What separates people who stagnate from people who go high in their careers?

Is it mostly lethargy and lack of interest in IT, or is it more due to prioritizing family and other endeavors? I know of some people who have been computer repair techs for 20 years, and I'm not sure what they make, but I'd be surprised if it was more than 40k. Why didn't they go into networking? Security? Administration? Why not sit down and study up the ladder: CCNA to CCNP to CCIE? Or CEH to OSCP to OSCE?

It seems very few people really try for the top. They find a comfy niche and decide, "This is as far as I'm gonna go." Something in their brain clicked and they decided to accept their station in life and never go beyond. I'm not saying this is bad, but I'm just trying to understand the mindset.

I feel like I have to keep going, and no goal achieved ever seems to be enough. There's always another. Perhaps one day that will change, but I'm not sure what might change it.

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dontstop

UncleB wrote: »

I recommend that rather than concentrating on what specific tech is the next target for your studies, you focus on what it is about these which are meaningful. Are you the burly defender between the business and the evil black hats out there, do you see the code like the matrix and feel at one with the zeros (pun intended) or do you just like the big pay cheque that allows you to be a semi-professional ballroom dancer in your own time.

The essence of this is "know thyself".

Honestly never thought about it this way.

TechGromit

NavyMooseCCNA wrote: »

In my situation my company actively discourages me from getting additional certifications. The tuition reimbursement, before it was removed as a benefit, did not cover certifications and only certain academic programs.

You have to wonder about the mindset of management, they must subscribe to the if we make them better employees, they will leave for better jobs mentality.

anhtran35

I remember talking to an SA who interview me for my current position. He stated: I have not move on to another company cause I'm tired of dealing with "A" holes!

NavyMooseCCNA

TechGromit wrote: »

You have to wonder about the mindset of management, they must subscribe to the if we make them better employees, they will leave for better jobs mentality.

Putting it mildly...we also just lost spousal coverage on our health insurance and our Healthcare Reimbursement Account. More than a few of the people here pay through the nose because our spouses aren't in jobs that offer health insurance. Instead of taking the time to look for my wife's new health insurance, I am putting additional effort into getting a better job.

EagerDinosaur

I've worked with several people like this. I think some of their reasons are:

1) They have families and busy lives outside work. Learning new technical skills oftens involves spending a lot of personal time studying and practicing, and quite reasonably they don't want to.

2) They have really good people skills and enjoy talking to users (even angry ones). They perform well in a help-desk role.

3) A more negative one - lack of ability to solve unfamiliar problems or learn new things. I've seen this cause people to gravitate towards areas where lack of ability can be concealed, usually tasks that involve following established procedures without deviation.

4) Other more ambitious staff don't want to talk to awkward users or support ancient legacy systems, so they are silently grateful that their less ambitious colleagues are willing to do these tasks, and don't draw attention to the situation.

DatabaseHead

Really good thread, lot's of good takes.

For me personally, I have always had a very high analytical aptitude and the ability to forge strong relationships. This has essentially worked for me throughout my career. I have discovered once I reached a certain point, just doing my daily job is enough to keep me learning and growing. For me it was taking a leap of faith into a challenging career / position and just working through that day in and day out. I'll hit up Lynda.com from time to time to keep my skills sharp or read a book on Kindle.

Back to the question, why are people complacent? As mentioned above in numerous post, different reasons for different people.

UncleB mentioned know thyself, great advice.

adam220891

Variety of reasons.

You'll get to a point where you've reached your technical and mental capacity. Not everyone can be a CCIE or a CEO.

You'll get to a point where you feel the workload to advance exceeds the rewards. If I was making $100k on a 35 hour work week, would I want to switch positions/duties to make an extra $10k if it meant routine 10 hour days and having to study/lab at home?

Life also happens. Personal circumstances dictate things.

