ITIL V2 or V3?

supercooldudesupercooldude Member Posts: 49 ■■□□□□□□□□
I was just wondering for someone thinking to start on the ITIL track, should I just go for ITIL Foundation V3 and don't mind V2?

The reason I ask is that many training providers around here offer training for both Foundation V2 and V3, but only V2 Practitioner and V2 Manager + V2 bridge courses for people wanting to upgrade from V2 Practitioner to V3 Intermediate, and from V2 Manager to V3 Expert.

Any thoughts, eMeS, amyamandaallen, bighornsheep ...?

Comments

  • eMeSeMeS Member Posts: 1,875
    I would have to say that v3.0 is gaining slow acceptance, primarily because of the direct participation of vendors in writing the books. v2.0 was very vendor-neutral.

    With this in mind, I think the answer is unfortunately "it depends"....

    Most people doing the hiring won't know the difference, and I would suspect that v3 sounds better than v2 to people that are unfamiliar...for example, I get calls all of the time from recruiters asking if I have "ITIL Foundations".

    On the other hand, some organizations have invested heavily in v2, and are hoping to maximize that investment before moving onto a costly v3 implementation. I have a customer like this right now...heavily invested in v2, and doesn't even want v3 spoken in their presence!

    The other point to make is that ITIL, regardless of the version, is a set of best practices...that means that organizations could pick or choose individual items out of any of the books and seek to implement them..Thus, if something from v1 still works in your organization, why change it just because there is a new v3 that's going to cost you tons of money to implement???

    I think it is possible to achieve the best of both worlds, with only minimal increased expense to you.

    In this situation I would complete v2 Foundation training. Once you pass (and you will), either sign up for a v2 to v3 bridge class (usually 1 day and $500, includes exam), or self-study the difference between v2 and v3 and sit the bridge exam. It will not hurt you to be able to demonstrate familiarity with both versions.....

    Regarding practitioner level...currently the only offerings are for v2 classes. These are very difficult, and I failed every one that I took the first time by 1 question. These can be useful classes if you have a good instructor. As you know it totally changes at this level in v3, as they now have what are called Lifecycle and Capability streams, with 5 and 4 courses respectively. I do not know of a stateside training provider that is offering v3 classes other than the Foundation and Manager bridge at this time, but they are all working diligently and there should be something available later this year.

    The good news is, with v3 (which will be pushed so hard that v2 will eventually fall out of vogue), you don't lose credit for any v1.0 or v2.0 certifications that you hold. For example, under the new credit system of v3, my Manager cert counts for 17 credits towards the 22 needed for the ITIL Expert cert.

    Also, now they've added an "Advanced Service Management Professional Diploma" cert after ITIL Expert, but haven't yet told those of us who do this for a living exactly how to earn it....

    Here's some links to the v2 and v3 qualification schemes:

    v2: http://www.itil-officialsite.com/Qualifications/ITILV2Qualifications.asp
    v3: http://www.itil-officialsite.com/Qualifications/ITILV3QualificationScheme.asp

    Wordy response...if I can help further let me know.

    MS
  • supercooldudesupercooldude Member Posts: 49 ■■□□□□□□□□
    Wordy? Nah, I couldn't have hoped for a better response. Thanks!
    And I did kind of expect it to be an "it depends" response :) because it was like a "MCSE 2003 or 2008" question: Go with what the company you're targeting is hooked on...

    I think it's difficult to predict how long the market's transition from v2 to v3 will take, as is the case in other areas too, like OSes for example.
    Many big organizations I know are still using Win2k on their production networks and haven't even bothered switching to 2003/XP because it's simpling still working. If it's not broken, what's to fix right?

    By the way, here's a link to a nice presentation about the key differences between v2 and v3.
    http://www.ilxgroup.com/itil-v3-presentation.htm

    I have a few more questions, if you don't mind.
    1) I think I understood the differences highlighted in the above presentation, but how do they look to a v2 Manager such as yourself eMeS?
    2) How far are you on your v3 pursuit? and how tough is it?
    3) Do you have any information about MOF (Microsoft Operations Framework)? I know it's the microsoft way of doing ITSM, but I mean since you do this for a living, how accepted is it in the market? What kind of reputation does it have?

    Thanks again for your reply.

    --
    SCD
  • eMeSeMeS Member Posts: 1,875
    Wordy? Nah, I couldn't have hoped for a better response. Thanks!
    And I did kind of expect it to be an "it depends" response :) because it was like a "MCSE 2003 or 2008" question: Go with what the company you're targeting is hooked on...

    I think it's difficult to predict how long the market's transition from v2 to v3 will take, as is the case in other areas too, like OSes for example.
    Many big organizations I know are still using Win2k on their production networks and haven't even bothered switching to 2003/XP because it's simpling still working. If it's not broken, what's to fix right?

    By the way, here's a link to a nice presentation about the key differences between v2 and v3.
    http://www.ilxgroup.com/itil-v3-presentation.htm

    I have a few more questions, if you don't mind.
    1) I think I understood the differences highlighted in the above presentation, but how do they look to a v2 Manager such as yourself eMeS?
    2) How far are you on your v3 pursuit? and how tough is it?
    3) Do you have any information about MOF (Microsoft Operations Framework)? I know it's the microsoft way of doing ITSM, but I mean since you do this for a living, how accepted is it in the market? What kind of reputation does it have?

