Another MSCA 2012 Lab Setup Question

mikeyjm26

Hi guys,

I've read lots of forum questions and various websites about creating a white box build and was looking for some advice. As the title says I'm looking at setting up a lab for the MSCA certification. I would be looking at purchasing new hardware so I was considering either going down the HP Microserver N54L or Gen 8 route or configuring a white box. Also I am looking for something small so Matx or itx would be great. I realise that the microservers will probably require at least 8Gb of RAM and are fairly decent equipment but I don't think they have much scope for upgrading?? If the HP system can handle the VM's required for the certification that makes the decision easier but I don't want to buy it and then find out I need to upgrade in 6 months time.

Ideally I would prefer to purchase the components separately and build a new machine. What components are compatible with ESXi or Hyper V? Should I go down the ESXi or Hyper V route?

Finally I am on a strict budget of £300-400 but I would think I could get up and running with something reasonably good for that cost.

Thanks in advance for any advice

Mikey

kriscamaro68

I would maybe look into how much Dell c1100 or HP Proliant DL 160g6 go for over there. Check ebay and see what kind of deals you can get. They will work with both Hyper-V and VMWare

mikeyjm26

kriscamaro68 wrote: »

I would maybe look into how much Dell c1100 or HP Proliant DL 160g6 go for over there. Check ebay and see what kind of deals you can get. They will work with both Hyper-V and VMWare

Thanks kriscamaro68 they would be great if I had the room. I really would want something smaller and much more portable.

kriscamaro68

Newegg.com - gigabyte brix

How about one of these with a nice size ssd. I think the hp micro will be on the weak side when it comes to CPU.

srabiee

If you simply want to be able to lab enough to pass the exam, why don't you just save your money and virtualize the entire lab environment? I have an i5 with 8GB of RAM and it works fine. There's also plenty of free virtualization software (VMware, Oracle, etc) so you don't even have to pay for the software either.

If I were to replace my desktop, I'd get an i7 with 16GB of RAM and call it a day. That would be plenty for me to lab anything I need as far as an MCSA goes. But honestly, you can do a whole lot with a whole little.

If you were actively studying for the VCAP or something like that, then I would look into purchasing physical boxes, storage, etc.

mikeyjm26

kriscamaro68 wrote: »

Newegg.com - gigabyte brix

How about one of these with a nice size ssd. I think the hp micro will be on the weak side when it comes to CPU.

I did consider one of those but I thought using a ssd in a VM environment would degrade it a lot quicker because of the amount of i/o operations it would be doing. I really like the size of it and the price is pretty reasonable. Does ESXi install on it without any problems?

mikeyjm26

Hi srabiee,

What would you suggest I get? I was under the impression that ESXi was a bit fussy on what it would install on. I was also considering running hyper v server, don't think that is as fussy, but I cannot get my head around what it is. Is it like ESXi? Do I need install server 2012 as well to manage it? I think I am confusing myself

mikeyjm26

Hi kriscamaro68 I did consider one of those but I thought using a ssd in a VM environment would degrade it quite fast since it would dong a lot of i/o operations ???

srabiee

I have two internal SATA SSD's in RAID-0 and they work fine for my virtualized lab. No problems whatsoever, and plenty fast.

I wouldn't recommend you run ESXi at this time until you start working on the VCP. It's overkill and will complicate things tremendously if your goal is to simply study for the MCSA. Use VMware Player, Oracle VirtualBox, or VMware Workstation if you need something with more features but you will have to purchase that one. VMware Player and VirtualBox should be free. Play around with them to see which you like better, and then work on getting your VMs installed and your lab environment up and running. Once you get the hang of it and get everything working, it should be all you need at this time.

If you want to install Server 2012 R2 on your physical hardware and use Hyper-V that's also an option, as long as you have the proper licensing, etc. You may be able to get away with not activating for x number of days and just use it under the grace period.

Do you have a decent rig already? It doesn't take much to run a modest lab.

mikeyjm26

Thanks for that srabiee, no I don't have anything to run it on. I would like to purchase a cheap lab setup and am open to suggestions.

I am more familiar with ESXi as we use it in work and I have done a few office installs. I believe we also have a technet subscription which means I can get a copy of 2012.

I was hoping to get away from using a base OS to run virtualbox, VMware player etc because that would mean I would have to purchase a windows license which is why I would like to use either ESXi or install server 2012 to make use of hyper v.

srabiee

Do you currently have a home computer? (laptop or desktop?) If so, what are the specs?

I haven't installed ESXi in an environment outside of our environment at work, which utilizes multiple Dell PowerEdge servers, so if you want to go that route for cheap I will let someone else make suggestions.

