Assistance Purchasing Lab Equipment CCNA

ITVince

I've been browsing the forums, i'm starting with my CCENT studies, then going for CCNA. I'm a huge n00b when it comes to networking. I'm seeing some equipment going for fairly cheap on eBay. The general consensus I am seeing throughout TE forums are

Cisco 2900 Series Switches
Cisco 2501 Routers

• Are these items good?
• How many switches and how many routers, is two a piece good for CCNA studies?
• What do I need to be on the look out for as far as add-ons?
  • I'll need a USB to Serial device thats compatible for Windows 7 64-bit, so I can console in to this stuff. Anyone know of one?
  • Do the Switches and Routers come with IOS installed or do people wipe these?
  • I'll need a Console Cable
  • As far as memory for the routers, what should I look for?
  • The routers need transceivers correct?

What else am I missing, any insight is appreciated guys. Thanks

alan2308

The general consensus has not been 2500 series routers for years.

What you want for the CCNA is 2950 switches (not all 29xx models are in the same ballpark), and 1721 or 1760 routers. There are cheaper models (such as the 2500 routers and 2900XL switches), but they won't do everything you need, and there are better models (such as 3550 switches), but they'll cost a lot more. How far do you plan to go into Cisco networking? If you plan to go for the CCNP after the CCNA, it might be wise to spend a little more now and get gear that will still be useful, otherwise you won't need to worry about anything beyond what the CCNA requires.

-I don't know anything about the USB to serial coverters, I don't use them.
-Every router or switch that I've bought off of ebay had an IOS image on it, though they don't always have a recent/useful one. If you buy routers from the same series, you can copy them from one to the other so don't stress if every single one has the latest/greatest.
-Memory and Flash depend on the model you're buying, different models are different in this regard. But as I said earlier, let's get your plans all out on the table and pick the best equipment for your own situation before trying to equip the routers. And with switches, memory isn't usually something to worry about.
-No decent enough router is going to require a transceiver, but they do require WIC's and serial cables.

echo465

There's a good series of articles on this topic by Wendell Odom, here: Cisco Cert Zone: CCNA Lab Series 2011: Overview
2950 series switches are still useful, but 2501's are pretty ancient now, I'd try and find 1721's (damn cheap for what they can do, and still pretty current) or 26xxXM for the routers. The 3550 series switches are getting cheaper too, and you can do PoE with them, if you want to study voice (or wireless? I dunno, I don't do wireless).

For addons:
USB/Serial device (if you don't have a serial port). I've got a 'scrap' PC (built out of leftover junk) connected to a USB-to-8xSerial box for my lab, but that's just so I can see multiple consoles together, and so I don't have to move console cables around. Some people use a console router (like a 2509 or 2511 series) instead.

Used Cisco gear almost always has an IOS installed. Check the auction description to see if you can figure out which version. As a bonus, a lot of time they're still configured, so you'll get experience doing a password reset on your new gear, and see how the former owner had it configured.

Console cables are funny. When you're starting out, you're always short of them, but by the time you've been using Cisco gear for a while it will seem like they're multiplying. Sometimes, they're included with gear, along with rack mounting brackets, a power cord, a CD you won't use, and some paperwork you won't look at.

Memory and Flash capacities can vary between routers with the same model number. More is better, of course. Newer IOS versions sometimes require more RAM and/or bigger flash to fit. Large flash capacity can let you keep more than one IOS version on the router too.

2500 series routers are fixed configuration, they don't take transceivers. 1721's come with a 10/100 interface, and two WIC slots. 2610 configurations.. well, here: Cisco 2600 Series Routers Hardware Installation Guide - Overview of Cisco 2600 Series Routers  [Cisco 2600 Series Multiservice Platforms] - Cisco Systems

ITVince wrote: »

I've been browsing the forums, i'm starting with my CCENT studies, then going for CCNA. I'm a huge n00b when it comes to networking. I'm seeing some equipment going for fairly cheap on eBay. The general consensus I am seeing throughout TE forums are

Cisco 2900 Series Switches
Cisco 2501 Routers

• Are these items good?
• How many switches and how many routers, is two a piece good for CCNA studies?
• What do I need to be on the look out for as far as add-ons?
  • I'll need a USB to Serial device thats compatible for Windows 7 64-bit, so I can console in to this stuff. Anyone know of one?
  • Do the Switches and Routers come with IOS installed or do people wipe these?
  • I'll need a Console Cable
  • As far as memory for the routers, what should I look for?
  • The routers need transceivers correct?

