Masters or CCIE?

jasong318

Hello all, I've really enjoyed reading these forums for the past couple months and have learned a lot from your responses. I now have a question for you guys that will hopefully produce some gems of knowledge that I've come to enjoy

I've been working in IT for 9 years, security for the past 2. I also just graduated from my local university with a BS in CS. I'm now at a cross roads. I can't decide whether to go ahead and start the WGU Masters in Info Security and Assurance program or pursue my CCIE Security. My current employer is a Cisco partner (and is a CCIE) so he is trying to get me to go ahead and commit to getting the CCIE first. He also has a Masters and sees it as not worth the time (his was from the same local uni, not WGU, not InfoSec). He's willing to help pay for the exam/lab attempts, training materials, and travel costs. This is pretty huge and I'm grateful for his confidence and his generosity. Although, it is not entirely altruistic as the company would benefit from having two CCIE's on the payroll as that bumps you up to Silver on the partner program.

On a day-to-day basis, I install/configure/maintain/troubleshoot Cisco security products for clients. I also provide pentesting and vulnerability assessment services, and that's what I most enjoy doing. I feel that getting my CCIE would kind of typecast me as a 'Cisco guy'. Plus, looking over job posting, most are looking for 'CCNP or CCIE', heck, I've even seen some ask for 'CCNA or CCNP or CCIE'. Not that I think I wouldnt be able to find a job with a CCIE, I just think having a Masters opens more doors. I can transfer 3 certifications into the program and be left with 25 CU's which I feel pretty confident that I can knock that out in one term.

So, here's my question, what would you do? What have you seen out there that would make you choose one track over the other? I plan on doing both eventually, I guess because I just finished my undergrad the local progression seems to be to knock out the Masters and then the CCIE.

Sorry to ramble, this has been bugging me for awhile!

erpadmin

I'm curious. Do you have a wife and kids?

Do you have anything else going on in your life that may disrupt CCIE studies?

I can tell you this much, a MS would require a time commitment too, but not as bad as obtaining a CCIE, at least based on the few threads I've read in the CCIE section of this board.

yamaj615

If your company has offered to help pay for some of the costs, i'd say pursue CCIE. I'm nowhere near that level yet but from what i've read it can get pretty pricey.

You mentioned that having a master degree will open more doors. Do you plan on leaving the company anytime soon? If not go CCIE, then go for the Masters. In my opinion, i think the CCIE Security is more valuable than a MS degree because of the difficulty and respect it commands.

I also have a BS but in IT and i'm trying to decide should I go for a MS in MIS after my CCNP studies or should i wait and start CISSP. I guess it boils down to your immediate goals.

BTW Congrats on graduating!!

Valsacar

That's a tough one, but as yama said if they are willing to pay I'd go for the CCIE. Of course, that is if Cisco is where you want to stay, which I would assume it is if you're even thinking about CCIE.

@yama, the MIS would help you in studying for the CISSP. Unless you really need that CISSP soon, I'd do the MS first and use that as part of your prep for CISSP.

Forsaken_GA

What are your goals?

If you want to stay a tech monkey, then go for the CCIE first, it'll give you the more immediate return. If you want to transition out of operations and move towards management, prioritize the masters

Slowhand

It's a tough call. On the one hand, your boss is willing to pay your way for the CCIE. On the other, you mentioned having enough units to transfer that you might be able to knock the Master's degree out in one or two terms. If your boss is willing to pay for the CCIE path at any time, however, then it seems like the logical thing for you to do is do the graduate degree now and then head for the big-bad-lab once you're done. As Forsaken_GA mentioned, the CCIE is more of a 'hands dirty' kind of cert, while a Master's degree and the aforementioned CISSP is definitely geared towards getting out of the trenches and into a manager's chair. It really depends on where you goals are, in the end.

As for being 'typecast', I wouldn't worry too much about it. While the CCIE studies are obviously Cisco-centric, I've met CCIEs and CCIE candidates who branch out into pretty much every area of networking. Cisco's been around a long time and their technologies are either emulated by or emulate those of other vendors. You shouldn't have any trouble marketing yourself outside Cisco-land if you're CCIE certified, regardless of the speciality. Heck, I see countless wanted ads on Craigslist, Dice, Careerbuilder, etc. that ask for Cisco certs even though the job-description clearly states that they run networking equipment from other vendors.

Forsaken_GA

Yup, even Cisco's competitors recognize the value of Cisco certification. Both Juniper and HP have fast track programs for their own certifications aimed directly at getting Cisco folks quickly certified on their own gear.

Everyone respects the CCIE, no matter which vendor you use.

PsychoFin

Yup and if you look at job ads by other vendors they even ask for ccie, that definitely says something.

powerfool

Good choice to make, between the to of these items.

My first thought... there is no such thing as altruism. It doesn't exist, it never will, and I don't think rational behavior could survive if it did (not that all people are rational or that rational people are so all of the time). Even if something is done for someone else's benefit, there is some return for the individual that is "giving"... whether it is simply the satisfaction of the act or another number to tack onto the Cisco Partner program.

