The certification bias during interviews

Azt7

So I just noticed an interesting trend over the last couple of interviews / opportunities that came on the table.

The most recent occurrence was related to a cloud technologies SME position and while talking to the technical evaluator, he kept insisting that the job is not necessarily technical but has a lot of documentation / presentation / customer interactions. So I basically wouldn't be a good fit and being certified is irrelevant for the position.

The conversation basically turned into me having to explain what certifications are for and why I was certified on all those technologies. The guy kept harping on the issue so much that the recruiter, who was also on the call, had to jump in and move the conversation forward.

This is not the first time that somebody with no certifications keeps harping on an irrelevant point about certifications while it has nothing to do with the conversation itself.

Is anybody else coming across this bias for lack of a better word ?

Do you feel that people are feeling maybe insecure or threatened by certified people during recruitment processes ?

Tekn0logy

That sounds unfortunate, but possibly a good thing. What happens if you were hired and found out the bias six months out?

NetworkNewb

Sounds like the guy just might've thought you would get bored with position since it isn't a technical position. That you wouldn't actually like doing it. He might've thought you belong somewhere doing more than just documentation.

Danielm7

I had a few interviews with minor questions before but they weren't a big deal. One was years ago in a mostly Cisco shop and the guy interviewing me was like, oh a CCNA, I don't have one of those, mind if I quiz you?? His big 2 questions, "describe a TCP connection" and "can you tell me the differences between TCP and UDP", yeah, mind blowing.

Azt7

Tekn0logy wrote: »

That sounds unfortunate, but possibly a good thing. What happens if you were hired and found out the bias six months out?

That would have been terrible hahaha

Azt7

NetworkNewb wrote: »

Sounds like the guy just might've thought you would get bored with position since it isn't a technical position. That you wouldn't actually like doing it. He might've thought you belong somewhere doing more than just documentation.

That's what I thought initially. I actually appreciated him for clarifying exactly what the job was. It's actually more than documentation : RFPs, In-person customer presentations, tenders, Architectural designs ...

I guess you had to hear it to understand that he had an idea and was just sticking to it.

Anonymouse

Danielm7 wrote: »

I had a few interviews with minor questions before but they weren't a big deal. One was years ago in a mostly Cisco shop and the guy interviewing me was like, oh a CCNA, I don't have one of those, mind if I quiz you?? His big 2 questions, "describe a TCP connection" and "can you tell me the differences between TCP and UDP", yeah, mind blowing.

Sometimes I wonder if those kinds of questions are just to filter out BS when interviewees either lie or somehow passed the test without actually understanding the material.

PC509

I've known some managers that were pretty anti-certification. It's not that they gave them no value. They actually thought of them as a negative. Only book smart, they aren't real world, etc.. Not a place I'd want to work as it sounds like they aren't too invested in their employees increasing their skills and helping with educational goals.

Although, I can see how some get burned with some people that have used ****, etc.. The old "paper" certs. I rarely hear of them much anymore, but it used to be a problem and might still have a bad taste with some people.

dave330i

Azt7 wrote: »

The most recent occurrence was related to a cloud technologies SME position and while talking to the technical evaluator, he kept insisting that the job is not necessarily technical but has a lot of documentation / presentation / customer interactions. So I basically wouldn't be a good fit and being certified is irrelevant for the position.

Unless you're leaving something out, the position sounds like it requires plenty of certs and technical knowledge.

TechGromit

Azt7 wrote: »

Do you feel that people are feeling maybe insecure or threatened by certified people during recruitment processes ?

There will always be people who feel threatened by those that are certified or otherwise more qualified then they are. One job I applied for, the person that made the appointment on behalf of the interviewing manager told me the wrong day and time for the interview, I later found out he got the job, talk about a conflict of interest.

SaltyHashes

dave330i wrote: »

Unless you're leaving something out, the position sounds like it requires plenty of certs and technical knowledge.

Underrated comment. Made me chuckle out loud. Thank you

UnixGuy

Tekn0logy wrote: »

That sounds unfortunate, but possibly a good thing. What happens if you were hired and found out the bias six months out?

^^ This. I was hired by such a person once, and I only lasted 11 months in that job. He was a very narrow minded individual, difficult to deal with and very low on both skill & overall character

Azt7

dave330i wrote: »

Unless you're leaving something out, the position sounds like it requires plenty of certs and technical knowledge.

Exactly my point. This position is deeply technical in terms of having enough technical understanding to translate business requirements into highly available / secure design and proposals for prospective customers.

So when the guy keeps insisting that it's not technical, I was like how can you even do this job if you think that ? haha

It appears that more and more competent people, that I can vouch for, are facing this type of pettiness.

Just curious to see what everybody else is coming across.

Azt7

TechGromit wrote: »

There will always be people who feel threatened by those that are certified or otherwise more qualified then they are. One job I applied for, the person that made the appointment on behalf of the interviewing manager told me the wrong day and time for the interview, I later found out he got the job, talk about a conflict of interest.

It is as sad as it is hilarious

Basic85

Wow it's a sad and messed up world we live in but look on the bright side, he showed his true colors during the interview. I've actually brought this topic up a couple years back on here so yeah it does happen. Some companies/managers have some bias against you for having certifications/education and they don't. So what do they do to make themselves feel better? They put you down. I've had a manager tell me that my certification "It's just a line on a piece of paper!" In the most demeaning and rude tone. I was younger then and put up with it during the interview and never heard from him again and I was glad. Now a days I don't put up with that, if something like that were to happen again then I would call him/her out on there attitude than end the interview.

TechGuru80

Azt7 wrote: »

1. The most recent occurrence was related to a cloud technologies SME position and while talking to the technical evaluator, he kept insisting that the job is not necessarily technical but has a lot of documentation / presentation / customer interactions. So I basically wouldn't be a good fit and being certified is irrelevant for the position.

2. The conversation basically turned into me having to explain what certifications are for and why I was certified on all those technologies. The guy kept harping on the issue so much that the recruiter, who was also on the call, had to jump in and move the conversation forward.

3. This is not the first time that somebody with no certifications keeps harping on an irrelevant point about certifications while it has nothing to do with the conversation itself.

1. People value certifications differently, but also it could be they want some specific skill sets such as extensive customer interaction experience...maybe that of a consultant or an MSSP...both of which usually have a lot of those skills. It's possible the interviewer didn't want you to expect some uber technical position and then be disappointed.

2. NEVER turn an interview into a confrontation. If it doesn't seem like a good fit, just keep moving through or end the interview. Nothing good will come out of confrontations in an interview.

3. Again it all comes down to what the company or hiring manager are looking for to fill the position. When it comes to true SME positions, certifications are not always what is valued. Are the customer interactions internal or external? I would find it hard to believe they wouldn't value certifications if it's external interactions, but sometimes customers are weird and are very specific with what they expect.

Azt7

TechGuru80 wrote: »

1. People value certifications differently, but also it could be they want some specific skill sets such as extensive customer interaction experience...maybe that of a consultant or an MSSP...both of which usually have a lot of those skills. It's possible the interviewer didn't want you to expect some uber technical position and then be disappointed.

2. NEVER turn an interview into a confrontation. If it doesn't seem like a good fit, just keep moving through or end the interview. Nothing good will come out of confrontations in an interview.

3. Again it all comes down to what the company or hiring manager are looking for to fill the position. When it comes to true SME positions, certifications are not always what is valued. Are the customer interactions internal or external? I would find it hard to believe they wouldn't value certifications if it's external interactions, but sometimes customers are weird and are very specific with what they expect.

I agree with all those points, I definitely could have dealt with this better.