Starting LSAT Prep in 3 Weeks

the_Grinch

Been doing my Masters in Legal Studies and have decided to go for the JD (upon graduation). As of right now I have a 3.95 with five classes left to complete. Anyone else take the LSATs? It seems like now (and especially in the next few years) IT and the law are going to be hot topics, especially for those who can straddle both worlds. My experience in regulation and technology has definitely served me well thus far and I think it will continue to do so in law school.

dmoore44

Good luck! I'd appreciate it if you could update us periodically on your test prep studies and impressions after the exam.

the_Grinch

Not a problem, will do!

JoJoCal19

Hey Grinch, good luck on your studies. Question, what school are you going to for your JD? I wanted to go back to UF for a JD (still kind of do) when I finished my BSBA but ABA schools do not allow their 1L students to work like more than 15 or 20 hours a week. Thus law school was but a dream for me.

the_Grinch

I am in New Jersey so I am going to look towards Rutgers University or Temple University (in Philadelphia). I will be going part time and part time students are allowed to maintain a full time job while in school. Also, you are given four years to complete the JD instead of the normal three. But not every school offers a part time program so I would inquire with UF if they offer such an option.

You may want to look towards the Mitchell Hamline School of Law as they have an online program that would allow you to sit for the bar in most states. There are two reasons why I haven't looked at Mitchell Hamline. First, New Jersey is like it's own country and while it appears I could sit for the bar exam knowing this state they would deny me only after I graduated. Second, it requires (or at least appears to require) that you go there for two weeks every term and while I have more than enough vacation time I really don't want to zap four weeks a year (if you go in Summer) for school.

the_Grinch

Class starts on Monday! Class is every Monday and Wednesday, with one Saturday in October and every Saturday in November. LSAT exam is on December 3rd. I'll post after every class where it appears to be relevant to those interested.

DatabaseHead

the_Grinch wrote: »

Class starts on Monday! Class is every Monday and Wednesday, with one Saturday in October and every Saturday in November. LSAT exam is on December 3rd. I'll post after every class where it appears to be relevant to those interested.

Bring it home bad ass!

the_Grinch

Last night was my first class and I have to say I am glad I'm taking it. The instructor started by explaining how the test worked and what the various scores meant in terms of schools you could attend. The breakdown was as follows:

Max score is 180
170+ = A+++++ you could get into any of the top 14 law schools (think Harvard, Yale, Stanford)
160-169 = A+ you could get into any of the top 50 law schools (UCLA, George Washington, etc)
150-159 = C+ you can get into any ABA law school
140's = F if you have a really good essay and everything else is perfect you could might get in somewhere (but probably not)

With that out of the way we did our first diagnostic exam. The exam (if I remember correctly) consists of 6 parts and a writing section. One of the six parts is experimental thus does not count, but you aren't aware of which section that is. You will know the category it falls into (the categories are Reading Comprehension, Logical Reasoning, and Logic Games), but you won't know which of the two are graded. The writing section appears to not count for anything and thus it isn't covered in the class.

Each section is 35 minutes long and you only get a real break after the third section. I knew going in that Logic Games are my weakest area so I wasn't too surprised that I bombed that section. Though you take the exam in class you actually grade it yourself and enter your answer online. Of course I live about 40 minutes from where I am taking the class so I had wait a bit. Entered in my info and scored a 143, which I am happy with because I thought I did much worse and it is the first class.

What I see as of now is that time management is of the utmost important. You have 35 minutes to do between 25 to 27 questions each of which requires the bare minimum of reading one paragraph. The first two sections I ended up leaving two or three questions blank because I ran out of time. It's definitely worth just filling in anything because at least you stand a chance to get it right. In the next sections once the 5 minute warning was called I quickly marked the questions I hadn't answered and put C as an answer then proceeded to answer them.

Next two months are definitely going to be trying, but looking forward to the challenge.

apr911

I took the LSAT back in 2007. It was mostly on a lark and I didnt do any study or review for it and I still scored in the 68th percentile with a 156.

The LSAT scores on a bell-curve distribution though its not actually graded that way. A score of 155 vs a 160 could mean a difference of up to 9 answers whereas a score of 175 vs a 180 might be less than half that.

A score of a 150 is usually in the 50th percentile and a 165 is in the 90th percentile with a 173 being in the 99th percentile. A 178 or better is in the 99.9 percentile

So mapping to grades on a typical curve (where 50th percent get a C or better):

150 - C
157 - B
165 - A
173 - A+
178 - A++

the_Grinch

Nice! Appreciate the info!

