Interviewing and seeing flat out lying on resume

AvgITGeek

First time interviewing people for a part time level 1 and possibly level 2 person for the team. The 4 candidates have all pretty much lied about their qualifications. They have all gone from "Completing MSCA" to "Well, I've started studying for the exams."
How do you handle the rest of the interview? I've had a problem with throwing technical questions at them because I will feel bad seeing someone flounder based on my first interview.

jelevated

The interview is pretty much over for me at that point, but they'd have a hard time getting an interview with me in the first place. Not having any certs is way better than trying to fudge it. I've seen people do something like this, admittedly the worst offenders:

Certifications:
MCSE Windows 98

In Progress Certifications:
CISSP
CCIE Written/Sec/Wireless/Collab/R&S/SP
GSE Expert
AWS Certified Solution Architect Professional

All to get pass the filters, and act shocked when we ask them questions that are well covered by the knowledge base. It drives me nuts, a huge slap in the face to all of us who agonized for hours while studying only to face the additional pressure cooker that is the exam room (although I'm sure many of you are quite comfortable there now).

yoba222

They were hoping to slide by and get interviewed by someone who doesn't care about certs. Plenty of managers out there like that. Unfortunately for them, they got you and you do care about certs. Maybe the next batch will a have a bit of integrity.

dontstop

I'll never lie about certifications or experience but I've been told that sometimes you might need to stretch the truth to get past HR drones.

HR: So do you have experience in VMware?
Me: I've used it before in a Lab/Personal environment, but not production
HR: So would you say you have VMware experience?
Me: I've done break fix work on VMware environment
HR: Soooo, do you have experience?
<add another 5 minutes of this>
Me: Yes, Yes I do.
HR: Excellent... moving right along

Then being fully honest in detail during the tech interview is most likely your best bet. Sometimes with HR too much detail/information may hurt you.

Panther

Even though it was shady, they're doing something right (figuring out the game/system), because they got an interview with the hiring manager.

About tech questions, I did have someone ask what menu items do you see on the screen, after pressing Ctrl + Alt + Del. I have several years of experience in IT Support, used Windows daily, but I don't remember things like that. I did know 3 of the 4 the menu items by memory. But still, to ask questions like that?! I floundered.

I'm able to discuss and expand on topics better, if I can talk about examples from past work.

Are you able to ask about their experience (applicable to whatever you're looking for)? Are they able to talk about that, or give examples from past work? (In this case, I assume they're probably going to flounder with this too, since they're already lying.)

Phalanx

I wouldn't trust anyone who is lying on their resume. Ever.

Danielm7

I interviewed someone for a high level security management position the other day who had a laundry list of technical skills on his resume. I tried to give him the benefit of the doubt as he had done a lot of management and it would be almost impossible for one person to actually have all the qualifications he claimed and maybe he was talking about people he managed. I gave him that possible out during the interview, nope, he took full credit for being a master of every skill that he listed and looked forward to a challenge. He said it so confidently he was almost angry about it. After asking him a few questions I can only assume that was a technique to make us back down from actually asking him questions.

We asked a few questions, everything we asked him about was 100% wrong. He made it past HR screens with flying colors, they couldn't understand why we voted no on moving forward.

scaredoftests

Ugh, lying is the worst.

volfkhat

jelevated wrote: »

I've seen people do something like this, admittedly the worst offenders:

Certifications:
MCSE Windows 98

In Progress Certifications:
CISSP
CCIE Written/Sec/Wireless/Collab/R&S/SP
GSE Expert
AWS Certified Solution Architect Professional

All to get pass the filters...

That's actually not a bad idea.
lol
But it may be better executed by putting the 'fake' certs at the bottom of the resume, in "WHITE" font, and in the smallest point font possible.
To an extent, i admire their dastardly methods :]

As for 'how' to handle the interview:
once you know they're full of Crap... END it; Right in the middle of their lame answers.
:]

networker050184

I'd say at least 99% of the people I interview have multiple lies on their resume. It's quite tiring trying to find someone good for a role.

