The best way to learn server technology

Dr_Atomic wrote: »

I read your PM. You tried to convince me to go with Windows Server 2008. I already told you that I've committed to Server 2003.

All I hear you telling me is how difficult and expensive it's going to be to pursue an MCSA. I'm going to need multiple OSs, I can't use Windows 7, etc, etc. Instead of being cryptic with your messages, maybe you could just tell me the easiest way to accomplish my goals. I'm not seeing it in your PM.

I deem that a bit rude and wholeheartedly agree with Turgon, but I can understand your frustration.

Check out the download links that the Moose just posted. Download the images (an image is the Operating System itself but in the form of a file instead of a CD, this way you can run multiple instances of the same OS in a virtualisation product), see if you can get it to work. If you cant, Google the errors, ask here.

Dont get frustrated so easily. When I first embarked upon my IT career, I didnt know this website and its super helpful existed. I googled my way through all the errors and issues I experienced. Dude, no one's going to spoon-feed you, people will help as much as they can, you got to figure out some things for yourself too.

Turgon

Essendon wrote: »

I deem that a bit rude and wholeheartedly agree with Turgon, but I can understand your frustration.

Check out the download links that the Moose just posted. Download the images (an image is the Operating System itself but in the form of a file instead of a CD, this way you can run multiple instances of the same OS in a virtualisation product), see if you can get it to work. If you cant, Google the errors, ask here.

Dont get frustrated so easily. When I first embarked upon my IT career, I didnt know this website and its super helpful existed. I googled my way through all the errors and issues I experienced. Dude, no one's going to spoon-feed you, people will help as much as they can, you got to figure out some things for yourself too.

Being successful in IT means dealing with frustration. Dude needs to deal with it. In 2002 I took holiday entitlement from work so I could play with a Xyplex terminal server to get it working for my Cisco homelab for a couple of days because I could not afford a Cisco terminal server (500 dollars). Online documentation almost zero. I got it working.

Dr Atomic. Deal with it.

MentholMoose

Dr_Atomic wrote: »

Someone else mentioned the TechNet subscription, also. I see that there's a Standard membership, which is $200. And you say that Windows Server 2003 can be obtained with that?

TechNet Standard apparently only includes Server 2003 Standard and not Enterprise. Click on the link for more info.

Dr_Atomic wrote: »

I haven't dug into all the details of it yet; how long does one have this membership, or is there a time limit?

It is a one year membership. If you don't renew you cannot download anymore or request more licenses, but you can still use the software you already downloaded and licensed.

Buy a Microsoft 2003 book and it will have a trial disc in the back.

Actually buying business software is going to be very expensive. The price is set as if you were a corporation and not someone looking to learn.

You can still get 2003 off MSDNA, but that is going to require you to go somewhere with access.

MentholMoose wrote: »

TechNet Standard apparently only includes Server 2003 Standard and not Enterprise. Click on the link for more info.

It is a one year membership. If you don't renew you cannot download anymore or request more licenses, but you can still use the software you already downloaded and licensed.

Could you learn what you needed to for the sake of the MCSA tests with just the Server 2003 Standard? Would it be that big of a difference between the two? I'd hate to get the Standard only to discover that all the things I needed to lab can only be done with the Enterprise.

From what I'm gathering on a lot of these posts, getting the VMware or Virtualbox is free, but the Server 2003 OS to go on it is going to cost hundreds of dollars - easily as much (if not more) than getting used routers/switches off eBay for a networking lab. I know few things can be obtained for free, but I guess I was a little more optimistic about getting a lab assembled for less cost.

Thanks for the help.

ccnxjr

Whichever route you choose keep in mind that officially, Windows server 2003 does not support DHCP v6

You can install IP v6, in which case it can fulfill a role as a file/print/AD server, but you'll need newer tech for DHCP v6
IPv6 Security Considerations and Recommendations
Not too sure about DNS though....

Dr_Atomic wrote: »

Could you learn what you needed to for the sake of the MCSA tests with just the Server 2003 Standard? Would it be that big of a difference between the two? I'd hate to get the Standard only to discover that all the things I needed to lab can only be done with the Enterprise.

Take a look for yourself. Here is the difference between enterprise and standard.
Comparison of Windows Server 2003 Editions: General

A lot of these are performance things, such as max ram and whether you can hot swap. You wouldn't need to worry about any of those. One thing for sure that you can't do is clustering (can do Network Load balancing). But I wouldn't be too concerned for that. For my own testing, I studied the theory and carefully watched the CBT's, but never actually implemented my own cluster. (Deemed it to be too much work for not enough gain at the time, and that I could more efficently use my time elsewhere).

You also are not able to create an Enterprise Certificate Authority. That one could bite you in the butt (good one to lab for the 293 exam) but you could probably manage without.

Devilsbane wrote: »

For my own testing, I studied the theory and carefully watched the CBT's, but never actually implemented my own cluster. (Deemed it to be too much work for not enough gain at the time, and that I could more efficently use my time elsewhere).

Good info, thanks. Were you able to lab at all to obtain your MCSA, or did you rely on the theory and online tools, such as videos? I know it's far from ideal, but it's better than moving into truck driving.

Dr_Atomic wrote: »

Good info, thanks. Were you able to lab at all to obtain your MCSA, or did you rely on the theory and online tools, such as videos? I know it's far from ideal, but it's better than moving into truck driving.

