I want a college degree, but is now the best time?

tycoonbob · November 2012

Hello everyone.
I have been speaking with WGU about signing up for their BIT: Network Administration program, since I have quite a few certifications that would transfer over. I'm just trying to decide if I should go now, or if I should wait.

I currently work as a Systems Engineer for a consulting firm based here in Louisville, KY. Getting a degree isn't going to translate into a pay increase, but I am definitely looking to get out of consulting and into a position as a SysAdmin, SysEngineer, or anything similar. Right now my focus is on Microsoft System Center products, but I am starting to do more into networking, and want to get my CCNA. I want to bench off that and get my CCNA Security, as well as some other security certifications. I have attached a spreadsheet which outlays the courses for the Network Admin program, and also shows what certs you get from those courses and what certs can bypass that course. I think that I could easily get my degree in 2-3 years, since I can bypass 8 classes (36 CU).

The only thing I don't like is that once you sign up, what certs you have is all that counts. The ICND1 class is in term 5, and while I don't have my CCENT currently...I could easily get it in the next month or two, but I would still have to sit through the class. That's one thing that is bothering me the most right now.

Anyone have any thoughts, or words of wisdom?

kgb · November 2012

If ICND1 at WGU is a certification class, you won't have to take it again if you transfer it in. The degree plan on the website is merely a suggestion. You determine what classes and when. If you wanted to take ICND1 in the beginning, you tell your mentor(WGU's term for faculty adviser) that's what you want to do.

Edit: I should say, for the first month, or so, depending on your mentor you might have to prove yourself before they let you bring in advanced classes.

Don't think of WGU classes as normal classes. Everything is self-paced. If it's a certification, then the class ends when you pass the exam. If it's a test/exam - think Math class. Then the class ends when you pass the final exam. There's no "seat time", you get the learning resources and then you run off and learn them. Take the test when you pass the pre-assessment, and move forward.

Oh, and by looking at your certs now, I think you finish pretty fast if you were motivated.

tycoonbob · November 2012

Thanks for that clarification. The person I spoke with told me that the course was outlined in a specific way, and that's the order I have to take all the classes in.
Maybe in my first post I wasn't clear, but if I don't transfer in my CCENT...lets say I start WGU Dec 1, 2012...test for my CCENT in Feb 2013, but my CCENT/ICND1 class didn't start until April 2013, do I still have to take the class? I didn't transfer in the cert, but my employer requires that I get certain certifications at certain times. For reference, the class in the scenario above is COV1 (Fundamentals of Interconnecting Network Devices).

ptilsen · November 2012

My understanding is that getting the certification will still earn the CU. However, by not "starting" it at WGU, you would not gain access to the study material WGU provides.

zrockstar · November 2012

If your whole goal is to get a sysadmin job, I would think you could most certainly obtain one with the certs you already have.

tycoonbob · November 2012

ptilsen wrote: »

My understanding is that getting the certification will still earn the CU. However, by not "starting" it at WGU, you would not gain access to the study material WGU provides.

Honestly, I'm not concerned about their study material, since I have several options through work. I just want to make sure that passing the cert, even after I enrolled, will still satisfy that class and I won't have to sit through it. I have contacted my enrollment counselor so hopefully I can get the ball rolling today. Aiming for a Jan. 1, 2013 start date!

zrockstar wrote: »

If your whole goal is to get a sysadmin job, I would think you could most certainly obtain one with the certs you already have.

I have no doubt that I could. That's not my whole goal, to be honest. I feel that if I am not study for a cert, or playing in my lab...I am not doing everything I can to be the best at what I do for a living. I don't look at it as just a job, since I love what I do...but if I ever wanted to move up, a degree will definitely help me.

zrockstar · November 2012

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I understand, I'm just thinking along the lines that a bachelors isn't really going to help you out much getting a job since you seem to already have the qualifications. I mean at the end of the day, a degree is really just another cert when you think about it. I'm not knocking school, I love it and am going to finish my bachelors in June. I am just thinking that maybe you can study something different that will help you in other areas. You can obviously self study for certs, so do that with the big ones, and study something that will further progress your career instead of defining what you already know. That's what I was trying to get at, and just my two cents.

tycoonbob · November 2012

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I would agree that a degree is more or less another certifications. I am satisfied where I am in my career right now, and my salary is in the low $60k area. However, the higher paid IT jobs in the $80k area are the ones that require a 4 year degree and 3 years of experience, or 8 years of experience...and I don't have either. I know I could do the job, but I could probably finish my degree in less than 2 years, and have the education, experience, and certifications for just about any senior level sysadmin or sysengineer job...and be in my mid-20s (I'm 23 right now). This degree isn't going to give me a raise...and quite honestly will put me in a little debt, but it will pay off in a few years. I also think that everyone goes through two careers in your lifetime, so 20 years from now I may decide to move to another field, and having some kind of B.S. will definitely be helpful.

