MCSE still worth it or expired?

benchod

Is it worth pursuing MCSE ?

Ben

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veritas_libertas

benchod wrote: »

Is it worth pursuing MCSE ?

Ben

If you are already using 2003 servers yes. If you are trying to get into Network Administration right now then just go the MCITP:EA path. That is my opinion. Do a search on MCITP on Monster and you will see the demand has changed alot from a year ago. I now see MCSE or MCITP frequently.

RobertKaucher

I agree witht his, but I still see no postings for the MCITP Certifications i my area. I see a few for the MCSE. The issue I am seeing is far, far fewer positions seem concerned about certification in general. :-/

benchod

I a not sure how I can break into any industry at this point. Currently, I am not in even in position as system admin /network admin none. My interest lies in Database Management, but I am not sure how I can even really break into the field. I am currently working as tech support and wasting my time since this position isn't taking me anywhere; my current employer has everything out sourced, you can think of this as a call center tech supor role, complete waste of time.

I've been getting good support from this board, but not straight path support. It seems like many of you have break-en into IT industry back in the days when it was easy for new comers to acquired position and progress.

How does individual like me progress in IT field ? I have a Bachelor, I have management experience but unable to progress.

I am thinking if I should abandon IT suppor role and enroll in master program to attract higher end IT position such as System analyst, Business Analyst, etc.. $30,000 debt and not even sure of end results.

I am not sure if I am making sense,but its getting frustrated, I can' t sleep well, I hate going to my tech job, feel so hopeless.

I know I have asked the same question over and over, but I am stuck in this cycle. I am 27 years old , married and without a career.

How do I break out of this cycle ?

My apology for any spelling error. Everyday is a dragged, my behavior has completely change from last year.. I feel I am going down in a wrong path.

Ben

veritas_libertas

benchod wrote: »

I a not sure how I can break into any industry at this point. Currently, I am not in even in position as system admin /network admin none. My interest lies in Database Management, but I am not sure how I can even really break into the field. I am currently working as tech support and wasting my time since this position isn't taking me anywhere; my current employer has everything out sourced, you can think of this as a call center tech supor role, complete waste of time.

I've been getting good support from this board, but not straight path support. It seems like many of you have break-en into IT industry back in the days when it was easy for new comers to acquired position and progress.

How does individual like me progress in IT field ? I have a Bachelor, I have management experience but unable to progress.

I am thinking if I should abandon IT suppor role and enroll in master program to attract higher end IT position such as System analyst, Business Analyst, etc.. $30,000 debt and not even sure of end results.

I am not sure if I am making sense,but its getting frustrated, I can' t sleep well, I hate going to my tech job, feel so hopeless.

I know I have asked the same question over and over, but I am stuck in this cycle. I am 27 years old , married and without a career.

How do I break out of this cycle ?

My apology for any spelling error. Everyday is a dragged, my behavior has completely change from last year.. I feel I am going down in a wrong path.

Ben

I am 27, married, doing desktop support, and planning to start on Bachelor degree next year. I would suggest working on the MCITP:EA and then working on the Database stuff that interests you after that. You could do the MCITP:EA over next year and then try to get a Network Admin job. From there you could study for Database certifications and then try to move into that area. I really believe in IT that there really is no standard path other than starting in Help Desk or Desktop Support first.

Look at this way (and no I am not doing the feel good thing, this is the truth) you already have done this much: Degree--> Desktop Support/Help Desk/IT Job-->

Now all you have to do is start working on certifications towards your goal. If you choose to you can use all that frustration as motivation to knock off some certifications and get out of what you hate. I badly want to break into security and I am using that as motivation to knock off my CCNA, knock off some sort of security certification, and start on Bachelor degree next year.

benchod

I thought certification without experience is pointless and waste of time ?

This is coming from many poster on the forum

tpatt100

benchod wrote: »

I thought certification without experience is pointless and waste of time ?

This is coming from many poster on the forum

Not a waste of time if you stick with entry level certs. I am the type that thinks progressing beyond A+, Network +, MCITP:SA,CCNA without experience is kind of wasting your time/effort but to each their own.

veritas_libertas

benchod wrote: »

I thought certification without experience is pointless and waste of time ?

This is coming from many poster on the forum

Time in IT, is still time in IT. A certification still means you have head knowledge. I don't want to teach someone head knowledge + application. I would much rather teach someone the application of what they have learned. There are plenty of people out there that have gotten there job because of certifications. I'm not saying having a certification makes you golden but you are still better off than the person who doesn't. I have a Computer Networking degree but no one wants me without at least a CCNA in the area I live in. If I had a CCNA I could probably snag an entry-level networking job.

Turgon

benchod wrote: »

I thought certification without experience is pointless and waste of time ?

