Fired from job of two months...

Not because of technicality but because of personal missing element. What to do now? Living with in laws, married with 5 month old daughter.

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Iristheangel

cyberguypr wrote: »

Wow! That guy has more entries in his resume than an internationally travelling escort.

Imagine if he kept count after 2008! He could make an amazing documentary. He could call it: "Tales from the Unemployment Office"

Joking aside, this would be inspiring and awesome if he learned his lesson, became a better employee, and ended up at his dream job after lots of hard work. Until then, it's just comedy.

NetworkNewb

bahahahahaha, your averaging almost a new job every month over a course of 13 years! (a little less but close enough). That is insane! I can't imagine how job interviews go when you are interviewing for a full time position. I would pay to hear that conversation.

wolfinsheepsclothing

This thread took an interesting turn.

techfiend

Iristheangel wrote: »

Joking aside, this would be inspiring and awesome if he learned his lesson, became a better employee, and ended up at his dream job after lots of hard work. Until then, it's just comedy.

I want to help him achieve this. He was in desktop support for awhile which usually takes a decent personality. I think he either felt way over his head in the network position or found out he doesn't like networking and made a bad decision of how to handle it. He'll hopefully learn to move up requires challenges and there's always going to be humans you don't get along with. If I was in a position to hire I would try to hire him to teach him these things.

To the OP: Keep your head up and look on the bright side. You may not be where you want to be but you will be soon if you stay aggressive and maintain a good attitude.

Iristheangel

techfiend wrote: »

I want to help him achieve this. He was in desktop support for awhile which usually takes a decent personality. I think he either felt way over his head in the network position or found out he doesn't like networking and made a bad decision of how to handle it. He'll hopefully learn to move up requires challenges and there's always going to be humans you don't get along with. If I was in a position to hire I would try to hire him to teach him these things..

Well... getting a job in Desktop Support when you lie or fudge your experience vs KEEPING your job is two different things. Everyone has the potential for change and to grow but it does take a certain amount of responsibility, maturity and growth. Ever heard the saying "You can lead a horse to water but you can't force it to drink."

No_Nerd

Iristheangel wrote: »

Well... getting a job in Desktop Support when you lie or fudge your experience vs KEEPING your job is two different things. Everyone has the potential for change and to grow but it does take a certain amount of responsibility, maturity and growth. Ever heard the saying "You can lead a horse to water but you can't force it to drink."

so true....

fmitawaps

Dehgrah - sorry, we seem to have jacked your topic here.

Let's see.... I will try to give some clarification on my extensive work history. It is a sad story, but there's some amusement and learning to be had as well....

1995-2008 - I graduated college with an Associates in Business (useful for toilet paper in an emergency). At the time I graduated college, I didn't really know what I wanted to do for a job, I was in Business Administration, so I guess a job in..... business? Clues are lacking. Maybe somehow it'll work itself out.

I never even went to very many actual interviews for "business" jobs. I started off in an office clerical job scanning prescription papers into a computer. Sometimes the women I worked with would claim that I stared blankly at the computer screen for 10 minutes on a single prescription paper, I thought they were crazy. In my mind I was working steadily, although maybe not quickly. For the near-minimum wage they were paying, what did they expect? I think I quit that job after 3 months to go elsewhere. My one "business interview" suit is still hanging in the closet, I am fully 70 pounds too fat to even fit into it. I don't know why I still have it, haven't worn it in a decade at least.

I can't itemize every job here, but generally speaking, after that, I fell into a cycle of temp agency contract jobs in electronics technician work. 95% of it was hand soldering and testing and hand placement of components on circuit boards, and I was pretty damn good at it. Pay in my area topped out at $12 an hour and I quickly hit the cap. But these types of jobs are frequently like IT contract assignments. Temporary. A company gets an order to build or rework 10,000 circuit boards, and life is good, but then you run out of boards to repair and you are out the door, looking for the next job.

When I wasn't working an electronics job through a temp agency, I was off doing whatever other work I could get. 90% of it was menial labor that never lasted long. Quite a few times, after getting fired or having a job end, I'd cruise by a friend's house and his dad would be there and we'd hang out and talk. I'd say "you may be wondering why I'm here at 2pm on a work day...." and he'd say "did you get fired AGAIN?!?!?!?!". Then I'd go into the latest story of injustice against me.

