Another LAB question

GDaines

Apologies if these have been answered before, I've read lots of lab threads and not really found my answers.

I'm currently studying for CCNA R&S, and if I manage to pass it I'm quite interested in CCNA Voice. With this in mind I've already bought the following kit:

1x WS-C2960-24TC-L
2x WS-C3560-24PS-S
1x 1841 Router with WIC-1T
2x 2811 Routers (one with 2x WIC-1T + 1x WIC-1ADSL)

Pretty sure everything has standard ram and CF, and all running IOS 12.something (I'll update my kit list to include ram/CF size and IOS versions if this information becomes necessary to answer my questions). I've gone for 60-series switches as the Todd Lammle book I've started with says the current exams are based on these, and they barely cost any more than people were asking for older 50-series kit and 2600XM routers. I'm also currently considering adding a 3845 Router, but non of the lab guides I've read seem to mention 37xx and 38xx series kit as I guess they used to be expensive, so I'm not yet sure if it will offer any other benefits than being more expandable and having gigabit Ethernet.

QUESTION 1: For the frame relay lab(s) I suppose I could simply add a WIC-1T to my second 2811 and buy a couple of DB60 DCE/DTE crossover cables, but is it worth considering getting a 3845 router with an NM-4T and move one of the WIC-1T cards to the other 2811 so that all 3 existing routers have one each? Would a 4-router setup be better than a 3 for this lab?

QUESTION 2: If I go the 3845 route can I add an NM-16ESW-PWR (for 16x 100/100 PoE Ethernet ports to run VoIP phones) or will I need something newer? And can it be fitted at the same time as the NM-4T? If I go the cheaper route and just add a WIC-1T to my second 2811, would the NM-16ESW-PWR work in a 2811?

QUESTION 3: If someone has IOS files downloaded for my routers and were to give me copies, can I load them to practice how to do it (subject to meeting minimum ram and CF requirements)? I'm currently ignoring whether it's ethical/legal to do at this stage and simply asking would it work? If yes I'll look at the implications later.

nanochillbot

QUESTION 1: For the frame relay lab(s) I suppose I could simply add a WIC-1T to my second 2811 and buy a couple of DB60 DCE/DTE crossover cables, but is it worth considering getting a 3845 router with an NM-4T and move one of the WIC-1T cards to the other 2811 so that all 3 existing routers have one each? Would a 4-router setup be better than a 3 for this lab?

What labs are you running? The FR labs on the 460-461 are optional.
VWIC2's are used, you'll need DSP's cards if you don't have them. A 4 router config nice idea but dependent upon what you want.
To do the basic VoIP lab, not necessary.


QUESTION 2: If I go the 3845 route can I add an NM-16ESW-PWR (for 16x 100/100 PoE Ethernet ports to run VoIP phones) or will I need something newer? And can it be fitted at the same time as the NM-4T? If I go the cheaper route and just add a WIC-1T to my second 2811, would the NM-16ESW-PWR work in a 2811?

I learned to use the Router software config guide, and Cisco documentation to learn what it would accept for cards. There are no such thing as
I card fits all. VoIP is another beast....with lots of specific needs or it simply will not work. The IOS version plays a critical role as well.

"With this in mind I've already bought the following kit: Pretty sure everything has standard ram and CF, and all running IOS 12.something (I'll update my kit list to include ram/CF size and IOS versions if this information becomes necessary to answer my questions)"

What the IOS's are you'll learn to ask up front. I've had classmates who vowed never to make that mistake again.The IOS's will have a version
hopefully, of CME, and enough flash to run your TFTP server and load files for your phones.

Hope this helps

theodoxa

GDaines wrote: »

QUESTION 1: For the frame relay lab(s) I suppose I could simply add a WIC-1T to my second 2811 and buy a couple of DB60 DCE/DTE crossover cables, but is it worth considering getting a 3845 router with an NM-4T and move one of the WIC-1T cards to the other 2811 so that all 3 existing routers have one each? Would a 4-router setup be better than a 3 for this lab?

The 2811 has 4 x HWIC/WIC slots. I used one as my Frame Relay switch (using 4 x WIC-1DSU-T1-V2) when I was working on CCNP. I personally prefer the T1 WICs as they're cheaper, I can make my own cables, and unlike DB60 you'll actually find T1 outside of a lab environment.

QUESTION 3: If someone has IOS files downloaded for my routers and were to give me copies, can I load them to practice how to do it (subject to meeting minimum ram and CF requirements)? I'm currently ignoring whether it's ethical/legal to do at this stage and simply asking would it work? If yes I'll look at the implications later.

The 1st Generation of ISRs (1800/2800/3800) use different IOS images for each package, so you could just load Advanced IP Services (this or Advanced Enterprise will cover all topics) and it would work (assuming you have enough RAM and CF). The newer 2nd Generation ISRs (1900/2900/3900) use a Universal image which requires license keys to enable features beyond IP Base (which covers very little of the topics). As long as you stick to 1800/2800/3800 series routers, you can load any IOS you can get your hands on. If you can't find a 15.1T image...try the link below and click 15.0.1M9(MD). I don't know if its an oversight or what...

https://software.cisco.com/download/release.html?mdfid=279120819&flowid=69480&dvdid=282804698&softwareid=280805680&release=15.0.1M10&relind=AVAILABLE&rellifecycle=MD&reltype=all&i=rp

As for why noone uses the 3845. That is because it is huge. The 2811 and 2821 are much better options (smaller), unless for some reason you just happened into a really good deal on some 3845s.

MTciscoguy

It is not an oversight, when you click on a link to download, it says login and service contract required.

To add, I have a lot of copies of various IOS images, for older gear.

GDaines

theodoxa wrote: »

The 1st Generation of ISRs (1800/2800/3800) use different IOS images for each package, so you could just load Advanced IP Services (this or Advanced Enterprise will cover all topics) and it would work (assuming you have enough RAM and CF). The newer 2nd Generation ISRs (1900/2900/3900) use a Universal image which requires license keys to enable features beyond IP Base (which covers very little of the topics). As long as you stick to 1800/2800/3800 series routers, you can load any IOS you can get your hands on. If you can't find a 15.1T image...try the link below and click 15.0.1M9(MD). I don't know if its an oversight or what...

https://software.cisco.com/download/release.html?mdfid=279120819&flowid=69480&dvdid=282804698&softwareid=280805680&release=15.0.1M10&relind=AVAILABLE&rellifecycle=MD&reltype=all&i=rp

As for why noone uses the 3845. That is because it is huge. The 2811 and 2821 are much better options (smaller), unless for some reason you just happened into a really good deal on some 3845s.

Thanks theodoxa, yes the link does seem to be an oversight on Cisco's part as all other versions do indeed need a valid login and SmartNet subscription to be able to download IOS images as pointed out by MTciscoguy, so I've grabbed the Advanced Enterprise Services and Advanced IP Services images while I can. And the info you've given is really useful, even if my home lab won't stretch to using 19xx/29xx kit, I might see it in the real world so it's useful to know.

I'm based in the UK and have found a basic 3845 for 50 UKP when I was paying 40 UKP for a 2811. As the 28xx-series can't use an NM-4T (10 UKP) I'd have to spend 24 UKP for 4x WIC-1T wasting all my WIC slots, or 40 UKP for 2x WIC-2T, so the 3845 makes more sense both on cost and expandability as far as I can see, and I'm only using 6U of a 12U cabinet I bought myself so space isn't an issue while I'm only looking at one of them.