Doing on a lark and getting that score is pretty awesome.

the_Grinch

Tonight was the second class and my head feels like mush. I was a little discouraged as I left, but as I was walking I realized it's a lot like studying for the CISSP. You just have to think like they want you to think and then you'll be just fine. The biggest issue is that I'll get the right answer, but not by the method that I should be using. So going to be a lot of late nights, but hopefully worth it.

the_Grinch

The prepping continues. I was definitely feeling bummed after Monday's class, but talked to some people currently in law school and was told they felt the same way as they started (also took the same course). I did better than expected on the homework and today found out that with my current score I could get into a law school not too far away. The big thing is that my numbers (if the LSAT score goes up a bit) should get me the money needed to go. Still aiming for a 168, but good to know there are options.

the_Grinch

Still chugging right along and am falling into a pattern now. When I first started the course my instructor said that doing the course would rewire your brain and I can definitely see my thought process changing. Now part of that is definitely from my Master's courses because learning the thought process of lawyers definitely changes how you look at problems. But the class is definitely pushing me to critically analyze arguments. I am slowly improving on questions and at least seeing my mistakes when I get things wrong.

As a tip for anyone looking to take the LSATS, I'd say make sure you ready very careful. Word usage is huge and so is knowing what they are asking you for.

the_Grinch

Test is six weeks away and I am starting to find my groove a bit. Improved my score by four points and last night I got a number of questions correct that a small percentage of those who took the test answered correctly. As it stands I should be able to get into one of the schools I'm interested in and with a full scholarship.

powerfool

I had grand plans for education looking to do an MBA and JD. I think there is probably still significant value to be had if I were to go that route, but it just depends on what I want to do in the future and how much cost there is (both in terms of time and money). I am ten years out from my undergrad and have completed an MS. At this point, I cannot see myself continue my level of effort for 20+ years... maybe just ten more. So, I don't think that with the time to complete either or both and then work, that I would get much return on it over that period of time.

However, I have changed a lot over the past two years with respect to my ideas on work. I went from thinking I would probably never retire at all, to thinking I want to "retire" as soon as possible and then maybe just work part-time and do more of the things I want to do each day. But keep in mind, by the time I completed my undergrad, I already had 10 years of experience, so, we'll see.

But, I have always enjoyed the nuances of law and the debating and supporting, substantiating, and disproving things. I took a law class in high school, one in my undergrad, and one in my graduate studies. However, from a practical standpoint, I also hate many hypocritical aspects of law and I have no interest in being an attorney (and that is not uncommon for graduate school students... it is about 50/50 whether students intend to be attorneys or not).

Although, I like this for you and look forward to continuing to read more on your progress.

the_Grinch

Boy do I understand everything you just said! I'm 31 so given the time needed to complete everything I'll be 36/37 by the time I am done. Thankfully, that is enough time to actually do something with all of the education, but you make a valid point in it is probably close to that line of not being worth it. In my case I can definitely see and would enjoy being an attorney. I work with them on an almost daily basis and love the nuisances.

In the actual law class I took (opposed to the legal studies courses I am taking) one of the speakers made a point that had a profound impact on me. She had stated that lawyers are trained to find flaws and that made them greatly suited for cyber related issues. Now she said that from a point of view of policy issues, but I looked at my career as a security person and saw that was akin to exactly what I do. Somedays I find a flaw and have to fix it, other days I exploit it, but regardless I am pointing them out. That cemented for me that the JD was the way to go because with both my security knowledge and the addition of the legal knowledge I would be a real force to be reckoned with. Also, I finally realized I can't always be the one behind the keyboard and if management was going to happen better to do something that will tax my mental muscles.

the_Grinch

18 days to go! Class is basically wrapping up at this point and thus far I have improved my score by 5 points. Most students improve around 10 points so I am getting close. Ultimately where I am right now puts me in the top 75% of the school where I believe I will be going. I am aiming for a 155 and will be putting in lots of time now. Not going to lie, juggling work, school and this has been very trying. I haven't been able to put in all the effort I would have liked, but I know I can start putting school aside (since I am near the end anyhow and have almost a 100 in both classes) a bit to concentrate on this. Pretty sure I can get a free ride with no contingencies with my score now and if I hit 155 it will probably be a definite.