So this self defeating circle went on until 2006, where I ended up in an electronics tech job, building wiring harnesses for marine diesel engines. For once, I started there through a temp agency, then after 90 days was legitimately HIRED into the company. Wow. That never happened before!

But there was a problem. I was playing WoW pretty hardcore at this time. And my drive to work was a 32 mile run with half of it being on 1-1/2 lane back country roads out through farm lands. If I was stuck behind a **** truck or some old person, I was SCREWED, as even a maniac behind the wheel like me had very few places on this road to pass other cars, IF another car wasn't coming the other way at the time. So I often came into work 10 or so minutes late.

Of course, the boss had a solution. Leave for work earlier. OH YEAH, LIKE IT IS JUST THAT SIMPLE. I've got to get some WoW time in the morning before work! So my drive to work was usually a two hands on the wheel, white knuckled, heavy breathing and sweating and swearing at slow drivers road race to defy the laws of physics and travel (X) miles in (X-5) minutes. For 32 miles, one way, every day.

So what, right? I get my work done on time and then some. With excellent quality. I never smoked, yet 90% of the other people in the place did, so it is ok for them go to smoke for 10 minutes 4 times a day, but god forbid I come in 10 minutes late, that is such a HORRIBLE CRIME!!!!!

But I was at the place for just over a year and a half, until the boss man finally had enough. Yes, I was warned several times about it, to be fair. Oh well. So that was in the spring of 2008 that I got fired from there.

Curious IT related point .. while working at this job, the server / router / switch rack was in the corner of one room near me. At the time, I knew nothing about anything in it. Now and then, people would come to work on the computer stuff in the rack, and a few times I tried to talk to them about what all that stuff was. They never said much, figuring I was just some menial low wage worker. They didn't know who they were talking to!

So after my unceremonious firing from what would be my last electronics job, I took advantage of the unemployment system and started collecting. I did some home pc repair cash paying work on the side for mo' money. Through the rest of 2008, that was pretty much it. Thanks to the wall street bankers and the housing crash of '08, unemployment got extended past the usual 6 months, and I rode that free money ride until I 99'd out, at 99 weeks. I actually saved a few grand during this time, and moved out to L.A., taking up residence in the SFV. I worked a couple blah pointless paycheck jobs there. As I was still playing WoW a lot, I had a laptop set up beside me, playing movies I had downloaded. At the time, I was watching the Jason Statham "The Transporter" movies and I got to thinking "I could do that", and started searching for driving jobs on Craigslist. And found one! I drove people around on the side ( this was before Uber) for cash money. But eventually, the woman I was driving retired from her "work", so I was out of a job again, and by the spring of '11, financial calamity forced me to move back across the country to a much lower cost of living situation. I was mad. I didn't want to leave L.A. .

So, now back home, just east of south nowheresville, PA, I began working pointless stupid jobs again, and kept advertising for home pc repair on the side.

Then in late 2011, I had an idea.

I like doing computer work. I make nice cash money at it. So why not do it for a regular job for companies?

Thus began the process of talking to temp agencies, finding out which ones hired for IT work, and what sort of jobs an IT newbie could get. Desktop Support. And of course, it was tough to get in, took 3-4 months to get the first little IT job. All the agencies wanted to know was "where have you done corporate IT before?". Well nowhere, but we have the opportunity to change that right now! HIRE ME, DAMMITT!!!!!

Eventually, through the spring and summer of 2012, I started getting more bigger better IT contract assignments, and I did well at them. A few weeks here, a weekend assignment changing out computers at local bank branches or a store being built, maybe a couple months there, etc.

In autumn 2012, I got called for a desktop support job at a local company that had a big data center, 20,000 square feet of raised floor in that 'ma! But I was doing a different job, picking up and delivering computer equipment to one of their contracted companies for a super weak $11.50 an hour. I was there for 3 months until an $18 an hour desktop support job came along. I REALLY didn't want to leave, I wanted to get into that data center and do more and learn! But for the money, I had to go.

So I stayed at the new job for almost a year, saved a ton of cash, met a nice woman my age, and moved back to L.A. for another year. Then I got married and SHE didn't want to leave home, so I had to come back here AGAIN! I'll get her to go to L.A. eventually.......