That being said... there are rarely any instances where your current personal development goals will match up with an employer that is willing to really support your efforts and process. I would say, for this reason alone, that you should seriously consider the CCIE. And if you go with the CCIE Security, that will develop on your CCNP Security and your general trend of working on security related endeavors.

Afterwards, you will be able to breeze through most of the WGU program, especially since you already have some of the certs that are in the program. If anyone is looking for a "big honking certification" to shoot for after that program... I would recommend the CISSP, as the overall program is geared to prepared individuals for it. Which makes me the the CCIE now is better... then work on the MS... and then you can work on the CISSP throughout the program, if that is interesting to you.

Regardless, you have to do all of it and we are just some schmoes on the Internet.

Best wishes.

jasong318

@erpadmin: Just the wife, and she's been very patient with me getting my CS degree. She also has her Masters and is a big fan of anyone continuing their education, and she knows that the CCIE is well respected and will further my career, so she is willing to support me no matter which path I take. The only other thing I have coming up is the CISSP exam in June, and then I'm free and clear, so to speak.

@yamaj615: Thanks, and good luck with the CISSP!

Everyone else, thank you for all your advice. I think I will knock out the CISSP and then pursue the CCIE and then my Masters. You're right, if my employer is willing to provide me with the necessary financial backing and resources I would be a fool to turn it down!

halaakajan

CCIE is the Phd of Networking

the_Grinch

I agree CCIE is the way to go at this point. College will always be there, but you won't always find an employer who is willing to pay for all the costs of the CCIE. While geared towards Cisco, you will still have knowledge that will span many products and vendors. Good luck!

demonfurbie

a CCIE can do nothing but help you with a masters degree later

Iristheangel

Welcome to the forums, Jason.

If it's a choice between a Masters and a CCIE, I'd look at the numbers. There are hundreds of thousands (if not millions) of people out there that have a grad degree in IT/CS/EE/MIS, but there are only around 26,000 CCIEs in the entire world. The best ROI is usually the CCIE in every case if you want to be in a technical role.

I, personally, believe that the CCIE exam is harder than the CISSP or any grad degree you can get. It's also my personal belief that it's one of the best things to have on your resume out of the many other vendor specific certifications out there and degrees you can get. That being stated, you have to be realistic about how hard it's going to be. I've seen guys who work at Cisco spend half a decade studying for the CCIE and failing their first few attempts. The pass rate on a CCIE is only around 26%. To put it in perspective, the BAR exam to become a lawyer has a 48% pass rate and medical board exams pass rates range from 65-94%. It's a beast. You'll dedicate hundreds of hours and potentially tens of thousands of dollars into preparation only to have a 75% chance of failing. But is it worth it? Yes. Absolutely. If you choose this route, understand what you're signing up for. It's a lot different than studying for 3-4 months for an exam and getting that instant gratification when you pass. It'll be at LEAST 18 months of hard studying, lab work, and money spent. You'll want to give up and wonder if you made the wrong choice. If you get that certification at the end of all that work, it'll be worth it.

Weigh the pros and cons. Make whatever choice that is the best for you and your situation.

jamesp1983

the_Grinch wrote: »

I agree CCIE is the way to go at this point. College will always be there, but you won't always find an employer who is willing to pay for all the costs of the CCIE. While geared towards Cisco, you will still have knowledge that will span many products and vendors. Good luck!

x2. I wish my employer would pay for my CCIE.

jasong318

Thanks everyone for your kind words and advice. I think after I sit for the CISSP in June I will start on the CCIE. I don't have any kids and my wife is very supporting of furthering education and career so time-management shouldn't be an issue. And you're right, if my employer is willing to support me in attaining my CCIE than I would be a fool to squander that opportunity, the Masters can be done at anytime. Good luck to everyone else on their endeavors!

erpadmin

Look forward to reading your CCIE thread at some point.

My first thought, in your case, would have been to get the CCIE instead of the MS. Since your wife is cool, then I stand by that.

Mike-Mike

I wouldn't consider it a debate, CCIE all day

spiderjericho

I'm late, but if your employer is willing to foot the bill, I'd take the opportunity. If he sends you to a written class/course, two lab courses an offer access to equipment, it would be valuable.

I know people with their masters who don't have a job, but I don't know anyone with a CCIE who doesn't have a job.

Good luck to you with the CISSP.

NOC-Ninja

CCIE but it demands a lot of time. You'll understand everything when you're in that situation.

instant000

Two questions:

1. How did the CISSP go?
2. How is the CCIE prep going?

Brain_Power

Ccie!!!

NotHackingYou

I'll throw out a different opinion - both. And here's why. You can knock out the Masters in one term, then do the CCIE and reap the best of both worlds. 9 years experience, BS in CS, MS in InfoSec and a CCIE? You could go anywhere. You will be just fine with either the MS or the CCIE but take an extra 6 months, get the MS and then have your employer pay for the CCIE.