Affordable Online PhD Programs

So, while I just finished my MS in December and planned to take a rather extensive break, I am considering PhD programs to aid in my master plan... reducing my child's tuition bill when she starts college. I need to find a PhD program that I don't have to pay more than $5k/year. If that is because I can go at a slower pace or because the cost is low enough matters not... also, I need for it to take my MS into consideration. I was looking into Capella, but they are over $4k/quarter (they will accept up to 32 quarter hours as transfer credit).

The $5k/year limit is due to my tuition reimbursement limit. Since the goal is to lower my expenses, I don't want to exceed my "free" money.

Also, I am choosing a PhD over a different MS or something else that I might like because it could assist me in some of my other career goals.

I am also open to non-online or partially online courses that work with minimal residency.

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jfitzg

Do you specifically want a PHD or just a doctorate degree? What are you going to do with it? Teach?

edit: FYI, getting a doctorate degree will most likely NOT help you in your career path, unless you plan on teaching that is.

ptilsen

Googled around quite a bit because the topic interests me as well. I am looking at the University of Minnesota, but it's way outside your price range. After my Googling, I'm concluding that even a bottom-dollar online-only graduate degree in Computer Science is not achievable for under $300 a credit in-state or under $600/credit out of state. Even at a slow place and in-state, we're talking $5K or more a year. To be honest, I'm not sure I'd invest my time in anything cheaper based on what I've seen. A doctorate from a mediocre school is probably not worth the time, never mind the price.

If your career goals are to be a software engineer or something of the like at a tech titan, Phd is absolutely going to help you. If it's to be a senior-level manager, it can help you there, too.

Not sure if you were looking for CS, CIS, business, or something else, but I doubt it matters much. A graduate degree is probably going to run you well over $20K, online or not, and unless you want to take forever it won't be doable in $5K a year. Heck, I go half-time to the cheapest university in my state (to my knowledge), and it costs me more than $5K for my undergraduate.

jfitzg

ptilsen wrote: »

If your career goals are to be a software engineer or something of the like at a tech titan, Phd is absolutely going to help you. If it's to be a senior-level manager, it can help you there, too.

For every one person that has used their PHD to get a senior level management or software engineer job that you see, I can show you 30 unemployed ones. This is the biggest misconception out there, a doctorate degree will NOT land you a senior level management position, or even a senior level position anywhere really. There are countless threads on this over at degreeinfo.com, the doctorate level degree is good for things that require research such as being a chemist, lawyer, or doing any form of research for a private company. A PHD will get you a research job (if you can find one), its not going to get you a promotion to CEO. Here is a good article to read, note reason 10.

12 reasons not to get a PhD - CBS News

I actually have my project and program management grad professor to thank me for this lesson, as I was heading down this path myself. I am now taking a similar (but cheaper) route, but I realize that this doctorate wont get me my dream job, in fact I will be leaving it off my resume when I do move positions in a couple of years. What it WILL allow me to do is teach part time (and inspire my kids to get a good education as well hopefully)

demonfurbie

i thought about doing phd after masters but ive desided that the investment in time and money wouldnt be worth it ... i dont think i would recover the cost

i think it would be better to get some high end certs (i see ya have some) and branch out into things like pmp and ITIL and go from there. you could even do obscure things in the tech world like hpux

ITMonkey

One would think that post-graduate work would expose you to new technologies -- perhaps even breaking ground with classmates in making a venture capital startup.

UnixGuy

PhD is an apprenticeship in research, it leads to either a research job or a lecturer position in academia. Academia is very difficult to break into (much MUCH more difficult with a cheap online PhD).

If you want to get into academia then do a full time on campus PhD from a decent uni. It takes 6 yrs on average, and it has to be funded (tuition waiver + small stipend to help you survive). But after that you will need to do post docs until you land a full time tenured position (if ever). Hint: calculate the opportunity cost.

If cutting the tuition costs for your child is your goal, then I recommend moving up in the corporate leader to land a management position where the money you get will help in paying tuition because academia doesn't pay well at all. Perhaps an MBA will take you further IMHO.