NetworkNewb

Lol @ dontstop's post. I've definitely had interviews with HR that have gone the EXACT same way.

gespenstern

Never lie on a resume, it'll hurt you in a long run, esp. if you plan to advance your career. If you plan to stay at helpdesk level 1 for life then it may work.

If I'm the interviewer I split my interviews in two stages, the first is to grill people on their resume, the second is on our job description.

If they state something on their resume which turns out not to be true we skip the rest and say thank you & goodbye. Some interviews were interrupted and ended prematurely just 5 minutes in.

cyberguypr

Ahhh, interviewing. Makes my blood boil in seconds. Last year we talked to a "network engineer" wanting to move into security. Resume had CCNA, "experience" with all things routing such as BGP, OSPF, RIP, PIX, ASA and whatnot. When we ask what he's been doing at his current job for 4 years this is how it went:

Us: "So what's the extent of your network experience at $bigcompany?"
Him: "I am in charge of deploying routers and switches"
(big silence)
Us: "Can you expand on that?"
Him: "When there are new offices spinning up or something breaks in an existing location I replace it"
Us: "I see. How long does it usually take you to replace and configure a router"
Him: "Oh no, I just rack them. Someone else configures them"
(we do a facepalm)
Us: "So you've been doing this for 4 years? Ever want to step it up and configure the equipment"
Him: "Yeah"
(big silence)

I personally point out that what they are saying doesn't seem to match the resume and it doesn't line up with our expectations. I then thank they for their time (but thinking WHY do you waste MY time).

I agree with gespenstern. I do not put anything on my resume that I can't thoroughly back up with facts. It's pointless and good interviewers will make you miserable in seconds.

volfkhat

cyberguypr wrote: »

Us: "So what's the extent of your network experience at $bigcompany?"
Him: "I am in charge of deploying routers and switches"
(big silence)
Us: "Can you expand on that?"
Him: "When there are new offices spinning up or something breaks in an existing location I replace it"
Us: "I see. How long does it usually take you to replace and configure a router"
Him: "Oh no, I just rack them. Someone else configures them"
(we do a facepalm)

But but i have People Skills!!
What the hell is the matter with you people??

Blucodex

I don't see an issue with one or two "in progress" certs assuming you are actively working on them.

NetworkNewb

Blucodex wrote: »

I don't see an issue with one or two "in progress" certs assuming you are actively working on them.

So you "might" have "some" of the knowledge about a topic? And there is chance you might have the cert in a few months or does that mean in a year or 2 from now? Assuming they actually pass the test when they take it of course.

My 2 year old is "in progress" on getting accepted to college right?

IMO you have it or you don't. If you do put it on, you better have the test scheduled soon or that would annoy me seeing it on a resume personally.

bodokid

Lying = bad, I'm still waiting for the HR ppl to ask for an entry-level position, only entry-level experience, not 5 years work experience and 10's of certifications, but hey, don't lie to HR, we are the only one that can do that! Is nice to see only the HR side of the problem, but what about the HR lying about the job description?

Blucodex

NetworkNewb wrote: »

So you "might" have "some" of the knowledge about a topic? And there is chance you might have the cert in a few months or does that mean in a year or 2 from now? Assuming they actually pass the test when they take it of course.

My 2 year old is "in progress" on getting accepted to college right?

IMO you have it or you don't. If you do put it on, you better have the test scheduled soon or that would annoy me seeing it on a resume personally.

Well, when I say actively working on it I mean you are dedicating a substantial amount of your free time to studying and have a target date in mind for taking the exam.

When I was asked to apply for a Security Analyst position you bet I added CEH, CHFI, OSCP, and a MS from WGU on my list of in progress items. This shows potential employers you are passionate/motivated and not just there to collect a check.

But this is a list of items that are being actively worked on--not a "wishlist".

Fulcrum45

volfkhat wrote: »

But but i have People Skills!!
What the hell is the matter with you people??

LOL! That was the first thing that popped in my mind also.

PersianImmortal

Blucodex wrote: »

I don't see an issue with one or two "in progress" certs assuming you are actively working on them.

