job hunting rant

slee335

docrice wrote: »

Having interest in the organization, its mission, and the role's contribution to the overall mission says a lot about a candidate, actually. I've interviewed many "just want a job" vs. "how can I help the business" candidates and the ones we'd ultimately lean towards are those who have a holistically-viewed approach to the bottom line. It shows a degree of personal investment towards an organization as opposed to just putting in a strict set of expectations. So yes, the attitude and approach can certainly be a factor in how you're viewed professionally.

It was good feedback I'll try to have more interest in the company next interview I get. Wish I get feedback like this after every interview. One question I hate being ask is what do you like to do besides work or hobby. I usually say basketball n yoga n golf. The interviewer said oh you have a life outside of work. Duh!Why ask that unless you want to know if I have a second job other than that I feel if my hobbies aren't to there liking I'm not going to get it. Should I ask the interviewer what hobbies they like lol

Danielm7

slee335 wrote: »

It was good feedback I'll try to have more interest in the company next interview I get. Wish I get feedback like this after every interview. One question I hate being ask is what do you like to do besides work or hobby. I usually say basketball n yoga n golf. The interviewer said oh you have a life outside of work. Duh!Why ask that unless you want to know if I have a second job other than that I feel if my hobbies aren't to there liking I'm not going to get it. Should I ask the interviewer what hobbies they like lol

Every company is different. Some of them want to hear, "nothing! I only work and only study for work!" which is crazy in my opinion but whatever. Others, and I want to believe most, want to hear that you're a human being who will actually get along with their other employees and make a happy work environment.

At my current job people like to joke around, it makes work less stressful and more enjoyable. If I interviewed someone that came off as a total cyborg I wouldn't want to sit next to them all day long.

As for the earlier comments about caring about the company, it's a funny time in the world. By that I mean many years ago you cared about the company you worked for and they cared about you in turn, you could work your whole career there and retired (with a pension!) and that was it. Now, they know you aren't going to be there for longer than a few years at most, but, they expect you to put on the front that you'll live and die for the company but when budgets get cut they won't shed a tear for letting you go. They want to see "progressive experience" on your resume, meaning each job should be higher than the last, but they don't want to promote from within to give you that experience when you work there. /rant.

Being realistic though, know about the company you are interviewing with, ask questions that show you did your research. Ask questions about the culture of the company, it is where you're going to spend the majority of your week, you don't want that to be a miserable time. Being a "just a paycheck" guy doesn't give the company a whole lot of reason to hire you vs. someone how has researched the company and really wants to work there.

mackenzae

slee335 wrote: »

blah i'm not a company man i'm a employee get the work done and leave. when the company makes billion i don't see cent. .

For some reason this reminded me of Office Space. Lol.

Here are some questions that I tend to use.

1. Does the company provide Education/continued training for you? Like when they upgrade systems, get new devices,etc..
2. If you are with the potential manager - ask about the IT environment? Is it team oriented? If so how often do they get together to discuss work stuff.
3. Ask the interviewer what they like about the company.. Why they work there? (I love this question btw). It basically gives you an idea of whether or not they like.. if they come back with something generic or something specific.
4. Ask if there was something they would change about the company, what would be? If they had to improve upon its culture

slee335

do you think i hurt my chances of getting a system job by taking this noc job. i notice every time i talk to a recruiter and i tell them my day to day and what i do they say its all network no server support. i explain to them my past job i did server support and this is my first networking job. now i regret taking this job in hopes of expanding my knowledge i think i hurt by being too jack of all trade and not concentrated. i was thinking of putting in some server stuff in this position even though i don't really touch but i know it. so they don't think i'm all network here.

ratbuddy

I don't know you or what you're like on the phone, but I can tell you that your posts convey a message about you that says 'this guy just doesn't give a crap.' If you're showing the same effort when speaking to a recruiter or hiring manager, it's not surprising that you aren't getting results.

I'd take a good look at the image you are projecting, it may be other than what you think it is

phantasm

ratbuddy wrote: »

I don't know you or what you're like on the phone, but I can tell you that your posts convey a message about you that says 'this guy just doesn't give a crap.' If you're showing the same effort when speaking to a recruiter or hiring manager, it's not surprising that you aren't getting results.

