Interesting articles regarding the next wave of workers

dynamik · November 2007

A friend just sent these to me, and I thought they looked interesting.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/11/08/60minutes/main3475200.shtml

http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/2007/05/28/100033934/

Plantwiz · November 2007

This has been a bad trend for a while. Interesting the media has bothered to jump on it. Lazy parents raising lazy kids....and now even seeing in our own children's friends and how there parents treat the kids....more spoiled rotten brats on the way.

I never heard of this 'everyone's a winner' sports league nonsense until moving into the community I'm at now. What garbage. Since this is an International Board...how is it other countries? Do parents cater to the child or is this only a US thing?

Nice links thanks for posting them!

nice343 · November 2007

bleep this article. Lazy folks don't succed. where I am from Is either you work hard or get fired.

My nephew used to play in these "everbody wins" soccer games. I took him out of that league and put him in a league where there are winners and losers. So if he and his teams wants to win they have to work hard to win. And if they want to lose, they can slack off.

Too many lazy folks being raised is just disgusting

dtlokee · November 2007

I have been dealing with this sort of nonsense since I opened my own business and started hiring employees. I have had several problem employees that I think this article was written about, the yoga class cracked me up because I had the same thing. One of my instructors thought it would be a good idea to start teaching a mid-day yoga class, and that I shouldn't have an issue with it. I had a similar problem with an instructor and his Saturday morning karate classes. I really want to ask potential employees if they still live with mom and dad, because they seem to be far more arrogant when they know they will still have a place to live even if they are out of work.

That's not to say they’re all bad, but there have been a few. I have gotten to a point where I will look for employees with a military background, I have had far less issues with employees who know what a tough day really is.

Schluep · November 2007

Even in the leagues with winners and losers the losers are not referred to as such anymore. It gets bad to hear things like:

"Congratulations. Team A won and Team B almost won."
"We took second place (there were only two teams playing the given sport)"

It is much like how people are not longer fired. Now they are:

"Layed off (makes it sound like you will be picked back up again when it is a permanant firing)"
"Downsized"
"Let go"
"Asking you to resign"
"Outsourced"
"We feel you need to consider early retirement"
"It is time we give you a chance to explore other opportunities"
"Cut back"
"Layed aside (same description as the first one I posted)"

Or what was once a used car is now:

"Previously owned"
"Certified Pre-owned"

Of course I think it is ridiculous to pretend everybody won even though one team clearly outplayed the other. Changing words to make bad things have a more positive connotation is getting to be almost as ridiculous. I can see it now in an inteview:

Manager: "Have you ever been fired, and if so why"
Applicant: "Nope"
Manager: "Why was there a two month gap on your resume after leaving these two companies"
Applicant: "I was outsourced at Company A and downsized at Company B."

I am also curious of this trend exists in other Countries like it is happening here. Political correctness is only one facet of the problem though. I think the other is from a growing mentality people have that the government or a large company should take care of people instead of them having personal responsibility.

Those articles from May/November are very late in commenting on what has been a sad growing trend for a while.

determinedgerman · November 2007

How true are those stories. I am 31 and I would have never considered myself old in any case but what I am reading in those articles is bad.
Those articles and the ones that I read in INC. magazine the other day that companies hire outside companies to fire people so that they are not able to be slapped by a lawsuit.

Companies are changing their employee review systems because they have to high of a employee turnover.

I am all for employees being able to get what they want for their work but at what point is it getting to crazy?
It actually looks this generation is getting away with it because of all the baby boomer's that start retiring in the next years.

I was born and lived in Germany until 2000 and I was happy that I got a job when I started working. Then again i went to the German Army and stayed there for a couple years which changed my outlook on life a lot.

All you can really do is teach your own kids the right thing to do. Working hard for your money and have your money work hard for you. The world is changing and there is nothing WE can do about.

There are a lot of good people looking for a job and we just have to make sure that we select those out of all the resumes/interviews that are coming across our desks.

Here is a quote from the CBS article that bugs me.

"We're not going to settle. Because we saw our parents settle," Dorsey says. "And we have options. That we can keep hopping jobs. No longer is it bad to have four jobs on your resume in a year. Whereas for our parents or even Gen X, that was terrible. But that's the new reality for us. And we're going to keep adapting and switching and trying new things until we figure out what it is."

What? If there is someone coming to me asking for a job and has had 4-5 jobs during a one year period than there is an issue and that person is not going to be ending up in my department.

steveo1985 · November 2007

"If your not first, your last" hahahaha love that saying :P

nel · November 2007

Everybody wins football (or soccer as you's call it lol) leagues! wtf are those lol!
Everyone should want to be a winner!

Schluep · November 2007

Actually, now that I think about it College Football (American usage of the word) here in the US doesn't really have clear winners/losers =0. That one is entirely profit driven however and has nothing to do with babying them.

Netstudent · November 2007

Yes this article is very true. I think a lot of it stems from the Freerider problem where ebveryone expects someone else to pay the dues. I have seen these types of characteristics in college students throughout my college career. Too many students only going to college because it's the norm. They don't care about what they're doing and they don't work hard. They just do what they must do to get by.

I think too many people don't have regrets for being slackers. I like to look back and see what I have accomplished and how far I have come. I couldn't imagine looking back knowing I could have worked harder or done better but I didn't. I would regret that till the day I died.