This is coming from many poster on the forum

Not exactly. A lot of people get locked into what they are using at work or are going to use. If you want to learn something new and the hands on opportunities do not arise in the workplace there is nothing wrong with reading up on new things.

veritas_libertas

tpatt100 wrote: »

Not a waste of time if you stick with entry level certs. I am the type that thinks progressing beyond A+, Network +, MCITP:SA,CCNA without experience is kind of wasting your time/effort but to each their own.

I agree with this statement. That is the point I was trying to make. Hmm, and I could have done it much fewer words

tpatt100

Turgon wrote: »

Not exactly. A lot of people get locked into what they are using at work or are going to use. If you want to learn something new and the hands on opportunities do not arise in the workplace there is nothing wrong with reading up on new things.

I agree with this, my point was people expecting since they have a CCNP or MCSE they should have an easier time getting a job if they are currently working at the mall or something. I think if you get the entry level certs and branch out slowly you will get more value from your entry level certs when you land an entry level job.

Once you get the job you can see what direction you want to go from there.

MentholMoose

benchod wrote: »

I a not sure how I can break into any industry at this point. Currently, I am not in even in position as system admin /network admin none. My interest lies in Database Management, but I am not sure how I can even really break into the field. I am currently working as tech support and wasting my time since this position isn't taking me anywhere; my current employer has everything out sourced, you can think of this as a call center tech supor role, complete waste of time.

You might consider trying to find a job similar to what you're doing now, but at a different company. It will be easier to move sideways, and if you can find a company where you will have more upward mobility, it will actually be a step up even if it is technically a lateral move.

There are still companies out there where this is possible. When you are interviewing, express your ambitions and try to gauge the chances of advancement... remember, an interview goes both ways!

mikej412

benchod wrote: »

How do I break out of this cycle ?

Gain knowledge and skills in an area that you like AND are good at -- then do what it takes to move into that area/field and impress people with results.

Certifications are just an indicator that you might possess a certain level of knowledge and skills -- subject to verification via technical interview -- and could get your resume pulled from a pile (or selected from a database).

The "low level" certifications may open some doors for you, but having "advanced" certifications without any relevant work experience probably closes more doors that it would ever open.

benchod wrote: »

My interest lies in Database Management, but I am not sure how I can even really break into the field.

I've seen server admins who learned some SQL move into Database Server Admin positions, and later Database Management positions.

I've seen mediocre programmers shift to Database Admin and Business Analyst positions -- and later into Database Management positions.

I've seen a lot of people without any real database/admin/server/SQL skills say they want to get into Database Management -- usually because of the $$$ -- and fail miserably.

And I've seen someone who started in a "data entry" job and spend 5 years working their way up at a "small" 50 million dollar a year company move from their Database Management position to an entry level programmer position at a Fortune 500 company and double their salary.

Turgon

tpatt100 wrote: »

I agree with this, my point was people expecting since they have a CCNP or MCSE they should have an easier time getting a job if they are currently working at the mall or something. I think if you get the entry level certs and branch out slowly you will get more value from your entry level certs when you land an entry level job.

Once you get the job you can see what direction you want to go from there.

Yes I agree. I think once you have your foot in the door and have put some time in then you can look at the advanced certs or perhaps look at something to round off experience obtained with an accreditation. Another approach is to look into a certification track to give you a jumpstart into something that would give you a new direction or a wider appreciation of things.

The problem is people plundering advanced certifications quickly without tangible experience to back it up and passing themselves off as experts. We saw a lot of this in the late nineties where there simply were not enough people available to go around. One guy I met on the boards years ago had his own site but had simply clattered the whole thing out in six weeks. He did some instructor type work but didn't run infrastructure for a living. He later then went into the security field and quickly realised there was an awful lot he didn't know in any depth. You really have to pay your dues in the field.

It's interesting. I saw a blog a little while ago where CNE's were talking about the testing loopholes they used to exploit to get accredited back in a day. They would take the same test twice in one day, in some cases three times in one day. This enabled them to clear CNE in a couple of days, and retake an exam they had seen perhaps twice already the same day and already passed in order to take it again and pass it with a high enough mark to become an instructor! Today with the technologies bedded in and so many timeserved people working infrastructure teams it's just not worth your while rat racing certs.

RobertKaucher

Ben,

I think certification is a good way to break into the IT world. I believe in another post you were talking about becoming a BI Analyst. Not gonna' happen over night. What I would suggest is that you sit down and map out where you want to be in the next 1 year, 3 years, 5 years. Are you still in school? I recall something about you getting your Master's? You should factor that into your plan as well, of course.

It seems like you are getting impatient. I've been there. But a career change of this magnitude does not happen over night and it may never happen if it is not planned or you begin acting impulsively due to a lack of patience. You could certainly go the Support -> Net Admin -> DBA route in your career, but that is not the only path that could get you where you want to go. For a serious BI/DB Developer position I would set the plan for 7 years. 1, 3, 5, and 7. What do you need to know, what background do you need to have, what will help you achieve this goal, what will add no value to your struggle? You have to find the answers....

Now if your real problem is that you need a jab that you can tollerate and still survive financially... That's another thing all together.