Ivy League schools exploring online learning

Judd

Interesting to see that new ideas and technology are making their ways to the traditional institutions. Perhaps you can be a Harvard grad from Wyoming that never stepped foot onto the Harvard campus someday.

http://encarta.msn.com/encnet/Departments/eLearning/?article=IvyLeagueOnline&GT1=7873

raross

This will never happen, not even at the undergraduate level. You miss so much from online courses it is ridiculous and particularly stupid unless there is no other choice. Some schools are willing to put their reputation on the line to make some serious money, but I don’t see the top schools doing it, since their main goal is quality of education and research.

TeKniques

raross wrote:

Some schools are willing to put their reputation on the line to make some serious money, but I don’t see the top schools doing it, since their main goal is quality of education and research.

I guess Yale admitting the Taliban student with less than a high school education is the exception.

jaeusm

This will never happen, not even at the undergraduate level. You miss so much from online courses it is ridiculous and particularly stupid unless there is no other choice.

I think this is a knee-jerk reaction. When I first heard of online classes, I immediately thought they would be easier or less-challenging. Having gone through one, I can tell you that I was wrong. The same material is covered online as in the classroom. The only difference is the medium.

One type of class that doesn't work as well online are labs. I've heard of some classes using simulators for things like embedded systems, but other classes, like electric circuits, I'm not sure how that is handled. Maybe those types of classes aren't available online.

Judd

I too have done both and can attest that the only difference is that the instructor gives the lecture instead of you reading yourself online. Assignments, tests, asking questions, all the same without voices or body language.

I think the big difference is self motivation, some are not disciplined enough to follow through with the online version. That's why many only offer online classes/degrees to those who already have an associates or at least 60 college credits.

Don't expect any hand holding or course advice as in traditional schools, online courses aren't designed for individuals unable to stay focused or who fail to think outside of the box a little.

Realize too that majors offered online only fit into certain criteria, you hopefully won't find many medical courses offered online. unless you're a military doctor

TheShadow

Are some of you not thinking about current technology? There is no reason not to see the instructor on your monitor in real time or for him or her not to see you maybe even with the remainder of your classmates. For a lecture, 20 rows up in a lecture hall or viewing on a monitor is about the same. If people are doing this now with something as simple as instant message programs and video games, why not a classroom.

Doctors are remotely diagnosing illnesses and assisting in medical procedures in real time now. In some parts of Alaska it is the only source for medical help. Microsoft and others have been pushing video conferencing for quite a while. As broadband expands along with IPV6 I think you will see lots of things change.

I would guess the Ivy League schools are just in the thinking phase knowing that what ever internet 2 becomes is going to be a sea change for many areas. It is that visionary stuff that 99.99 percent of the world misses, including I.

.

Judd

TheShadow wrote:

I would guess the Ivy League schools are just in the thinking phase knowing that what ever internet 2 becomes is going to be a sea change for many areas.

True, but it could be decades before the Internet2 pipe is available for students to use for academic purposes. That is for the usage of online courses and/or degrees.

Good thing Harvard is a member of the Internet2 consortium!

TheShadow

Decades seems a stretch. The internet as we know it and Al Gore invented it <sic> lol has only been around 15 years. Before that it was a military/uni thing. IPV6 takes off in full in what 2008 ? Things should pick up fast after that.

Judd

Maybe I've misunderstood the context of your comment, are you referring to the research and applications of I2 or the physical network used?

From the research I've done on I2 it doesn't seem that it will be allocated for public usage. The papers indicate that it will remain intended for academia and research purposes and very specific usage. If the public were to have full access to the network it would be counterproductive to its cause.

My interpretation is that they are developing technologies that will be used on the internet to increase overall performance. Hardware will have to support the performance increases and it will take some time for everyone to be on the same level to take advantage of it.

http://www.internet2.edu/about/faq.html

JDMurray

raross wrote:

You miss so much from online courses it is ridiculous and particularly stupid unless there is no other choice.

Have you ever taken a series of college-level classes from an accredited, distance learning school? It sounds like you don't have any significant personal experience with the situation that you are criticizing.

raross

Yes I have, we have gone through this before, and that is why I am not arguing with you. If you think online classes are great, good for you. The reasons they are ridiculous are obvious, and if you cannot figure it out then you honestly need to reconsider your current education.

eurotrash

raross wrote:

The reasons they are ridiculous are obvious, and if you cannot figure it out then you honestly need to reconsider your current education.

oooooooooh a fight!!

