Turned down for an interview based on school I went to

Alexsmith

So I applied for a position to work as a IT security analyst for a defense contractor in the area and was contacted by thier HR since my qualifications matched what they were looking for. But when she forwarded my resume to the manager he turned down the opportunity to speak with me because in his experience candidates from UMUC didn't have the "skills" needed in interviews to sell themselves or perform the job correctly.

I was thinking that since I already had 3-4 years experience in the field that they would at least want to talk with me if their HR took the time out to call me. Is this common for others going to online or other private schools?

IIIMaster

Dont get your self down stay positive. But this what happen when a few bad apples spoils the bunch.

N2IT

That's a shame, there was a recent thread about this in regards to WGU. It'll be interesting to see if this starts to happening more often or if this is 2 unrelated happenings.

Like III mention I wouldn't let it get you down. To your point, I find it bizarre that a degree would sway them seeing you have the experience.

akboyboy

It's probably not a good environment if the manager is that close minded. Try not to let it get you down.

Alexsmith

I did find it odd that the manager decided to not even do a phone interview with me considering I have the job experience to back me up and instead mentioned to HR about not wanting anyone from UMUC altogether. I was disappointed initially because the position was with Lockheed, was 100% remote and with a 20% pay increase, but by the sound of it the manager was probably a jerk anyway.. so I'll keep looking until something else comes along.

* I just saw the other thread about WGU, I would hope this isn't going to lead to a trend down the road.

N2IT

Alex anything is possible, trends can pick up momentum is a hurry. It wouldn't surprise me one bit if o line universities started to become "irrelevant".

HR is like IT, it get's it's new "best practices" or "methodogies" and if they say on line universities are bad you'll see companies start to adopt this. Not to mention the educational field has been flood, everybody and their brother/sister have a degree. It's simple supply and demand. There is a surplus of candidates with degrees, they will need to find a reason/condition to eliminate the excess that could be in the form of On Line schools.

I still believe experience will always been the biggest draw so if you can get that make sure to hang on to it and continue to develop the skills with experience.

Just saying.....

And my MBA is from an on line school.....

IIIMaster

I would agree too, you have experience so one would assume you should be knowledgeable. I would think possibly a test or phone interview to gauge your aptitude would have at the least clear any doubts. But man it sounds like this guy had some bad run in with UMUC students. I hope he wasnt pulling raw graduate students and placing them into advance roles.

N2IT

III Sounds like that could of been the case, of course I am assuming.

All it takes is one bad employee from a school and that school is tainted in that persons eyes so who really knows. I had a help desk manager back in the day who refused to hire Vatterott grads. He wouldn't make a production out of it or anything it, but if you had that on your resume you were done. No chance at all.

With that said I haven't seen it like that very often, but have ran into it once.

MrAgent

IIIMaster wrote: »

I would agree too, you have experience so one would assume you should be knowledgeable. I would think possibly a test or phone interview to gauge your aptitude would have at the least clear any doubts. But man it sounds like this guy had some bad run in with UMUC students. I hope he wasnt pulling raw graduate students and placing them into advance roles.

Not all Lockheed managers are like this. My manager is pretty cool and cares more about knowledge and experience rather than credentials.

techiie

N2IT wrote: »

That's a shame, there was a recent thread about this in regards to WGU. It'll be interesting to see if this starts to happening more often or if this is 2 unrelated happenings.
.

Mind pointing me to that thread? Thanks

dou2ble

techiie wrote: »

Mind pointing me to that thread? Thanks

http://www.techexams.net/forums/jobs-degrees/109609-interesting-education-discrimination-email-i-got-today-2.html


I think for many of us with experience an online degree is sufficient. But with no experience I would never recommend an online school (even if classes are offered onsite). Their curriculums just aren't up to par. I took one of the java classes and passed. I completed the coding assignments but I can tell you that this course was nothing like a traditional CS degree course. A lot of my classmates just wanted the paper and weren't really learning.

bloodshotbetty

Frankly, employers are going to need to change their attitudes on online learning. This is the new trend. With the rising costs of education and the idea that adults are going to school later in life- online education is on the rise.

It's unfortunate that he declined an interview with you even with your experience.

Question: Is it required to put what school you went to on your resume? Would it work to just put the degree you obtained?

I debated putting an organization I was involved with on my resume. However, I was elected to the board of directors and was an officer (treasurer) so it demonstrated my leadership skills. BUT- it was an anti war organization (Women Against Military Maddness) which can be polarizing. I just started abbreviating it with WAMM.

fitzybhoy

Wow, thought I had stepped back in time to the West of Scotland in the 80s and 90s.

Seriously, it's a sore one when you get refused on something like that. I was refused consideration despite a good interview based on the hirer not liking the "tone" of a follow up email. It's sore but on reflection it's probably no great loss.

rsutton

bloodshotbetty wrote: »

Frankly, employers are going to need to change their attitudes on online learning. This is the new trend.

I'm not sure what your source is, but it seems like you are implying it's an employee's market & that online schooling is on the rise. I don't have any empirical evidence to refute that, but I do screen, and interview 100's of applicants every month. I have not noticed an increase in online degrees, although it seems logical this would be the case. I am not sure I agree that it is an employees market. I get flooded with resumes for every open position and have always had the luxury of choosing the best candidates for interviews. Best, however, is not synonymous with a good school. Experience is king.

bloodshotbetty

I suppose my frame of reference is personal experience. Many, many of my friends and family memories are turning to online education or strongly considering it whereas when I was applying to college (2002) it was unheard of.

DoubleNNs

dou2ble wrote: »

Their curriculums just aren't up to par. I took one of the java classes and passed. I completed the coding assignments but I can tell you that this course was nothing like a traditional CS degree course. A lot of my classmates just wanted the paper and weren't really learning.