I have my own mini corporation set up in vmware.
Server1 is a RRAS server set to bridge the connection from a NAT network to a private network. I also have DHCP installed here.
Servers 2 and 3 are my Domain Controllers and DNS servers. One of them also has WSUS installed.Server 4 is actually a DC for a child Domain.
After that I kind of forget server names. I have an enterprise CA and a standalone CA out there. I have 2 xp workstations, one that is a member of each domain.

I didn't build this overnight, I just started with the Domain Controllers back at the 290, and by the time I was at the 293 I had the rest installed.

Ah - well I got my 70-290 MS textbook in the mail today and was pleasantly surprised to find that Windows Server 2003 was enclosed within (2 CDs). Although it says it for evaluation purposes only and good for just 180 days, it should be enough for me to pass what I need to. I hope to get it up and running with Virtualbox very soon.

Go for gold dude! Not to throw a spanner in the works, but you may need something like Nero or MagicISO to create iso images of the OS and then play with it.

Dr_Atomic wrote: »

Ah - well I got my 70-290 MS textbook in the mail today and was pleasantly surprised to find that Windows Server 2003 was enclosed within (2 CDs). Although it says it for evaluation purposes only and good for just 180 days, it should be enough for me to pass what I need to. I hope to get it up and running with Virtualbox very soon.

180 days will be more than enough for the 290. You will likely get the same with your 291 book and so on, so when it does expire, you can just put in your new key and get going again.

Devilsbane wrote: »

180 days will be more than enough for the 290. You will likely get the same with your 291 book and so on, so when it does expire, you can just put in your new key and get going again.

For real. Even if I didn't finish in time, I could just buy another textbook with another disk set and start a new 180-day clock. But if I can't finish up in 180 days, you may as well just take me out and shoot me.

I think after studying for the one test (70-290), it should give me an idea as to whether I'm going to like server administration more or less than networking, which is all I've been doing. The thing about networking in my experience has been that I primarily sit in front of a monitor(s) all day and do my job, whereas I'm hoping that server work would have me interacting with either customers or coworkers on a much more frequent basis. I'm very much a "people-person," which is why I'm hoping I'm going to like the subject matter.

MentholMoose

Dr_Atomic wrote: »

For real. Even if I didn't finish in time, I could just buy another textbook with another disk set and start a new 180-day clock.

I think you can just reinstall and reuse the same key. I tested the ISOs I linked above with an eval key I got years ago and it activated with no problem.

N2IT

I am currently reading [The Complete Guide to Servers and Server+]

This won't make you a UNIX, Linux, or MS system admin, it gives you a high overview of the technology and really blends network + and A + into the documentation. It touches on security also which I don't have a lot of experience with, but I would think if you had sec + it would only further your understanding.

Anyway I plan on getting Server + soon and do not regret going this route. Of course I haven't signed up for the exam yet

I have my textbook and I'm excited about studying. I just hope one day I can figure out Virtualbox so I can do an actual lab.

For all the talk about how simple it is, it ain't so simple to set up if you haven't done it before. I still can't get an OS on it.

MentholMoose

Dr_Atomic wrote: »

I have my textbook and I'm excited about studying. I just hope one day I can figure out Virtualbox so I can do an actual lab.

For all the talk about how simple it is, it ain't so simple to set up if you haven't done it before. I still can't get an OS on it.

If you have a specific problem then maybe we can help. First I suggest doing some research, though.
Let me google that for you

This guide looks particularly straightforward:
Lifehacker, tips and downloads for getting things done

Turgon

A lot of things are not simple if you haven't done them before. Unfortunately in IT, new things will come your way constantly. Worse still you will be expected to just handle it.

The pain you go through trying to get something working at home when the pressure is off will teach you approaches to dealing with these situation when the pressure is most definitely on. So when you are inexperienced configuring an ASA with an important customer expecting the access to be there the same day and your credibility is at stake, or a dozen Solaris servers turn up that need configuring by the end of the week, you can cope.

Dr_Atomic wrote: »

I have my textbook and I'm excited about studying. I just hope one day I can figure out Virtualbox so I can do an actual lab.

For all the talk about how simple it is, it ain't so simple to set up if you haven't done it before. I still can't get an OS on it.

The Moose put it quite aptly. Dr_Atomic, post up if you have specific problems. Post the screenshot, type out the error message.

Lemme tell you this though however harsh this may sound, you are not going to get too far in this particular area of IT if you dont first troubleshoot a problem yourself. I know you are new to servers and all this is Greek and Hebrew to you, but all that aside, you MUST first troubleshoot an issue yourself. Google and TechNet (for Microsoft folks) are your best friends. You get an error, you punch it into Google. You get a whole boatload of results, you start trying what's more relevant to your situation. If you dont find something of relevance, your search string was probably too vague or out-of-whack with your situation. Heck, it's a lab environment you are labbing in, so trying anything. Something will work. When it does, save the link of the website that fixed it for future reference. Note down in a notebook the issue and the troubleshooting you did.

It's simple, you troubleshoot it, you learn it. You dont troubleshoot it, you dont learn.

This is exactly how I have brought myself from complete IT n00b to a fairly competent Systems Engineer in just under 3 years.

MentholMoose wrote: »

If you have a specific problem then maybe we can help. First I suggest doing some research, though.
Let me google that for you

This guide looks particularly straightforward:
Lifehacker, tips and downloads for getting things done

Thank you, Menthol. You're actually giving me something to work with and I appreciate it. I'll look into your links.