CCIE or Not?

Daniel333 · June 2012

So,

I have not been maintaining my skills like I should in the last 6-8months. I finished my CCNP and sorta stopped. I did refresh my VMware skills, but really there wasn't a lot to learn.

I starting dabbling in CCNP: Sec but just really found the material too esoteric and boring.

I've got a couple coworkers starting their CCIE: R&Ss and I am debating if I should go that path. I am not really a networking guy per se. I mean, I've installed Cisco routers, switch etc. But never full time. It's always been more one off things.

I think I would get more value from say.. RHCE or even a Java certification. But CCIE! I mean, it's just THE cert to get, right?

I enjoy messing with routing and switching in general. I mean, I made my way through CCNP. Just not sure I have the experience to back up a CCIE trek. My experience with ine.com says I could pull it off in a year with some challenges.

Blarg, just thinking out loud here. But really on the fence if I am ready to commit that kind of money and time.... well. time mainly. I actually have a really nice CCNA/CCNP lab that will grow pretty easy into CCIE:R&S.

Input? Thoughts?

Daniel333 · June 2012

My cert list if it matters...

Microsoft
MCITP – Server Administrator 2008
MCSE Security –Certified Systems Engineer on Windows 2003/XP with security specialization
MCP – Administration of Microsoft Exchange 2003
MCTS – ISA Server 2006, Configuring

Cisco
CCNP - Routing and Switching
CCNA – Cisco Certified Network Associate in Routing and Switching
CCNA Security – Certified Network Associate Security in Implementing IOS Security
CCNA Voice – Implementing IOS Unified Communications Express

Other
ACSP – Apple Certified Support Professional 10.6
CCA - Citrix XenServer 5 Server Virtualization
Comptia A+
Comptia Network+
Comptia Linux+
Comptia Security+
Sage Certified Saleslogix CRM Administrator 7.0

docrice · June 2012

Based on cursory information, it doesn't sound like a CCIE is in your near-term path. From my impressions, going that route would entail a heavy degree of specialization in Cisco networking. If you enjoy that stuff a lot and it'd be worth your time / investment into achieving it, then by all means. I personally don't think it's the end-all of certs, similar to how some might see the GSE as the ultimate achievement for security certs.

lordy · June 2012

You don't sound like the typical CCIE candidate and there is nothing wrong with that. It's a great cert to earn but to really make it worth the trouble you would have to become a full-time network guy or consultant. Just my 0.02 EUR

Roguetadhg · June 2012

As others have said, CCIE is a time-consuming experience. On the flip-side, I don't know of any CCIEs that regret getting their IE certification. It may open doors for you. But if you're not interested in that path, I don't see why you would devote a year+ for it.

Somnipotent · June 2012

Why put yourself through the torture of the infamous lab exam if it's something you're not really that interested in. You've collected a good bulk of the core Cisco certs tho. If you're heart's not in it, don't do it man. You've got quite a bit under you already.

Devilry · June 2012

From the looks of your resume you have a jack of all trades type rounding (not a bad thing.

I would either narrow your focus to what areas you enjoy, which you should know, and take the advanced certification path in that direction.

Time for some soul searching!

gwhitney · June 2012

I would agree with the above. Doesn't sound like CCIE is in the heart. Networking and VMWare are good core knowledge to have. I might recommend a storage cert like EMC or Cisco storage. That way you have core knowledge of the entire virtual stack. On the other hand, if you want to get out there a bit, some programming could come in handy for automation or troubleshooting. I'm talking .NET or Java and not Powershell. That is if you enjoy cross domain knowledge and want to move into solution architecture in the future. I guess the question is deep specific knowledge or broad solutions knowledge? Of course, leadership and business classes help round things out for smaller to medium sized companies.

Brain_Power · June 2012

Daniel333 wrote: »

My cert list if it matters...

