Network vs Host question

I'm starting to study CCNA

I'm trying to understand the subnet

each octet has 8 bits etc..
In Binary 1 represent Network and 0 represent Host

I understand host is a PC
but Network what does that represent? the number of routers? or switches?
what exactly is Network when we are talking about subnet?

Number of Subnet mask within the same network router?

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Comments

kalebksp

The network is just an identifier, it doesn't represent the number of anything. When hosts communicate they use the network portion of the address to determine whether they can communicate directly (they have the same network portion) or whether they need the assistance of a router (they have different network portions).

Bl8ckr0uter

Handbrake wrote: »

I'm starting to study CCNA

I'm trying to understand the subnet

each octet has 8 bits etc..
In Binary 1 represent Network and 0 represent Host

I understand host is a PC
but Network what does that represent? the number of routers? or switches?
what exactly is Network when we are talking about subnet?

Number of Subnet mask within the same network router?

Welcome to the forums!

First off, the host doesn't nessarly need to be a pc. It could be anything that is not going to be the device providing routing services (default-gateway is a term that comes into play when thinking about this) for the "network" - a pc, a switch, a router, blackberry/iphone, or whatever.

A "network" in the terms of ip addressing is anything in the confines of the ip addressing scheme which is dictated by the subnet mask. What the hell did I just say? Well think about it like this we have this IP address:
192.168.1.1/24 (255.255.255.0)
The "network" is 192.168.1 and the "host" .1. What controls the network portion/host portion of the ip address is the subnet mask. In the previous example the /24 (255.255.255.0) means that the first 3 octets are used for "network" addressing and the last octet is used for "host" addressing. The first ip address in a network is used to identify the device that will be providing routering services for the network (almost always a router). Reading this IP subnetting made easy will help you. I am not going to go into the binary math in this response because I think that is best sumed up via the article.

Now here is a question for you if I a have this ip address/subnet mask what is the network portion and host portion: 10.1.0.1 255.255.0.0
Bonus points if you can tell me the technique that I applied to this ip address and what is its use.

miller811

http://www.techexams.net/forums/ccna-ccent/38772-subnetting-made-easy.html

gravyjoe

Think of hosts and networks as "the number of hosts vs. the number of networks". Since 0 represents hosts, and 1 represents networks, the more hosts (zeroes) in a 32-bit mask, the less amount of networks there can be. The more networks, the less amount of hosts can be in those networks.

It's like a hotel. Networks are like rooms, and hosts are like people. If you only have so much space to build a hotel, you can either create:
1) Millions of very small rooms to fit a few people each.
2) A few rooms that can fit millions of people each.
3) Or somewhere inbetween.

Example 1: If I have a subnet mask of 255.255.255.252, it will look like this in binary:

11111111.11111111.11111111.11111100

There's a whole lot of networks (1's) here, but with a 255.255.255.252 mask, only 2 hosts are allowed per subnet. It's like having millions of very small rooms that can only fit up to 2 people.

Example 2: If I have a subnet mask of 255.0.0.0, it will look like this in binary:

11111111.00000000.00000000.00000000

A whole lot of hosts (0's) here. A lot of hosts can fit into this subnet. Very large room. However, not as many rooms can be created.

Hope this helps

Forsaken_GA

To try and simplify this a bit -

A host is an endpoint, and a network is a logical grouping of hosts. Think of it like a baseball team - the network identifier tells you the team is the Detroit Tigers, and number 35 identifies Justin Verlander.

Handbrake

knwminus wrote: »

Welcome to the forums!

First off, the host doesn't nessarly need to be a pc. It could be anything that is not going to be the device providing routing services (default-gateway is a term that comes into play when thinking about this) for the "network" - a pc, a switch, a router, blackberry/iphone, or whatever.

A "network" in the terms of ip addressing is anything in the confines of the ip addressing scheme which is dictated by the subnet mask. What the hell did I just say? Well think about it like this we have this IP address:
192.168.1.1/24 (255.255.255.0)
The "network" is 192.168.1 and the "host" .1. What controls the network portion/host portion of the ip address is the subnet mask. In the previous example the /24 (255.255.255.0) means that the first 3 octets are used for "network" addressing and the last octet is used for "host" addressing. The first ip address in a network is used to identify the device that will be providing routering services for the network (almost always a router). Reading this IP subnetting made easy will help you. I am not going to go into the binary math in this response because I think that is best sumed up via the article.

Now here is a question for you if I a have this ip address/subnet mask what is the network portion and host portion: 10.1.0.1 255.255.0.0
Bonus points if you can tell me the technique that I applied to this ip address and what is its use.

10.1. is network and 0.1 is host?

I figured since subnet is 16/16 bit

Bl8ckr0uter

Handbrake wrote: »

10.1. is network and 0.1 is host?

