Minimum years at a job until redflag is gone.

DatabaseHeadDatabaseHead Teradata Assc 16, Querying Microsoft SQL Server 2012/2014, CSMMember Posts: 2,646 ■■■■■■■■■□
edited February 23 in IT Jobs / Degrees
I'm in the states so it's probably different than a lot of other countries....   With that said it used to be 3 years....  However per Indeed, LinkedIn, and a few other job services they all seem to think 2.  Some HR VP from one of these fortune 500 companies said anything over 2 is clear....  

In your opinion has it moved back to 2 now in regards to mainstream HR?  

I remember a few years ago there was an article posted in regards to the top tech companies (Microsoft, Facebook, Google, Amazon, Etc) And I believe out of the 10 companies only Facebook median time at a job was over 1 year at 1.1 years....   All the rest were under that.  Thought that was interesting.....  

I'm getting older and have lost touch with the market.  Has it gone from 3 to 2?  I remember YEARS ago it was 5.  

Comments

  • scaredoftestsscaredoftests Security +, ITIL Foundation, MPT, EPO, ACAS, HTL behind youMod Posts: 2,779 Mod
    for duration of a job you mean? I think 2 years.
    Never let your fear decide your fate....
  • SteveLavoieSteveLavoie Member Posts: 961 ■■■■■■■■□□
    If you have a streak of staying only 1-2 years at different place,  I would expect that you will continue to do that, then I will make my decision based on that. In my case, I prefer to pass and focus on people that will commit to the company (and I am working hard to keep them happy, it need to be a win-win situation). Less than 2 years, better offer a contract position.  I dont have the statistics, but median stay in my company is in the 8 to 10 years.  
  • JDMurrayJDMurray MSIT InfoSec, CISSP, SSCP, GSEC, EnCE, C|EH, CySA+, PenTest+, CASP+, Security+ Surf City, USAAdmin Posts: 12,176 Admin
    I think a "red flag" would only be thrown if someone's resume shows a pattern of job-hopping and not by having only one or two short-time positions. The younger (Millennial) workforce seems to commonly change jobs frequently and well under two years between gigs. This behavior has caused employers to readjust their perspective of how long they want candidates to have stayed in their prior positions.

  • thomas_thomas_ CompTIA N+/S+/L+ CCNA R&S CCNP R&S/Enterprise/Collab Member Posts: 983 ■■■■■■■□□□
    I think 1 year is enough.  Although I can see how it might be beneficial in senior positions to have longer stints.  

    I think career boards recommend getting a new job every two years to ensure your wages don’t stagnate.  However, if you’re at a company that has substantial upward mobility and they compensate you adequately for internal position changes, then I think it makes sense to stay with the same company.

    Also, it makes sense when you are early in your career to job hop more to keep your wages up with your skill ability.  Once you reach a senior level and you are making the big bucks, then it may make sense to stick around longer especially if you can’t find other positions that will pay you enough to justify changing jobs.

  • DatabaseHeadDatabaseHead Teradata Assc 16, Querying Microsoft SQL Server 2012/2014, CSM Member Posts: 2,646 ■■■■■■■■■□
    edited February 24
    JDMurray said:
    I think a "red flag" would only be thrown if someone's resume shows a pattern of job-hopping and not by having only one or two short-time positions. The younger (Millennial) workforce seems to commonly change jobs frequently and well under two years between gigs. This behavior has caused employers to readjust their perspective of how long they want candidates to have stayed in their prior positions.

    Interesting take.  Would the job-hopping piece get weighted less and less as years go by?  Example:   If your current history has 6 months, 6 months, and then 3 years, is that viewed differently if your job history is 3 years, 6 months, and 6 months.  In reality, they are the same average duration, but one is more recent in regards to long-term duration.  

    For instance, @SteveLavoie mentioned 1 - 2 years would be a red flag.  What if someone had 1 - 2 for 3 jobs in a row but their latest position was 5 years.  How would the previous 1 - 2 reflect since the individual is 5 years current. 

    How are contracts fit in here?  Are they viewed differently?   

    I thought I read the most recent job history (current position) weights their decision the most.  Like 90% according to some HR guru's.  
  • JDMurrayJDMurray MSIT InfoSec, CISSP, SSCP, GSEC, EnCE, C|EH, CySA+, PenTest+, CASP+, Security+ Surf City, USAAdmin Posts: 12,176 Admin
    edited February 24
    How employment duration on a resume is interpreted depends on each individual HR department and hiring manager. (There is no universal standard that all employers follow.) Also, there will always be some companies that insist on only interviewing candidates with long duration of employment history. These companies might see this as an indication of a candidate committed to long-term loyalty to the company, or the company has problems with high turnover because it's not a great place to work.
    I would suggest that you, like the rest of us, are not going to get most of the jobs for which we apply, so you should just apply to as many job openings as possible and not worry about second-guessing how some hiring manager will interpret your (truthful) employment history.
  • balancebalance Member Posts: 217 ■■■■□□□□□□
    This is a great topic. 

