CCIE RS easier than CCNP?

its-the-fwits-the-fw Member Posts: 9 ■□□□□□□□□□
Starting to get worried but so far the blueprint for CCIE has been easier than CCNP.

Currently I'm working in order and am at EIGRP. I know there's a lot to go but looking at the blueprint as a whole there doesn't seem to be as many topics as in CCNP.

Layer 2 specifically, seems like if you understand STP (and its variations) you've got layer 2 down.

Maybe it's because during CCNP a lot of the information was new, but going deep for CCIE on technologies i'm now familiar with doesn't seem so bad.

Anyone else having this experience or am I in for a world of hurt?

Comments

  • theodoxatheodoxa Member Posts: 1,340 ■■■■□□□□□□
    its-the-fw wrote: »
    Layer 2 specifically, seems like if you understand STP (and its variations) you've got layer 2 down.

    Wait until you get to Layer 2 -- Compatibility/Interoperation between 802.1D-1998 STP, PVST, PVST+, Rapid-PVST+, and MST. I will probably have to go over that part again, because it is so convoluted.

    Also, number of topics doesn't a difficult exam make. The 642 Series ROUTE had a lot less topics (EIGRP, OSPF, BGP, Redistribution, and VPN) than SWITCH, but I felt it was more difficult. A lot of the material in my CCIE book is a rehash of CCNP (just as a lot of CCNP material was a rehash of CCNA), but there is also entirely new topics such as IS-IS, Multicast, QoS and the existing topics like EIGRP, OSPF, and BGP are covered in more depth.
    R&S: CCENT CCNA CCNP CCIE [ ]
    Security: CCNA [ ]
    Virtualization: VCA-DCV [ ]
  • networker050184networker050184 Mod Posts: 11,962 Mod
    its-the-fw wrote: »
    Maybe it's because during CCNP a lot of the information was new, but going deep for CCIE on technologies i'm now familiar with doesn't seem so bad.

    I think that's the key. You're no longer learning things from scratch for the most part at this point if you've come up the R&S track.
    An expert is a man who has made all the mistakes which can be made.
  • its-the-fwits-the-fw Member Posts: 9 ■□□□□□□□□□
    Guess maybe i went a little overkill on CCNP then. Feels like CCNP switch already covered STP and it's variations and how they inter-operate.
    Already got through the Layer 2 section of CCIE and it doesn't seem any expanded from CCNP.

    STP (and it's variations): This was well covered in CCNP.
    VTP, CDP, LACP: This is CCNA material
    dot1Q truks: Yet again CCNA
    IGMP: Ok this is new, but they are not expecting a whole lot out of you on it.
    WAN tech: This has also been covered since CCNA.

    Obviously you go deeper in these materials than previous levels, but for some of them (VTP, LACP...) how deep is there to go?


    I agree ROUTE was more difficult for me as well, but mostly because of the depth. Seems like the SWITCH test just went wide where the ROUTE went really deep.

    Ahh thank you that's what i overlooked. Get a lot of exposure to ISIS and QoS at work so that wasn't bad.
    Multicast was new and fun though. But for the purposes of the exam doesn't seem like there's a whole lot to it.
  • its-the-fwits-the-fw Member Posts: 9 ■□□□□□□□□□
    I think that's the key. You're no longer learning things from scratch for the most part at this point if you've come up the R&S track.

    Yeah i think that's the kicker.
    Wanted to know if other people had the same experience.
    For cisco exams i go the route of being very over prepared. And so far the CCIE has me very nervous, not because of the material, but the lack of depth i'm feeling.

    But if i look back at my understanding of say Routing now compared to when i first started with CCNA... ok yeah it's miles ahead.

    Just relative to CCNP it feels like a smaller jump.
  • AwesomeGarrettAwesomeGarrett Member Posts: 257
    Yes, what you're feeling is normal. However, OSPF will knock you back to reality and then BGP... well, it's BGP.
  • its-the-fwits-the-fw Member Posts: 9 ■□□□□□□□□□
    Yes, what you're feeling is normal. However, OSPF will knock you back to reality and then BGP... well, it's BGP.

    Thank you!
    Ok I was getting nervous, like if i'm using the wrong material or looking at the wrong requirements.

    Agreed OSPF was a culture shock for CCNP. BGP is going to be fun too.
  • Dieg0MDieg0M Member Posts: 861
    The first few topics will be a review/deep dive into technologies you have already seen in the CCNP. You will eventually get into more advanced topics like MPLS, multicast, QoS, advanced security features, etc. Just remember that the hardest part of the CCIE is not the individual technologies themselves but the complexity of adding them all together. The CCNP simlet's and questions focus on a technology at a time and the CCIE focuses on several layers together.

