Could someone explain to me what is going on behind the scenes? (recruiter questions)

I had a surprise interview for a great job last week through a recruiting firm (it is a permanent, direct placement opportunity). Slightly outside my field of expertise, but it is something I could pick up very quickly. I liked the team and I liked the scope of work a lot. Benefits are good and it looks very stable (their most recent employee has been there for six years and they're a team of nine). The pay ranges from what I am making right now to right under 50% more than what I am making now.

So I talked to my recruiter today and she said that I was currently their top contender after interviewing several candidates, which is great. I may get an offer as early as Friday if they aren't dazzled by another candidate between now and then.

I asked her how salary negotiations would work once an offer was on the table. She said that she had presented me as an X candidate, with X being a number somewhat above what I'm making now, but still near the bottom of the range.

When I originally talked to her at the beginning of all of this (before any job was on offer), I mentioned X as the absolute bottom of my range, contingent on scope of work, benefits, pay structure, bonuses, the permanency of the position, and certain intangibles.

My question, then, is - is this normal? Do recruiters present candidates at a particular value before a job is offered? I definitely didn't ask her to do that, and I feel like I will have no room to negotiate if they do make an offer. From what I understood during the interview there wasn't much of a pay raise structure in place; X is a decent number for me (it's more than what I make now, specifically it's an 11% salary increase), but I don't think it will scale very well over the next few years and I'm just going to end up on the market again, which is not something I desire. The job would be a remarkable opportunity to learn new things and become a bona fide intermediate-level IT professional very quickly, but it would be longer hours than I am working, which could be problematic since I have kids and school. So there is some cost for me, it isn't all roses. I think it is still worth it, but at X it is pretty much ruined as a long-term opportunity unless I can renegotiate later.

I'm not really sure how I'm going to proceed if they make an offer of X on Friday. Maybe they'll find a better candidate and I won't have to worry about it.

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Comments

networker050184

The recruiter is going to do what it takes to get someone hired to make their commission. It's up to you to ensure you are taken care of. If you don't want to work for X amount then make a counter offer. Nothing else you can really do.

TechGuy215

***Note this is based on my own experience:

This is why i can't stand recruiters/headhunters. In all hontesty, they get paid a commision for filling jobs, PERIOD. They don't at all care about whether or not your skillset or experience matches a job posting, whether your are going to receive the salary you prefer, or whether or not you are even competent honestly.

At one point I made the mistake of posting my Resume on Monster. I got called literally every other hour, for job offer's in which the description of duties in no way shape or form matched the qualifications, expertises, and skillsets listed in my Resume. The truth is almost all of the recruiters have zero technical knowledge and are just hitting on keywords. Needless to say, I took my Resume down pretty fast.

I ALWAYS look for direct-hire positions and apply through the company themselves. If the company is too inept to have their own IT an HR department do the interviewing/hiring, then you probably wouldn't want to work for that company anyways.

Kreken

In my experience, some recruiters will fight for you to get the best terms and others will do it just for the commission. It's really hit or miss.

kohr-ah

Most people I know have had the same experience. The ones that do their job well and aren't trying to meet the quota to keep their job seem to fight for you and do better at it.

The ones trying to just make a quick buck on the other hand....

networker050184

Meeting the quota is doing their job well. You have to remember, you are not the recruiters customer, the company doing the hiring is.

iBrokeIT

Had this exact same thing happen to me recently. Just moved to this area, first meeting with a recruiter in the area and didn't know what the range was for my skill set.** I was stupid enough to give out my previous salary. The recruiter threw out a number that was 25% higher than what I made previously to which I shrugged and said maybe but I would have to further research the salaries for the area and positions I am looking at. The number sounded good because it was more than I previously made but again I didn't know how much I was worth.

They scheduled me for an interview a few days later which went well and I received an offer from the recruiter. That offer was for 25% higher salary than my previous salary. I used the days in between the initial meeting to meet with a few other recruiters, checked glassdoor, calculate the cost of living difference between the two locations and reviewed the salary thread on this forum. After my research I determined that the offer I was given was extremely low and only covered the cost of living increase over where I previously lived. It did not account for the additional role responsibilities and my recent professional improvements. I made a counter offer to the recruiter of a 65-75% increase and explained why I felt that it was necessary and market rate for my skills to the recruiter. They felt that was too big of gap to bridge and I was talked down offering the company a number that was 50% increase over my previous salary. My counter offer was rejected and I was disappointed because I REALLY liked that company and the owner.