JDMurray

raross wrote:

The reasons they are ridiculous are obvious, and if you cannot figure it out then you honestly need to reconsider your current education.

I have not experienced any quality of online education that I would consider "ridiculous." However, I am very interested in your online education experiences that you consider ridiculous. Online education certainly isn't for everyone--but then again, neither are traditional brick-and-mortar schools.

12thlevelwarrior

I work at a top Business School that is routinely ranked in the top 10. They don't have exclusive online degrees, but they do offer degrees that are made up of about 70% of online classes. My general impression of the people in the distance mba classes compared to the daytime mba classes are that they are the same caliber but just alittle older. I would have to agree that you may take away more from a full-time daytime degree, but it isn't enough to discredit the online version.

Just thought of this, one point that supports the strength of the online/weekend warrior degree is that you are surrounded by people that have tons of work experience instead of being surrounded by a bunch of people that just got out of college and for the most part don't have real world experience except for a resume building internship or something

ajs1976

The more schools target non-traditional students, the more they are going to offer non-traditional classes.

For my associates degree, I had two online classes. One was a joke. I learned a lot, but not as much as I could of if the instructor was more involved. He basically just posted assignements and scheduled tests. The other class was a lot more work. There were more assignements and a discussion board, where we had to post on various topics for participation.

Some of the local universities are starting to offer distance learning class. One of the schools is offering courses that are 50/50, which I think is a good idea.

oldbarney

Judd wrote:

Interesting to see that new ideas and technology are making their ways to the traditional institutions. Perhaps you can be a Harvard grad from Wyoming that never stepped foot onto the Harvard campus someday.

http://encarta.msn.com/encnet/Departments/eLearning/?article=IvyLeagueOnline&GT1=7873

The Harvard Extension School offers an online graduate certificate in Applied Sciences - a computer degree.

http://www.extension.harvard.edu/cas/default.jsp

Consists of 8 courses and costs about $14,000. According to the web site, with the exception of one semester of residency, a masters degree is also possible using online distance learning.

Harvard Extension School is sort of an enigma. A recent New York Times story stated that some students denied admission to Harvard U are attending the extension school not only due to costs, but also because credits earned transfer directly to the university.

Online versus traditional: Of my 176 undergrad semester hours, roughly 80 percent were earned in a traditional classroom setting. The other 20 percent were distance and online. Online courses are just as difficult as traditional classes, and sometimes more difficult. Had one e-commerce course that required 10 written assignments - one was 8 pages in length - plus two proctored exams. The class average for exams was 75%.

JDMurray

oldbarney wrote:

plus two proctored exams.

How were the online exams proctored? Did you need to travel to an annex campus of the online university, or did they use a service like Vue or Prometric?

oldbarney

jdmurray wrote:

oldbarney wrote:

plus two proctored exams.

How were the online exams proctored? Did you need to travel to an annex campus of the online university, or did they use a service like Vue or Prometric?

In my case, it was sort of convenient. Main campus for the school is 60 miles from my residence. The test center stays open from 9 AM to 7 PM, Mo-Th and Friday mornings. This is a public college catering to both traditional and distance students, by the way.

For true distance students, primarily military, the base education center serves as the proctor. All others request pre-approval for a proctor, usually another college. I've heard of Vue/Prometric centers also used - for a fee - by students.

All exams are accessible through a web portal. A proctor logs in with a user name/password sent by the college after approval. Students read the instructions and begin. Exams are mostly timed, multiple choice tests containing 100 questions. Many courses require that exams be completed within a certain window.

supertechCETma

I think the key to this whole argument is accreditation. If the regional acceditation agency says its accreditted, that's all I need to know. They set the standards. The same regional agencies accredit online and brick and mortar.

Like any educational experience, you get out of it what you want.

JDMurray

supertechCETma wrote:

I think the key to this whole argument is accreditation. If the regional acceditation agency says its accreditted, that's all I need to know. They set the standards. The same regional agencies accredit online and brick and mortar.

This is very true for the school, but don't forget checking the accrediation of the major itself. For example, for Information Security, you want the major's department to meet some of the Committee on National Security Systems (CNSS) training and education standards (e.g., 4011, 4012, 4013, 4014, or 4015), and the school itself be a recognized National Center of Academic Excellence in Information Assurance Education (CAEIAE).

http://www.nsa.gov/ia/academia/cnsstesstandards.cfm

http://www.nsa.gov/ia/academia/caeiae.cfm