When everyone is a winner, losers win and winners lose. Winners lose their incentives to win because they aren't recognized and losers gain incentives to lose because they aren't pushed to win.

It really is sad.

On a side note, one could argue that we dig our own crap holes. Some argue that technology erodes what it means to work hard, and endure hardships (whatever they may be). Some say technology makes life too easy. Being technologists, that can be a hard pill to swallow.

Vogon Poet · November 2007

I've seen similar articles.
One thing they fail to mention is that a lot of middle managers were "downsized" in the 90s, and were eventually replaced by younger, less experienced, and cheaper (the operative word) replacements. They don't like paperwork (e.g. performance standards, personnel reviews, disciplinary actions, etc.). OK, who does? Unfortunately, they often try to achieve consensus, rather than mandate performance goals. It's ridiculous that consultants are hired to help them manage this "new breed" of employee.
I know the primary issue is about the employees, but it sounds like too many bosses don't know what they're doing.

garv221 · November 2007

dynamik wrote:

A friend just sent these to me, and I thought they looked interesting.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/11/08/60minutes/main3475200.shtml

http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/2007/05/28/100033934/

Wow, talk about profiling people. You know there is a simple fix for this problem- its called POLICY AND PROCEDURES; either the employees follow it or they are fired, cut and dry, simple and plain.

I honestly I hate it when parents say "just have fun, don't worry about winning". That quote is simply for losers, I'm in it to win it every time.

jarjar · December 2007

Got one like this at work. He wears the best clothes, leases a very nice SUV with all the toys, has the coolest cell phone, and makes 40k a year (complains he's not paid enough). He can't replace a failed hard drive and drop an image on it.... His resume says he can do all of these things, but that is not reality. I've been ordered to not bail him out anymore and let him hang himself. That is the only way we can get rid of him so we don't find ourselves in a lawsuit.

silentc1015 · December 2007

Well, I got a kick out of those articles. I'm 25 and I know I work harder than most of my older colleagues. I feel I have more to prove so I am more ambitious and motivated. I also worked a 12 hour shift on Thanksgiving so my older colleagues with families could have dinner and spend time with them. I am also doing the same for a bit on Christmas (not 12 hours, though). I volunteered, and I'm happy I could do that for them. But less generalizing please.

networker050184 · December 2007

silentc1015 wrote:

Well, I got a kick out of those articles. I'm 25 and I know I work harder than most of my older colleagues. I feel I have more to prove so I am more ambitious and motivated. I also worked a 12 hour shift on Thanksgiving so my older colleagues with families could have dinner and spend time with them. I am also doing the same for a bit on Christmas (not 12 hours, though). I volunteered, and I'm happy I could do that for them. But less generalizing please.

I agree there should be less generalizing. I think it all comes down to the person. I have met lazy people of all generations and hard workers of all generations. It all comes down to your work ethic which is something you decide for yourself.

That's not to say they’re all bad, but there have been a few. I have gotten to a point where I will look for employees with a military background, I have had far less issues with employees who know what a tough day really is.

Hey dtlokee looking for anyone with military backgorund now??

liven · December 2007

Netstudent wrote:

On a side note, one could argue that we dig our own crap holes. Some argue that technology erodes what it means to work hard, and endure hardships (whatever they may be). Some say technology makes life too easy. Being technologists, that can be a hard pill to swallow.

I do agree with this. BUT, having these new tools at our finger tips should allow us to work even hard. Being a "technologists" should allow us to get more things done in a day. And I would wager to say that most of the folks on this board work just as hard as the generation before us. However it is a different kind of work. Sure it is less labor intensive, but it only makes sense. A human can not do the physical work a machine can do. But the machines need to be operated, and they need to be maintained, and updated etc...

Once again I totally understand what your saying. But I am sure you can agree that technology isn't making your life to easy. Are you not studying till the wee hours of the morning from time to time?

jamesp1983 · December 2007

I had 3 jobs last year and it was because I was working 4 month long, no chance of hire, contract jobs. They were awful, but I needed to get experience somehow. I also needed money. I think some hiring managers are more understanding of multiple jobs within a year because of contracting. Would you still frown upon someone with a high number of jobs due to contracting?

It was about a year and a half at a bank. 4 months at DuPont, 4 Months at Bank of America, 4 Months at DuPont again, now my current job.

dynamik · December 2007

I'd just make a note that they were four month contract jobs, so a person looking at your resume wouldn't just assume that you hop jobs every few months.

Schluep · December 2007

dynamik wrote:

I'd just make a note that they were four month contract jobs, so a person looking at your resume wouldn't just assume that you hop jobs every few months.

As dynamik said, the key is to be sure and mention they were contract positions. Something in your description like this could even work:

"Four month contract position with Bank of America responsible for _____." In addition to these responsibilities ________ was also accomplished succesfully completing the terms of the contract.

jamesp1983 · December 2007

Schluep wrote:

dynamik wrote:

I'd just make a note that they were four month contract jobs, so a person looking at your resume wouldn't just assume that you hop jobs every few months.

As dynamik said, the key is to be sure and mention they were contract positions. Something in your description like this could even work:

"Four month contract position with Bank of America responsible for _____." In addition to these responsibilities ________ was also accomplished succesfully completing the terms of the contract.

\

I actually was told by a recruiter to mention that they were contracts as well. Schluep, that is a great addition as well.

Interesting articles regarding the next wave of workers

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