Should I move on?

Zomboidicus

Hello all.

After hearing that I was to receive a negative feedback, I did some reflecting, and I realized that I am really not happy with my job.

I love what I do, and the environment that I am in enables me to get exposure to a lot of things. However, there are few factors that make me dread waking up in the morning and going to work;

• There is no team effort. I often find myself doing 2-3 times more the ticket than my colleagues, and on some worse days, it could be more. I also somehow became the go-to guy for meetings for severe incidents, which last for hours. 50% of our shift literally cannot do their jobs, and the rest has to pick up their slack. Some of them leave 2 hours early, while I stay 2 hours extra for an unpaid overtime. I am physically exhausted to the point of migraine on some days.
• There is no positive feedback from higher-up. Despite the fact that I am rather green in networking, my name goes on decent amount of tickets or email chain for projects and severe incidents (while the rest of the shift ignores them.) Management does not care who does it as long as it is done. There is no efficient utilization of manpower that is driven from higher-up. It becomes overwhelming, and I think increases the likeliness of making a mistake.
• I feel like my learning experience is hindered. Because I am overwhelmed, on some days, it seems my job has become "how to pass the buck within minimum effort/time but within reason." I would like to spend a decent time for the sake of both myself and the customer.

Anyways, enough of my sob story. I was wondering if these sound like a legitimate reason to consider moving on? My concern is that I haven't in this position for very long...about a year and several months. Would it do more harm than good for an entry-level person like I am to be considering moving on so quickly? Or would it be best to stay until, let's say I obtain some certs that validate my experience, or until a 2 year mark for example?

Any tips will be appreciated, and I would also like to hear your stories/situation that compelled you to move as well!

Thanks in advance

kiki162

I think you can use the time to work towards the certs you want. I totally understand your frustrustion, but I'd try to stick it out a while longer till you obtain your goals. I'd wait till you are at the 3 year mark before you start looking. Companies will take you a little more seriously after that time, however it's up to you. Doesn't hurt to start looking now.

Far as your co-workers, there's obviously not much you can do, it's more how you react.

scaredoftests

Yes, move on. Start sending resumes out to feel how things are out there for you.

TylerBarrett

From what I've gathered on this board the normal amount of time to stay at a job has gone down slightly from the 3 years I was told to about 1 year. Just make sure you have valid reasons fore leaving, like the ones you listed and you should be fine. I'd say start putting feelers out there.

Jasiono

If you are at a point where you really dread going to work, and I think you are, I think it's time to move on. Seems like things will not change unless you bring it to the managers attention, and if that happens, the environment could change to a more hostile one. It's a shame that this happened and I hope that whatever you do, it turns out for the best for you.

markulous

Yes, easy answer. Move on.

How are you getting 2 hours of unpaid overtime? Are you an hourly employee? If so, they have to pay you and I'd press the issue, especially now that you are headed out of there.

Mooseboost

It sounds like it is time to move on to bigger and brighter things. Once your work becomes a sense of dread then it is definitely time to scoot on out of there. I have left a position before because I noticed the job was making me become a horrible person who was always unhappy. I regretted leaving at first for guilt but now looking back I know it was the right decision.

Zomboidicus

kiki162 wrote: »

Far as your co-workers, there's obviously not much you can do, it's more how you react.

You are right. I try to keep a positive outlook, but it gets difficult as the situation becomes worse.

TylerBarrett wrote: »

From what I've gathered on this board the normal amount of time to stay at a job has gone down slightly from the 3 years I was told to about 1 year. Just make sure you have valid reasons fore leaving, like the ones you listed and you should be fine. I'd say start putting feelers out there.

Sweet, time to get the resume sharpened!

Jasiono wrote: »

If you are at a point where you really dread going to work, and I think you are, I think it's time to move on. Seems like things will not change unless you bring it to the managers attention, and if that happens, the environment could change to a more hostile one. It's a shame that this happened and I hope that whatever you do, it turns out for the best for you.

I can't really bring anything up to the manager. The day that I had the meeting for the mistake I made was the first day that I've seen him in real person. I don't really have a relationship with him.

