ROI with ccie

I see many people that shut themselves from the world and love ones and ruin personal relationships to pursue the coveted ccie. After you achieved your number in whatever specialization voice , securuty, rs, etc. was it all worth it?

New opportunities, big raises, better lifestyles or did you end up with a number or worse without the number and alone without that big payout.

EDIT: Wasn't sure which forum to post this topic in. If you feel it'll go better in another section please move thanks

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shodown

From the guys that I know who are CCIE's.

One charges 120-140 a hour and never is without work

Another gets 205K for a contract

I also know of one who only gets 115K cause thats all the contract allows for his position. and he is better than the 2 guys mentioned above. So I think it all depends on the person. If you get the number, and you have the skills the payout is there, but there are guys like Turgon who make what CCIE's make and don't have the number the the correct experience.

Legacy User

I'm sure the guys you mentioned are doing great with their experience level the ccie was the icing on the cake. But this post isn't really for indirect pats on the back its more to have ccie certified or candidates who sacrificed almost everything to get that expert level certification to share their story either good or bad.

elderkai

I wouldn't sacrifice my free-time completely. I would go insane. Not only that but hurt the relationships with those I love. I retain information rather well, even better with repetition over a period of time, but constant labbing with no large amount of other activity would just make me forget more than I could retain. When I go toward the CCIE, I'll have to take it slower than the guys working towards it here. There are some tough individuals on this forum, that's for sure.

NOC-Ninja

Try it so you'll understand if the ROI is worth it.
I know a guy w/ CCIE that makes $350/hr but have more than 10yrs exp. Also, I know a guy that makes 200k without CCIE but have a 11yrs experience in networking.

IMO pursuing CCIE:

Demands a lot of time
Dedication is an understatement. People wont understand that word without labbing it
It costs a lot of money = time
It will break you
It will push you to lab (in my case 5-6 times a week)

instant000

According to a friend, he doubled his salary with his first CCIE. It took him three years to get there after he got CCNP, though. He had to take it more than one time. He was (and still is) very bright and knowledgeable, but if you're not prepared for what you might face, it can still take you out.

He's now looking at going for his second. He says the motivation for the second isn't as strong, mainly because not a chance he'll double his salary for this one

So, based on close friend feedback, the new opportunities, bigger paycheck, better lifestyle motivations are there.

I also know that the only reason I get certifications is for the three reasons I listed above, for the career ROI, lol. (Some certs are a lot better at this than others, with CCIE being one of them).

jamesp1983

My salary just increased about $40k over the past year since I started my CCIE Journey (I wasn't making peanuts a year ago). I don't know if its just the fact that I'm pursuing my CCIE or a combination of things (like experience, college, certs so this probably plays a role), but life has certainly improved since last July when I started studying for the CCIE. I don't know if this would be the case for everyone, but I have certainly noticed more interest in my resume since passing my CCIE Written and continuing to lab. I just accepted an offer from a huge company with an extremely large network for well into 6 figures and I don't even have my CCIE yet, but they were impressed that I am pursuing it.

Iristheangel

I haven't met a CCIE who regretted it. It doesn't have to be an "all or nothing" sacrifice. The key to NOT sacrificing your personal relationships in pursuit of ANY certification or education is communication and time management.

ToddB

Agree, its abourt time management even at my level ccna going for voice. I have a freind in his mid 40's with a wife, 2 young kids and a full time job that went back to college (online anyway). After work eat dinner with family, played with the kids and put them to bed then around 9 started his school work till about 1-2 am. Yes he finished, and raise in salary will be taken away if your studies end up giving you a "D" . I just turned 50 taking ccna voice soon then ccnp voice I'll end there because of my age.

apd123

Wow I can't believe how similar my experience is to instant000's friend from a previous post in this thread. I actually checked what city you were from to make sure you weren't talking about me.

If you want to understand how the protocols work and benefit your career at the same time then go for it. The per suit humbled me and I become an expert in topics I didn't even know existed. Once I studied using CCIE level training products I never wanted to use anything else. The speed that I was able to learn at was incredible and addicting. Going back to work the pace of real networking seems mundane. I truly feel the knowledge gained is as important as the certification itself. This knowledge can of course be obtained through experience, but it would be rare to be exposed to the topics even for a consultant given the breadth and depth of the lab.