Asif Dasl

I don't know about PhD's but what I do know is $5000 increasing by 3% inflation per year, invested in the stock market (with dividends reinvested!) and a low return of 10% for 15 years would result in $205,801. That would reduce your childs tuition considerably and probably send them to Harvard too...

Ivanjam

Dakota State D.Sc. in Information Systems:
Program: Information Systems, D.Sc. - Dakota State University - Acalog ACMS

Tuition rates:
Tuition, Fees, Other Costs - Dakota State University - Acalog ACMS

powerfool

Thanks to those that offered some insight.

I think that some of you may have missed the point, however. I am getting $5k/year in tuition reimbursement from my employer, so it isn't a matter of taking $5k/year and investing it versus paying $5k/year for graduate education... it is a matter of not getting $5k/year or getting $5k/year for education. As far as career path, there is one teaching job that I am interested that prefers a PhD but would be okay with an MS (which I already have). Other than that, my ventures into academia would only be adjunct and I can do that already.

In regards to lowering my child's tuition, each student you have in your household will slash the "expected family contribution" of each child because the EFC is per family... so EFC/(# of student in your household).

In regards to career advice, I am good there... I make good money and I am 15 years into this.

I think my other option is to look at other graduate opportunities. There are many post-masters graduate certificates (such as this one from DePaul), though they don't really help you further down the doctorate path unless it is something with that school, as they tend to limit what they allow you to transfer in.

fiftyo

jfitzg wrote: »

Here is a good article to read, note reason 10.

12 reasons not to get a PhD - CBS News

A very biased and perhaps even dumb article imho. Seemingly the author herself isn't a P. hD either. However, the discussion is hard to tackle due to the fact PhD degrees are in every field, which means the statisics you get are extremely flawed, and even in most cases useless. While a degree in arts/literature/languages probably wont get you a job matching with your skillset, a degree in IT/engineering probably will.
Besides we live in a developing world, who knows, perhaps tomorrow's jobs will require higher degree deplomas due to its complexity evolving.

powerfool

fiftyo wrote: »

A very biased and perhaps even dumb article imho. Seemingly the author herself isn't a P. hD either. However, the discussion is hard to tackle due to the fact PhD degrees are in every field, which means the statisics you get are extremely flawed, and even in most cases useless. While a degree in arts/literature/languages probably wont get you a job matching with your skillset, a degree in IT/engineering probably will.
Besides we live in a developing world, who knows, perhaps tomorrow's jobs will require higher degree deplomas due to its complexity evolving.

Yeah, it seems similar to his statement "For every one person that has used their PHD to get a senior level management or software engineer job that you see, I can show you 30 unemployed ones." That is similar to everyone denouncing the MBA because of all the unemployed folks that they know that have it.

Sorry, that is complete balderdash. You don't go from being completed employed/employable to not so after furthering your education... that's just ridiculous. It is much more common that these folks weren't employed or employable already and turned to furthering their education in the hope of finding a job more readily. Correlation does not equal causation. Similar sentiments are plentiful in regards to certifications, too... and most of the people complaining about the lack of value in certifications either have none or expected to start a new job in IT making $75k/year after attending some IT training courses and attaining an A+ and Network+, or even an MCSE/MCITP, for that matter, and then had a rude awakening.

I already have a job and have been steadily employed and have advanced in my career for the past 15 years. I'm not worried about it. Furthering your professional development with never hurt you; just don't forget that the biggest value you provide to employers is the actual work that you do, so don't get all educated and certified at the expense of doing real work.

demonfurbie

if your not paying anything (besides time) i would go for it .... however you need to put a price on your time as well ...

if i didnt have to pay cash for it id do it for the same reason im doing my masters, it doesnt expire unlike high end certs

jdancer

Go see geteducated.com and degreeinfo.com for list of accredited PhD programs.

If I had the cash and time, I would get the Indiana State University: College of Technology: Ph.D. in Technology Management

ptilsen

jfitzg wrote: »

For every one person that has used their PHD to get a senior level management or software engineer job that you see, I can show you 30 unemployed ones.