Zomboidicus

markulous wrote: »

Yes, easy answer. Move on.

How are you getting 2 hours of unpaid overtime? Are you an hourly employee? If so, they have to pay you and I'd press the issue, especially now that you are headed out of there.

I get paid hourly, but any OTP has to be approved beforehand. And our team is 24/7 so they expect me NOT to stay for overtime. Except, if I ask the next shift to take care of something and it doesn't get done, I get blamed for it and receive a negative feedback

Jasiono

Yeah man, move on. It's a toxic work environment. Put your resume out there. They don't deserve someone like you and you definitely don't deserve to be treated that way. You obviously care about your career and you won't go anywhere with these toolbags.

alias454

Zomboidicus wrote: »

• There is no team effort. I often find myself doing 2-3 times more the ticket than my colleagues, and on some worse days, it could be more.

Don't let the actions of others dictate how you act. Keep doing what your doing because you are building a reputation based off of your work. When you start to function poorly it reflects on YOU not them. Your reputation is your brand and will follow you to other jobs.

Zomboidicus wrote: »

• I also somehow became the go-to guy for meetings for severe incidents, which last for hours. 50% of our shift literally cannot do their jobs, and the rest has to pick up their slack. Some of them leave 2 hours early, while I stay 2 hours extra for an unpaid overtime. I am physically exhausted to the point of migraine on some days.

That's the problem with being a doer. I have the same problem in that I feel it is my job to get stuff done and move on to the next thing. You have to have some balance though. Stop staying late for unpaid work. You get paid for 8 hours, give them 8 hours and take some time for yourself. No job is worth your health.

Zomboidicus wrote: »

• There is no positive feedback from higher-up. Despite the fact that I am rather green in networking, my name goes on decent amount of tickets or email chain for projects and severe incidents (while the rest of the shift ignores them.) Management does not care who does it as long as it is done. There is no efficient utilization of manpower that is driven from higher-up. It becomes overwhelming, and I think increases the likeliness of making a mistake.

A pat on the back once in awhile is nice but don't ever expect it. I go with the "No news is good news" philosophy. When managers aren't looking to talk to you, that means everything is going good because you are making their life easier. They still have to deal with the people sluffing off even if you don't see it. Make your boss' life easier and become an asset to them. Another thing, take on the hardest tickets you can find, that's how you gain knowledge and experience. Don't just take tickets you can close easily because you aren't learning anything that way.

Zomboidicus wrote: »

• I feel like my learning experience is hindered. Because I am overwhelmed, on some days, it seems my job has become "how to pass the buck within minimum effort/time but within reason." I would like to spend a decent time for the sake of both myself and the customer.

All the customer wants is their issue resolved ASAP, that's it. if you don't know, say so and tell them you need to ask a colleague. Be pleasant, helpful, knowledgeable, and most of all fast. Plus don't ever take it personal.

Remember, working for a company is a two way street, which either party can terminate at any time. If you have already made up your mind then start looking but you might run into these same things elsewhere then what? You should look into taking control of what you can and make the best of it. I don't know the entire situation but reasons I would move on for are better pay, better opportunities, and better work environment. In the end, it is your decision but don't make it based on emotion.

Regards,

IIIMaster

Stop taking so many tickets. Work at your pace do what you can do then leave. I use to do the same thing stay over without pay to play catch up. My boss found out and he told me do what I can do then leave because I'm not getting paid for it. If it's not done its not done.

ImThe0ne

I wouldn't get too hung up on the 2 yr mark, I bounced around job-to-job every 8 months for the last 3 positions until now and it never hurt my chances for anything. Obviously I am not condoning that much moving, but sometimes things don't happen the way you want and you need to move on from it. In my opinion, there is no reason for you to dread going to work, when you start dreading it every morning or have that sick feeling, it's time to look for greener pastures.

I would definitely say it's time to pack your bags. Start working on your certs in the mean time, sometimes job hunting works perfect and quick and sometimes it takes time. In that time, get certified.