So for now I am back here, doing more IT work, pushing to get into data centers and do network admin jobs, working on my Cisco certs, etc. I'll keep at it, but only until I hit the lottery and retire.

There it is, a basic overview of the work history of me. Better late than never, I guess, that I found good work in IT. In 90% of my IT jobs, I got along with my co-workers well. It was only the one a couple months ago where things went south fast.

Iristheangel

Is your name Leeroy Jenkins?

NetworkNewb

I feel like this is an elaborate trolling attempt here. Definitely has my interest though. Looking forward to part 2!!

**starts making some popcorn**

TomkoTech

NetworkNewb wrote: »

I feel like this is an elaborate trolling attempt here. Definitely has my interest though. Looking forward to part 2!!

**starts making some popcorn**

As I read Im thinking this exact same thing. And yet I realize that there are indeed people out there like this......

fmitawaps

Okay, I just finished editing that wall of text. Go back and re-read it, some parts changed and details added.

BlackBeret

fmitawaps wrote: »

Well, that was a while back, working in menial and lesser skilled jobs, when I knew I was better than the job and most of the people there, but had not yet identified IT as a viable long term career path.

I didn't know you could be too good for a steady paycheck. I know I'm not, but I'm pretty sure one of the guys that hangs out on the side of the gas station all day said something similar. He's too good to work with other people, then he started mumbling some stuff about being over 3,000 years old, his chain keeping him alive, and the ground trying to steal his blood.

bluejellorabbit

fmitawaps wrote: »

So what, right? I get my work done on time and then some. With excellent quality. I never smoked, yet 90% of the other people in the place did, so it is ok for them go to smoke for 10 minutes 4 times a day, but god forbid I come in 10 minutes late, that is such a HORRIBLE CRIME!!!!!

Unfortunately, corporate mentality often is unwilling to see its own illogical policies. Many of my friends have flexible schedules, so they can come and go at whatever time is convenient for them, as long as the work gets done. This makes a lot more sense for many jobs.

I noticed the smokers' inequality at a couple jobs I had. If you smoke, you can take extra breaks. If you don't, you can't.

iBrokeIT

Let's get Iris to hook you up with a job at Cisco out in LA, I will film it, we can call it "The Network Crowd", we'll make millions and then retire!

TomkoTech

iBrokeIT wrote: »

Let's get Iris to hook you up with a job at Cisco out in LA, I will film it, we can call it "The Network Crowd", we'll make millions and then retire!

I don't think he would last long enough for a second episode.......

iBrokeIT

Good point, we'll have to go to Seattle for seasons 2 and 3 to do Microsoft and Amazon. We'll only be gone for three months though so we could do it in the short period the weather is nice.

Iristheangel

iBrokeIT wrote: »

Let's get Iris to hook you up with a job at Cisco out in LA, I will film it, we can call it "The Network Crowd", we'll make millions and then retire!

That would be interesting. This is how I would see it going down from Fmitas' perspective:
- Customer meeting at 10AM in downtown LA. Fmitas shows up at 10:45. "I don't see what the big deal is! Don't you guys know how crazy LA traffic is???"
- "Ugh. These customers think they can just monopolize my time and expect a response."
- "Shouldn't the customers be paying me to configure this for them?"
- "Do they really expect me to answer emails after 5PM after I've been on client sites all day?"
- "If they want more than the bare minimum, they'll have to pay me overtime. It doesn't matter than I'm a salaried employee."
- "I don't see what's the big rush to get documentation done. They've lived for this long without it. It's not like their network is blowing up."
- "Due to WoW commitments, I cannot make this customer meeting in San Bernardino. Don't you know it takes an hour to get out there???"
- "I have to work more than 40 hours a week????? WTF???"

fmitawaps

Iristheangel wrote: »

That would be interesting. This is how I would see it going down from Fmitas' perspective:
- Customer meeting at 10AM in downtown LA. Fmitas shows up at 10:45. "I don't see what the big deal is! Don't you guys know how crazy LA traffic is???"
- "Ugh. These customers think they can just monopolize my time and expect a response."
- "Shouldn't the customers be paying me to configure this for them?"
- "Do they really expect me to answer emails after 5PM after I've been on client sites all day?"
- "If they want more than the bare minimum, they'll have to pay me overtime. It doesn't matter than I'm a salaried employee."
- "I don't see what's the big rush to get documentation done. They've lived for this long without it. It's not like their network is blowing up."
- "Due to WoW commitments, I cannot make this customer meeting in San Bernardino. Don't you know it takes an hour to get out there???"
- "I have to work more than 40 hours a week????? WTF???"

