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zebra-3 · December 2007

I just had a job interview about 2 hours ago, the interview was with HR officer and technical manager.
The technical manager told me MCPs or MCSE certs worth **** as it is easy to **** them with **** and you only need to study 2 hours to pass an mcp...I have tried to make him understand it is not so true but he was sticking on his ideas about mcps.

To tell you the truth I am feeling really upset about this myth about cheating MCPs...2 hours of studying to pass an MCP

this is so ridiculous to actually believe that.

Ahriakin · December 2007

I'm guessing he has never sat one. It's easy for losers to believe that everything they don't have is easy to achieve if they really wanted and that those that have it already cheated to get it. I guess it's one way of dealing with feelings of inadequacy...It's also why they are losers.
(for the record I'm not denigrating those without certification, I didn't have any for the first 10 years in IT, but I cannot stand anyone who thinks so little of those that have achieved them without any personal experience of the candidate or the course).

Schluep · December 2007

Sad fact of the matter is that as more people do **** on any exam, the value of the certification will diminish as you experienced. This is why it is very important to the organizations administering the certification, the holders of the certification, and the companies that value it to do the best they can in combating such activity.

A great example here is the fact that the name mentioned is filtered so that somebody who never heard of it before cannot go look it up now. Testing centers and certification vendors have been increasing their certification security in attempts to further increase their value because of many scenario's like you mentioned. If potential employers and potential clients do not beleive in the value of a certification, people will not spend the time and money to obtain them.

The CISSP has a very high reputation in the Security industry not only because of the material, but also because it is one of the more difficult ones to find questions and answers available.

It hurts when you work hard for something and the value of it is not recognized because of other unscrupulous people that did not put forth the same effort. Good luck with the position you are interviewing for!

brad- · December 2007

It probably wouldnt be such a big problem if the books, test, and training materials werent so expensive.

seuss_ssues · December 2007

I think Schluep hit the nail on the head.

Unfortunately people do **** on these things. It may take them more than 2 hours to memorize it all but it still degrades the honest MCPs out there.

Netstudent · December 2007

I would have asked him if he had any Microsoft Certifications. Then I would have asked him if he has ever atempted a MS certification exam. And if he said no, I would have asked him, then how do you know exactly how easy it is to pass an exam with a XXXX. What an ass.

I wouldn't want to work with someone that was naive enough to make false assumptions.

sir_creamy_ · December 2007

zebra-3 wrote:

The technical manager told me MCPs or MCSE certs worth ****

Does anyone else think that this sort of phenomenon (i.e., arrogant/blowhard managers) is more pronounced within the IT industry?

Smallguy · December 2007

Netstudent wrote:

I would have asked him if he had any Microsoft Certifications. Then I would have asked him if he has ever attempted a MS certification exam. And if he said no, I would have asked him, then how do you know exactly how easy it is to pass an exam with a XXXX. What an ass. I wouldn't want to work with someone that was naive enough to make false assumptions.

I wouldn't wanna work for someone like that either.

Fact of the matter is people have cheated to obtain university Degrees.. are degrees now worthless for those who busted their asses in school

It sounds like your potential boss is an idiot and I would look for another option if possible

iowatech · December 2007

Does anyone else think that this sort of phenomenon (i.e., arrogant/blowhard managers) is more pronounced within the IT industry?

Just someone that's now realizing wasting 4 years and 60,000 for college didn't get him what he wanted and is mad at the rest of the world. Seems to be a lot of this going around now days.

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Daniel333 · December 2007

Sucks dudem, I am sorry your interview went south on you. Don't think about it for a day... relax and write down what COULD have done to improve on it and forget about the things you couldn't help. There is always something for the next time you can take with you.

A few of our IT managers feel the same way about certs. One of our lead IT managers for the west coast went as far as to say "comptia certs actually hurt your resume".

A cert can never get you a job, never sell yourself on it. Most of the time it just pads your resume. Give you that little "extra" to push you over the top. Qualify what the prospective employeer needs and sell yourself to it.

I know a couple MCSE who can't even subnet here... so yes. Many people do get paper certs.

If an employer really wants to screen people, they will have written and hands on exams. I really respect an interview I went to with a small city, they had us do written exams (taken right from an A+ book no less!) and then during the interview they had you manipulate a switch/router/2k server. Also sat you down with a "user" (HR lady I believe) and had you work through a Microsoft Office problem with her (security settings too high for Excel).

Very good interview, I wish more places used their practices.

But most HR departments just OCR your resume and look for keywords and some guy talks to you and decides if he likes your face.

nel · December 2007

sorry to hear that mate. did you find out the outcome of the interview?

liven · December 2007

Daniel333 wrote:

But most HR departments just OCR your resume and look for keywords and some guy talks to you and decides if he likes your face.

Yes and no,

The last few interviews I have been on were very technical. Granted I was not tested in the traditional sense of the word, but I was most certain screened.

Typically in a room with 3 or more highly skilled people who started a very technical conversation. Having been on both sides of the table in a situation like this, it is very easy to tell when someone does or does not know what they are talking about.

BUT, any prospective boss that thinks certs are worth anything is not to bright. Especially the more advanced certs, you can't memorize those kinds of questions and answers.

Don't let that guy (the interviewer) get you down. Your on the right path and soon you will find the right opportunity!

jarjar · December 2007

To be honest, I thought more people cheated in the days of NT 4.0. Back then I'd bump into a lot of network admins/computer people who had their MCSE, but didn't get that whole NTFS thing (swear to FSM). Now-a-days I seem to meet more MCSEs and those pursuing their MCSE who have a much firmer grasp of administrating a Microsoft based network. I thought things had gotten better.

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