Zomboidicus

IIIMaster wrote: »

Stop taking so many tickets. Work at your pace do what you can do then leave. I use to do the same thing stay over without pay to play catch up. My boss found out and he told me do what I can do then leave because I'm not getting paid for it. If it's not done its not done.

I feel like that may be part of my fault too. Perhaps I jump on tasks and tickets without giving enough time for other members. But it's very difficult for me to ignore the feeling like I "have" to.

And sometimes my team members give my name to the customers on my behalf for tshoot sessions or straight out ask me to do it, so some tasks I get stuck with involuntarily.

But I guess the place of blame isn't really what I'm concerned with at this point...I think I need to gradually reduce the workload to healthy/acceptable level, reduce the potential for mistakes to stay under the radar of management, and study for certs while I attempt to move on.

ImThe0ne wrote: »

I wouldn't get too hung up on the 2 yr mark, I bounced around job-to-job every 8 months for the last 3 positions until now and it never hurt my chances for anything. Obviously I am not condoning that much moving, but sometimes things don't happen the way you want and you need to move on from it. In my opinion, there is no reason for you to dread going to work, when you start dreading it every morning or have that sick feeling, it's time to look for greener pastures.

I would definitely say it's time to pack your bags. Start working on your certs in the mean time, sometimes job hunting works perfect and quick and sometimes it takes time. In that time, get certified.

You are right...it's possible that I might even be closer to my 2 year mark by the time I can get an offer. And if I get interviews and offers, obviously that would be a proof that some employers may not care.

If I can move on quickly, then great; the pay increase may not be much (if at all) but I may be in a better work environment. If it takes time, then perhaps I can get more certs and longer experience in this particular position, which may increase the potential for better pay. I guess all I can do is polish my resume and linkedin account, and put myself out there!

Mide

Yeah I would move on if I were you. Start sending out resumes and go for positions that are a bit higher on the totem pole vs doing a direct lateral move. This way the 1.x years of experience won't look bad since you would be advancing your career.

That being said there's almost never a perfect job, but if you don't feel as though you're advancing ($$, learning new technologies, boss doesn't provide good feedback) then the company has issues and it's time to start looking.

RoyalRaven

You're likely dealing with burnout, considering you enjoy the content of your work but it's a drag on you directly. Take a step back and see if there are things that you can change to make each day less chaotic or stressful.

As others mentioned, start testing the market...see what else is out there, but you'll need to cope with the current situation until things change, so at least try to make the best of what you have at the moment.

Hammer80

I agree with everybody else here its time to move on and start looking for another job, there is no opportunity there. Also do not get hung up on the 3 year deal, in tech fields you staying 3 years is an eternity. As long as your skills are improving and your resume reflects that than the sweet spot for anyone in tech is to jump after 1 year. There are many people on this board that have gone trough half a dozen jobs in less than 5 years and it has not hurt their career, in fact its actually helped them. There have been recent studies that have actually shown that folks that jump ship every 1-2 years get promoted faster and earn more than the ones that stay over the span of their careers. The only place that you should stay longer is if you get a job on any government level, the benefits and the ability to move up while keeping your benefits (sweet sweet pension) is just too good to pass up. I mean no offense to anyone but the recommendation of staying 3+ years in this business is old school and is career suicide unless you happen to work for a very good company. That advice worked when companies still had a shred of loyalty but not anymore.

Chitownjedi

You are over a year there, honestly, at least where I am from, that is more than enough time to be somewhere and make a move for more advantageous work. Maybe grab a nice certification that should culminate with your 2 year mark and then head out then to get best of both worlds.

NetworkNewb

You say you love the work and the environment allows you to get exposure to a lot of things, judging by that I'm assuming you work in a large environment? Have you sat down with your boss/manager and told him directly that you have interest in a certain area?

There are two ways to get out of your current position, do it yourself and jump ship, or talk with your manager and see if he (and the company) can help you grow. I would first have a meeting with your manager and see if they are willing to help you. I'll guarantee your manager doesn't know what interests you have or if you are unhappy doing what you currently do. A good manager will also be happy to know that you have the desire to learn more and grow within the company and might be willing to help you get to where you want to be as well.