LOL, I don't think I'd be THAT bad. I spent a lot of time in L.A. traffic, I'd know what to expect. And I don't play WoW much anymore, maybe 2-3 hours a week.

iBrokeIT

fmitawaps wrote: »

LOL, I don't think I'd be THAT bad. I spent a lot of time in L.A. traffic, I'd know what to expect. And I don't play WoW much anymore, maybe 2-3 hours a week.

Ok, this isn't going to work with that level of reasonableness, you'll have raid AT LEAST 3 times a week and rage quit at least once a week. You are the antagonist here, act like one!

Iristheangel

iBrokeIT wrote: »

Ok, this isn't going to work with that level of reasonableness, you'll have raid AT LEAST 3 times a week and rage quit at least once a week. You are the antagonist here, act like one!

If only he were as reasonable when he had to drive that long country road and he knew folks might be slow on it every day. Le sigh...

Oh well, he's amusing at least. He's probably just going for attention but amusing all the same.

TomkoTech

I would be curious as to how he envisions an actual job in networking going once he finds someone to hire him in it. Sitting at a desk playing wow for 40 hours a week? Or will he quit over the injustice of having been paid a salary exempt and asked to work 65 hours one week?

ITSpectre

Iristheangel wrote: »

That would be interesting. This is how I would see it going down from Fmitas' perspective:
- Customer meeting at 10AM in downtown LA. Fmitas shows up at 10:45. "I don't see what the big deal is! Don't you guys know how crazy LA traffic is???"
- "Ugh. These customers think they can just monopolize my time and expect a response."
- "Shouldn't the customers be paying me to configure this for them?"
- "Do they really expect me to answer emails after 5PM after I've been on client sites all day?"
- "If they want more than the bare minimum, they'll have to pay me overtime. It doesn't matter than I'm a salaried employee."
- "I don't see what's the big rush to get documentation done. They've lived for this long without it. It's not like their network is blowing up."
- "Due to WoW commitments, I cannot make this customer meeting in San Bernardino. Don't you know it takes an hour to get out there???"
- "I have to work more than 40 hours a week????? WTF???"

- "Shows up to job interview with resume, CV, and a card. On the card it says HIRE ME DAMMIT!!!!"

ITSpectre

TomkoTech wrote: »

I would be curious as to how he envisions an actual job in networking going once he finds someone to hire him in it. Sitting at a desk playing wow for 40 hours a week? Or will he quit over the injustice of having been paid a salary exempt and asked to work 65 hours one week?

This is what would happen..............

The good days are here.
- Gets networking job..... "hey man I just got this cool NOC position!!!!"
- man im working hard at this new position... but ive noticed that one guy that im training with is lazy and I have to share a cube with him

Annoyed at first
Man im a NEW NOC and I just want to have at it with the networks but im raiding right now thats why I was late for work... 10 mins late.... IS THAT A CRIME!!!!! I mean I have GOT to play my WoW in the mornings I already drive 20 mins to work.... and last night I almost beat the new dungeon

Downward Spiral
My boss warned me again for being late but I mean the country streets I drive on are 2 lanes and im always stuck behind some old guy. PLUS I play WoW 2-3 times a week and im not going to miss the new dungeons

The exit
So today I was caught for the 3rd time playing WoW on a company computer. I mean if everyone else can play hearts, solitare, or minsweeper I can play WoW. My game time is about to expire anyway... at least I get paid tomorrow so I can re up.... I got called into the office and fired today all because of WoW. Oh well back to the job hunt... and now I can play more WoW too....

Another reason why Im glad im gone is because my boss asked me to work overtime this week and I can't do that. I have a strict WoW raiding schedule that is more important.... the NERVE of him to ask me to work more then 40hrs this week...