I guess I am thinking more about the long term, than today. I have two more Microsoft exams scheduled for this week, which will get me my MCSE: Server Infrastructure, to go along with my already existing MCSE: Private Cloud. I know I can get certifications, but the education will be the challenge, which I am looking for.

kgb · November 2012

I personally have not verified this, but I've seen several other people either on these forums or other WGU related forums state that you cannot transfer certifications in after you are enrolled. So, if you took the exam while enrolled at WGU, but not enrolled in the class, you'd have to take the exam again... That doesn't make sense to me, but I've seen other people state that.

If you are set on getting the cert ASAP, I'd just postpone enrollment until afterwards.

tycoonbob · November 2012

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Well, the CCENT isn't something I am getting ASAP, but it's something I am going to get probably before term 3 which is ideally when that class is taken. If I didn't transfer it in, how can I retake a Cisco exam? Would I have to take some kind of competency test that they would administer?

KeithC · November 2012

I have not read the whole thread. I just wanted to comment on the certification question. WGU will not transfer in certifications after your start date. If you want to gain the certification while a student in WGU without using any of the school's resources you can. If you pass the certification you will ask your mentor to add the class to your AAV and then submit a copy of the pass to the school.(I just scan in the score report and email it) As for the list of what classes to take each term, as far as I am aware the list is more a suggestion and not really enforced.

nosoup4u · November 2012

tycoonbob wrote: »

Well, the CCENT isn't something I am getting ASAP, but it's something I am going to get probably before term 3 which is ideally when that class is taken. If I didn't transfer it in, how can I retake a Cisco exam? Would I have to take some kind of competency test that they would administer?

While there is a rough track for what classes you should take in what term it isn't mandatory at all.

For example I'm studying for Project+ which is supposed to be in my 8th term, and I'm taking it in my first.

Simply put, you sign up for what you want when you want within reason and with what you would transfer it I doubt any mentor would give your grief about it.

tycoonbob · November 2012

@KeithC
Thanks for that clarification. As long as I don't have to sit through the class, I am perfectly fine with that.

@nosoup4u
Thanks for that clarification as well. I like that I can schedule my classes more freely, which will be great for me.

Thanks everyone for your answers and help. I have applied today for admission, did my FAFSA, and claimed my ID. I just need to complete the assessment and wait.

Any tips on the assessment?

KeithC · November 2012

tycoonbob

Just to re-illiterate what kgb said the classes are not a traditional 6 week, 3 month, semester time frame. If you can pass a class in a week then you passed it.

As for your choice of what degree and your desire to gain the CCNA certification. If you have the MCITP:EA it would be my opinion to start with the network design and management track. Your Microsoft certifications may be accepted for some of the MTA certs. I think at least you should after enrollment ask for a transfer evaluation for both tracks the network design and management and the network administration.

I would guess you'll have less classes to complete with the network design and management that would translate to completing your degree quicker which would save you money and then you could work on the CCNA.

Edit: For each class you will have sometimes one or many learning resources which is what you study from. For example I am doing the CIW database class atm so I have access to CIW's resource for the certification. I believe for the Comptia certifications you would use LabSim. If you want to receive a voucher for the test from WGU at the very least you would have to pass a pre-assessment if you wanted to skip the learning resource content.

tycoonbob · November 2012

Well the Network Design & Management track doesn't have any CCNA certifications as part of it.

To be honest, I want to go with the Security track, but according to MY calculations (based on the transfer credit PDF, student handbook, and the website), I should be able to transfer in the CU by going the Network Administration Track. In both tracks (NA and Sec) I am NOT interested in the CIW and MTA stuff, but more so the Cisco and Security+. I figured going from no Cisco to CCENT/CCNA/CCNA Security in 2 years would be a lot of material, and without hands on experience, I might just be wasting time.

The NA track should allow me to transfer 36 CU from my certifications, whereas the Security one would transfer somewhere around 28-32 (can't remember). I will definitely speak with my enrollment counselor and have them spec out both the NA and Sec tracks and see which one I can transfer more of.