Is there a position at your current company that someone higher up than you does that you wish you did? I would ask my boss what does it take to get there and see if you can come up with a career plan at the company for it.

Of course, if you don't really like the current company you can ignore everything above and look for another company

TheProf

I completely understand where you're coming from, been there myself. Only thing I am curious about is why you would be getting negative feedback? you seem to be pulling a lot of weight? Sure you can make a mistake here and there, we all do, that does not warrant for negative feedback if most of your work is good?

Maybe they want to give you some constructive criticism?

Personally, I would say, try to stay more than just a year, I would recommend 2 years minimum. If you're learning, it could be very valuable. However if the team and upper management is not helping you out, I can understand why you'd feel this way.

echo_time_cat

TheProf wrote: »

I completely understand where you're coming from, been there myself. Only thing I am curious about is why you would be getting negative feedback? you seem to be pulling a lot of weight? Sure you can make a mistake here and there, we all do, that does not warrant for negative feedback if most of your work is good?

Maybe they want to give you some constructive criticism?

I'll take a guess as to why...

volfkhat

In my opinion, the BEST time to have a job.. is when you have Mentally PUNCHED-OUT

Sometimes, when the "stars align" (in just the right way), you will find yourself at a point when you are so mentally beatdown, tired/frustrated (of pulling the DEAD-WEIGHT),
that you mentally 'PUNCH OUT'.

Are you there yet? if so, Celebrate :]

STOP taking so many tickets.
START slacking like the rest of the Deadbeats.
STOP staying LATE... Only put in EIGHT.
DO let Sh#t Hit the Fan, and Revel in the Aftermath

Oh, and yes,
DO blast your resume out there ASAP. And go for a certification while you are at it.

Your job has inadvertantly done you a Favor.... they have (mentally) Set you Free.
Fly Away, my friend.... FLY!

Zomboidicus

NetworkNewb wrote: »

You say you love the work and the environment allows you to get exposure to a lot of things, judging by that I'm assuming you work in a large environment? Have you sat down with your boss/manager and told him directly that you have interest in a certain area?

There are two ways to get out of your current position, do it yourself and jump ship, or talk with your manager and see if he (and the company) can help you grow. I would first have a meeting with your manager and see if they are willing to help you. I'll guarantee your manager doesn't know what interests you have or if you are unhappy doing what you currently do. A good manager will also be happy to know that you have the desire to learn more and grow within the company and might be willing to help you get to where you want to be as well.

Is there a position at your current company that someone higher up than you does that you wish you did? I would ask my boss what does it take to get there and see if you can come up with a career plan at the company for it.

Of course, if you don't really like the current company you can ignore everything above and look for another company

It's a NOC for a data center, and the company itself is indeed large. I get exposure to traditional Cisco devices, as well as DC devices such as Nexus, ACE, ASRs, and etc. Devices from other vendors are used there as well. I have no issues with the company itself, just the team that I am in. Recruiter mentioned that it is possible to jump to another teams if there are vacancies, but I'm not sure how to bring this up to the recruiter.

I've only talked to my manager once in person and it was about the negative feedback, so I'm not sure how that conversation will go. I don't think I have a good impression and relationship for me to be able to do that. I'm thinking of jumping ship before my reputation here gets any worse, and hope that I can join a team that is more friendly, driven and team-oriented.

TheProf wrote: »

I completely understand where you're coming from, been there myself. Only thing I am curious about is why you would be getting negative feedback? you seem to be pulling a lot of weight? Sure you can make a mistake here and there, we all do, that does not warrant for negative feedback if most of your work is good?

Maybe they want to give you some constructive criticism?

Personally, I would say, try to stay more than just a year, I would recommend 2 years minimum. If you're learning, it could be very valuable. However if the team and upper management is not helping you out, I can understand why you'd feel this way.