The same could be said for proper Brick and Mortar schools. A lot of them are filled w/ kids who had a faint idea what they think is "cool" but have no idea how it relates to the professional world. They do just enough in class to not fail out and continue to stay on campus because they'd be separated from their friends and parties if their parents stopped paying their tuition. It's also well known that cheating is ubiquitous.

Not saying that B&M schools are bad.. but realize they aren't perfect either. I've met a few Devry graduates that have impressed me more than Ivy graduates - but it's usually because the Devry graduate feels they have more to prove and compensate w/ actual skills as opposed to simply name recognition (Ivy).

Cisco Inferno

Wait, so you're telling me that a degree that I am trying to do.. That requires CCNA, CCNA:W, CCNP, CCDA, MCSA, and and other security courses to graduate does not prepare you for the field? Yah alright. just move on.

Khaos1911

I actually ran into a problem similar to this when I was discussing Tuition Reimbursement with our Director of IT which is my bosses boss. And he was like "please just don't go to one of those online only school nobody ever hears about like WGU." I was a bit shocked by that comment and even went as far as telling him WGU is a fairly respected program from the IT side of things and they are accredited. He didn't want to hear it. So, needless to say I'm looking at the Penn State World Masters in Information Science: Cyber Security and Information Assurance program, but I'm going to have to come out of my pocket a bit more than I like to start and finish in a reasonable amount of time.

Legacy User

Alexsmith wrote: »

because in his experience candidates from UMUC didn't have the "skills" needed in interviews to sell themselves or perform the job correctly.

You are taking it way to personal. That hiring manager just had bad experiences with people from that school which left a bad taste in his mouth. Once a school gets a bad wrap with a person its hard to shake it from them. It'd be a different conversation if the manager said everyone I tried from an online school was terrible but according to your OP that was not the case. Its a specific situation while this manager may not care for grads from that school the next person may not care what school you went to only your skills and experience.

Take it with a grain of salt and keep it moving. Just chalk it up to it wasn't meant to be.

anhtran35

Hiring Manager is simply being discriminatory.

tahjzhuan

Had no issues with receiving tuition reimbursement approval for WGU from my employer after the program was vetted by HR. The school has been endorsed by our Governor. I've been able to do fairly well over the years with a 2 year degree and few certs, but this shows that i'm taking it up a notch in terms of personal and professional development. Everyone has their unique perspective and subjective view.

N2IT

@ Khaos that is frightening. I have an MBA from WGU and a bachelors from a brick and mortar. Is it possible the on line degree devalues the brick and mortar?

Just curious.

Khaos1911

I certaintly hope not, N2IT. The Penn State Matsers program I'm hoping to get accepted into is a 100 percent online as well, so from his perspective he probably only hears "Penn State" and disregards that it is a 100% online. I think he is just an older guy that's stuck in his ways, but I digress.

aspiringsoul

It is their loss. Keep your chin up and move on. I wouldn't want to work for a company that selects its candidates based solely on where they obtained their degree.

dou2ble

DoubleNNs wrote: »

The same could be said for proper Brick and Mortar schools. A lot of them are filled w/ kids who had a faint idea what they think is "cool" but have no idea how it relates to the professional world. They do just enough in class to not fail out and continue to stay on campus because they'd be separated from their friends and parties if their parents stopped paying their tuition. It's also well known that cheating is ubiquitous.

Not saying that B&M schools are bad.. but realize they aren't perfect either. I've met a few Devry graduates that have impressed me more than Ivy graduates - but it's usually because the Devry graduate feels they have more to prove and compensate w/ actual skills as opposed to simply name recognition (Ivy).

We all know B&M CS degrees are better than an online school, so no point in arguing there. Cheating is universal and so are top notch students. No school is perfect but there are rankings. So if you can choose to excel and are smart enough but have no work experience, why pick online over B&M. The weakest link shouldn't be the standard. To say that B&M's students also **** isn't a good enough reason to choose a weaker and easier program.

srabiee

UMUC is a regionally accredited state school. This school is non-profit, correct? (I performed a Google search and couldn't find anything regarding that.)

At any rate, the school is legit, if anyone has a problem with it, then it's their problem, not yours. Kindly invite them to bite your ass and move on.

BlackBeret

One project manager had a bad experience it seems. Lockheed Martin is generally a good company, and UMUC is extremely popular for military personnel, especially in the cyber security realm. Being a defense contract company I would think that he's in for a hard time, but at the end of the day it's his call on who he hires. Personally I would make an issue out of it, but I wouldn't work for the guy in the end. I'd be willing to bet his boss and a few others would disagree with his decision if you are qualified for the job.

Gess

I have a friend who works for Lockheed and his degree is from American Military University. When we were Marines together and going to school I was going to UMUC and he was going to AMU. Now we're both in successful careers out of the military. In both of our cases experience helped and the degree didn't hurt. Be glad you were turned away from that unsupportive institution.

gc8dc95

aspiringsoul wrote: »

It is their loss. Keep your chin up and move on. I wouldn't want to work for a company that selects its candidates based solely on where they obtained their degree.

^^^This.

JamesKurtovich

He's not doing Lockheed any favors with such a narrow view on hiring in regards to education.

It's unfortunate, but a lot of people lump UMUC, WGU, etc. in with the likes of Phoenix and ITT Tech.

Gorby

I'm sure this isn't a culture thing with Lockheed as a whole and most likely just a personal preference this hiring manager has for the position. I think online education can be benificial especially for those who work and don't want to have. I'd just to keep looking instead for other opportunities in the area.