What else am I missing, any insight is appreciated guys. Thanks

alan2308

echo465 wrote: »

2500 series routers are fixed configuration, they don't take transceivers.

Most 2500's certainly do require transceivers. Unless you don't want to use Ethernet that is.

ITVince

The general consensus has not been 2500 series routers for years.

Wow...I should have looked at post dates, sorry about that.

What you want for the CCNA is 2950 switches (not all 29xx models are in the same ballpark), and 1721 or 1760 routers. There are cheaper models (such as the 2500 routers and 2900XL switches), but they won't do everything you need, and there are better models (such as 3550 switches), but they'll cost a lot more.

Okay, so I will look at Cisco 2950 Switches and 1721 or 1760 Routers. I am actually familiar with the 3550 POE switches, we use those at work, but I dont get to touch :-p

How far do you plan to go into Cisco networking? If you plan to go for the CCNP after the CCNA, it might be wise to spend a little more now and get gear that will still be useful, otherwise you won't need to worry about anything beyond what the CCNA requires.

To be honest, It probably will take me quite some time to achieve my CCNA. Let's stick with strickly CCNA gear for now.


So with all of this being said, should I pick up Cisco 2950x2 and Cisco 1721 or 1760x2?

Thanks for all your help so far!

ITVince

echo465 wrote: »

There's a good series of articles on this topic by Wendell Odom, here: Cisco Cert Zone: CCNA Lab Series 2011: Overview
2950 series switches are still useful, but 2501's are pretty ancient now, I'd try and find 1721's (damn cheap for what they can do, and still pretty current) or 26xxXM for the routers. The 3550 series switches are getting cheaper too, and you can do PoE with them, if you want to study voice (or wireless? I dunno, I don't do wireless).

For addons:
USB/Serial device (if you don't have a serial port). I've got a 'scrap' PC (built out of leftover junk) connected to a USB-to-8xSerial box for my lab, but that's just so I can see multiple consoles together, and so I don't have to move console cables around. Some people use a console router (like a 2509 or 2511 series) instead.

Used Cisco gear almost always has an IOS installed. Check the auction description to see if you can figure out which version. As a bonus, a lot of time they're still configured, so you'll get experience doing a password reset on your new gear, and see how the former owner had it configured.

Console cables are funny. When you're starting out, you're always short of them, but by the time you've been using Cisco gear for a while it will seem like they're multiplying. Sometimes, they're included with gear, along with rack mounting brackets, a power cord, a CD you won't use, and some paperwork you won't look at.

Memory and Flash capacities can vary between routers with the same model number. More is better, of course. Newer IOS versions sometimes require more RAM and/or bigger flash to fit. Large flash capacity can let you keep more than one IOS version on the router too.

2500 series routers are fixed configuration, they don't take transceivers. 1721's come with a 10/100 interface, and two WIC slots. 2610 configurations.. well, here: Cisco 2600 Series Routers Hardware Installation Guide - Overview of Cisco 2600 Series Routers* [Cisco 2600 Series Multiservice Platforms] - Cisco Systems

Thank you very much for this information, I will go ahead and read over these articles, thank you!

ITVince

Here's two switchesCisco Catalyst 2950 WS-C2950G-24-EI Switch Lot of 2 | eBay


Here's one of those routers looks pretty dinky?

Cisco 1721 1-Port 10/100 Wired Router | eBay

cyberguypr

I got this adapter from amazon, but some here got similar ones cheaper on eBay. Works smooth on Win 7 64 bit.

