Anyone know where I can learn installation?

Hi all,

I'm starting to poke around withh networking, and am trying to move over to the net admin side of the house from the sys admin side. I've spoken to some of the net admin guys here and have determined that having knowledge of network installation is a positive. I've been looking around to find out if there are any standards for network and cable installations, and maybe if there are certifications in that vein. Does anyone here know of any and/or can point me in the right direction? Thanks.

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Netstudent

ummmmm...Maybe start out with a good cabling book for cable plants, runs, drop downs, conduit.<--Probably a dry as hell read though...... Then I would have TIA/EIA standards under my pillow and for lunch.<---again dry as heck. But all this is highly dependent on the work environment. Some installation jobs require knowledge on these subjects and some do not. BUt if the guys at your work say that you should know cabling and standards, then you would want to know TIA/EIA standards.

Then you could take that even farther with a CCNA and CCDA. Are the networking guys at your work certified in anything? IF you really want to get into the networking side, you may want to consider putting 70-290 on the backburner untill you can get CCNA.

Networking is so competitive now you must have 2 out of 3 things nailed. 1Experience 2.Degree 3.The right Certs.

Seems like you have some IT experience, and some certs, but do you have the certs you need?

mrj

How long have you been a Sys Admin? I assume not very long?

The net eng's I work with wouldn't go near a cable unless it was crunch time. That's typically a Tech's job. Obviously every organization does things it's own way. I'd be curious to know, if you asked, how many of your network admins even know what pin #'s and colors are different between the various cables we use everyday. I'd bet most wont know anything other than possibly the pin numbering.

Anyhow, I'd suggest studying CCNA/CCDA courses as opposed to learning the in-an-outs of cabling if you have previous SA experience.

Network installation to ME is post-design. It's installing switches/routers and knowing what cables go between both, and connect the other nodes. It's not delving into what year a cross-over cable was invented and the logics of straight through copper. Obviously maximum cable ranges and throughput are important in an installation/design, but as a newbie Network guy you won't be going near that kind of work for awhile.

Definitely good stuff to know, but I think you'd end up spending a lot of time on it when you could be doing something more enriching.

SrAtechie

How long have you been a Sys Admin? I assume not very long?

Four years in the military, and almost four years now in the civilian world.

The net eng's I work with wouldn't go near a cable unless it was crunch time. That's typically a Tech's job. Obviously every organization does things it's own way. I'd be curious to know, if you asked, how many of your network admins even know what pin #'s and colors are different between the various cables we use everyday. I'd bet most wont know anything other than possibly the pin numbering.

The network guys where I'm at just completed an infrastructure install in on of our buildings, and are in the process of pulling copper and replacing with fiber in my building. They are getting ready to rework the infrastructure in our remaining buildings and as I type the guy next to me is getting quotes for panduit. So I'm pretty sure the network guys are versed in layer one stuff here. On top of that, the lead net admin spent most of his military career installing the cables for the networks he managed. I think being in military/government IT means we can't always have specialization such as you have described. Hence I ask the question because I'd like to join this network team and at least bring this aspect to the table. I'm sure they're willing to teach me what I need to know about routers and switches, but if I can help them put tray up and run fiber then that means they'll have that much more time to show me the ropes once the grunt work is done.

Anyhow, I'd suggest studying CCNA/CCDA courses as opposed to learning the in-an-outs of cabling if you have previous SA experience.

Thanks for the advice mrj.

ummmmm...Maybe start out with a good cabling book for cable plants, runs, drop downs, conduit.<--Probably a dry as hell read though...... Then I would have TIA/EIA standards under my pillow and for lunch.<---again dry as heck. But all this is highly dependent on the work environment. Some installation jobs require knowledge on these subjects and some do not. BUt if the guys at your work say that you should know cabling and standards, then you would want to know TIA/EIA standards.

Then you could take that even farther with a CCNA and CCDA. Are the networking guys at your work certified in anything? IF you really want to get into the networking side, you may want to consider putting 70-290 on the backburner untill you can get CCNA.

Networking is so competitive now you must have 2 out of 3 things nailed. 1Experience 2.Degree 3.The right Certs.

Seems like you have some IT experience, and some certs, but do you have the certs you need?