Ivanjam · November 2012

nosoup4u wrote: »

Simply put, you sign up for what you want when you want within reason and with what you would transfer it I doubt any mentor would give your grief about it.

@tycoonbob - your mentor will probably want you to complete AGC1 (basic math) and BBC1 (basic english) in the beginning, then you can do whatever you want to. I have exams in INC1 (3rd semester), BNC1 (7th semester) and MGC1 (8th semester) all scheduled for this Thursday and, like nosoup4u, I started 11/01/12.

KeithC · November 2012

I'm all for going the track you want but on the other hand I prefer the shortest route and that isn't necessarily counted in CU but more number of classes. Let us know if you have any more questions.

kgb · November 2012

KeithC wrote: »

I'm all for going the track you want but on the other hand I prefer the shortest route and that isn't necessarily counted in CU but more number of classes. Let us know if you have any more questions.

This is an excellent point. For example, I only transferred in 27 cus... But that was 10 general ed classes. Not having to deal with TaskStream for most of my classes enabled me to accelerate rather fast.

EV42TMAN · November 2012

I started on September 1st and i transferred in 54 credits from certifications and my one semester as a music major a the University of Minnesota. After I talked to my student mentor they let me start with the certification classes so I could finish those up first. When I started i had project +, CIW certs and a Microsoft Web development certifications left then everything else is generals. Basically i told my mentor that i wanted to do the certification classes first so I can look for a better job without having to walk into the interview saying "In the first 6 months of my employment I need to leave early or come in late because of school". They agreed and I'm over half way done with my first term goal. you can see my progress in my signature.

PurpleIT · November 2012

tycoonbob wrote: »

Well the Network Design & Management track doesn't have any CCNA certifications as part of it.

To be honest, I want to go with the Security track, but according to MY calculations (based on the transfer credit PDF, student handbook, and the website), I should be able to transfer in the CU by going the Network Administration Track. In both tracks (NA and Sec) I am NOT interested in the CIW and MTA stuff, but more so the Cisco and Security+. I figured going from no Cisco to CCENT/CCNA/CCNA Security in 2 years would be a lot of material, and without hands on experience, I might just be wasting time.

In some respects I am in the same boat as you; I am more interested in the Security path, I want to transfer in as much as possible as getting my BS as fast as humanly possible is my number one goal. At this point I am not really interested in picking up any more certs (well, CCNP Sec maybe, but that isn't an option via WGU), so I don't care about those. I certainly won't do anything to maintain or promote those certifications once I graduate.

The NA track should allow me to transfer 36 CU from my certifications, whereas the Security one would transfer somewhere around 28-32 (can't remember). I will definitely speak with my enrollment counselor and have them spec out both the NA and Sec tracks and see which one I can transfer more of.

If you have used the transfer PDF to do a self-evaluation you probably won't have any surprises, but you may have to walk your enrollment advisor through the process. My guy was fixated on the idea that my certifications would transfer or not transfer regardless of which program I was in and didn't seem to get my emphasis on maximizing the number of credits that apply TO A DEGREE so I could graduate ASAP.

tycoonbob · November 2012

Thanks everyone for the info.

I am aware that the more transferred CUs doesn't necessarily mean the least amount of classes I will have to take. I have applied, did my assessments and FAFSA yesterday...and am in the process of sending in my previous college transcripts and certification transcripts. My enrollment advisor is going to evaluate both tracks to see which one I should go with. She seems smart, and eager to help...so I have no doubt that she will be helpful. If the Security track is only one or two classes longer, I will probably still go that way. Otherwise, it will definitely be NA.

I have a nice little spreadsheet that I worked on, that lists all the classes for each track (NA and Sec) and the certifications that will transfer credits for it, that I will share here once I get it cleaned up a little. It was very helpful for me to evaluate where I stand currently.

Oh...and because I feel like bragging today, I just passed my MS 70-413 exam with a 943.

70-414 to go, and I will have my MCSE: Server Infrastructure (Server 2012 equivalent of the MCITP: Enterprise Admin)

KeithC · November 2012

Another suggestion (that may be "silly") is to gain your CCENT or CCNA before you start at WGU. I am unsure, but believe you can keep pushing your start date back further.