Amazon.com: Sabrent SBT-USC1M Hi-Speed USB 2.0 to Serial (9-pin) DB-9 RS-232 Adapter Cable (1-foot, Blue): Electronics

ITVince

cyberguypr wrote: »

I got this adapter from amazon, but some here got similar ones cheaper on eBay. Works smooth on Win 7 64 bit.

Amazon.com: Sabrent SBT-USC1M Hi-Speed USB 2.0 to Serial (9-pin) DB-9 RS-232 Adapter Cable (1-foot, Blue): Electronics

Fantastic, thank you!

brad-

FWIW i built my lab about 6 months ago...all off ebay. I looked around at other CCNA kits...that are all overpriced, and just peiced out my own. I got 3 routers and 2 switches.

2x2610XM
1x2620
2x2950
2xDCE/DTE cables
2xWIC-1T
1xNM-4A/S ( i think it is called - 4 port serial add in)
...i also splurged on a skeletek rack to keep it all neatly together.

At the end of the day i want to say all that cost me about $700. It could probably be had for less but i wasnt willing to wait on ebay auctions, i did ones with a reasonable 'buy now' price.

ITVince

brad- wrote: »

FWIW i built my lab about 6 months ago...all off ebay. I looked around at other CCNA kits...that are all overpriced, and just peiced out my own. I got 3 routers and 2 switches.

2x2610XM
1x2620
2x2950
2xDCE/DTE cables
2xWIC-1T
1xNM-4A/S ( i think it is called - 4 port serial add in)
...i also splurged on a skeletek rack to keep it all neatly together.

At the end of the day i want to say all that cost me about $700. It could probably be had for less but i wasnt willing to wait on ebay auctions, i did ones with a reasonable 'buy now' price.

Thats wayyyyyyy out of my price range

echo465

alan2308 wrote: »

Most 2500's certainly do require transceivers. Unless you don't want to use Ethernet that is.

You're right, of course, I was thinking WIC's or Network Modules.

OP, what is your budget?

ITVince

Around $250 or less i'd say. Is that so hard? I see these routers and switches going for like $25 a piece

echo465

ITVince wrote: »

Around $250 or less i'd say. Is that so hard? I see these routers and switches going for like $25 a piece

Something like a Cisco WS-C2950C-24 switch is available now for $40. Careful ebaying can save you a lot of money. Checking my records for what I paid for my CCNA equipment:

10/6/2009 Cisco Catalyst WS-C2950C-24 $33.50
10/10/2009 Cisco 3640 Router $25.75
10/10/2009 Cisco 1721 $47.55
10/13/2009 Cables $25.50
10/13/2009 WIC-2T $$37.00
10/17/2009 Cisco 2600 Series Routers $73.07
10/18/2009 Cisco 1720+WIC-2T $47.32
11/5/2009 Cables $15.55
11/8/2009 More cables $15.45
11/21/2009 Cisco Catalyst WS-3550-SMI-48 $218
02/20/2010 Network modules for 3640 router, APC rackmount surge protectors $35.75
03/11/2010 2x WIC-2T $43.98
03/13/2010 9x Console cables, $5.94
03/14/2010 1720, 1721, and 2x WIC-1DSU-T1 cards, $34.90
05/25/2010 WS-C3550-24PWR-SMI $215

alan2308

ITVince wrote: »

Around $250 or less i'd say. Is that so hard? I see these routers and switches going for like $25 a piece

You should be able to find 2 routers, 2 switches, WIC's and cables for that and have change left over. Just watch eBay for a couple days and wait for a deal. Don't jump on the first thing you see.

ITVince

alan2308 wrote: »

You should be able to find 2 routers, 2 switches, WIC's and cables for that and have change left over. Just watch eBay for a couple days and wait for a deal. Don't jump on the first thing you see.

Ok so go with the models I listed above for router and switch? What are WIC's? Any examples of compatible ones for the router? What type of cabling is required?