If you want to go the Server 2012 route for Hyper-V, pick up an i5, or an i7 processor if you can afford it, as much RAM as you can afford (at least 12GB), and SSD if you can afford it. If not, get a large, fast HDD. You can dual-boot the OS and use this as your regular desktop PC as well when you aren't labbing, if you want.

Again, it doesn't take much to set up a functional lab for testing purposes.

mikeyjm26

I don't have a home computer, I just have my work laptop but I would prefer to have my own machine. If I was to install Server 2012 on a home machine would it need to be of a certain spec ie how easy would it be to get drivers for the motherboard chipset, NIC etc Could I just use the Win 8 drivers? Also would hyper v server need to be installed on a separate machine for server 2012 to manage?

Many thanks for your help and advice srabiee.

Dewayne.smith1

I too am studying for the MCSA for 2012R2. What I am using is VM Ware Fusion on a 2011 MacBook Pro. So far what I have seen is make sure you have enough RAM I only had 8 in my Mac and the VMs would run but not very good. I have since upgraded to 16GB and everything runs smooth. If you’re only going to run one computer for your setup you may want to create a host box with 2012 R2 and use Hyper V (server role) to build your lab systems in. I started out with 6 separate VM's for my lab and have since moved to One Host Server (VM) with 4 guests. You can PM me if you need specifics.

kriscamaro68

mikeyjm26 wrote: »

Hi kriscamaro68 I did consider one of those but I thought using a ssd in a VM environment would degrade it quite fast since it would dong a lot of i/o operations ???

All I use is SSD's for labbing and vm's. It makes a world of difference and takes the annoying wait times out that will frustrate the hell out of you. I would do never go back to regular hdd for labbing again.

mikeyjm26

Is there anything special about your lab? What do you run it on? ie hyper v?

srabiee

Yeah SSD's make a big difference in total performance. Going from HDD's to SSD's is like going from dial-up to broadband. Once you go SSD you won't easily be able to go back, it's just that much faster.

I'd recommend building a desktop with an i5 or an i7 depending on your budget, 16GB RAM, motherboard with whatever features you're wanting (cheap ones work), video card of your choosing, internal SSD disk, and some type of large-capacity external storage...USB 3.0 or NAS if you want more flexibility. Let the reviews on Newegg be your guide and do a bit of research on each component.

Basically as far as specifications go, you're going to be building a functional everyday-use desktop that's going to double as your lab. I have an i5 that's 2 or 3 years old and it's still plenty fast. I won't be upgrading for several more years, it just isn't necessary at this point.

You will install Server 2012 R2 and install the Hyper-V role, then use Hyper-V to build out your VM's and configure your virtual network. RDP into your VMs and go from there.

mikeyjm26

Thanks for that srabiee. Do I need server hardware or can I use a normal motherboard with Win 8 drivers for the NIC, chipset so that server 2012 can recognise it? I take it server 2012 would be the main OS ie what loads when I switch on the machine?

Really appreciate all the advice and help you have given me.

srabiee

Normal hardware is fine. Server 2012 R2 should have all necessary drivers, especially after running Windows update.

I recommend dual booting the machine with Windows 8.1 so that you can use it as your everyday desktop PC as well when you aren't labbing. You can use Server 2012 R2 as your desktop OS if you want, but if you want to play games you may have better compatibility with Windows 8.1 That's something you can play around with a bit.

When purchasing components like the motherboard or video card, check to see if the hardware has Server 2012 drivers or a compatible alternative like Windows 8.1 drivers or Server 2008 R2 drivers. It probably won't be much of an issue, but it's always smart to research this stuff ahead of time.

kriscamaro68

mikeyjm26 wrote: »

Is there anything special about your lab? What do you run it on? ie hyper v?

My lab kinda different. I have a desktop with a quadcore and 8gb of ram. That desktop has 4 ssd's and 2 hdd. I am running server 2012R2 on it and it acts as my DC and my storage array. I have all the ssd's and the 2 hdd in a storage pool with storage tiering that serve up the storage for my 2 hp proliant dl160 g6 servers. Those servers have 2 quad core cpu's in each with 72gb of ram and 1 ssd. I have 2012R2 on those and they are my Hyper-V cluster that I then run my entire lab from. I have VMM 2012R2 running in a VM on the desktop with 8gb of ram so that I have a full managed cluster setup. It's a lot of hardware for a lab but I like it that way.