    Hope this helps.
    Follow my CCDE journey at www.routingnull0.com
  • d4nz1gd4nz1g Member Posts: 464
    Dieg0M wrote: »
    The first few topics will be a review/deep dive into technologies you have already seen in the CCNP. You will eventually get into more advanced topics like MPLS, multicast, QoS, advanced security features, etc. Just remember that the hardest part of the CCIE is not the individual technologies themselves but the complexity of adding them all together. The CCNP simlet's and questions focus on a technology at a time and the CCIE focuses on several layers together.

    Hope this helps.

    This. A random guy who had recently knocked the CCIE Written told me that it felt like ROUTE+SWITCH+TSHOOT all at once.
  • its-the-fwits-the-fw Member Posts: 9 ■□□□□□□□□□
    That sounds very accurate. I smashed all the CCNP exams into a 3 month period so maybe that's influencing me :D
  • d4nz1gd4nz1g Member Posts: 464
    3 months is such a short period for those exams.
    make sure you won't stop studying, because, otherwise, the knowledge will slowly fade from your brain, and you will end up holding a worthless certification.

    I've been through that right after achieving my ccnp, and it was a pain to study most of it again after 6-8 months without touching routing/ipv6.
  • its-the-fwits-the-fw Member Posts: 9 ■□□□□□□□□□
    Yeah it was a whirlwind for the CCNP.
    Fortunately i use most of what the CCNP covered at work daily, but i know what you mean.
    Had to do a VACL the other day and it sure was slow... a lot of context help on that one.

    The CCIE material seems like a great refresher for the CCNP though.
  • d4nz1gd4nz1g Member Posts: 464
    If you use most of the CCNP content at work, then you will be fine.

    It is hard to retain routing stuff when your job is basically configuring access and distribution switches haha
  • BardlebeeBardlebee Member Posts: 264 ■■■□□□□□□□
    Yes, what you're feeling is normal. However, OSPF will knock you back to reality and then BGP... well, it's BGP.

    This, right freaking here. If you're following my journey. I am in OSPF, almost "done" of it at least for the INE section for it. I never knew how much I didn't know about OSPF before. Holy. Crap.

    EDIT: To add to this, I don't believe the content in the CCIE is hard. Not in the sense that you couldn't figure it out with decent labbing. Its just that the level they want you to be at is "Moosh all this together and answer these questions, one on average within 10 minutes while we give you questions that are very broad"

    So the test is what is killer, not so much each technology separately. And yeah, too bad the CCIE isn't split up into SWITCH/ROUTE/TSHOOT. I think though everyone would have one at that point though.
  • AwesomeGarrettAwesomeGarrett Member Posts: 257
    You'll see when you get to BGP. And as Dieg0M mentioned, there still the other things after that.
  • BardlebeeBardlebee Member Posts: 264 ■■■□□□□□□□
    Why you have to go and make me so sad. ;_;

    Yeah it'll be interesting growth through those sections. Can't wait... but I have to considering how much there is. Even going 4 hours a day like I am non-stop it feels like forever.
  • AwesomeGarrettAwesomeGarrett Member Posts: 257
    Same here, going on and off for 14 months now. Studying minimum 20 hours a week when I do. Although, I had a new job, new baby, vacations, and normal life stuff I'm still going strong.

    If you're single or just with a significant other, I'd advise to keep working at it. And remember, it takes time and reading the Cisco Doc. :)

    Back to the cave, maybe I'll pop out after the written or just push to the finish line.
  • rogerp007rogerp007 Member Posts: 8 ■□□□□□□□□□
    Do you think an 8 hour hands on lab is going to be easier than a 120 minute multi choice exam?

    Good on you for going for CCIE and taken in isolation all the topics are easy to learn and you are doing it the right way, but at some point it all has to come together.

    I don't know your experience level and how far you have progressed but if you want to get a sense check book a full scale lab with INE or IPexpert.

    Set aside 8 hours and see how you do. You will very quickly find holes in your knowledge you didn't know were there.

    The CCIE is not just about learning the technology, the exam is a major time management exercise. You have to configure a lot of stuff in a reasonably short amount of time. And it all has to work just as Cisco want it.

    Keep going and dont' give up.

    But is CCIE RS easier than CCNP - no.

    Layer 2 forms a much smaller part of the exam now that everything is virtual and there are no physical switches so there is a lot more with routing, DMVPN, VRFs, MPLS, BGP, Multicast, Security, QoS etc etc.

    Speed is a big part of CCIE

    You also have a 2 hour troubleshooting section that can crush you if you are not fully prepared.

    Anyway I hope I have not put you off, but book a full scale lab and see how you do. Work on your weak points and keep going.