I figured since subnet is 16/16 bit

You got it. Now tell me what kind of application of the subnetting this is for the bonus?

Hint Hint: What kayne west did to taylor swift showed that he is _________ and that he had no __________

dynamik

Yo knwminus, I'm really happy for you. I'm gonna let you finish, but tech-airman asks the best leading questions of all time. Of all time!

networker050184

dynamik wrote: »

Yo knwminus, I'm really happy for you. I'm gonna let you finish, but tech-airman asks the best leading questions of all time. Of all time!

Now that is hilarious!

Handbrake

knwminus wrote: »

You got it. Now tell me what kind of application of the subnetting this is for the bonus?

Hint Hint: What kayne west did to taylor swift showed that he is _________ and that he had no __________

I'm not sure If I understand your application question but I think it's use for a large or mid size network since class B sub can have 65534 hosts and networks

miller811

Handbrake wrote: »

I'm not sure If I understand your application question but I think it's use for a large or mid size network since class B sub can have 65534 hosts and networks

Would he be considered Classful or Classless?

KPWright

I'll take a stab at the application question, but it looks like it's an "it depends" answer.

If the routing protocol used is a classful protocol (eg RIP v1), then the mask is ignored and the address yields the network portion to be only the first octet with the network defined as 10.0.0.0 since 10 is part of the class A range. The address would be specifying host no. 65536 out of a total of 16777214 possible in the network.

If on the other hand the routing protocol used is a classless protocol (eg OSPF), the address would yield one of 256 subnets, with a network address of 10.1.0.0. Each of these subnets could address as many as 65534 hosts. The address given denotes the first host address in the subnet.

I know that's more than what you had in mind, but let me know if I'm off base on any of it. I'm at the dangerous point where I think I might be starting to get it.

But I'm still confused what this has to do with Kanye West being brain dead

)

Bl8ckr0uter

KPWright wrote: »

I'll take a stab at the application question, but it looks like it's an "it depends" answer.

If the routing protocol used is a classful protocol (eg RIP v1), then the mask is ignored and the address yields the network portion to be only the first octet with the network defined as 10.0.0.0 since 10 is part of the class A range. The address would be specifying host no. 65536 out of a total of 16777214 possible in the network.

If on the other hand the routing protocol used is a classless protocol (eg OSPF), the address would yield one of 256 subnets, with a network address of 10.1.0.0. Each of these subnets could address as many as 65534 hosts. The address given denotes the first host address in the subnet.

I know that's more than what you had in mind, but let me know if I'm off base on any of it. I'm at the dangerous point where I think I might be starting to get it.

But I'm still confused what this has to do with Kanye West being brain dead )

The answer I was looking for was classful or classless. I was trying to say that Kayne was classless, and that he had no class.

And yea that was more than what I was thinking although I believe you are right.

tech-airman

Handbrake wrote: »

I'm starting to study CCNA

I'm trying to understand the subnet

each octet has 8 bits etc..
In Binary 1 represent Network and 0 represent Host

I understand host is a PC
but Network what does that represent? the number of routers? or switches?
what exactly is Network when we are talking about subnet?

Number of Subnet mask within the same network router?

Handbrake,

Do you know how to find out the IP address for the computer that you're using now?

Handbrake

tech-airman wrote: »

Handbrake,

Do you know how to find out the IP address for the computer that you're using now?

Yes with ipconfig command

regarding classful and classess

how can u tell if it's classful or classless?

is it because it's class A ip with class B sub?

Bl8ckr0uter

Handbrake wrote: »

Yes with ipconfig command

regarding classful and classess

how can u tell if it's classful or classless?

is it because it's class A ip with class B sub?

Short answer yes.

Long answer: You can tell it is classless by the subnet that it is using. In classful addressing a class a address (10.0.0.0) can only use a class A subnet mask (255.0.0.0) a class B (172.16.0.0) only uses a class b subnet mask (255.255.0.0) and a class C (192.168.1.0) only uses a class C subnet mask (255.255.255.0).
In classless addressing you can have a class A ip with a class A or B or C address and etc.

tech-airman

Handbrake wrote: »

Yes with ipconfig command

regarding classful and classess

how can u tell if it's classful or classless?

is it because it's class A ip with class B sub?

Handbrake,

What is the IP address and subnet mask for your computer?

rwwest7

A host is a PC, a network is a collection of PC's.

A PC on one network can't reach a PC on another network without using a router/gateway. The whole point of creating different networks is to make multiple broadcast domains.

Handbrake

tech-airman wrote: »

Handbrake,

What is the IP address and subnet mask for your computer?