To be honest, I don't think you can even show me 30 unemployed PhDs. Not that they don't exist, but don't make silly claims like being able to point them out. If we're going with anecdotal evidence, all of the PhDs I've ever met are employed gainfully, many both in academia and prestigious industry positions. The unemployment rate of PhDs outside of academia certainly isn't the 97% you imply.

The unemployment rate of people with doctorates is lower than that of any education level. Perhaps there are certain subject areas for which PhDs face higher unemployment due to non-existent demand outside of academia, but I sincerely doubt Powerfool is looking at one of those subjects. And, as he put it, going from very well employed to unemployable because of getting a more advanced degree is just not gonna happen.

However, I do think it is wise to at least be cautious on going down this route. It's a lot of time and money. I just don't think I'd do it for any of the degrees that can be had for $5,000 a year. Personally, I'd go for the degree I want and pay the rest out of pocket. Even $5,000 is a big help.

powerfool

jdancer wrote: »

Go see geteducated.com and degreeinfo.com for list of accredited PhD programs.

If I had the cash and time, I would get the Indiana State University: College of Technology: Ph.D. in Technology Management

Dude, thanks! I will take a look. My wife is attending the ISU LPN-to-BSN program, that would make her day.

EDIT: So, I spoke with someone at ISU and it is a very interesting program. The courses are taken at various universities in the consortium. ISU would have a significant number of the overall courses as they are the degree granting institution and they are currently at $400/crhr., so four courses per year would be $4800. Also, if I started the program in the Fall, I could front load that first semester with additional courses as I would have more money available. Also, I would be able to transfer in up to 21 credit hours from my MS, depending on how they are evaluated (I already see courses with considerable overlap that are eligible).

If I need to take an extra course here or there, it is not so unreasonable a cost that I couldn't afford it, either.

Each school charges their own rate for courses, costing more or less than ISU's rate.

Once candidacy status is reached (perhaps 3 years into the program), work must be completed within six years. So, I definitely can stretch this out a bit. I completed my undergrad at a B&M school attending full-time in the evenings in 4.5 years, so I think that including the work I complete before candidacy status and my transfer credit, it should be doable within six years at 6 credit hours per semester, Fall and Spring only. This would be great because my eldest has 2-3 years left of high school (may be an early graduate) and then I have another that will follow by two years (and another four years later, but that is pretty far our there). I think that couple with my wife's desire to get an MS in Nursing Midwifery, we will have 3-4 concurrent students, which should dramatically help in our financial aid (which we need as we are in the dreaded spot of making too much money to qualify for much aid, but not enough to put us into a position of not regarding cost). Anyhow, the plan has always been that the wife will work and we will pay their tuition in cash, as needed.

An interesting fact is that many of the prestigious private schools have significant aid programs. We aren't getting much at all in the way of assistance for my wife, currently, at ISU... as state institution. However, I filled out the aid profile for Princeton and it said costs would be about $57k/year, but with their independent aid, we would only need to pay about $11k/year. That would be just about the same as my wife's full-time tuition at ISU, as this is all expenses at Princeton. Something to consider. Many private schools don't use the FAFSA... which I was unaware because my undergrad school is private and does use it.

JaneDoe

An online PhD program is a joke, but most good residential programs will allow you to leave campus after the first year or two for research and writing. Most PhD students are employed by their university and get free tuition, so find out about such options if you're interested in getting your PhD. PhDs take 5-8 years of full time study to complete, so unless you can quit work for a while, working half time on a PhD means it'll take you 10-16 years, a good portion of your working life, to complete. PhDs are for people who passionately love the act of studying more than people who are looking for career advancement. Where you get a PhD from matters a lot, as most people who will judge you based on it are academics themselves. If you get a PhD from an online university it won't be worth the time or money you put into it. If you get a PhD from MIT or CMU you will have recruiters hounding you, but again you will spend 8-10 years working very hard for little money to earn the credential from an elite school. PhD programs at elite schools are highly competitive as well, so unless you have a 4.0 the chances of getting accepted to them are slim. The value of the PhD is determined the prestige of the school you get it from, as is its difficulty. If you can get into a PhD program at Princeton and can afford to work for next to nothing for 10 years, go for it, but don't waste your time with less serious programs.