Just to go into more detail about the number of classes comment I made. It all depends on the person but some classes are just #$@$#'ing harder then others KFT1, LAT1, CLC1(It took me three tries) sometimes it may be the scope of the class like CIW javascript or the poor (imo) learning resources like the MCITP. My point is even the number of CU or classes doesn't mean you'll make out easier in the long run.

tycoonbob · November 2012

Here are a few things I can contribute.

WGU Transfer guidelines:
https://docs.google.com/open?id=0Bz_lHxLQ-xf2NlJBQkt4LUw3ZnM

My spreadsheet listing classes, CU, cert received, and certs that can bypass that class:
https://docs.google.com/open?id=0Bz_lHxLQ-xf2MjFxdmZDOE1jZUE

You can see in my spreadsheet where I left my certs in. For the Network Administration track, I can actually bypass 43 CUs (10 classes) leaving 77 CUs (25 classes). For the Security track, I can bypass 19 CUs (5 classes) leaving 103 CUs (32 classes). Based on my information, and assuming I didn't overlook something...the Network Administration track should be the quickest for me. Feel free to save a copy of that spreadsheet and change the last column to your certs to get an idea for yourself.

KeithC wrote: »

Another suggestion (that may be "silly") is to gain your CCENT or CCNA before you start at WGU. I am unsure, but believe you can keep pushing your start date back further.

Just to go into more detail about the number of classes comment I made. It all depends on the person but some classes are just #$@$#'ing harder then others KFT1, LAT1, CLC1(It took me three tries) sometimes it may be the scope of the class like CIW javascript or the poor (imo) learning resources like the MCITP. My point is even the number of CU or classes doesn't mean you'll make out easier in the long run.

Yeah, I understand completely. I am thinking about getting my CCENT prior to my start date (which I pushed back to Feb 1), which shouldn't be hard. I have two Microsoft exams on top of my radar (70-414 and 70-687), which I should have by the end of the year. I'm sure the CCENT won't be too difficult for me. Great idea.

Raisin · December 2012

tycoonbob wrote: »

Yeah, I understand completely. I am thinking about getting my CCENT prior to my start date (which I pushed back to Feb 1), which shouldn't be hard. I have two Microsoft exams on top of my radar (70-414 and 70-687), which I should have by the end of the year. I'm sure the CCENT won't be too difficult for me. Great idea.

I don't understand why people always try and complete a certification before their start date at WGU. Unless someone else is picking up the tab for the CCENT wait until your start date and request a voucher code on day one and save some money. Tell your mentor you've spend the last couple of months studying and you're ready for the test. They'll probably ask you to complete a assessment before they give their approval but that shouldn't be a problem if you're prepared for the actual test. People think they are saving time by doing the test before hand but really you end up delaying your start date because WGU won't give you a credit eval until all your transcripts are turned in. If you push back your start date by a month that's a month where you could've completed multiple classes along with the CCENT.

santaowns · December 2012

I updated your spreadsheet to include other features like automatic adding and what not, ill post it here later. I am sure someone will like it.

tycoonbob wrote: »

Here are a few things I can contribute.

WGU Transfer guidelines:
https://docs.google.com/open?id=0Bz_lHxLQ-xf2NlJBQkt4LUw3ZnM

My spreadsheet listing classes, CU, cert received, and certs that can bypass that class:
https://docs.google.com/open?id=0Bz_lHxLQ-xf2MjFxdmZDOE1jZUE

You can see in my spreadsheet where I left my certs in. For the Network Administration track, I can actually bypass 43 CUs (10 classes) leaving 77 CUs (25 classes). For the Security track, I can bypass 19 CUs (5 classes) leaving 103 CUs (32 classes). Based on my information, and assuming I didn't overlook something...the Network Administration track should be the quickest for me. Feel free to save a copy of that spreadsheet and change the last column to your certs to get an idea for yourself.

Yeah, I understand completely. I am thinking about getting my CCENT prior to my start date (which I pushed back to Feb 1), which shouldn't be hard. I have two Microsoft exams on top of my radar (70-414 and 70-687), which I should have by the end of the year. I'm sure the CCENT won't be too difficult for me. Great idea.

santaowns · December 2012

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0As3c-LMt_qjgdEtYeHNobFl5aU1ONXEzeGU3ZElXeWc

download it and when you transfer something or complete it put a y in the correct column and that will add automatically at the bottom and update the row with a green color.

tycoonbob · December 2012

Hmm, nice. No idea why I didn't think of that in the first place.

Will definitely be useful when it's time to go through all of my transfers next month!

Thanks!

I want a college degree, but is now the best time?

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