Is it just me, or can anyone else absolutely not stand Keith Bogarts teaching style?

I've noticed that some of Chris Bryants materials that are supposed "refreshed" are in fact out of date, pulled from older video series, and just missing some material.

So I finally tapped my all-access INE pass beyond just the Practice Exam murdering me, and Keith does an OK job with Q&A explaining the answers for the practice exam, but when he actually teaches a lesson, I cannot stand him.

He says the same things repeatedly followed by silence like he himself is confused about what he just said, his explanations he makes a lot of odd hand gestures, followed by more silence as he moves on in the topic.

I can't imagine what a "water cooler" chat with this guy would be like if I met him in a check out line at the grocery store, I would probably go home and immediately kill myself.

Is it just me or is this guy seriously just absolutely hard on the ears and eyes to listen to and watch for any length of time?!

/rant, I am just having to use his material to fill in some gaps Chris's course left, and every minute of his videos are like torture.

EDIT:

Not to say he isn't brilliant when it comes to Cisco technology inside and out, but my god is he hard to watch or listen for me.

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MitM

Not me. I used his courses for CCNP and found it to be fantastic. He does at times seem confused though.

he's very responsive to his student too unlike a lot of instructors

shortstop20

I'm with you, I can't watch his videos.

ande0255

I now see that it sort of seems like his courses are based around accomplishing tasks, and he is thinking through his options of how to accomplish the task, rather than having a steady flow of explaining the topic.

He kind of bounces back and forth between explanations, which in the end clarify his point, but good lawdy is he hard to watch get through the explanation of the topic.

MitM wrote: »

Not me. I used his courses for CCNP and found it to be fantastic. He does at times seem confused though.

he's very responsive to his student too unlike a lot of instructors

That makes a complete difference I would bet, I only have the All-Access on demand stuff, but having the ability to ask questions from him and get responses would be a huge helper if you cannot decipher his lesson.

I just am so glad I am done listening to him for tonight, he is great for explaining the details of protocol behaviors, but he is just so hard to watch for an extended period of time stumble through the topic but eventually getting his point across.

I think leaving him off-camera and just having the CLI / Whiteboard / Topology would do wonders for his course, they seriously need to get this guy off camera!

mbarrett

ande0255 wrote: »

and Keith does an OK job with Q&A explaining the answers for the practice exam, but when he actually teaches a lesson, I cannot stand him.

Nobody is forcing you to watch - why don't you just find another training source if you're not happy with INE? You could always give feedback directly to them, if it's really a problem...

adrianm68

I think it depends on the watcher, and where you are in your study. I used to love watching Jeremy Cioara when I did my CCNA, and hated the videos I saw of Keith Bogart. But now that NP study calls for more intensive study, I quite like Keith at INE, mostly I think because he covers alot more background and detail. I am studying for switch, and I think Jeremy's NP switch course at CBT nuggets is far too light on to get a pass. As for Chris Bryant, I have never really enjoyed his style, but for 10 bucks, he is a steal - and one simply cannot get enough different sources from which to study.

sacredboy

I watched CBT with JC, ITProTV with Don Pezet and INE with Keith Bogart and from my personal experience I totally agree with TS. Keith Bogart is the worst tutor.

SeekBytes

I am personally a big fan of Keith Bogart. I enjoyed his teaching style.

ande0255

adrianm68 wrote: »

I think it depends on the watcher, and where you are in your study. I used to love watching Jeremy Cioara when I did my CCNA, and hated the videos I saw of Keith Bogart. But now that NP study calls for more intensive study, I quite like Keith at INE, mostly I think because he covers alot more background and detail. I am studying for switch, and I think Jeremy's NP switch course at CBT nuggets is far too light on to get a pass. As for Chris Bryant, I have never really enjoyed his style, but for 10 bucks, he is a steal - and one simply cannot get enough different sources from which to study.

Yes this about sums up my situation, Chris Bryant is great, but the more I read through his ebook after watching his video series he just doesn't have that above and beyond detail like Keith Bogart goes into.

I think he is just awkward with speaking, like I said, if I had to shoot the **** with him in a grocery line I would probably come home and scrub my brain with a wire brush.

However, if I had to learn the difference between a distribute-list vs filter-list in OSPF, I'll listen as long as I can withstand his slow paced explanations for clarity sake.

ccie14023

ande0255 wrote: »

I can't imagine what a "water cooler" chat with this guy would be like if I met him in a check out line at the grocery store, I would probably go home and immediately kill myself.

My first stint at Cisco way back in 2005 was in TAC, and I had to do a two-day course in switch architecture. Keith was the instructor. He was awesome and a great guy.

It was funny, though, because Beau Williamson was in his class. Beau wrote the Cisco Press book on multicast. The first one. And when Keith got to multicast Beau was sitting there shaking his head. Finally Beau got up and taught the multicast portion himself. Keith was cool about it though, it could happen to anyone.

Haven't seen his videos, though, maybe he's changed, but I remember Keith and thought he was a good guy.

MitM

ande0255 wrote: »

That makes a complete difference I would bet, I only have the All-Access on demand stuff, but having the ability to ask questions from him and get responses would be a huge helper if you cannot decipher his lesson.