It's not the required courses that takes most of the time and makes PhDs the bear they are, it's the dissertation you have to write. A PhD dissertation is usually hundreds of pages long and must be all original research. I would be very concerned about a PhD program that insisted you finish everything in 6 years. At a prestigious university your dissertation will be a contribution to the industry, will look amazing on any resume and will put your name out there as a top researcher in your field. When you finish your PhD you should be a global expert on whatever topic your dissertation is on.

coty24

JaneDoe wrote: »

An online PhD program is a joke, but most good residential programs will allow you to leave campus after the first year or two for research and writing. Most PhD students are employed by their university and get free tuition, so find out about such options if you're interested in getting your PhD. PhDs take 5-8 years of full time study to complete, so unless you can quit work for a while, working half time on a PhD means it'll take you 10-16 years, a good portion of your working life, to complete. PhDs are for people who passionately love the act of studying more than people who are looking for career advancement. Where you get a PhD from matters a lot, as most people who will judge you based on it are academics themselves. If you get a PhD from an online university it won't be worth the time or money you put into it. If you get a PhD from MIT or CMU you will have recruiters hounding you, but again you will spend 8-10 years working very hard for little money to earn the credential from an elite school. PhD programs at elite schools are highly competitive as well, so unless you have a 4.0 the chances of getting accepted to them are slim. The value of the PhD is determined the prestige of the school you get it from, as is its difficulty. If you can get into a PhD program at Princeton and can afford to work for next to nothing for 10 years, go for it, but don't waste your time with less serious programs.

It's not the required courses that takes most of the time and makes PhDs the bear they are, it's the dissertation you have to write. A PhD dissertation is usually hundreds of pages long and must be all original research. I would be very concerned about a PhD program that insisted you finish everything in 6 years. At a prestigious university your dissertation will be a contribution to the industry, will look amazing on any resume and will put your name out there as a top researcher in your field. When you finish your PhD you should be a global expert on whatever topic your dissertation is on.

Here are my thoughts:

- I agree with some of what you are saying, but I feel there is an extreme bias in favor of B&M in your statement. I don't think a program is invalid because of the delivery of the courseware. I am willing to bet all colleges have an online presence, (including the elite colleges you wrote about) does that make their online offerings not as good?

- Also why isn't 6 years enough for finishing a PhD program?

- What if the candidate has family obligations as well; I really understand dedication to the program but what about when a person is done with the program of study. I think that living life is important as well and NOTHING is more important than the welfare of my family.

I am not here to start an argument, I just felt compelled to respond.

JaneDoe

- I agree with some of what you are saying, but I feel there is an extreme bias in favor of B&M in your statement. I don't think a program is invalid because of the delivery of the courseware. I am willing to bet all colleges have an online presence, (including the elite colleges you wrote about) does that make their online offerings not as good?

It has nothing to do with the offerings, it has more to do with connections and lack there of. The bias isn't toward B&M institutions isn't just mine, it's employer's and academia's as well. Online institutions just don't have the respect conventional schools do, don't be suckered by online diploma mills that tell you otherwise.

- What if the candidate has family obligations as well; I really understand dedication to the program but what about when a person is done with the program of study. I think that living life is important as well and NOTHING is more important than the welfare of my family.

This why many PhD students don't have families or have a spouse to support them. This is a good reason not to get a PhD.

- Also why isn't 6 years enough for finishing a PhD program?

6 years could be enough time to finish a PhD program but it may not be if you have family or work obligations as well. Starting a PhD program that kicks you out after 6 years is a hell of gamble if you have other obligations.

instant000

This post is an opinion (I'm not a PhD holder).