I would like to stay until I've hit the 2 year mark as well, but I'm not sure if it's worth it. I'm also not sure if I can survive it
I feel like the learning experience has stagnated, which is one of the main reason why I am considering moving on.
I guess it also depends on the response I get once I start posting the resumes as well. If the pay increases, then why not?

The talk mostly seemed to be a negative feedback with a hint of constructive criticism. There were some lines that sounded like a threat (even if he didn't mean it to be), so perhaps I am overselling/deceiving myself into thinking that I am doing a good job. Or maybe there is something in the background that I am completely unaware of, like I pissed someone off unintentionally. I am really not sure, to be honest.

volfkhat

Zomboidicus wrote: »

Recruiter mentioned that it is possible to jump to another teams if there are vacancies, but I'm not sure how to bring this up to the recruiter.

~Talking with the Recruuiter is quite EASY. You walk to their Office, and say "I want to jump to another team".
The Hard part is mustering the Courage to do it.

Zomboidicus wrote: »

I've only talked to my manager once in person and it was about the negative feedback,...

~FLAG!! That doesn't sound like much of a 'manager', imo.

Zomboidicus wrote: »

The talk mostly seemed to be a negative feedback with a hint of constructive criticism. There were some lines that sounded like a threat (even if he didn't mean it to be), so perhaps I am overselling/deceiving myself into thinking that I am doing a good job. Or maybe there is something in the background that I am completely unaware of, like I pissed someone off unintentionally. I am really not sure, to be honest.

~ Lastly, Please remember this:
Nobody is Perfect. Everybody Fails. Everybody grows.
That's life. Don't beat yourself up Over "Am i doing a good job?".
Maybe you are... Maybe you're not. As Long as your are putting forth the Effort... That Is What matters.

It sounds like your job has turned into a borderline hostile environment?
Is this your first Career job? Is this the first time you've been in a Job with so many Negatives?

When my career was about 5 years old, i had a ruff job like that yours. It was a really MISERABLE place to be.
But i had NEVER been in such a Toxic environment before.... so i thought the problem was something that "i" could resolve.

Looking back... i'm actually GLAD that i had experienced such MISERY.
It taught me to recognize Bad situations (going forward), and to Remove myself from them!

Fly away :]

Ismaeljrp

Ok. I'm going to be honest, this is getting confusing...

You say you get tons of exposure and experience, but you say your learning has stagnated?

Also, whether you decide to stay or if you leave, you should make adjustments to how you work.

I especially recommend you do your shift and get out. That's your time, you don't gain anything from doing unpaid OT. Next shift should take care of whatever is left to be done. That's just the way it is. It's the manager's responsibility to make sure they have the resources to get the job done.

You are a resource, and so are the other employees. Remember, you are a valuable asset. If you are doing as good a job as you describe, they'll notice the drop in production once you start doing your actual shift, and they may even investigate who is slacking on their shift. You should be covered.

This experience is good though, it'll toughen you up. You need to stand up for yourself more.

Start applying to other places and see what you get, in the meantime, get tough.

Zomboidicus

volfkhat wrote: »

~Talking with the Recruuiter is quite EASY. You walk to their Office, and say "I want to jump to another team".
The Hard part is mustering the Courage to do it.

I talked to the guy. He made it sound like there would be no trouble with it, and that it depended more or less on when I want it to happen.


Sweet!

volfkhat wrote: »

~ Lastly, Please remember this:
Nobody is Perfect. Everybody Fails. Everybody grows.
That's life. Don't beat yourself up Over "Am i doing a good job?".
Maybe you are... Maybe you're not. As Long as your are putting forth the Effort... That Is What matters.


It sounds like your job has turned into a borderline hostile environment?
Is this your first Career job? Is this the first time you've been in a Job with so many Negatives?

For my first job after graduation, I used to work in an small IT department prior to this NOC job.
There was some similar themes, like there was a guy who's been there for about a decade or so. He was comfortable and had no trouble dropping the stack of papers on my desk (if you know what I mean.)


