Giving up

I am a career changer. That in itself must be a dirty word in IT, because I just had the worst interview of my life today.

I was told to prepare for an hour interview with the manager. Instead I met two managers for 15 minutes. When we sat down, they introduced themselves and then sat there saying nothing. They stared at their blackberries. I chitchatted and they finally spoke. They asked me nothing about my resume. Instead they posed maybe five questions about things unrelated to the posted position and my IT education.

I had come in for an entry level Help Desk. The only requirement was a High School Diploma. They were asking me about my experience with Juniper equipment (not listed on my resume and not in the job's reqs). One chuckled at my certifications. She asked If I could travel throughout the state, even though the job was 90% phone and 100% at that office. I tried to keep a smile and answer positively. The male manager ignored me most of the time only to chuckle inappropriately at what I said and typed on his blackberry. The female manager was nice at least but she ushered me out into the hallway because the next guy is coming in 10 minutes. What the hell???

I ended up showing myself out the door.

I have gone over and over in my head. I am confident they didn't mistake me for another applicant. Was it a stress interview? Is it yet another big business looking to add numbers to their applicant pool? Why waste me time and theirs?

I am so depressed about my job search. I have had 2 phone interviews that went great but with no replies back, my recruiter never returns my emails and now this disaster. I can't tell my partner about it anymore because I don't want him to feel like its his job to cheer me up.

It so aggravating and humiliating. I am contemplating just getting my CCNA and foregoing the PC Tech/Help Desk jobs. But what do I do about the gap in my resume?

I don't know what to do. Thanks for letting me vent.

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Comments

Turgon

Sorry to hear about this. You have been treated like sh1t today. Your recruiter has a lot to answer for. Many of them do. It's not your fault but be a bit more bullish when you deal recruiters so you dont end up being cannon fodder sent to interview so someone can make a quota.

Roguetadhg

try getting a internship. while it may not pay - it's something. Atleast it's a foot in some door.

bud08

Roguetadhg wrote: »

try getting a internship. while it may not pay - it's something. Atleast it's a foot in some door.

I would love to get an internship, but I am not a college grad. Every one I have seen is college grad or pursuing. Would you suggest applying to those regardless that requirement? I feel desperate at this point.

Thanks for the positive thoughts.

Roguetadhg

bud08 wrote: »

I would love to get an internship, but I am not a college grad. Every one I have seen is college grad or pursuing. Would you suggest applying to those regardless that requirement? I feel desperate at this point.

Thanks for the positive thoughts.

I've heard of people getting work through internships that don't pay, as long as you work hard. It can't hurt to check out government, churches, hospitals, businesses for someone to do grunt work.

You'll be fine

When you give up is when you should be worried.

Although, if you give up - my cynical view point takes over and I find myself saying "That's good, then someone who hasn't given up can take your spot." Yeah, say that to your fiance once in public.

...I sleep on the floor a lot.

veritas_libertas

bud08 wrote: »

I am a career changer. That in itself must be a dirty word in IT, because I just had the worst interview of my life today.

I was told to prepare for an hour interview with the manager. Instead I met two managers for 15 minutes. When we sat down, they introduced themselves and then sat there saying nothing. They stared at their blackberries. I chitchatted and they finally spoke. They asked me nothing about my resume. Instead they posed maybe five questions about things unrelated to the posted position and my IT education.

I had come in for an entry level Help Desk. The only requirement was a High School Diploma. They were asking me about my experience with Juniper equipment (not listed on my resume and not in the job's reqs). One chuckled at my certifications. She asked If I could travel throughout the state, even though the job was 90% phone and 100% at that office. I tried to keep a smile and answer positively. The male manager ignored me most of the time only to chuckle inappropriately at what I said and typed on his blackberry. The female manager was nice at least but she ushered me out into the hallway because the next guy is coming in 10 minutes. What the hell???

I ended up showing myself out the door.