Microsoft
MCITP – Server Administrator 2008
MCSE Security –Certified Systems Engineer on Windows 2003/XP with security specialization
MCP – Administration of Microsoft Exchange 2003
MCTS – ISA Server 2006, Configuring

Cisco
CCNP - Routing and Switching
CCNA – Cisco Certified Network Associate in Routing and Switching
CCNA Security – Certified Network Associate Security in Implementing IOS Security
CCNA Voice – Implementing IOS Unified Communications Express

Other
ACSP – Apple Certified Support Professional 10.6
CCA - Citrix XenServer 5 Server Virtualization
Comptia A+
Comptia Network+
Comptia Linux+
Comptia Security+
Sage Certified Saleslogix CRM Administrator 7.0

Why would you not be proud of CCNP?

m3zilla · June 2012

imo, it's kind of like "If you have to ask, you can't afford it!". The CCIE is not like the CCNP where you can half ass through and still pass. The CCIE requires real dedication and lots of hours to pass. If you're on the fence now, changes are, you'll stop half way through.

examkill · July 2012

There is no end for learning. Learn what you feel interesting. Don't take the courses just because your friends or mates are doing that.

Daniel333 · July 2012

Thanks everyone!

I've opted to finish my VCP and update my Microsoft certs to 2012. I'll actually be in a Windows 2012 first look boot camp tomorrow at Unitek in Fremont, CA and will be doing a couple microsoftelearning classes over the next few weeks I just bought. I don't expect either one to be hard, but the update seems like a good idea.

Somnipotent wrote: »

Why put yourself through the torture of the infamous lab exam if it's something you're not really that interested in. You've collected a good bulk of the core Cisco certs tho. If you're heart's not in it, don't do it man. You've got quite a bit under you already.

I'm actually interested in networking very much so. I just never have been able to be a full time networking guy. Seems like every opportunity I get is such a huge step down in pay and grade and I just always turn it down.

Devilry wrote: »

From the looks of your resume you have a jack of all trades type rounding (not a bad thing.

I would either narrow your focus to what areas you enjoy, which you should know, and take the advanced certification path in that direction.

Time for some soul searching!

Haha, you are so right. I am all over the place right now. Sometimes it's a blast. Sometimes it makes me feel like I going on the wrong direction.
This month alone:
1) Teaching classes on monitoring strategy to my company an one partner company.
2) I've been writing code and helping with Java/Jboss troubleshooting for a few months.
3) I was working with my coworker on our big data strategy with Splunk, writing apps on it etc.
4) I also handle the some of our vSphere troubleshooting.
5) General RedHat deployments with Puppet, Cobbler, kickstarter
6) Troubleshooting Cisco firewalls, switches and F5 load balancers
7) Oracle 10g performance optimization project

Data center power reduction project
9) Training of new NOC staff
10) I consult for AWS for some friends' companies.
11) Attending Velocity conf

gwhitney wrote: »

I might recommend a storage cert like EMC or Cisco storage. That way you have core knowledge of the entire virtual stack. On the other hand, if you want to get out there a bit, some programming could come in handy for automation or troubleshooting. I'm talking .NET or Java and not Powershell. That is if you enjoy cross domain knowledge and want to move into solution architecture in the future. I guess the question is deep specific knowledge or broad solutions knowledge? Of course, leadership and business classes help round things out for smaller to medium sized companies.

I really don't know where to start with Storage to be honest. I've installed a few real basic SANs now (netapp and compellant) but am certainly no expert. At this point in life I just throw SSD's at my IO problems, but I would like to get better.

As far as certing up. I don't have access to the equipment and the learning materials seem sparse. Any recommendations here? Seems even Comptia Storage+ (which looks like you walk away knowing nothing from the learning path I saw) lacks books, CBTs and labs?

I actually have a project coming up where I am deploying a monitoring solution for our core fabric and Hitchi SANs. Sadly wasn't in the budget to train me on up on any detailed level.

I do some really basic programming at work. But also help troubleshoot the Java stack. I did some VB programming under Saleslogix years ago. Designing interfaces etc. But, been a long while. MIght be something to consider to round me off. Was also thinking of knocking out the CIW line of certs. They look like good review. CIW Perl and JavaScript.

Leadership and business classes are a good idea. My availability is weird. Traditional classes don't always work. But maybe. I think the company offers a few. I might want to look into that.

VAHokie56 · July 2012

Brain_Power wrote: »

Why would you not be proud of CCNP?