ITVince

Or what if I go the Sim route? What's your guys take on this CCNA Network Simulator & Router Simulator | NetSim 8.0

alxx

Before you buy a sim , go and download gsn3 http://www.gns3.net/

Make sure to read up on how to tune the idle settings!
You could just buy switches and use gsn3 for the routers.

I'd recommend buying the switches and a couple of routers

1721's , 1751's ,1760/1761,s or 2600xm's

The 1751's , 1760's and 2600xm's can be used for voip with addition of a few modules/voice wics.

For switches if you can afford it get at least one 3550 (L3).

The same setup should do you (with minor additions) for ccnp



Few links for you to have a read of
Cisco Cert Zone: CCNA Lab Series 2011: Overview
Cisco Cert Zone: CCNA Lab II: How Topologies Drive Device Choices
Cisco Cert Zone: CCNA Lab III: Sifting Through the Router Model Series
Cisco Cert Zone: CCNA Lab IV: Choosing the IOS Version and Feature Set
Cisco Cert Zone: CCNA Lab Part V: Ruling Out (or In) 2500 and 2600
Cisco Cert Zone: CCNA Lab Series Part 6: The Best Router for CCNA, 2011
Cisco Cert Zone: CCNA Lab Part 7: Choosing the Right Switch Models
Cisco Cert Zone: CCNA Lab Part 8: How Many Switches, and Which Ones?CCNA Router IOS FeaturesCCNA Switch IOS FeaturesCCNA Topologies
1700 Series Routers2600 XM Series Routers
Switch: 2950 Serieshttp://www.certskills.com/LabGear/Switches/3550.aspx


freeccnaworkbook.com

Maybe we need a sticky thread near the top of the ccna/cent forum
with suggestions for 2011/2012 suitable hardware as quite a few people seem to look at old posts and go and buy older hardware without checking first.

ITVince

alxx wrote: »

Before you buy a sim , go and download gsn3 GNS3 | Graphical Network SimulatorMake sure to read up on how to tune the idle settings!
You could just buy switches and use gsn3 for the routers.

I'd recommend buying the switches and a couple of routers

1721's , 1751's ,1760/1761,s or 2600xm's

The 1751's , 1760's and 2600xm's can be used for voip with addition of a few modules/voice wics.

For switches if you can afford it get at least one 3550 (L3).

The same setup should do you (with minor additions) for ccnp



Few links for you to have a read of
Cisco Cert Zone: CCNA Lab Series 2011: Overview
Cisco Cert Zone: CCNA Lab II: How Topologies Drive Device Choices
Cisco Cert Zone: CCNA Lab III: Sifting Through the Router Model Series
Cisco Cert Zone: CCNA Lab IV: Choosing the IOS Version and Feature Set
Cisco Cert Zone: CCNA Lab Part V: Ruling Out (or In) 2500 and 2600
Cisco Cert Zone: CCNA Lab Series Part 6: The Best Router for CCNA, 2011
Cisco Cert Zone: CCNA Lab Part 7: Choosing the Right Switch Models
Cisco Cert Zone: CCNA Lab Part 8: How Many Switches, and Which Ones?CCNA Router IOS FeaturesCCNA Switch IOS FeaturesCCNA Topologies
1700 Series Routers2600 XM Series Routers
Switch: 2950 Serieshttp://www.certskills.com/LabGear/Switches/3550.aspx


freeccnaworkbook.com

Maybe we need a sticky thread near the top of the ccna/cent forum
with suggestions for 2011/2012 suitable hardware as quite a few people seem to look at old posts and go and buy older hardware without checking first.

Thank you kind sir for all of those articles, I will be sure to add everything to my collection. I do agree that we need to add a 2011/2012 suitable hardware thread, that would be very beneficial to the group. Maybe we can get a hold of the Webmaster or an Admin.

So i'll get Cisco 1721x2, Cisco 2950x1 and Cisco 3550x1 how's that sound?

Then as for add-ons

I need Memory and Wics for the routers? and just crossover cables for the switches to trunk them? Then power of course for all devices.