I'd take a good look at the image you are projecting, it may be other than what you think it is

def

I agree with this one. You seem to project an image that says 'you're just here for the paycheck'. People like that are of no use to most corporations. In fact, when I'm interviewing people I ask what they know about the company I work for. I don't expect them to know our quarterly financials but I expect you to know what market we're in and maybe a few random facts. It goes to show interest.

If you approach every job or interview with a 'I just need a paycheck' approach you'll be left in the dust more often than not. So, in conclusion, work on your soft skills. They're as important as your tech skills if not more so.

bloodshotbetty

I always go into an interview with the attitude that *I* am also trying to see if this company will be a good fit for ME. That is why I ask questions- What is the culture like? What values does the company hold? If I will be spending 40+ hours there a week, I want to fit in.

Also- put your education at the top of your resume. Even if your degree isn't related, it shows a dedication to education AND that you had the "college" experience. You learn MANY applicable skills regardless of what your major is.

Fulcrum45

bloodshotbetty wrote: »

I always go into an interview with the attitude that *I* am also trying to see if this company will be a good fit for ME. That is why I ask questions- What is the culture like? What values does the company hold? If I will be spending 40+ hours there a week, I want to fit in.

Yup. That's exactly how I approach my interviews as well. They need to sell themselves to me just as much and I need to sell myself to them. Ask questions, maintain eye contact and watch their body language. And make no mistake, EVERY company needs at least a few people who are simply willing to punch in, collect a paycheck and punch out- but you're going to have a hard time selling yourself that way

slee335

ratbuddy wrote: »

I don't know you or what you're like on the phone, but I can tell you that your posts convey a message about you that says 'this guy just doesn't give a crap.' If you're showing the same effort when speaking to a recruiter or hiring manager, it's not surprising that you aren't getting results.

I'd take a good look at the image you are projecting, it may be other than what you think it is

with recuriter they mostly just ask about tech skill. only had like 2 interview this year I'll try to take more of a interest in the company when i get a another interview. i was just trying to be real in past my experience most coworker are there for the pay check i mean they are good and they don't slack or anything but they didn't care what the company did really if they did good or bad. expect if they did worried about getting can that about it. they care about the user or clients thats about it. i always wonder how crappy people get the job they are good at interviewing and the good people don't. they are good at BS. they should teach a class how to bs to get the job.

honestly do you guys care about the company or is it just for show to get the job. you care more about the position than the company.

a few exception are technology company where you support the product. like this one law firm they thought technology was waste because it doesn't bring in the money. they spent money a lot of money on technology but they felt it was more of waste because it didn't bring in the money it kept things going smoothly though. but if we did bring in money or bill it we were like sucking money.

SpetsRepair

slee335

Most people get these jobs by having pretty good social skills and a desire to learn even if they don't know as much as they say they do. I've worked with some people who only worked one previous job and spent a long time looking for work and ended up giving up only to one day find a pretty stable career in the help desk profession. Even though most of us can walk circles around their techinncal knowledge sometimes its just they have much better social skills. I also personally believe too much technical knowledge can sometimes be a bad thing

Also to touch on the recruiter thing a bit, I'm not a big fan of them because they are in no way technical at all. I've been at many interviews and most of the time the person interviewing me isn't really that up to date on their technical knowledge. After being asked a series of tech questions i decided to ask them if they knew the difference between FTP and TFTP they did not.

slee335

agreed good social skills are important but cmon some of these are hiring i see just makes me go crazy. I am social once i get comfortable with the person its just during interview I'm nervous trying not to say the wrong thing. i think you might be right too much technical knowledge could make out snob and think automatically you get any job. i think before i got so technical i was willing to learn about the culture and company and everything. but now not really. now i think about it i should have spent more time on the soft skill than technical. at least 80/20 i'm like the opposite now 80 tech /20 soft

Mr. Meeseeks

With a majority of companies you have to look at it like you are joining a team. Your interests need to align with their (or at least come close) AND SHOW IT... or you will never get the job.