For me, I do this stuff as a means to an end. I have no desire to work more than 40 hours a week and I'm pretty burned out from studying. It's nice to enjoy life once in a while. I've missed countless social experiences to stay at home and study. That catches up to you eventually. I also like money and not having to worry about it, so that drives me to find success.

I personally wonder when I'll hit the technical ceiling or when I'll have decided I make enough money. Perhaps the latter never comes. If that's the case, I've got a long life ahead of me.

OctalDump

I think it's a combination of ability/talent/gift/intelligence/nature and drive/priority and a bit of luck. Some people do find a comfy niche, realise that they are enjoying life and feel fulfilled. Some people try hard but just don't have the right mindset to 'get' the thing they are studying. And some people just have a few too many curve balls thrown their way - pick a bad niche that disappears, have to start again, have other commitments and can't develop the way they want to. And there's things like the CCIE which are genuinely a huge commitment and take a lot more work than even enthusiastic and driven people can find.

When you talk with people, you do get a feel for those that just have a bad attitude (doing the bare minimum to keep their current cushy role), and those that are just happy where they are and do a good job at what they do. It's usually not really useful to judge the choices other people make, since it's nearly impossible to really understand all the things that lead them to those choices.

packetphilter

I'm curious what people think about significant others' roles in their career achievement. Do you think it helps to have a significant other/family for encouragement, or is it more of a hindrance when trying to find that extra study time?

NetworkNewb

packetphilter wrote: »

I'm curious what people think about significant others' roles in their career achievement. Do you think it helps to have a significant other/family for encouragement, or is it more of a hindrance when trying to find that extra study time?

Nah, I don't like encouragement. I prefer my wife to put me down and spit on me when I try and study.

gespenstern

If their IQ was measured the difference would be obvious.

EANx

I think it depends on the other person and what their priorities are. For some, it's all about support while with others, they feel you need to squeeze studying in around the other activities of the family. Fortunately, most relationships are somewhere in the middle. But it's not just on the partner to have some flexibility, techs need to as well. I've been telling my GF for months that Sat is for studying, Sunday is for other things. I can't keep the entire weekend for myself, nor could I ignore a request to swap the two days unless I had something serious I couldn't reschedule. And there are times when the entire weekend goes poof. Roll with it if it isn't very often.

I've always found their cooperation to be helpful, just make sure they don't feel ignored.

SteveLavoie

I would simply resume by telling that some people have jobs, working for the next paycheck. Some have career and the will to climb toward a self-defined goal. Other want a career, they want to climb but cannot (lack of talent, lack of drive, lack of luck...)

You know, I am working at a small VAR/consultancy shop. I have starting to work in managing the training of my team (about 10 tech). I have free voucherS from Microsoft and other vendor, but I have yet to find a guy willing to step in and study. I have some Azure cert vouchers and a Sonicwall CSSA voucher FREE for one of my team member. I just need a guy willing to learn... I will have to give another "carrot" to get those certs done.

They are all comfortable with their job... conditions are good, enough work... but they lack passion, they lack drive, they lack vision...

UnixGuy

jelevated wrote: »

Are those who are in engineering/senior roles really winning though? sometimes I can't tell. A desktop support person making $50k but gets to go home and relax, or the engineer making $100k but is constantly on call, working overtime, extremely tough work statement. Sometimes I just don't know.

The senior role/engineer who makes 100K, don't have on-call, reads for pleasure and has a manageable workload - that's the one winning.

packetphilter

NetworkNewb wrote: »

Nah, I don't like encouragement. I prefer my wife to put me down and spit on me when I try and study.

This response doesn't make any sense in regards to what I asked.

NetworkNewb

LOL, I read "Do you think it helps to have a significant other/family for encouragement". as if you were wondering if it is helpful to have people around you encouraging you or not, since most people have family or a SO... And I was replying that I don't like encouragement, but prefer to be put down. Makes sense to me.

edit: I do realize you meant it to be interpreted differently but the response for that way wasn't as humorous to me.

nestorh

packetphilter wrote: »

I'm curious what people think about significant others' roles in their career achievement. Do you think it helps to have a significant other/family for encouragement, or is it more of a hindrance when trying to find that extra study time?