    Thanks again for your reply.

    --
    SCD

    1) There's a lot of contempt in the freelance/boutique consultant community for v3, because a lot them think there was too much vendor involvement and that it adds too much out of the box help for people, meaning that they won't need consultants.

    My point of view is exactly the opposite (this is true for most knowledge/certs)...we earn what we earn primarily because many people/organizations are not willing to spend the time to read/learn a body of knowledge and develop the experience to apply and implement it. Either that or, ideally, they are focused on their core business and would rather pay a specialist for such thigns.

    One major difference that I see is that v3 is much more useful out of the box. They've elaborated on things that were at most only mentioned in v2, and have produced a nice collection of material. The lifecycle model is the big new thing, as well as expanding the number of processes to 27 (depending on whom you ask).

    Another major difference that I see in v3 vs. v2 is that they have truly setup the education and qualifications scheme to be a huge money maker over the next several years.

    2) I take the v3 bridge in early April and the test at the end of the class. I took the v3 Foundation bridge class last week as part of my preparation (although it was not required). Currently I am reading the 5 core books to prepare.

    I was told that some of the ITIL authors initially failed the v3 manager bridge exam. I have a friend that recently took it and she got a 95%, which means she missed exactly 1 question. I am also told that "tension metrics", if given as an option on a manager bridge question, is always correct.

    Reading, reading, and more reading is my preparation for the v3 bridge.

    3) I do not know of anyone currently using MOF (but that doesn't mean they aren't out there). Nor do I know of any consultants that have expertise in it. I have considered developing some knowledge in it, because at some point some customer will request it....it's always nice to be able to answer those kinds of questions with a "yes, I'm experience in it" as opposed to trying to explain why it is no different than ITIL. A lack of time has kept me away from it, but I have heard that the material is very similar to ITIL Foundation.

    As far as acceptance/reputation...it's hard to say because I just haven't seen any demand for it....Let me know if you pursue it...

    MS
  • supercooldudesupercooldude Member Posts: 49 ■■□□□□□□□□
    eMeS wrote:
    1) There's a lot of contempt in the freelance/boutique consultant community for v3, because a lot them think there was too much vendor involvement and that it adds too much out of the box help for people, meaning that they won't need consultants.

    My point of view is exactly the opposite (this is true for most knowledge/certs)...we earn what we earn primarily because many people/organizations are not willing to spend the time to read/learn a body of knowledge and develop the experience to apply and implement it. Either that or, ideally, they are focused on their core business and would rather pay a specialist for such thigns.

    One major difference that I see is that v3 is much more useful out of the box. They've elaborated on things that were at most only mentioned in v2, and have produced a nice collection of material. The lifecycle model is the big new thing, as well as expanding the number of processes to 27 (depending on whom you ask).

    Another major difference that I see in v3 vs. v2 is that they have truly setup the education and qualifications scheme to be a huge money maker over the next several years.

    2) I take the v3 bridge in early April and the test at the end of the class. I took the v3 Foundation bridge class last week as part of my preparation (although it was not required). Currently I am reading the 5 core books to prepare.

    I was told that some of the ITIL authors initially failed the v3 manager bridge exam. I have a friend that recently took it and she got a 95%, which means she missed exactly 1 question. I am also told that "tension metrics", if given as an option on a manager bridge question, is always correct.

    Reading, reading, and more reading is my preparation for the v3 bridge.

    3) I do not know of anyone currently using MOF (but that doesn't mean they aren't out there). Nor do I know of any consultants that have expertise in it. I have considered developing some knowledge in it, because at some point some customer will request it....it's always nice to be able to answer those kinds of questions with a "yes, I'm experience in it" as opposed to trying to explain why it is no different than ITIL. A lack of time has kept me away from it, but I have heard that the material is very similar to ITIL Foundation.

    As far as acceptance/reputation...it's hard to say because I just haven't seen any demand for it....Let me know if you pursue it...

    MS

    Thank you for the clarifications.
    I decided to go with v2 Foundation for the time being and see how it goes.
    I might try MOF right after it, then do the v3 Foundation bridge.
    Do you have any suggestion concerning study material?

    --
    SCD
  • eMeSeMeS Member Posts: 1,875
    Sounds like a good plan!

    One of the most overlooked study aids for ITIL Foundation, which happens to also be free, is the official glossary.

    V2 and v3 glossaries are available at:

    http://www.best-management-practice.com/officialsite.asp?FO=1230366&action=confirmation&tdi=575004

    MS
  • supercooldudesupercooldude Member Posts: 49 ■■□□□□□□□□
    eMeS wrote:
    Sounds like a good plan!

    One of the most overlooked study aids for ITIL Foundation, which happens to also be free, is the official glossary.

    V2 and v3 glossaries are available at:

    http://www.best-management-practice.com/officialsite.asp?FO=1230366&action=confirmation&tdi=575004

    MS
    I just downloaded the glossaries. Thanks for pointing it out.

    SCD
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