I have gone over and over in my head. I am confident they didn't mistake me for another applicant. Was it a stress interview? Is it yet another big business looking to add numbers to their applicant pool? Why waste me time and theirs?

I am so depressed about my job search. I have had 2 phone interviews that went great but with no replies back, my recruiter never returns my emails and now this disaster. I can't tell my partner about it anymore because I don't want him to feel like its his job to cheer me up.

It so aggravating and humiliating. I am contemplating just getting my CCNA and foregoing the PC Tech/Help Desk jobs. But what do I do about the gap in my resume?

I don't know what to do. Thanks for letting me vent.

What do you mean by gap? If you were considering going after the CCNP before getting some NOC or Network Administration experience I would think your pyramid looked top heavy, but not a CCNA.

Also, do you have your resume on Monster and Career Builder? If not that is something to consider.

bud08

Roguetadhg wrote: »

...I sleep on the floor a lot.

Thanks for the laugh. I needed it.

Turgon

bud08 wrote: »

I am a career changer. That in itself must be a dirty word in IT, because I just had the worst interview of my life today.

I was told to prepare for an hour interview with the manager. Instead I met two managers for 15 minutes. When we sat down, they introduced themselves and then sat there saying nothing. They stared at their blackberries. I chitchatted and they finally spoke. They asked me nothing about my resume. Instead they posed maybe five questions about things unrelated to the posted position and my IT education.

I had come in for an entry level Help Desk. The only requirement was a High School Diploma. They were asking me about my experience with Juniper equipment (not listed on my resume and not in the job's reqs). One chuckled at my certifications. She asked If I could travel throughout the state, even though the job was 90% phone and 100% at that office. I tried to keep a smile and answer positively. The male manager ignored me most of the time only to chuckle inappropriately at what I said and typed on his blackberry. The female manager was nice at least but she ushered me out into the hallway because the next guy is coming in 10 minutes. What the hell???

I ended up showing myself out the door.

I have gone over and over in my head. I am confident they didn't mistake me for another applicant. Was it a stress interview? Is it yet another big business looking to add numbers to their applicant pool? Why waste me time and theirs?

I am so depressed about my job search. I have had 2 phone interviews that went great but with no replies back, my recruiter never returns my emails and now this disaster. I can't tell my partner about it anymore because I don't want him to feel like its his job to cheer me up.

It so aggravating and humiliating. I am contemplating just getting my CCNA and foregoing the PC Tech/Help Desk jobs. But what do I do about the gap in my resume?

I don't know what to do. Thanks for letting me vent.

Go and get the CCNA. I think that should be first anyway in a networked world. You can do MS/Linux/UNIX/Novell box certs later if you dont want to play in the networking genre..which is a little rough

pacotaco

Hang in there. The fact that the people interviewing you stared at the blackberries and what seems like blew you off makes me think that 1. they are not professional which may lend to age 2. they already had someone (of their friends) lined up for the job.

There is a thread I read recently where someone had done some interning; small 1 and 2 week contract jobs, volunteering, etc. and put all that experience under one heading on their resume. You can explain further in the interview process about the span of experience.

I took a CCNA class with a guy that was a plumber. He hurt his back and is having to switch careers. I was surprised to learn he is in his late 40's (does not look like it). He has some basic IT working experience from years back (15?). I don't know what his transition plan is, but we all come from somewhere.

You have the right to be ticked off being treated like that, and they wasted your time. Try to move on and put out of your mind. Pick up a CCNA book and get to work

bud08

veritas_libertas wrote: »

What do you mean by gap? If you were considering going after the CCNP before getting some NOC or Network Administration experience I would think your pyramid looked top heavy, but not a CCNA.

Also, do you have your resume on Monster and Career Builder? If not that is something to consider.

I would have a work experience gap. I am working as a temp in my old field. The longer w/o any IT related experience is what worries me while getting my CCNA.