As a non-PhD holder, this is what I think the PhD boils down to:
step 1: the student is going to do their survey of the field (research what's already been done)
step 2: should come up with some idea they're going to research into that no one has before (thesis)
step 3: research topic, with continual feedback loop with mentors
step 4: go back to step 2, if necessary
step 5: get thesis approved
step 6: do additional research in thesis area, with continual feedback loop with mentors
step 7: write, with continual feedback loop with mentors
step 8: go back to step 6, if necessary
step 9: submit dissertation for approval
step 10: revise as necessary
step 11: get dissertation approved
step 12: successfully defend the dissertation
step 13: PhD

As far as whether or not this work is necessarily done on-campus or off-campus, in my opinion, it depends on what I consider professor-assisting work. That is, doing a PhD on campus has a big benefit to the professor, who uses the student as a Teaching Assistant (TA). I'm not sure that it helps the student so much. As far as TA work, I see it on the pages of several PhD programs as a requirement. Is this OK? I guess it works out great for the school, but does it necessarily help the student get their research done any faster? Or, what if you're on campus as a Research Assistant (RA)? Does this help the student, or does it help the professor? Is the professor more concerned about doing his /her research via the RA so the grant money comes in, or helping his/her student?

I honestly feel that it is more of (what have you done? versus where did you graduate from?) It's the work you've done that really matters. Once you get past your PhD, it is about what you have contributed to the field.

For example, Perlmann is famous because of what she has done, not because she went to MIT.

If it is not yet apparent, I encourage the OP to pursue a PhD.

Hope this helps.

NinjaBoy

JaneDoe wrote: »

An online PhD program is a joke, but most good residential programs will allow you to leave campus after the first year or two for research and writing. Most PhD students are employed by their university and get free tuition, so find out about such options if you're interested in getting your PhD. PhDs take 5-8 years of full time study to complete, so unless you can quit work for a while, working half time on a PhD means it'll take you 10-16 years, a good portion of your working life, to complete..

JaneDoe wrote: »

...6 years could be enough time to finish a PhD program but it may not be if you have family or work obligations as well. Starting a PhD program that kicks you out after 6 years is a hell of gamble if you have other obligations.

I have to disagree, the Open University (which is one of the leading Universitys in the UK) can offer the PhD program full time for 3 years full time or 6 years part time. The University even offers a shorter research degree program, the Master of Philosophy (MPhil) full time for 15 months or 24 months part time.

They offer these programs part-time for those of us (not that I'm doing one of these programs) who have to balance studies with work and family commitments.

JaneDoe wrote: »

PhDs are for people who passionately love the act of studying more than people who are looking for career advancement...

While, there is a percentage of people who this applies to. There is also a percentage of people who do this for career advancement; posts with significant leadership roles in academic environments, medical, industry, government and private organisations.

JaneDoe

PhD programs normally take varying amounts of time per student depending on what the student researches for their dissertation. Many of the most competitive PhD programs take around 10 years to complete. I would be suspicious of any PhD program that had a fixed amount of time to complete specified.

You're right that it's about what you contribute to the field, and that's why being at a university like MIT with world experts in the field makes a PhD more valuable.

powerfool

Probably not a wise or reasoned idea to make assumptions or blanket statements. Based on your profile information, I could make some assumptions, but they may very well be far off base.

I don't need any advice from folks giving me reasons to not do the program... I am a responsible adult that was seeking specific advice that several folks were willing to offer. Further, I wouldn't take time away from work to get further my education... I already work at one of the most prestigious consulting companies in the world and am doing very well there; I don't need any more education to advance my career. If I simply wanted to pursue education for its own sake, however, I don't need a school for that one bit.

the_Grinch

Tuition & Fees | Capitol College <---I'm guessing you want to stick to something information assurance based. Capitol College is a good school and well known. Do not, I repeat, do not go to a college such as Phoenix or Capella. I work for a research University and know a lot of professors on selection committees. I've been told that PhD's from those schools are often looked right over. Something to think about if you're going to put in the time and money.

powerfool

Thanks, good info. Yeah, I tend to shy away from that crowd anyhow.

Doyen

I'm curious powerfool, did you find the phd program you were looking for?