I only have the All-Access pass stuff too. If you send him an email @INE, the guy will answer. He prefers their forums, but I never had a problem

Legacy User

Have you tried watching at 1.5 speed? Watching him is not bad I just don't care for the 45 minute videos. Have you tried kevin wallace live lessons for ccnp route? It follows the format of OCG Route. It doesn't go into absolute detail but gives a great overview to bring you up to speed so you can read and understand the documentation. I like Keiths video more then Brians.

ande0255

I'm actually picking out videos from his "Bootcamp" series on topics I really sucked at, and watching his video just enough to get a gist for the configuration and behaviors, then labbing the rest to understand whats all going on.

OSPF is so much broader than I originally studied, it is just absolutely incredible, but after really learning the LSA Database and how they propagate throughout the network I feel I am in much better shape already!

Thank you for the input dmarc!

MitM

ande0255 wrote: »

I'm actually picking out videos from his "Bootcamp" series on topics I really sucked at, and watching his video just enough to get a gist for the configuration and behaviors, then labbing the rest to understand whats all going on.

OSPF is so much broader than I originally studied, it is just absolutely incredible, but after really learning the LSA Database and how they propagate throughout the network I feel I am in much better shape already!

Thank you for the input dmarc!

Unrelated, but if you want a good course on OSPF. Check out JP Cedeno's. It can be yours for only 19.99

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Legacy User

JP Cedeno <xtremeie> stuff is CCIE level so it will go into absolute detail much further then needed for the CCNP but great for real world. His EIGRP series is 9 hours so you can only imagine that he does not leave any stone left unturned. I have all of his videos. His EIGRP is the best I've seen yet haven't delved into his others topics quite yet. He sells his entire routing bundle for $60. He's a very helpful and a down to earth guy.

Iristheangel

It's true - JP Cedeno is pretty awesome. Little known secret: I have a nerd crush on him. Shhhhh. Don't tell him!

Legacy User

He does pass through here on occasion so I think it'll only be a matter of time* until the secrets out lol

Iristheangel

I'm counting on one thing: His laziness to create an account. Foiled again, JP!

Jking. I'm actually in a group chat with him and speak with him every day. I'm sure he'll see this thread.

ande0255

Keith actually responded to an IPv4 to v6 and back question to his email the next day, with a detailed answer that went above and beyond what I had originally asked (from my Hex conversion thread).

He didn't quite explain the conversion process itself flat out, but how IPv6 was meant to replace IPv4, and the mechanisms built into IPv6 configurations that convert between the two (In some of his IPv6 lessons).

I've actually gotten it down where I listen to the portion of his video I need for configuration details, then freestyle lab it on my own until I get stuck, then watch further into the video to see where I goofed up or use google resources.

Also with Chris Bryant and re-watching his videos on a post I made regarding VPN Packet Types / Headers / Tunnel mode differences, I found the lack of thorough explanation needed to full understand the subject which I needed to read RFC's and such to really get.

However I've learned, like myself, you just need to take Keith Borgart in small doses at a time - Then his sessions are much easier to make it through and give you details that I think will make or break a candidate on exam day.

He is about on par with Mark Snow who I used for Voice, so I am no stranger to boring explanations that drag on for hours, and fortunately Keith is a good step up from Mark Snow so I think I can survive his technical explanations to hopefully come out with a Pass grade on attempt #1!

adrianm68

I'm watching his switch videos - there might be a difference in his style between route and switch.

CertifiedMonkey

I listen to Keith at 1.2-1.3x speed. He has some GREAT videos on CLN. His stuff for INE is good as well, but not as good as his old vids that he did when he worked for Cisco. He's one of my favorite instructors, but I have to admit that his CCNA video series for 200-125 was poorly done.

Also, +1 for XTREMEIE. Lots of good videos for routing protocols.

dontstop

CertifiedMonkey wrote: »

I listen to Keith at 1.2-1.3x speed

Very much depends on the person I'm listening to but KB is also 1.2-1.3x for me as well.

I'm going to check out xtremeie as I've been looking for a OSPF/EIGRP/BGP deep dive series. Epic!

MAC_Addy

I love his series. I'm going through the SWITCH videos right now. I typically speed up the video to about 1.2. I honestly think he's great.

ande0255

I will increase the speed, I honestly would not have even thought of that, thanks for sharing that info on how you guys deal with his lessons

MitM

ande0255 wrote: »

He is about on par with Mark Snow who I used for Voice, so I am no stranger to boring explanations that drag on for hours, and fortunately Keith is a good step up from Mark Snow so I think I can survive his technical explanations to hopefully come out with a Pass grade on attempt #1!

Mark is a super smart guy, but I could not get into watching his videos, at least his voice ones. His CCIE DC ones were better, probably because the topics interest me more.

ande0255

Yes I ONLY resorted to his video series as I just got hired in as a Uinifed Communications 'Engineer' (My company loves the title Engineer), and I told the manager up front I had absolutely no phone or really network experience beyond a CCNA, but he had a good feeling on me.

So I couldn't let the opportunity slip, fortunately his voice series matched up well with SMB customers at my MSP, some of them still using those old UC500 routers solely as there phone system up to multiple Call Manager / Unity / Presence servers.

That was my lucky break into networking, the hiring manager left the company a couple weeks after hiring me, I like to call myself his last **** you to the company but fortunately it worked out very well