I haven't put my resume on Monster or CareerBuilder yet. I put my old career resume on CareerBuilder years ago and was flooded with sales positions. Has it gotten better?

tr1x

Don't let it bother you, it would have obviously been a terrible company to work for anyway. I would have left midway through the interview if anyone was texting and laughing, that's ridiculous.

Just keep searching - it takes a few tries to get the first job. I had to do a few interviews myself. Just keep at it.

pacotaco

bud08 wrote: »

I put my old career resume on CareerBuilder years ago and was flooded with sales positions. Has it gotten better?

Expect to get flooded with job listings for your old career. That is what I'm up against. I get flooded with BA positions. That doesn't mean I wouldn't put it up there and find out for sure. You can always tweak it later when you find out what might get you noticed for your help desk search.

Bokeh

Look at volunteermatch.org . You might find some IT related positions that you could volunteer for. I have seen several for helping recondition machines for use, or organization has a computer lab and they need people a few hours a week to help others get online, etc. This day and age, every little bit helps!

contentpros

Bud,

Don't let it get to you. If your experience during the interview was this bad imagine what it would be like to work for these knuckleheads! I hope that you get a callback or offer and when you do please take a moment (politely) to explain to the hiring manager or recruiter that based on your experience during the interview they couldn't pay you enough to work there. Constructive comments like this will generally make it back up the chain. People like this tarnish the company name and brand which most managers will want to know about especially if word gets out and impacts the companies' ability to hire quality people. Sadly, the two people you dealt with likely think that they are the best managers or bosses to work for.

One other thing I hope you and other candidates will remember is that you are in as much control of the interview as they are. I know it may sound crazy or not seem possible but in most cases it is the truth. I will admit that every once and a while you will end up with some rude jerk where salvaging the interview is worthless but those are people you probably are glad you will never have to see again. We have all had interviews where we sit across from an interviewer or panel of interviewers and they ask a question and we give an answer. This process is rinse and repeat for the next 30 or 45 minutes until they ask "do you have any questions" which most candidates never do and then you are told we should contact you in some random time frame and you are ushered out the door.

I talked about this before in this thread http://www.techexams.net/forums/jobs-degrees/58771-managers-those-conducting-interviews.html#post458640 so I don't want to rehash too much. Don't be afraid to ask a question to give a better answer. Not everything is black and white. Sometime the follow question you ask will draw out more details so that you can give better answers. This also lets the interviewer know that you are really engaged in the discussion. When you hit one of the uncomfortable silences ask another question to draw out more info. This will help you figure out if they are looking for a warm body or somebody with a particular skill-set or to solve a problem they are currently experiencing. Take the reigns, ask them what they are try to solve for. What are the challenges that you can help them solve. Start working on building a 30, 60, 90+ day road-map of what the expectation is and why you are the person they can't afford not to hire. Remember, this is the time that you need to be a salesman as well as a geek and sell yourself. Don't be afraid to stump the interviewer. If you do stump them it will show them that they may need to put some thought into what they really need or that you are a forward thinker and are worth a second look. It can be really hard to get yourself into this habit but if you do you will probably see a higher success rate.

Slightly off topic but still something to remember as a candidate, go through your resume and the job posting with a fine tooth comb. If you list experience with something or have experience with something directly listed in the posting, have some specific examples ready to share. If I ask you if you have experience with blah and you give me a "yeah" or "yes" i probably will think your not being 100% truthful. If you give me a short example of how you've deployed or used blah then I am more likely to believe you have the actual experience. As a hiring manager I expect a little fluff/padding/exaggeration about your experience. Giving me real world scenarios help me form a better opinion about how accurate your resume really is.

HTH
~Cp

bud08

Thanks for all the kind words.
I applied to some small private schools and put my resume on monster. See what happens there.

Going to hit the books even harder.

I am still fuming but I need to let those things go. So hey I learned something from the experience.

