowledge (the resume would look pretty plain).

edzy

I am in the same situation as op