The people are against me
I don't understand it. there are people there that take 4 smoke breaks a day but I come in 10-15min late a day and I get fired!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! the NERVE of them.... oh well they are all beneath me. I am smarter, and my wow character is calling me.

thomas_

Iristheangel wrote: »

- "If they want more than the bare minimum, they'll have to pay me overtime. It doesn't matter than I'm a salaried employee."
- "I have to work more than 40 hours a week????? WTF???"

Unfortunately, a lot of employers incorrectly categorize their IT workers as being computers workers and thus exempt from FLSA rules in regards to overtime pay and compensation. Furthermore, a lot of IT workers don't realize this, so they work long hours without overtime pay thinking that's just the way it is, but in reality they should be getting paid time and a half for every hour over 40 hours they put in during any given week.

TomkoTech wrote: »

I would be curious as to how he envisions an actual job in networking going once he finds someone to hire him in it. Sitting at a desk playing wow for 40 hours a week? Or will he quit over the injustice of having been paid a salary exempt and asked to work 65 hours one week?

See my quote above. Your employer is literally stealing money that should be in your pocket by saying you are exempt when you really aren't exempt. In a lot of cases IT workers aren't exempt from FMLA even when their employers say they are.

ITSpectre wrote: »

I don't understand it. there are people there that take 4 smoke breaks a day but I come in 10-15min late a day and I get fired!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! the NERVE of them.... oh well they are all beneath me. I am smarter, and my wow character is calling me.

I have a lot of sympathy for FMITAWAPS in regards to this issue. It is complete bull **** that employees who smoke automatically get extra breaks that non-smokers don't get to take. If a non-smoker tries to take a "non-smoking" smoking break that immediately get a lot of flack for it.

Iristheangel

thomas_ wrote: »

Unfortunately, a lot of employers incorrectly categorize their IT workers as being computers workers and thus exempt from FMLA rules in regards to overtime pay and compensation. Furthermore, a lot of IT workers don't realize this, so they work long hours without overtime pay thinking that's just the way it is, but in reality they should be getting paid time and a half for every hour over 40 hours they put in during any given week.

See my quote above. Your employer is literally stealing money that should be in your pocket by saying you are exempt when you really aren't exempt. In a lot of cases IT workers aren't exempt from FMLA even when their employers say they are.

I have a lot of sympathy for FMITAWAPS in regards to this issue. It is complete bull **** that employees who smoke automatically get extra breaks that non-smokers don't get to take. If a non-smoker tries to take a "non-smoking" smoking break that immediately get a lot of flack for it.

No, they're not stealing money from you. You can be exempt from overtime as a salaried employee for a number of reasons:
- 541.201 - Directly related to management or general business operations - And I quote: "To qualify for the administrative exception, an employee's primary duty must be the performance of work directly related to the management or general business operations of the employer or the employer's customers... Work directly related to management or general business operations includes, but is not limited to work in functional areas such as... computer networking, internet and database administration"
- 541.301 - Learned professionals - (a) To qualify for the learned professional exemption, an employee’s primary duty must be the performance of work requiring advanced knowledge in a field of science or learning customarily acquired by a prolonged course of specialized intellectual instruction. This primary duty test includes three elements: (1) The employee must perform work requiring advanced knowledge; (2) The advanced knowledge must be in a field of science or learning; and (3) The advanced knowledge must be customarily acquired by a prolonged course of specialized intellectual instruction
- 541.601 - Highly compensated employees - (a) An employee with total annual compensation of at least $100,000 is deemed exempt under section 13(a)(1) of the Act if the employee customarily and regularly performs any one or more of the exempt duties or responsibilities of an executive, administrative or professional employee identified in subparts B, C or D of this part

So yes, any number of the above would still make someone exempt. If you get a high-paying networking or systems job down the road and start telling your employer that they're stealing from you because there's a outage that requires you to work 50 hours that week and you don't get paid overtime... well... good luck?

thomas_

Thank you for providing that information. It definitely gives me something to look into. I was more or less referring to the "computer employee" exemption. However, based off of what you posted there are quite a lot of other exemptions, I guess I should read through the entire text of the FLSA sometime.

I would be interested to see if there's any case law in regards to the specific exemptions that you mentioned. Oftentimes, the way laws are interpreted by the courts are different than the way it seems like it should be interpreted.