You have to care about the company you are working for. If there is no company... you have no job... You may not think so now, because you hate your current employer and I am sure you are only there to collect a paycheck. Companies and employees invest in each other.

slee335

question.

i applied to this company and the company recruiter called and said "we are interested i would like to setup a call with the hiring manager i'l email you the info time and spec about the company". i said great the next day no email so i sent him a thank you/ follow up email later that evening as a reminder saying hi researched the company and is really interested and looking forward to speak to the hiring manager. should i have waited longer before i sent the follow up/thank you letter did i sound to eager or desperate.

from my past experience mostly with recruiter they send you email that day.trying something different this time i'm usually passive when this stuff happen and thinking if they like me they'll contact me. this time i'm trying to show more interest and be proactive. see if this helps.

ratbuddy

Not to beat a dead horse here, but I really hope you used better spelling, grammar, and punctuation than you use on this forum

kiki162

Slee335 - Stay away from recruiters and contract positions. Don't respond to them because you are desperate to move into a new job. Yes you do need to be interested in a prospective company, do some research if you can't think of questions to ask at an interview. I'd work on getting yourself another certification under your belt to help you slide into a new position.

Work on completing the MCSE and clarify on your education...did you get a degree...or did you just attend and drop out. If you dropped out, then remove that from your resume. If you are still attend, you can put something like Expected Graduation: Month/Year. Would also work on your grammar and punctuation in your resume. Nothing turns off a HR person more than bad grammar.

You also have a bit of security experience too, I'd work on certs like SSCP, and possibly CISSP if that interests you. Or you can work on Cisco Security or go for your CCNP. Remember the more time you put into your education, the more positive results you will get.

TLeTourneau

slee335 wrote: »

...SNIP...
honestly do you guys care about the company or is it just for show to get the job. you care more about the position than the company.
...SNIP...

Honestly, I care about the company, the work the company does and the work I do to support the company's mission. Although the work I (and many of us) do supports systems that are ubiquitous they need to work. One of the reasons I chose to work in healthcare IT rather than another market sector is that the work we do helps people just about as directly as an IT career can.

So yes, I care about the company.

SpetsRepair

kiki162 wrote: »

Slee335 - Stay away from recruiters and contract positions. Don't respond to them because you are desperate to move into a new job. Yes you do need to be interested in a prospective company, do some research if you can't think of questions to ask at an interview. I'd work on getting yourself another certification under your belt to help you slide into a new position.

How would you build enough experience without contracting experience?

guy9

I will repeat the same thing that was said. When I go an interview I do all the digging I can about a company. I look at all the email address on the email find the LinkedIn page facebook page (don't tell them that) and all the good and bad. Look at your LinkedIn settings to see if they will know you visited the page. Or create a bogus LinkedIn profile. I have had good and bad experiences with giving them history and what's on said persons LinkedIn. Some people smile and like you did your research and one lady asked me during the interview if I was a "hacker". So you have a 50/50

You saying you don't care about the company probably showed. You have to be eager they have to hear it in your voice. Like I have said before...remember you're not the only one who applied for that position. ........and if I knew I had 0 security experience and they had to take time to train me and they said the salary was between 70k-90k I would say I'll work for 63k. Just in case I totally bombed the interview and my resume was in cursive they might consider hiring me because it saves money...every company wants to save money. I didn't say I'd stay with the company for 2 years cause I wouldn't, just for the experience

mackenzae

guy9 wrote: »

one lady asked me during the interview if I was a "hacker".