Agreed. I listed on my resume that I'm going for the CISSP soon. I think it shows employers what your immediate aims are (at least cert-wise). However, if a candidate has more than 1 or 2 certs listed as "In Progress", that might raise a few flags in my opinion...

dizzy_kitty

I leave certs in progress off my resume. I would rather just mention the certificate that is in progress during the interview with a scheduled date.

jamesleecoleman

I leave the certification in progress to the cover letter. I never put any future certification plans or expired certifications on my resume.

*Well I do for the future certifications but just to see what it looks like on my resume from time to time

kabooter

Exaggerating and fuzzing on a resume is expected to some extent and lets not forget, it is not a one way street. Employers do it all the time. HR is utterly hopeless often and hiring managers sometimes are ridiculous in their expectations.
However, having said that, I still think that resume should be reflective of what one has 99% and what one is working on 1% - clearly specified. In progress certifications should be 1 or two at the most and it is job of initial telephone call screener to do his/her due diligence to find out more from client.

Cisco Inferno

Phalanx wrote: »

I wouldn't trust anyone who is lying on their resume. Ever.

Exactly. You are selling yourself with that piece of paper.
I wouldn't ever wish to sell a dodgy product(version of myself) to anyone.

dave330i

Certs in progress usually means you don't have enough stuff to fill out a 1-2 page resume.

pramin

Everything brought up in this thread has been discussed ad nauseam regarding hiring and interviewing process.

At times the person being interviewed is the problem and what they bring to the table.

Others how HR makes the hiring process difficult.

Then sometimes even the hiring manager/group doesn't have it together.

Hiring people isn't an exact science and is very difficult. Sometimes it is like throwing darts in the dark.

Queue

Cert in progress only makes any sense if it's a multiple test cert.

As in, CCNP - 3 test cert.
If you completed 1 or 2 tests already, then it is in progress.

Cracking open a book here and there for a month is not an in progress cert.

stryder144

volfkhat wrote: »

But but i have People Skills!!
What the hell is the matter with you people??

Bwahahahahaha....

UncleB

pramin wrote: »

Hiring people isn't an exact science and is very difficult. Sometimes it is like throwing darts in the dark.

If you get some professional training on the recruitment process then it is laborious but it becomes rare to make a bad hire.

For example, get the job ad right - create a person specification, select a small list or really Essential skills and a list of desirable skills. Let HR post the ad, filter the resumes on whether they reach the Essential criteria and drop ALL the others.

Next get 2 colleagues together, spend 2 minutes max per CV from the ones that pass HR (typically 20-50) and if they look like they have the what it takes to spend more time on then separate them for further investigation. Any CVs that can't tell you everything you need to know in 2 mins and take more than 2 pages - bin them ruthlessly. These people clearly cannot communicate that they are a match for the Essential skills so you don't want them.

You may now have 10-20 CVs left - spend 5 minutes with your 2 colleagues and score them against all Essential and Desirable skills - at the end compare results and take the top 5. Call them for a phone interview and if they can't communicate clearly then drop them and take the next one down the list until you have 5 to interview - get them in sharpish for a face-to-face interview.

For a technical role get the candidate to take an online test and drop anyone who fails - back to the list and get the next people.

In the interview the CV is no longer relevant - ask questions on their experiences and go heavy on scenario questions using role play if needed (eg for helpdesk call simulation). Gague their suitability to fit into the team and reject anyone likely to cause conflict. Use the same scoring process and only compare results after the interview. The best score wins - easy.

Now we can prove our selection process is fair, thorough and auditable as all scoring records are kept along with the reasons for rejecting a candidate at any stage - HR & Legal departments will love you for this.

The big lesson to learn from all this is that your CV is absolutely critical to getting the job and should be tailored for every application, reflecting the person profile they are looking for.

EANx

Blucodex wrote: »

But this is a list of items that are being actively worked on--not a "wishlist".

Might as well add "Millionaire: In progress"

Basic85

I've been mostly honest during interviews. I've been lied to by employers a lot from what happen to previous employees, salary, position being already filled but just interviewing for a quota, etc.