If I was making over six figures I probably wouldn't complain about working 50 hours a week. However, if I was being required to work an excessive amount of hours on a consistent basis then I would probably pay to consult with a labor law attorney to see if what my employer was doing was in fact support by the FLSA and any applicable case law. Ideally, before I got hired for the job it would be put in my employment contract that I wouldn't work more than 40 hours a week and should the occasion arise where I had to work more than 40 hours a week I would be compensated time and a half for every hour over 40 hours that I worked.

DoubleNNs

Iristheangel wrote: »

That would be interesting. This is how I would see it going down from Fmitas' perspective:
- Customer meeting at 10AM in downtown LA. Fmitas shows up at 10:45. "I don't see what the big deal is! Don't you guys know how crazy LA traffic is???"
- "Ugh. These customers think they can just monopolize my time and expect a response."
- "Shouldn't the customers be paying me to configure this for them?"
- "Do they really expect me to answer emails after 5PM after I've been on client sites all day?"
- "If they want more than the bare minimum, they'll have to pay me overtime. It doesn't matter than I'm a salaried employee."
- "I don't see what's the big rush to get documentation done. They've lived for this long without it. It's not like their network is blowing up."
- "Due to WoW commitments, I cannot make this customer meeting in San Bernardino. Don't you know it takes an hour to get out there???"
- "I have to work more than 40 hours a week????? WTF???"

Those like like quotes from me at my current job.

Iristheangel

There's been a few and definitely a lot of settlements - mostly because there's a lot of expenses in carrying on a long class action suit. One thing to consider when you are thinking of consulting a lawyer or threatening legal actions with your employer:

- No matter how "in the right" you are, you're most likely never going to move up in that company after threatening legal action. Ever.
- If you go through with a lawsuit, your name will now be Google-able for that lawsuit that your name is slapped on since it's a matter of public record. This is what future employers will see when they search for your name.
- If you're right, make sure you will win and that you'll win enough for future lost wages since every future employer may be cautious about you

I do believe that there are injustices in this world and in employment and laws act as a shield to us from these injustices but they shouldn't be used as a sword. I think legal action is warranted in extreme action but you have to decide what that is for you because if it's not something that's really going to right the wrong or keep you employable in the future, you have to decide if it's worth it. I do think if someone is being harassed, bullied, abused, etc in some extreme manner at work, the employer should not be able to submit them to that but if it's arguing about exemption status and a bunch of iffies that might or might not get you something like $50K when all is said and done IF you win and after paying a lawyer and your name is forever out there as that person that sued you previous employer, is it really worth suing vs just quitting?

Never put up with an abusive or bad situation but don't shoot yourself in the foot long term just to be "right."

iBrokeIT

Iristheangel wrote: »

No, they're not stealing money from you. You can be exempt from overtime as a salaried employee for a number of reasons:
...

Actually the more commonly cited one I've seen is this one: https://www.dol.gov/whd/overtime/fs17a_overview.pdf

Which states:

Computer Employee Exemption
To qualify for the computer employee exemption, the following tests must be met:

• The employee must be compensated either on a salary or fee basis (as defined in the regulations) at arate not less than $455 per week or, if compensated on an hourly basis, at a rate not less than $27.63 anhour;
• The employee must be employed as a computer systems analyst, computer programmer, softwareengineer or other similarly skilled worker in the computer field performing the duties described below;
• The employee’s primary duty must consist of:
1) The application of systems analysis techniques and procedures, including consulting with users, todetermine hardware, software or system functional specifications;
2) The design, development, documentation, analysis, creation, testing or modification of computersystems or programs, including prototypes, based on and related to user or system designspecifications;
3) The design, documentation, testing, creation or modification of computer programs related tomachine operating systems; or
4) A combination of the aforementioned duties, the performance of which requires the same level ofskills.

$455 per week comes out to be about $23,660/yr.

Simply stating a fact here and not trying to introduce politics into the discussion... In the last three days it was announced that Obama and the DOL were raising that rate from $23,660 to $47,476 which will take effect on Dec 1st, 2016.

Article: Obama Administration Extends Overtime Pay to Millions - WSJ

(Please keep politics out of this discussion)

Iristheangel

Oh, I don't care about the politics aspect so no issue there

The job I was referring to in my original sarcastic post pays much more than $50K anyways. I don't think if you make under $50K it is fair to exempt you from overtime in my honest opinion.