Obviously it helps. Not the same having 1+ people motivating and acouraging you to study/be better than the opposite.

Expanding on this, you know the old saying: "You're the result of the 5 people you spend most time with". I recently experienced this, while dating for a little short of time (only 2 months) a highly succesful woman. She had an amazing job, went to a private school and college with scholarship, is pretty intelligent and take new courses and get high grades all the time. She didn't directly tell me to study and/or motivated me to "get on her level", but just by spending time with her and looking at what she had accomplished, it made me force myself to try to at least keep up in some senses with her, and it helped me get the ball rolling. Whereas in the past i dated for a couple of years this girl, that really had little aspirations in life and just lived by, and I kinda adopted the same philosophy.. not aspiring for much at the time, and just living day by day.

joshuamurphy75

SteveLavoie wrote: »

I would simply resume by telling that some people have jobs, working for the next paycheck. Some have career and the will to climb toward a self-defined goal. Other want a career, they want to climb but cannot (lack of talent, lack of drive, lack of luck...)

You know, I am working at a small VAR/consultancy shop. I have starting to work in managing the training of my team (about 10 tech). I have free voucherS from Microsoft and other vendor, but I have yet to find a guy willing to step in and study. I have some Azure cert vouchers and a Sonicwall CSSA voucher FREE for one of my team member. I just need a guy willing to learn... I will have to give another "carrot" to get those certs done.

They are all comfortable with their job... conditions are good, enough work... but they lack passion, they lack drive, they lack vision...

This is a surprisingly common problem.

NOC-Ninja

I think its the life experience. If you were taught to chill when you were young then that will play a part in your life. Nobody told me I can do it. I just said, Fk it, I will do it. Fk everyone that doesnt believe in what I want to do.

Although, being born and growing up in a 3rd world country played the biggest part in me. Going thru sleeping in a floor cement without any bed, not having a ref and TV, eating once a day, seeing my mom beg the electric guy not to cut our electricity since we cant afford $2 bill in a month, and walking a kilometer to get 1 bucket of water. Its a very rough world. Now that I have this chance in US. Im willing to sacrifice my free time. Its that drive or hunger. I see it as , its there, you can have it, but you will pay for it. Are you willing to pay for it though?
Thats my mentality. I dont even think Im smart. I just sacrifice time a lot and have a high pain threshold.
Musk said it himself, "you must have a high pain threshold".

gkca

SteveLavoie wrote: »

I have free voucherS from Microsoft and other vendor, but I have yet to find a guy willing to step in and study. I have some Azure cert vouchers and a Sonicwall CSSA voucher FREE for one of my team member. I just need a guy willing to learn... I will have to give another "carrot" to get those certs done.

Whereabouts in QC?

SteveLavoie

What do you mean ? I am french and not sure what you meant ?

NetworkNewb

I think he is trying to stalk you...

JK, he is just wondering where in Quebec do you live.

logisticalstyles

I feel like I've been the stagnated guy for a while now. I'm just now getting motivated to get more certs in order to move up in my career. Although I have made some great moves career wise within the past year I feel like I could be doing more. I've been on this new job for the past 6 months as Help Desk lead. Things are very slow around here and I was using my free time to pursue my other endeavors but now I want to focus on getting my MCSA. It just feels like the right time to do it. I have lot's of real world experience. I've been in IT since 2009 and have already passed the A+, Net+ and some Apple certs. I now feel like as Help Desk lead I should at least have an MCP if not an MCSA.

That's why I've returned to this forum. It was a great help in getting my A+ and Net+. I have lot's of free time to study and we are currently working on a Windows 10 upgrade project here at work. Seems like the perfect storm for me to take the 70-698 and pass with flying colors. Wish me luck!