The recruiter then called me a few days later stating they had another interview lined up for me and said: "just so we are on the same page I presented you as a candidate for (salary that was 50% more than previous salary) to the company". I was extremely turned off by that fact they took my absolute minimum and ran with it to another company when I stated I wanted to be in a range that was a 65-75% increase but went to the interview anyways. Again, interview went well, liked the company but it would take a week or two for them to get approval for the new position from management which was fine by me because I was taking a VMware class the following week.

That night I went online and searched for open positions. I found a different recruiting firm that actually posted the ranges for two positions I was interested in. One was a W2 position that offered a 70-80% increase in salary for me and the other was a 1099 6 month contract position that offered a range that a 80% - 110% increase for me. Interview both places and look that 1099 contract offer and ended up with a 94% increase in salary. Obviously since that is a 1099 rate it isnt actually a 93% increase due to stuff like additional taxes, no pto ect. I took the 1099 position because I am enrolled in self+spouse benefits through my wife employer, there is a strong chance that I will be able to come on board at or slightly above that rate once the contract is up and it give me the ability to work with a wide variety of technologies so given those factors I was looking at pure $$ now and in the near future.

Hopefully my experience can provide some insight and guidance on how to navigate things with recruiters. You should never accept an offer on the spot, always take time think it over even if you are going to accept it. If you aren't comfortable with an offer after thinking it over make a counter offer and if it is reject be prepared to walk. I feel if you don't do you research, aren't willing to make counter offers and turn offers down then you have little leverage and you aren't going to make your full potential. Obviously your results are going to vary but those are the things that I did.

**I moved from western SD to the Twin Cities and went from working a 100 user/10 server environment to working corporate IT.

treehouse

I really appreciate all of the feedback, guys. I think I understand what is going on here and I have a counteroffer strategy ready to go. I am absolutely prepared to walk away from an offer if they won't budge from the low figure that the recruiter pushed out. I'm also laying out my salary expectations more clearly for future opportunities. I still hope this one works out, but I have a steady job now and I've only been on the market for a little over a month. My resume will be more solid in one year if I stay my current course, so they don't really have much leverage if they're going to be stingy.

iBrokeIT

treehouse wrote: »

I really appreciate all of the feedback, guys. I think I understand what is going on here and I have a counteroffer strategy ready to go. I am absolutely prepared to walk away from an offer if they won't budge from the low figure that the recruiter pushed out. I'm also laying out my salary expectations more clearly for future opportunities. I still hope this one works out, but I have a steady job now and I've only been on the market for a little over a month. My resume will be more solid in one year if I stay my current course, so they don't really have much leverage if they're going to be stingy.

That's an excellent mindset and strategy, best of luck to you.

Slithy

Kreken wrote: »

In my experience, some recruiters will fight for you to get the best terms and others will do it just for the commission. It's really hit or miss.

Are there methods to determine under which mind set a recruiter is operating? Obviously, if you get continuously lowballed like OP/others that will answer it, but is there any way to seek out recruiters that are more likely to fight for terms?

dave330i

Don't understand OP's difficulty. Based on your post, you haven't started salary negotiation. Until you sign an offer letter, you're free to renegotiate as much as you want.

TechGuy215 wrote: »

I ALWAYS look for direct-hire positions and apply through the company themselves. If the company is too inept to have their own IT an HR department do the interviewing/hiring, then you probably wouldn't want to work for that company anyways.

It's cheaper for companies to use recuriters to find employees. Paying comission is cheaper than hiring fulltime HR employees.

powmia

Treehouse... You are worth X, because you said X was the absolute minimum you will work for. You ended negotiations the moment you said that.

Kreken

Slithy wrote: »

Are there methods to determine under which mind set a recruiter is operating? Obviously, if you get continuously lowballed like OP/others that will answer it, but is there any way to seek out recruiters that are more likely to fight for terms?

I wasn't able to tell until the offer was made. If you get continuously low-balled, raise your minimum requirements you are willing to work for. I was actually burned by this too but after declining an offer, I was called by the company with a counter-offer.

@TechGuy215
Some industries/companies go only through recruiting agencies and don't do direct hire. Hedge funds are such companies. Plus, on the other side, when a recruiter sends in your resume to a company, you are guaranteed that at least it will be looked at. When you send it directly to HR, it could just get lost in a stack of other resumes and never even get to a hiring manager.