Turgon

bud08 wrote: »

Thanks for all the kind words.
I applied to some small private schools and put my resume on monster. See what happens there.

Going to hit the books even harder.

I am still fuming but I need to let those things go. So hey I learned something from the experience.

The recruiter you dealt with, and the people who saw you are dorks. This has happened to all of us at some point. Press on. Just be more picky about your requirements in future when a recruiter returns your call.

bababooey1

I had an interview years ago that was similar but not quite as bad. Two guys were interviewing me and they both just looked annoyed. At one point one guy asked if I had AD experience and the other answered for me "sure he does, it's right here on his resume" as he points to it with a chuckle. They were just miserable people at a miserable company, and so were the Tools that interviewed you. Don't give up, just use it as fuel. Also, getting the CCNA certainly won't hurt.

BTW, I and a lot of people changed careers into IT. I did it at 30 and I'm 41 now. If I can do it anyone can.

MentholMoose

tr1x wrote: »

Don't let it bother you, it would have obviously been a terrible company to work for anyway. I would have left midway through the interview if anyone was texting and laughing, that's ridiculous.

Agreed 100%. It's tough to break into IT, but try to look on the bright side, you won't have to work for those jerks.

paul78

My goodness... That has got to be the rudeness thing that I've heard in a while. Forget that's it's unprofessional, that is just crass behavior.

Most corporate culture start with the tone from the top. If that is how their managers behave - you absolutely do not want to be associated with a company like that.

Good luck with your search. I would pass on these bozos even if they called you back.

rep21

Those people sound like complete idiots. Count yourself lucky to not work for them.

Also, don't worry about a gap in work experience. I didn't have a job for EIGHT years, which was reflected on my resume, when I got hired at my current helpdesk position. I suffered from severe depression after my dad committed suicide and didn't have a job for so long that I was scared to work. It took 11 interviews before I got hired for my first IT position. My enthusiasm for IT got me to the final two/three of many of those interviews. Finally someone took a chance on me and now everything is going great. I've settled in to a normal working routine. So don't give up. Just keep applying and someone will hire you if you present yourself with enough desire. Work harder than those other applicants and you won't have to say anything to your partner at all because you will be employed in no time.

drew726

The first interview I ever had was completely terrible. Something I would never forget, but I took it as a learning experience for future interviews. Going into any interview, I always think that this one will never be as bad as my first one. But anyways man, the way those guys treated you, you were probably lucky not to work there anyways. Keep working hard, you might have to start off volunteering first, which was what I did. I found this forum about 2 years ago after getting laid off with no degree and no certs. I'm actually doing pretty well now and you can too. Just keep working hard.

cmitchell_00

Never give up or stay discouraged just keep moving forward until you get your chance! The door will open up because it's alot of I.T. work out here you just have to keep applying.

coffeeluvr

Stay Positive....I know it is easier said than done.

afcyung

I would have been hauled in cuffs after inserting a blackberry into someones rectum. Nothing sends me through the roof like just strait up disrespecting someone.

Akaricloud

Remember, interviews are as much about them as they are about you. Situations like that are really good chances to take control of the interview, learn more about them, their needs and then tell them how you can help. It's fairly common for interviewers to ask you about something (such as Juniper) that you know nothing about just to better see your thought process and attitude.

It sounds like you probably wouldn't have wanted to work for that company anyways but it's always good to learn from bad experiences.

EZ21

bud08 wrote: »

I am a career changer. That in itself must be a dirty word in IT, because I just had the worst interview of my life today.

I was told to prepare for an hour interview with the manager. Instead I met two managers for 15 minutes. When we sat down, they introduced themselves and then sat there saying nothing. They stared at their blackberries. I chitchatted and they finally spoke. They asked me nothing about my resume. Instead they posed maybe five questions about things unrelated to the posted position and my IT education.