JoJoCal19

Good luck! How are you able to get a free ride based on the LSAT score? Is that something specific to law school or that particular school? Curious how that works.

the_Grinch

Ah sorry I didn't reply sooner! Almost all schools will give you some money. But the biggest factors for any law school are your LSAT score and GPA. These are the two things utilized to rank the schools and thus they want to attract the best candidates they can, which means giving scholarships for academic performance. Every school publishes the averages of the student body as it relates to their LSATs and GPA. The school I am looking at has a 75th percentile at 150 for LSAT and 3.2 for GPA. I have a 3.41 undergrad GPA, and should be able to get the 150 so I figure I can get a free ride. Also, people post their stats on other forums and I know they have gotten anywhere between 80% and 100% tuition.

All that being said on Saturday I take the test! Going to use the next four days to further study and review, taking off on Friday as most people suggest not doing anything the night before. I'm aiming for between a 150 and 155 which I believe will be obtainable.

the_Grinch

Tomorrow is the big day! Months of studying and reviewing have come to an end (thank God)! Based on my research it would seem I need to be prepared to be there for up to 7 hours. According to the testing company I will get my results in a month (1/4/17). I'll post tomorrow after the exam with my final thoughts.

NetworkNewb

Best of luck!!

JoJoCal19

Good luck today! Let me know what you think of the exam.

the_Grinch

Ok so I have completed the exam (yay!!). Overall, it was what I expected it to be and I believe that I got around what I was getting on the practice exams I took. Have to wait a month for the results, so lots of time to sit and think about what I should have done etc.

Firstly, I had read a number of blogs that spoke about being at the testing site for 7 hours or more. Thankfully that was not the case for me. I arrived by 7:45 and by 8:15 they had us lined up checking ID's and admission tickets. Secondly, I lucked out in I had a pretty silent group. Some shuffling of chairs, but otherwise no annoying noise to get in the way. So we started at around 9:10 and I was out by 1:15 or so.

Now for advice if you are considering taking the LSAT:

- prepare for a year - I only started preparing in September and I know if I had started even three months before that I would have been in much better shape

- how do you prepare? I recommend you purchase the PowerScore books for the three sections (Logic Games, Logical Reasoning, Reading Comp). If you're like me you'll think you will be fine at reading comp (we're IT people we read and comprehend stuff all day), but think again. It's not the hardest section, but if isn't easy and I was someone who always did well on reading comp tests.

- do purchase a course - Before you take the exam take a class. I'd say buy the books, work on them for 9 months, and then use the last three months to take a class. Why take the class if you read the books? If for no other reason then to practice under testing conditions. I won't lie, the clock will kill you (it got me on every section) and it will be worse if you don't simulate the conditions. As for what to take, I took TestMasters and it helped, but looking back I would have gone with Blueprint. TestMaster's teaches things very quickly and teaches that there is a formula for every question type. I'd argue that with a firm base in some formulas you could answer any question without dealing with all of the stuff they throw at you. Plus juggling the hours (two four hour nights a week and a number of Saturdays) is a bit much. I am working full time, doing grad school part time, and doing testing prep...very rough.

Blueprint is completely online and runs at a monthly rate, thus you'll save some money. You won't get the testing conditions, but if you can work out with a friend to be the clock for you or are disciplined enough to do it on your own then you'll be alright. My buddy took Kaplan and he did extremely well (I believe their course is six weeks in length), but I can't comment on the quality of that course. I know about Blueprint from other reviews and the videos they posted online.

study a lot and often - if you are going to put the full year in, work two hours a night on LSAT prep. You probably will finish pretty quickly, but constant practice is definitely the trick to beating this thing.

All and all I hope I get to go to law school. I don't think I'll have an issue getting it, but I'm not willing to pay to go (have enough school loans) so if there isn't at least an offer of an 80% scholarship I won't be attending (and even then I'd have to really think about it). Obviously, if you have any questions feel free to ask!

Rylee1246

How'd your results go?

mart541

I took the lsat during college which was a while ago, but it tests how you think not what you know. I bought 1 study book, read it a few times, took the practice tests in the back, and did well enough to get into a top 20 school. Point being, if you're generally good at taking standardized tests it's not so bad. I find tech exams that test actual knowledge to be much harder, but everybody's brain works differently. I didn't even know that the lsat was something people went all in on until after I was in law school. Maybe I just got lucky...