But the manager valued my work, listened to my inputs, and gave me constructive critisism if there was anything I was doing that was inefficient. I actually had a say in of some of the projects. He tried to fight for my raise, and gave me nothing but a "good luck" when I had to move on because the company wanted to bring me in as an employee instead of contractor without a penny of raise (and I wasn't making much.)


Now I'm surround by teammates who just watch Neflix or read a book while they watch the ticket queue be filled with my name and this another guy.

volfkhat wrote: »

When my career was about 5 years old, i had a ruff job like that yours. It was a really MISERABLE place to be.
But i had NEVER been in such a Toxic environment before.... so i thought the problem was something that "i" could resolve.


Looking back... i'm actually GLAD that i had experienced such MISERY.
It taught me to recognize Bad situations (going forward), and to Remove myself from them!


Fly away :]

That's a good point, and I'm glad that this situation that I am in is not the norm.

Ismaeljrp wrote: »

Ok. I'm going to be honest, this is getting confusing...


You say you get tons of exposure and experience, but you say your learning has stagnated?


Also, whether you decide to stay or if you leave, you should make adjustments to how you work.


I especially recommend you do your shift and get out. That's your time, you don't gain anything from doing unpaid OT. Next shift should take care of whatever is left to be done. That's just the way it is. It's the manager's responsibility to make sure they have the resources to get the job done.


You are a resource, and so are the other employees. Remember, you are a valuable asset. If you are doing as good a job as you describe, they'll notice the drop in production once you start doing your actual shift, and they may even investigate who is slacking on their shift. You should be covered.


This experience is good though, it'll toughen you up. You need to stand up for yourself more.


Start applying to other places and see what you get, in the meantime, get tough.

When I first started, between tickets, I could afford to jot down notes about what happened on my technical journal, such as the description of the issue, what is it that I did, and how it was fixed. Recently I haven't had the time to even do this. I think I'm also getting anxious at work with how busy it is, and how I am treated by my co-workers and upper management, and I feel like it's adding up. It's tiring and de-motivating, so when there is some down time, I'm just trying to relax instead of opening up a book or watching some training videos or reflecting on tickets I've worked on by further researching the topic. I feel like the balance between workload and learning has tipped to one side. In my opinion, it's like skimming an unread chapter the day before the exam, you may absorb enough to answer few questions (or all if you have excellent short-term memory) but who knows how long it'll stick with you? It's an effort to get by, which is low in value in terms of learning experience. But I guess it's different for everybody.


But you're right, I am a "yes man" and I feel like that's what gets me in these kinds of situations.

IIIMaster

If your coworkers are delegting task towards you that has to be address. They are paid and is train at the same level as you. If your not a senior tech or in a position where matters must be esculated to you it needs to address. Employees doing task like that will be terminated in my work enviroment. I call it, call avoidance.

Ismaeljrp

In the beginning of our careers most of us are "yes men". We're all gung ho and eager to please and create an impression. Once we realize how the business actually works, that can change.

Where I work, I've been told that expecting a salary raise anytime soon is not gonna happen. I've been here 14 months. I'm not worried about it yet, but eventually I know I will. They constantly want us to do more than we were hired for. I'm just taking this experience for it's positives, I get paid OT at 2 X my hourly rate, I get lots of experience, paid training, our NOC group is really cool as people including my manager. I suppose that carries it's value as well because it leads to less stress.

markulous

Ismaeljrp wrote: »

In the beginning of our careers most of us are "yes men". We're all gung ho and eager to please and create an impression. Once we realize how the business actually works, that can change.

Where I work, I've been told that expecting a salary raise anytime soon is not gonna happen. I've been here 14 months. I'm not worried about it yet, but eventually I know I will. They constantly want us to do more than we were hired for. I'm just taking this experience for it's positives, I get paid OT at 2 X my hourly rate, I get lots of experience, paid training, our NOC group is really cool as people including my manager. I suppose that carries it's value as well because it leads to less stress.

Don't get stressed out over raises. Good thing about IT is you can bounce around to different places and that's the best way to get a raise. Milk the current company for all you can as far as experience/knowledge goes, then go somewhere else more challenging and/or that will give you more $.