Lol.. I love when people think you're a hacker because you know how to use or do something on a computer that they didn't know.

slee335

Sorry I need to vent again got another rejection this time I had to take 4 online exam. They said they had other applicants that had scored higher. One good thing I’m getting more call backs now. I potential have two more interview one for system administrator and one for something totally different technology operation manager. the system administrator role i had a phone interview with the tech last Friday. its been a week since i talked to him but it seems forever. going to follow up with them on Monday. the technology operation manager is supposed to be phone interview. not sure which one i'm rooting for. both kinda dream job.

pinkydapimp

slee335 wrote: »

Sorry I need to vent again got another rejection this time I had to take 4 online exam. They said they had other applicants that had scored higher. One good thing I’m getting more call backs now. I potential have two more interview one for system administrator and one for something totally different technology operation manager. the system administrator role i had a phone interview with the tech last Friday. its been a week since i talked to him but it seems forever. going to follow up with them on Monday. the technology operation manager is supposed to be phone interview. not sure which one i'm rooting for. both kinda dream job.

Sounds like you fixed your resume problem. Now you just need to tighten up your interview skills. Practice in front of as many people you can get in front of. look up interview questions and practice answering them.

scaredoftests

4 online exams? ugh

blargoe

The thing about a job interview that people lose sight of is that you aren't the only one who is supposed to be interviewed. It is your opportunity to interview THEM as well. I (tactfully) ask about the things that interest me, and throw in a couple of feel good questions about the company as well even if I'm not that interested. One thing that I always ask about - I want to know what they consider the criteria for success for a new hire in this role.

slee335

blargoe wrote: »

The thing about a job interview that people lose sight of is that you aren't the only one who is supposed to be interviewed. It is your opportunity to interview THEM as well. I (tactfully) ask about the things that interest me, and throw in a couple of feel good questions about the company as well even if I'm not that interested. One thing that I always ask about - I want to know what they consider the criteria for success for a new hire in this role.

i did this on my last phone interview with the tech he seemed a little disinterested and just asked me like a 3 question did i know this and that and said do i have any other question. so i tried to keep the conversation going by asking how this position came about, how long you work there. tried to talk about the position and company how i would love to work there and like to learn new things like. i hope that made me stand out a little.

docrice

Many technical interviewers are not very good, nor do they expect an interviewee to ask questions back. It's definitely a two-way street, but keep in mind that hiring managers often pull in "techies" to ask questions with little notice. It also takes a certain kind of personality to be able to communicate in a situation like that.

Raystafarian

I'd remove your resume or at least your current employer from it, given the initial post in this thread..

kenrin

Do people get jobs from those recruiters that give online exams? I did one for TEKsystems that was basic MS 7 and Office questions and aced it. Guy tried to get me to do an hour commute for $10 | hr. What a joke, I asked for over double that before the exams.

The guys from TEKsystems or Robert Half are the only ones that I can understand enough to have a conversation with. I'm not saying their English is bad but try talking to people from a cell phone in a rural area with a thick Indian accent.

slee335

kenrin wrote: »

Do people get jobs from those recruiters that give online exams? I did one for TEKsystems that was basic MS 7 and Office questions and aced it. Guy tried to get me to do an hour commute for $10 | hr. What a joke, I asked for over double that before the exams.

The guys from TEKsystems or Robert Half are the only ones that I can understand enough to have a conversation with. I'm not saying their English is bad but try talking to people from a cell phone in a rural area with a thick Indian accent.

this is test was given by the hiring company not recruiter.

i don't trust recruiter if they are not local most of the time the non local recruiter are indian thick accent reading a script and also offering jobs not even in my area and they say "oh you not looking to relocate"

SaSkiller

IME a good percentage of the foreign recruiters are the bottom of the barrel types that send out emails to anyone and everyone. I generally disregard them except to see what qualifications they are looking for.

slee335

i applied to this job for one of my favorite company i would love to work for. they contacted me yesterday i missed there phone call and they left me a VM to call them back. when i got a chance i called them back no one answered i left a VM and they still haven't called me back. i tried calling them this morning and the recruiter isn't picking up. i don't want to seem too needy should i keep calling till the lady picks up or wait for them to call me back. i really want to work for them. can't believe i missed there call. i looked up her info on linkdin was thinking about contacting her through there.

edit: still waiting to hear back from two companies. i haven't heard back from them in about a week and half so i sent a follow email to one and called one up. to find out if i'm still in consideration they both said yes and the position isn't filled yet. they are still interviewing so i'm not feeling too good about it.