I have a class C address with class C sub

192.168.1.33
255.255.255.0

I don't have 33 Hosts on my network ..i just static assigned random

Handbrake

knwminus wrote: »

Short answer yes.

Long answer: You can tell it is classless by the subnet that it is using. In classful addressing a class a address (10.0.0.0) can only use a class A subnet mask (255.0.0.0) a class B (172.16.0.0) only uses a class b subnet mask (255.255.0.0) and a class C (192.168.1.0) only uses a class C subnet mask (255.255.255.0).
In classless addressing you can have a class A ip with a class A or B or C address and etc.

I guess I don't get the purpose of classless of mixing things together..

wouldn't it be neat and nice just to keep it classful?

trackit

Handbrake wrote: »

I guess I don't get the purpose of classless of mixing things together..

wouldn't it be neat and nice just to keep it classful?

it would, if we would have enough addresses that everybody could be assigned a classful block of addresses

i almost always use classful nets for internal use, but we cant do that with external addresses.

Handbrake

trackit wrote: »

it would, if we would have enough addresses that everybody could be assigned a classful block of addresses i almost always use classful nets for internal use, but we cant do that with external addresses.

Yes this is where I become confused is subnetting.. i'll have to read through subnetting made easy really slow

tech-airman

Handbrake wrote: »

I have a class C address with class C sub

192.168.1.33
255.255.255.0

I don't have 33 Hosts on my network ..i just static assigned random

What is the default mask for a Class C network?

Handbrake

tech-airman wrote: »

What is the default mask for a Class C network?

Default
Class C mask is
255.255.255.0
Or prefix of /24bit of networks

and 8bit host

Is the term Network Address, and Subnet Address the samething?

Handbrake

IP Address 195.219.91.33/19
Subnet Mask 255.255.224.0 (224 = 11100000)
Network ID 195.219.64.0 (2^5 = 32
Broadcast ID 195.219.95.255 (64+32-1= 95)

Host = 2^13bit = 8192 - 2 = 8190 (2 = Network ID+Broadcast ID)
Network = 2^19bit = 524, 288

Ok, above I think I understood how to get Network ID and Broadcast ID. Thanks to easy subnetting.. "AND" command on calculator was supper helpful without having to convert everything to binary..which i know to do, but i tend to make a mistake when converting it back and forward.

Basically, I AND 91.33 and 224.0 and got 64.0
Now to get Broadcast ID I have to convert 224 to binary to see the remaining host bit.

(Question here..Do you have always convert it to binary?
Can you just use a calculator some how?)

The next octet is 255 which i saw network ID last octet is 0..and I guess it's going to max out at 255 but in reality is 1-254 usable for host right?

I hope I got the math correct...

Even I got this math figured..I still really don't fully understand the concept of putting it to work.

8190 Hosts.. meaning I can have 8190 on 224.0 Subnet

Out in the real world How many switches and router do I need to deal with 8190 hosts? How would you setup a network with these many hosts..?

Router-->SW1---SW2--->Sw3 etc? this is where I'm not being able to put to gether....I guess I need a diagram

I understood on a smaller scale of 192.168.1.1/24
One router could probably handle this 254 Hosts right?

Firemarshalbill.com

And thats why we go to the next level VLSM - subnetting subnets

Handbrake go to my linkedin page and download my IP Subnetting presentation I think it does a good job of simplifying the process for alot of the IP stuff. My students at ITT find it helps them alot. I am in the process of writing and publishing another white paper on the topic of VLSM

http://www.linkedin.com/in/firemarshalbill

tech-airman

Handbrake wrote: »

Default
Class C mask is
255.255.255.0
Or prefix of /24bit of networks and 8bit host

Is the term Network Address, and Subnet Address the samething?

Handbrake,

What is the subnet mask for your computer again?

Handbrake

tech-airman wrote: »

handbrake,

what is the subnet mask for your computer again?

255.255.255.0

Handbrake

Tech Airman..i thought i got the math down but I guess not at 100%

I took a test online and most stuff i could figured out but I have no idea how to get this one.

Can you give me a formula for below question?

The number of avalid subnets on 99.0.0.0/17
network is

Answer: 512

KPWright

Handbrake wrote: »

Tech Airman..i thought i got the math down but I guess not at 100%

I took a test online and most stuff i could figured out but I have no idea how to get this one.
Can you give me a formula for below question?

The number of avalid subnets on 99.0.0.0/17
network is

Answer: 512

Handbrake, If you don't mind I'll take a stab at this and maybe somebody can check me on it.

99.0.0.0 is a class A network so the first octet is dedicated. The remaining 24 bits are available to identify subnets / hosts. The 17 bit mask includes the 8 bits which identify the class A as well as 9 more that are "borrowed" to identify possible subnets. The number of available subnets is therefore 2^9 = 512.

How'd I do?