Are WICS neccessary?

alxx

yes you need some serial wics and cables to match.

wic2t's or wic1t's

When buying the routers try to get them with wics and as much memory as possible
(avoid 1720 ,1750 and 2600(non xm) as they do not have enough ram and flash for recent ios versions)

Have a look at gsn3 first, get some switches , then look at routers.

For the switches avoid the 2950c , the LRE , the sx and fx versions as they need fibre patches/interconnects (for both 2950 and 3550).
The c2950t's are the best but plain 2950's or 2950g's are also good

The 2950g's need gbics for the 1Gb ports

see http://www.cisco.com/en/US/prod/collateral/switches/ps5718/ps628/product_data_sheet09186a00801cfb64.html

If you end up with a few switches that need gbics to connect them together, the cheapest ones are usually the
WS-X3500-XL GigaStack GBIC and cables CAB-GS-50CM.
Cisco GigaStack GBIC  [Cisco GBICs] - Cisco Systems

The gbics that have a 100/1000tx port as the most useful as you can just plugin a rj45 cat5 or cat6 cable.

murdoctx

The main thing to pay attention to with paypal is the shipping fees. You can get good units for little or no shipping but you gotta pay attention or you may pay too much.

alan2308

murdoctx wrote: »

The main thing to pay attention to with paypal is the shipping fees. You can get good units for little or no shipping but you gotta pay attention or you may pay too much.

QFT. Too many times I though I found the deal of the century, only to find that shipping was $100.

ITVince

Only problem with GSN3 is you have to provide your own IOS for the router. I guess I could try to ask one of our network admins for an image

MAC_Addy

alan2308 wrote: »

QFT. Too many times I though I found the deal of the century, only to find that shipping was $100.

That has happened to me, too. A couple of times I've accidentally put in the bid and THEN looked at the shipping. I think I have all my equipment now... I'll post a picture later.

ITVince

alxx wrote: »

yes you need some serial wics and cables to match.

wic2t's or wic1t's

When buying the routers try to get them with wics and as much memory as possible
(avoid 1720 ,1750 and 2600(non xm) as they do not have enough ram and flash for recent ios versions)

Have a look at gsn3 first, get some switches , then look at routers.

For the switches avoid the 2950c , the LRE , the sx and fx versions as they need fibre patches/interconnects (for both 2950 and 3550).
The c2950t's are the best but plain 2950's or 2950g's are also good

The 2950g's need gbics for the 1Gb ports

see http://www.cisco.com/en/US/prod/collateral/switches/ps5718/ps628/product_data_sheet09186a00801cfb64.html

If you end up with a few switches that need gbics to connect them together, the cheapest ones are usually the
WS-X3500-XL GigaStack GBIC and cables CAB-GS-50CM.
Cisco GigaStack GBIC* [Cisco GBICs] - Cisco Systems

The gbics that have a 100/1000tx port as the most useful as you can just plugin a rj45 cat5 or cat6 cable.

So something like this?

Cisco Catalyst (WSC2950G24EI) 24-Ports External Switch Managed stackable | eBay

Has free shipping. Looks to be model G.

What model routers do you recommend?

Timber Wolf

You can pretty much get away with which 2950 you can find. You don't have to use the uplink ports so those really don't matter.
Although you will want to try and get the ones with the Enhanced Image although i found that it wasn't to important to have one. But you can find a list of witch ones have it here.

Cisco Catalyst 2950 Series Switches with Enhanced Image SW  [Cisco Catalyst 2950 Series Switches] - Cisco Systems

instant000

I'll co-sign on the 1721 routers being very inexpensive. What tends to cost you is the Ethernet WIC's. The WIC-2T's are very reasonable, but the WIC-1ENET (hope I said that right) usually cost as much as a router. I remember wanting another WIC-1ENET, and I ordered a 1720 router that had one included, as it was cheaper than buying the router itself. If you get a 1721, might as well get the one with 32F. You can purchase a 64 MB ram upgrade, and take it up to 128 MB ram, rather inexpensively, but since it's just for labbing, no big deal on that, but the ram is usually inexpensive.