I had come in for an entry level Help Desk. The only requirement was a High School Diploma. They were asking me about my experience with Juniper equipment (not listed on my resume and not in the job's reqs). One chuckled at my certifications. She asked If I could travel throughout the state, even though the job was 90% phone and 100% at that office. I tried to keep a smile and answer positively. The male manager ignored me most of the time only to chuckle inappropriately at what I said and typed on his blackberry. The female manager was nice at least but she ushered me out into the hallway because the next guy is coming in 10 minutes. What the hell???

I ended up showing myself out the door.

I have gone over and over in my head. I am confident they didn't mistake me for another applicant. Was it a stress interview? Is it yet another big business looking to add numbers to their applicant pool? Why waste me time and theirs?

I am so depressed about my job search. I have had 2 phone interviews that went great but with no replies back, my recruiter never returns my emails and now this disaster. I can't tell my partner about it anymore because I don't want him to feel like its his job to cheer me up.

It so aggravating and humiliating. I am contemplating just getting my CCNA and foregoing the PC Tech/Help Desk jobs. But what do I do about the gap in my resume?

I don't know what to do. Thanks for letting me vent.

I was treated the exact same way as you when I first started interviewing for my first jobs out of college. Just move on, trust me, that company was probably a bunch of losers anyways. Real companies respects all people who they interview. You just interviewed with unprofessional idiots. Have you tried volenteering at a school. Thats how I got my first start. Helping out for FREE for a few months and made friends with the superintendent, then got offered part time work for $18/hr 3.5 hrs a day to now working full time making $3K+/month. And I did all of this within 9 months. So just keep pushing, you'll get there.

zenhound

contentpros wrote: »

One other thing I hope you and other candidates will remember is that you are in as much control of the interview as they are. I know it may sound crazy or not seem possible but in most cases it is the truth. I will admit that every once and a while you will end up with some rude jerk where salvaging the interview is worthless but those are people you probably are glad you will never have to see again. We have all had interviews where we sit across from an interviewer or panel of interviewers and they ask a question and we give an answer. This process is rinse and repeat for the next 30 or 45 minutes until they ask "do you have any questions" which most candidates never do and then you are told we should contact you in some random time frame and you are ushered out the door.

I talked about this before in this thread http://www.techexams.net/forums/jobs-degrees/58771-managers-those-conducting-interviews.html#post458640 so I don't want to rehash too much. Don't be afraid to ask a question to give a better answer. Not everything is black and white. Sometime the follow question you ask will draw out more details so that you can give better answers. This also lets the interviewer know that you are really engaged in the discussion. When you hit one of the uncomfortable silences ask another question to draw out more info. This will help you figure out if they are looking for a warm body or somebody with a particular skill-set or to solve a problem they are currently experiencing. Take the reigns, ask them what they are try to solve for. What are the challenges that you can help them solve. Start working on building a 30, 60, 90+ day road-map of what the expectation is and why you are the person they can't afford not to hire. Remember, this is the time that you need to be a salesman as well as a geek and sell yourself. Don't be afraid to stump the interviewer. If you do stump them it will show them that they may need to put some thought into what they really need or that you are a forward thinker and are worth a second look. It can be really hard to get yourself into this habit but if you do you will probably see a higher success rate.

Slightly off topic but still something to remember as a candidate, go through your resume and the job posting with a fine tooth comb. If you list experience with something or have experience with something directly listed in the posting, have some specific examples ready to share. If I ask you if you have experience with blah and you give me a "yeah" or "yes" i probably will think your not being 100% truthful. If you give me a short example of how you've deployed or used blah then I am more likely to believe you have the actual experience. As a hiring manager I expect a little fluff/padding/exaggeration about your experience. Giving me real world scenarios help me form a better opinion about how accurate your resume really is.

HTH
~Cp

This is such valuable advice. Interviewing skills are just gold. I am kind of amazed at times how many of my fellow IT people, often people much more skilled and knowledgeable than I, ignore the interviewing skillset. Tech skills are mostly what will see you through in IT but being able to ace an interview with ease will never hurt. And it's a skill that can be learned, just like many of us are teaching ourselves various tech fields. I'm not saying I'd spend a ton of time or money on it, but a couple books and some CBT training have done wonders for me in this arena.