As for if you go down the desktop route. You could just build the desktop and use Windows 8 Pro as it has Hyper-v built in so that way you can still run a desktop OS. Otherwise you can just install Server 2012R2 and call it a day but it will only be good for 180 days. Your motherboard will have a disc with it most likely that you can use for drivers for the main OS. The vm's will use drivers supplied by Hyper-V so you won't need to worry about that.

mikeyjm26

Thanks for those comments guys, gives me something to think about. I want to try and keep the cost down as much as possible so I am looking at at AMD processor and mobo which will save me nearly £100 and also just have server 2012 instead of Win 8. Once I get a spec could you guys look over it and let me know what you think and see if I should make any changes?

Thanks for your help again.

mikeyjm26

Looking a bit more into it AMD might not be the way to go even if it is cheaper on initial purchase. Back to Intel it is.

srabiee

I'm not a fan of AMD. They haven't been top-dog since the Athlon 64 days, which was eons ago. Go with Intel.

mikeyjm26

From what I have read I agree with going with an Intel. I was looking at the i5-4590 processor but cannot find any other builds that have used it so I could see what motherboard or graphics card to get. Just need something that is not expensive, can take up to 32gb RAM and preferably micro atx.

I can get a couple of 40gb ssd for really cheap which I would assume would be sufficient to run each VM??

srabiee

Haswell i5 CPU:

Intel Core i5-4590 Haswell Quad-Core 3.3GHz LGA 1150 84W Desktop Processor Intel HD Graphics 4600 BX80646I54590 - Newegg.com

Intel 9-series H97 chipset:

GIGABYTE GA-H97M-D3H LGA 1150 Intel H97 HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 Micro ATX Intel Motherboard - Newegg.com

DDR3 1600 Dual-Channel Kit:

Crucial Ballistix Sport 16GB (2 x 8GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Low Profile Desktop Memory Model BLS2K8G3D1609ES2LX0 - Newegg.com

MicroATX Case:

Rosewill LINE-M Micro-ATX Mini Tower Computer Case, Dual USB 3.0, come with Dual Fans, Support up to 4 Fans, 12.5" card-Retail - Newegg.com

PSU:

CORSAIR CX series CX500 500W ATX12V v2.3 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Active PFC Power Supply - Newegg.com

DVD-RW:

ASUS Model DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS 24X DVD Burner - Bulk Black - Newegg.com

Internal HDD:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822236625&cm_re=western_digital_black-_-22-236-625-_-Product

srabiee

Do you want to save money and use the motherboard's integrated GPU for video?

Do you need a monitor, keyboard, and mouse?

Do you need Wi-Fi capability with the desktop?

Do you want a higher-performance, quieter CPU cooler than the stock heatsink and fan?

If your budget allows, I also recommend you pick up an external USB 3.0 or network-capable HDD for backups and additional storage and flexibility/portability.

If you can get a couple of SSD's, run them in RAID-0 and store the VMs on them. If you have enough room on the array, install the OS (Server 2012 R2) on the SSD's and boot from them. Will greatly increase overall system performance. Use the 1TB drive to store everything else, and use it for storage shared across the VM's.

mikeyjm26

Whoa, that is awesome!!! Many thanks for that srabiee. I did look at that motherboard but wasn't sure if it was the right one to get because it didn't mention anything on the mother board about VT technology.

I am happy to use the on board video if I don't need a separate graphics card. Keyboard and mouse I'll get and happy to connect the system via network cable. I might get a quieter CPU fan as they are not expensive. I do need to get another storage device for backups and they are not too expensive.

That is good advice about how to setup the SSD's, I'll definitely get a few SSD's and run the VM's off them, I might need to add a 1Tb drive later but to get me up and running just now I'm sure I'll be more than happy with the SSD's.

Really appreciate this, just going to price everything up just now and see how much the final bill will be!!!

srabiee

If you only have two 40GB SSD's, you will need the larger HDD immediately. After installing the host OS, and then installing a few VMs and allocating disk space accordingly, you are going to run out of space on the SSD's very quickly. I highly recommend you go ahead and purchase the internal HDD or external HDD. Ideally, you will want at least 250GB of SSD space to work with, but you can upgrade down the road.

Integrated video on the motherboard will work fine.

I can't really find any inexpensive aftermarket CPU coolers that are socket 1150 compatible. Seems like they all start at $30 or above. For now go ahead and use the stock Intel cooler and then if you don't like it you can replace it later when more 1150 coolers become available.

Let us know how the final system turns out.

Shdwmage

Speaking of SSD New Egg 250gb EVO 840 On sale 129.99
Newegg.com - Shell Shocker Deal. Exclusive Jaw Dropping Savings on PC Components and Electronics.

mikeyjm26

Many thanks for that srabiee, I'll let you know what I managed to get. Still in the process of pricing up the components and seeing if I can get it any cheaper. Really appreciate the advice you've given me.