I view the CCIE as a incredible experience and journey that I have now completed. If you are not really into learning and view hours studied as hours not out drinking with friends or some other activity well that sounds like a tough way to go about it. To anyone who plans to pursue the lab without sacrificing free time you are either significantly more intelligent than me or are not going to pass.

and36y

I'm a career networker.. I First worked on cisco's when they were beige and VLANs were theoretical, a collapsed backbone was a couple of hundred yards of yellow thicknet wrapped in a cabinet (I joke you not). Reason for me studying is, the job market. Unfortunately CCNP's are now 10 a penny and so salaries have dropped. the only way for my CV to float to the surface of the hiring managers pile is to have the number on the front. My salary would increase a bit, but in a double dip recession, its not going to do alot. For me, its to give me greater work opportunities.. its what sorts the boys out from the men on a cv pile....

NetworkVeteran

But this post isn't really for indirect pats on the back its more to have ccie certified or candidates who sacrificed almost everything to get that expert level certification to share their story either good or bad.

If someone sacrifices almost everything for their CCIE, they either had little to lose or have much to learn about life. I know quite a few CCIEs, and can't recall any sacrificing "almost everything" to get there. I do hear that one from time to time from folks who aren't willing to make that commitment. This makes me think of two Aesop fables--sour grapes, and that time-managing turtoise.

instant000

apd123 wrote: »

Wow I can't believe how similar my experience is to instant000's friend from a previous post in this thread. I actually checked what city you were from to make sure you weren't talking about me.

LOL.

My friend is from Ohio, and he's not you.

To anyone who plans to pursue the lab without sacrificing free time you are either significantly more intelligent than me or are not going to pass

I met a Cisco employee considering the CCIE ... wasn't sure if he wanted to put in the six to nine months of hard study to get it. (This guy had five already ... and still considered it months of hard study to get one.)

This line of thought makes me recall the INE guy who got 4 in 2 years. He even blogged about his time optimization via spaced repetition (same thing that makes memosyne work) ... he'd even worked out a formula to show how likely you were to forget something ... to some extent, it is a memory exercise, as you consume a lot of information in a short period of time, and you have to be able to recall it during the moment of truth. I think he has a Ph.D. in Math or something. (Even doing it optimally, it still took on average 6 months each, and we're not counting the studying and work experience he did before he took the first test, just that he got 4 lab passes in a 2 year span.)

networker050184

I think the ROI depends heavily on where you are in your career. If you are at the mid level trying to break into that senior level that's probably where its going to do the most for you. If you already hold a senior level position the CCIE probably isn't going to give you a big bump as far as pay and position are concerned. It will help you to keep getting these kinds of jobs in the future though.

instant000

About the guy who did 4 CCIEs in 2 years. Here's his "how to study" blog entry. (This link was requested via PM.)

Hope this helps someone.

How to study for your CCIE

NetworkVeteran

instant000 wrote:

Even doing it optimally, it still took on average 6 months each...

It's an impressive accomplishment, but others have completed their CCIEs in half that time, and without buying the rack rentals, workbooks, or bootcamps he's selling. The optimal path for any particular person will be different. I love the journey and am in no hurry.

PS - I'm a long-time proponent of spaced repetition!

Sirsamon

I am in my 40's, i do not work as IT person specializing in networks, i am a troubleshooter for solutions not working which can and most times is the customers setup. In this i mean any variation from user to admin, network etc.

I did MCSE and all the Citrix in 2000 onwards got bored. I then discovered Cisco for the last 7 years i have been through CCNA, CCNP then spent 2 years reading and labbing my way though a vast amount of Cisco Press books, with $1,000s of dollars on equipment and updates.
I then sat and passed the CCIE R&S just over a month ago. Now studying for the lab.

The only reason and benefit i get from doing this is, I seem to have a passion to want to keep learning everything there is R&S, voice, security and so on, i also hate wondering if i could have achieved something, i would rather know yes or no. I do not see it as a sacrifice, when i tutor anyone i always say, first thing first you might think you are missing out on something, but next year when you do go out for a beer or whatever with you friends, family. it will be the same friends, family, beer just that they will not have done anything you will have achieved something personally and hopefully for you professionally if you want that also.
Just like choosing to have kids, this is the biggest training anyone takes and it is never ending. you do not hear anyone shouting don't have kids its not worth it, theirs no value in it, i never got anything for having them ?

i think it all boils down to your own wants, needs , perspective.

for me i just want to do it, not for money not for hey look at me, just plain old can i

WiseWun

I know a girl who received her CCIE 4 months after graduating with a masters degree in computer networking. She had little to no experience but received multiple job offers ranging from 90-120k. I have yet to start my journey, waiting on my friends so we can study together before paying for training.

I have never meet an unemployed CCIE. But I know a few with multiple CCIE's that struggle due to lack of communication. Not only will your salary see an increase but the knowledge gained is priceless. Goodluck.