    If you want it you will get it, most people give up.

    Roger

    www.rogerperkin.co.uk
    CCIE #50038
  • theodoxatheodoxa Member Posts: 1,340 ■■■■□□□□□□
    its-the-fw wrote: »
    Guess maybe i went a little overkill on CCNP then. Feels like CCNP switch already covered STP and it's variations and how they inter-operate. Already got through the Layer 2 section of CCIE and it doesn't seem any expanded from CCNP.

    Other than STP Interoperation (which I didn't run into in my CCNP materials) and QinQ Tunneling, I agree that Layer 2 was mostly a rehash of CCNA and CCNP.
    R&S: CCENT CCNA CCNP CCIE [ ]
    Security: CCNA [ ]
    Virtualization: VCA-DCV [ ]
  • its-the-fwits-the-fw Member Posts: 9 ■□□□□□□□□□
    rogerp007 wrote: »
    Do you think an 8 hour hands on lab is going to be easier than a 120 minute multi choice exam?
    ...

    Thank you for the encouragement. It's a good reminder that the exam will have a lot of different technologies to balance.

    Yes I expect the Lab to be exponentially more difficult than the CCNP but so far the material doesn't seem bad.

    I think this comes from building up the CCIE to mythical proportions, and now that i'm faced with it I can see it's very doable. Just will take some time.

    And I have been lucky enough (or unlucky) to have a lot of experience troubleshooting multiple technologies in my career, so while I expect the CCIE to throw me curve balls, generally it should still be within my comfort zone.
  • gorebrushgorebrush Member Posts: 2,741
    Personally, I don't think the CCIE is "difficult" per se. As Roger highlighted above, the individual topics by themselves are easy enough. The big problem is the sheer amount of content you have to get through from beginning to finish, and the ultimate goal is being able to piece together all of those things inside one 8-hour lab.

    I am not joking but the lab is a mammoth task that can make or break you in the first two hours thanks to troubleshooting.

    However, don't let that put you off - the TS section of the lab isn't too bad - but again, the key is time management.

    Each of the tickets are modular so you can skip one and come back to it if you think you need to. I kept my eyes on the clock all throughout troubleshooting - I nailed 4/5 tickets fairly easily and realised I had to come back to two of them.

    I took a "5 minute" approach to the tickets - if I couldn't easily resolve it or see what the issue was within five minutes - move on. You can easily do an entire pass of all the tickets inside an hour and I had plenty of time left to burn on the one ticket that eluded me.

    The diagnostic section is even more fun. It's like taking a mini written exam, but the amount of information you are presented with - well - it's a lot. You need to be able to whittle down through that information quickly and confidently in order to get to the right answer.

    The final section, configuration, my only advice for this is to ensure that by the end of your preparations - you need to be fast, efficient, methodical. I spent about 4 weeks drilling all sorts of configuration templates to the point that I was able to rattle out DMVPN templates without needing the DocCD.

    You need to be able to find areas that you can copy and paste between devices, BGP config springs to mind - and you need to be able to work out the "order" of the lab - i.e. the most efficient way to approach all the tasks.

    This will all come in time.
  • its-the-fwits-the-fw Member Posts: 9 ■□□□□□□□□□
    gorebrush wrote: »
    Personally, I don't think the CCIE is "difficult" per se. As Roger highlighted above, the individual topics by themselves are easy enough. The big problem is the sheer amount of content you have to get through from beginning to finish, and the ultimate goal is being able to piece together all of those things inside one 8-hour lab.

    Thank you so much, that is all really excellent advise and gives me a much clearer picture of what I need to prepare for the CCIE exam.

    The tickets being modular, do they typically involve one technology or multiple? (if this gets too close to violating any rules please ignore).
    Just wondering if a ticket will have a layer 2 issue and a layer 3 issue all in one. If so then that can easily suck up a lot of time.

    Thanks again
  • BardlebeeBardlebee Member Posts: 264 ■■■□□□□□□□
    As a non-CCIE take my answer with a grain of salt...

    But I am taking a CCIE TSHOOT class this week and most questions they go through are multi-problem. Some single, some multi technology and some multi-layer.

    Depending on the complexity the points will be more in theory. But again I'll wait for someone who has actually taken the lab to answer hah.
  • gorebrushgorebrush Member Posts: 2,741
    Hmm - I believe I am more than OK to state that: -

    Tickets carry 2 or 3 or 4 points (IIRC)

    2 points generally mean there is one fault -

    the more points - the more problems. But 2 corrections is enough at a minimum.

    However - the other point is - you are allowed to fix things whichever way you want - provided you do NOT break the restrictions.
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