WARNING: Any flash/ram upgrades, you're on your own. Watch out on the 1721, they're either sold with 32F or 16F, and you can't upgrade it. Also, not all of these can accept the same intefaces. As the 3640 is so "fat" it can accept a lot of modules, but by default, it's pretty bare-bones, if you actually wanted to connect to something else ...but, it is very flexible, so keep that in mind, you can get good deals getting a 3640 with 32F/128D and some good modules installed too, if you want that.

Also, the fixed configuration routers tend to not be rackable, and depending on your living quarters, that might come into consideration, also, as there's no easy way to rack a 1721 , unless you're just installing a shelf, and sitting it on top of that



2950 switch: $35 or so (will get you through CCNA, and 50-75% of CCNP switching topics)
3550 switch: $110 or so (will get you through CCNP, and 95% of CCIE switching topics)
3560 switch: $400-$500 (will get you through CCIE)

IOS 12.4 support:
fixed config:
831 router: $70 or so
modular:
1721 router: $30 or so
3640 router: $75 or so
2611xm router: $125 or so

IOS 15 support:
Modular:
1811 router: $400 or so (a guy can dream)
1841 router: $230 - $250
Fixed Configuration:
871 router: $250 or so
861 router: $135 (saw it on buy it now, the average of these is $265 though) it even has show version output


Hope this helps!

ITVince

instant000 wrote: »

I'll co-sign on the 1721 routers being very inexpensive. What tends to cost you is the Ethernet WIC's. The WIC-2T's are very reasonable, but the WIC-1ENET (hope I said that right) usually cost as much as a router. I remember wanting another WIC-1ENET, and I ordered a 1720 router that had one included, as it was cheaper than buying the router itself. If you get a 1721, might as well get the one with 32F. You can purchase a 64 MB ram upgrade, and take it up to 128 MB ram, rather inexpensively, but since it's just for labbing, no big deal on that, but the ram is usually inexpensive.


WARNING: Any flash/ram upgrades, you're on your own. Watch out on the 1721, they're either sold with 32F or 16F, and you can't upgrade it. Also, not all of these can accept the same intefaces. As the 3640 is so "fat" it can accept a lot of modules, but by default, it's pretty bare-bones, if you actually wanted to connect to something else ...but, it is very flexible, so keep that in mind, you can get good deals getting a 3640 with 32F/128D and some good modules installed too, if you want that.

Also, the fixed configuration routers tend to not be rackable, and depending on your living quarters, that might come into consideration, also, as there's no easy way to rack a 1721 , unless you're just installing a shelf, and sitting it on top of that



2950 switch: $35 or so (will get you through CCNA, and 50-75% of CCNP switching topics)
3550 switch: $110 or so (will get you through CCNP, and 95% of CCIE switching topics)
3560 switch: $400-$500 (will get you through CCIE)

IOS 12.4 support:
fixed config:
831 router: $70 or so
modular:
1721 router: $30 or so
3640 router: $75 or so
2611xm router: $125 or so

IOS 15 support:
Modular:
1811 router: $400 or so (a guy can dream)
1841 router: $230 - $250
Fixed Configuration:
871 router: $250 or so
861 router: $135 (saw it on buy it now, the average of these is $265 though) it even has show version output


Hope this helps!

Thank you for this fantastic write-up. In your experience / opinion how many routers and how many switches are required for CCENT/CCNA labs?

MAC_Addy

I have some spare 1721's if you want them?

They don't have any WIC's in them, though.

Timber Wolf

Id recommend 3 Routers and 3 switches as this is what most lab topologies call for although you can get away with 2 routers and 2 switches. Really it just depends on your budget.

ITVince

Timber Wolf wrote: »

Id recommend 3 Routers and 3 switches as this is what most lab topologies call for although you can get away with 2 routers and 2 switches. Really it just depends on your budget.

I'd have to stick with 2 and 2 for now. Wife is going to kill me This guy seems to have the right idea. I need to start off small then work my way up. Looks like two 2600 series routers and a 2950 switch?