I was thinking the same thing

Daniel333 · July 2012

I brute forced the exams. Failed route twice and switch twice. Passed tshoot with flying colors though. Top it off I've not been able to break into networking work. So over all I feel like I wasted my time and money. Would have been better to focus on other things. So ultimately it's just an interest.

NOC-Ninja · July 2012

A wise old man from TE always said that you should start looking for a Networking job as soon as you get CCNA, CCNP will hurt you rather than help you if you dont have networking experience & get certifications that is aligned with your experience.

Mrock4 · July 2012

If you want it, then go for it. If not, don't. I don't think there's a reason you can't get it, and who am I to tell someone else not to pursue a cert?

That being said, some experience will definitely help. My first go at CCIE studies was several years ago, and I have learned a lot since then, that has helped tremendously this time around.

pert · July 2012

NOC-Ninja wrote: »

A wise old man from TE always said that you should start looking for a Networking job as soon as you get CCNA, CCNP will hurt you rather than help you if you dont have networking experience & get certifications that is aligned with your experience.

CCNP will not hurt you rather than help in any situation except the one where you get a technical interview and then can't answer CCNP questions. That's what hurts people, the fact that they bomb the tech interview, not that they have an NP without experience. Also, youre going to need above an NA knowledge to break into the field in most places, so I'd study for the NP immediately anyway, just because a naked NA is not enough to be useful except in a pure level 1 NOC.

networker050184 · July 2012

I have to disagree with you pert. If I see a resume with CCNP and no experience I'm not going to give the person a shot. As I said in the other thread, two things come to mind, 1. dumper 2. someone thats going to jump ship as soon as something higher comes along. Neither are the type of person I'd be looking to hire for an entry level networking gig.

MAC_Addy · July 2012

networker050184 wrote: »

If I see a resume with CCNP and no experience I'm not going to give the person a shot.

How many years of networking experience would you recommend to have before jumping into CCNP?

networker050184 · July 2012

I wouldn't put a number of years on it as we all know someone can reset passwords for ten years. Its more about the quality of experience. I am a firm believer in certifying in what you have experience with and not certifying to learn. Of course we all pick up some things and refresh the finer details as we get ready for the exam, but if you aren't already familiar with the bulk of the material why would you want to call yourself certified?

NetworkVeteran · July 2012

+1 NOC-Ninja & Networker. Sorry, pert, that just isn't how the business world works. If you earn your CCNP certification, but keep it a secret, then I might agree with you.

Mac_Addy, Cisco puts a recommendation right on their CCNP page--"The CCNP certification is appropriate for those with at least one year of networking experience who are ready to advance their skills and work independently on complex network solutions."

prtech · July 2012

Getting the CCNP won't hurt you. It's not like you're being forced to put it on your resume. Besides, a dumper can easily be ruled out on technical interviews. Jumping ship is an issue but that's always going to be a problem if you don't have advancement opportunities in your company.

Mrock4 · July 2012

My company let go of a CCDP/CCIP/CCSP/CCNP....he had years of experience (supposedly)..and the certs to match..

I think the final straw was when they realized he couldn't clear port security without help.

So..experience + certs = questionable at best (unless validated). I ALWAYS appreciate a good technical interview, because they weed out people like this beforehand.

That being said, I think for certified individuals, a good technical individual should be our best friend. It's our only defense against ****!

UnixGuy · July 2012

I think you have a lot of certifications already. Just see what's your NEXT career target is, and plan ahead.

I agree with the guys who said that having a CCNP not backed up with experience is not a good sign.

So what's your next career step?

1) Networking ==> move to a full time Networking job so you can learn more on the job, then think about CCIE and start after you built some experience.

2) Want to become a full time Linux administrator? Go for RHCE, and find a job to back it up.

3) Want to move to management? go for PMP, ITIL,..etc. or even a masters degree.

I think adding more certs at this point isn't a good thing. I even think of removing my expired CCNA from my CV because I can't remember much from the CICSO command line...

Forsaken_GA · July 2012

Daniel333 wrote: »

I've got a couple coworkers starting their CCIE: R&Ss and I am debating if I should go that path. I am not really a networking guy per se. I mean, I've installed Cisco routers, switch etc. But never full time. It's always been more one off things.

If networking is not your primary focus, and you don't love doing it, don't go for the CCIE, you won't finish it

CCIE or Not?

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