Turgon

contentpros wrote: »

Bud,

Don't let it get to you. If your experience during the interview was this bad imagine what it would be like to work for these knuckleheads! I hope that you get a callback or offer and when you do please take a moment (politely) to explain to the hiring manager or recruiter that based on your experience during the interview they couldn't pay you enough to work there. Constructive comments like this will generally make it back up the chain. People like this tarnish the company name and brand which most managers will want to know about especially if word gets out and impacts the companies' ability to hire quality people. Sadly, the two people you dealt with likely think that they are the best managers or bosses to work for.

One other thing I hope you and other candidates will remember is that you are in as much control of the interview as they are. I know it may sound crazy or not seem possible but in most cases it is the truth. I will admit that every once and a while you will end up with some rude jerk where salvaging the interview is worthless but those are people you probably are glad you will never have to see again. We have all had interviews where we sit across from an interviewer or panel of interviewers and they ask a question and we give an answer. This process is rinse and repeat for the next 30 or 45 minutes until they ask "do you have any questions" which most candidates never do and then you are told we should contact you in some random time frame and you are ushered out the door.

I talked about this before in this thread http://www.techexams.net/forums/jobs-degrees/58771-managers-those-conducting-interviews.html#post458640 so I don't want to rehash too much. Don't be afraid to ask a question to give a better answer. Not everything is black and white. Sometime the follow question you ask will draw out more details so that you can give better answers. This also lets the interviewer know that you are really engaged in the discussion. When you hit one of the uncomfortable silences ask another question to draw out more info. This will help you figure out if they are looking for a warm body or somebody with a particular skill-set or to solve a problem they are currently experiencing. Take the reigns, ask them what they are try to solve for. What are the challenges that you can help them solve. Start working on building a 30, 60, 90+ day road-map of what the expectation is and why you are the person they can't afford not to hire. Remember, this is the time that you need to be a salesman as well as a geek and sell yourself. Don't be afraid to stump the interviewer. If you do stump them it will show them that they may need to put some thought into what they really need or that you are a forward thinker and are worth a second look. It can be really hard to get yourself into this habit but if you do you will probably see a higher success rate.

Slightly off topic but still something to remember as a candidate, go through your resume and the job posting with a fine tooth comb. If you list experience with something or have experience with something directly listed in the posting, have some specific examples ready to share. If I ask you if you have experience with blah and you give me a "yeah" or "yes" i probably will think your not being 100% truthful. If you give me a short example of how you've deployed or used blah then I am more likely to believe you have the actual experience. As a hiring manager I expect a little fluff/padding/exaggeration about your experience. Giving me real world scenarios help me form a better opinion about how accurate your resume really is.

HTH
~Cp

Yes some very good advice there, and while the OP had a bum steer interview and he's best off out it, we are all wise to work on the things you mentioned for the next interview. For me, when I have been hired it's because there was a sparkle between myself and the interviewer. Try to get that going on interview day!

Roguetadhg

Turgon wrote: »

Yes some very good advice there, and while the OP had a bum steer interview and he's best off out it, we are all wise to work on the things you mentioned for the next interview. For me, when I have been hired it's because there was a sparkle between myself and the interviewer. Try to get that going on interview day!

Like Vampires, IT persons sparkle now? :P

Turgon

Haven't you heard 'I dream of Wires?'

I am the final silence.
The last electrician alive.
They call me the sparkle..
I was the best I worked them all...

Robert Palmer - I Dream of Wires - YouTube

VAHokie56

afcyung wrote: »

I would have been hauled in cuffs after inserting a blackberry into someones rectum. Nothing sends me through the roof like just strait up disrespecting someone.

I am for this idea