Thanks for the tips Netstudent. I'll be sure to look up some of that stuff. Yeah, you're also right. The 290 has officially taken a back seat now that my CCENT is in the mail and headed to my house as we speak

I am going to start working towards my CCENT and hope to accomplish it in the next month or two. I hope to finish off my CCNA within 2-3 months of completing my CCENT and hopefully I'll be in good shape to slide into the net shop sooon.

mikej412

There is the Cisco Network Academy Panduit Network Infrastructure Essentials course.

tech-airman

SrAtechie wrote:

Hi all,

I'm starting to poke around withh networking, and am trying to move over to the net admin side of the house from the sys admin side. I've spoken to some of the net admin guys here and have determined that having knowledge of network installation is a positive. I've been looking around to find out if there are any standards for network and cable installations, and maybe if there are certifications in that vein. Does anyone here know of any and/or can point me in the right direction? Thanks.

SrAtechie,

There is the BICSI (not to be confused with the Professional level exam BSCI) Installer program.

Source:

BICSI - BICSI Courses - IN100 - Information Transport Systems (ITS) Installer 1 Training - http://www.bicsi.org/Content/Index.aspx?File=appren.htm

datchcha

Hey a first time for everything. When i worked for the state, no engineer would touch the Infrastructure cabling; they thought that was too blue collar for them, so they usually had the techs who had network+ or BICSI to install the infrastructure cabling. Most of the time 3rd party contractures installed the infrastructure cabling for us, because state and county code needed to be met when installing cables in walls and in drop ceilings.

Remembering back, (4 years ago) when i was working with a BICSI, he was telling me that a particular type of jacket needed to be used if the cable was going in the wall, or in a drop ceiling. The material needed to have a high burn tempature and some smoke standard. Can't remember all the details.

tech-airman

datchcha wrote:

Hey a first time for everything. When i worked for the state, no engineer would touch the Infrastructure cabling; they thought that was too blue collar for them, so they usually had the techs who had network+ or BICSI to install the infrastructure cabling. Most of the time 3rd party contractures installed the infrastructure cabling for us, because state and county code needed to be met when installing cables in walls and in drop ceilings.

Remembering back, (4 years ago) when i was working with a BICSI, he was telling me that a particular type of jacket needed to be used if the cable was going in the wall, or in a drop ceiling. The material needed to have a high burn tempature and some smoke standard. Can't remember all the details.

datchcha,

He was probably referring to "plenum grade cabling."

SrAtechie

Thank you both mikej412 and tech-airman. That was exactly what I was looking for. I'm also happy to say that the local community college here in Las Vegas offers the PNIE course and I'm driving over there this afternoon to find out the specifics. One of the net admins here (who was an E & I team installer while he wore the uniform) also endorsed BICSI as the way to go because most of the AF follows their methodology. Would you find that to be a true statement tech-airman?

dtlokee

You really want to check local laws before you embark on any type of cabling. Here in NJ you need a licensed electrician to install any type of data cabling (ok there's an exemption for stuff under 48 volts, but most cities will not accept it, they still require a licensed electrician). You can open yourself up to lawsuits if it is improperly installed as one of my students found out the hard way when they cut into a 30 minute rated firewall and didn't properly patch the hole around the cables they installed. The worst case occurred and there was a fire awhile later and the investigation found the mistakes they had made and they were sued by the neighboring tenants for smoke and fire damage. Their business insurance didn't cover it because they are not licensed electricians as required by local codes. It put them out of business (the lawsuits were in excess of 2 million dollars)

Make sure you get permits and inspections for any cable installs. Most people in IT don’t think about this but it can have serious consequences.

networker050184

OUCH!!!! That would suck! I never really thought about all that stuff when running cable. I will now after reading that though.......

tech-airman

SrAtechie wrote:

Thank you both mikej412 and tech-airman. That was exactly what I was looking for. I'm also happy to say that the local community college here in Las Vegas offers the PNIE course and I'm driving over there this afternoon to find out the specifics. One of the net admins here (who was an E & I team installer while he wore the uniform) also endorsed BICSI as the way to go because most of the AF follows their methodology. Would you find that to be a true statement tech-airman?

SrAtechie,

Honestly, I don't know. However since the USAF being a national level organization and BICSI also being a national level organization, I think it would be reasonable for the USAF to use BICSI's standardized methods. From what I know, BICSI uses standards such as the "National Electric Code" or NEC for short. However, depending on jurisdiction issues, as previous posters have mentioned, you may need to comply with State, Local, and City laws regarding cable installer licensing.