    I just reviewed my CV and I tend to stay in a position 1.5 years at max.  All of my positions outside of the Army were contract  except one direct hire position.   I ended up leaving that direct hire position for a marriage proposal which didn't go though. 

    I was dinged recently during my job search about not staying long enough in each position.  However, I was able to speak to why I moved on from each position.  I had to explain to a perspective employer why I left a full time perm position after 1 year . Non performance related and in fact I received a few performance bonus which was nice.  The reasoning however good it was for me  did not matter to the perspective employer. I think things like Marriage , Divorce, Deaths or family illnesses are great reasons to jump if you have to. Luckily for me two of the positions were in Hawaii and the Cost of Living is / was too high to deal with. Most people understand wanting to leave the island. 

    Now contracting in the middle east  I will jump again in a few few months due to a less than favorable pay modification across the board (around maybe 25K decrease total package). I think jumping could be understandable that when a new company comes in and chops your pay.

    I never went looking for new positions (until the large pay cut recently) but it does appear that I always ended up getting contacted by someone with an interesting position around the 1.5 year mark.

    God willing I will not have to jump again for the next five years.... assuming this new position was marketed correctly. 
  • DatabaseHeadDatabaseHead Teradata Assc 16, Querying Microsoft SQL Server 2012/2014, CSM Member Posts: 2,646 ■■■■■■■■■□
    edited February 25
    balance said:
    This is a great topic. 

    I just reviewed my CV and I tend to stay in a position 1.5 years at max.  All of my positions outside of the Army were contract  except one direct hire position.   I ended up leaving that direct hire position for a marriage proposal which didn't go though. 

    I was dinged recently during my job search about not staying long enough in each position.  However, I was able to speak to why I moved on from each position.  I had to explain to a perspective employer why I left a full time perm position after 1 year . Non performance related and in fact I received a few performance bonus which was nice.  The reasoning however good it was for me  did not matter to the perspective employer. I think things like Marriage , Divorce, Deaths or family illnesses are great reasons to jump if you have to. Luckily for me two of the positions were in Hawaii and the Cost of Living is / was too high to deal with. Most people understand wanting to leave the island. 

    Now contracting in the middle east  I will jump again in a few few months due to a less than favorable pay modification across the board (around maybe 25K decrease total package). I think jumping could be understandable that when a new company comes in and chops your pay.

    I never went looking for new positions (until the large pay cut recently) but it does appear that I always ended up getting contacted by someone with an interesting position around the 1.5 year mark.

    God willing I will not have to jump again for the next five years.... assuming this new position was marketed correctly. 
    I've left an FTE position after 3 months (big-time bait and switch, to the point of ridiculous).  Thankfully I was able to get a couple of 6-month contracts and then roll into an FTE position which I have been in for exactly 1 year.  I am hoping to stay for another year and then get promoted internally, we shall see....   My preferred length of stay (In a company not a role) is between 3 - 5.    
  • Moon ChildMoon Child Member Posts: 183 ■■■□□□□□□□
    edited March 21
    I think it really depends on the company and in the line of work your in. In IT job hopping seems frequent, In both my current job and my past jobs in IT. People only stay a few months to 2 years or a little more usually before moving on. Actually at the current company I am at even in non-IT jobs people are leaving the company for a different one after a few months, 1 year, or 2 years. Job hopping is more common these days. People get hired/fired/quit a lot more these days, It is a different culture then what my parents and grandparents grew up in. In the more cutthroat workforce I think people have learned to be willing to job hop more and even hop between professions simply as a way to survive. Like for example I have about 5 years now total in IT: 1 year doing PHP, 2 years as a laptop technician, and these past 2 years as a helpdesk technician. I also though have experience in the Education field, Over the Road Truck Driving (CDL), Security work,  Healthcare, and odd jobs. IT jobs are hard to come by and there were years would go by and no bites and so I took other jobs instead. I am not sure when I leave this Helpdesk Job if my next job will be for example Truck Driving, Teaching, or another Job in IT, it is whatever falls in my lap :)
    ... the world seems full of good men--even if there are monsters in it. - Bram Stoker, Dracula
  • UnixGuyUnixGuy Are we having fun yet? Mod Posts: 4,267 Mod
    Really good topic and one I'm personally struggling with.


    Geographic differences aside, my CV now has 1 yrs , 1.5 yrs. 1.8 yrs, 1 yrs stints.

    I did jump UP, so it looks like career progression. Yes it did work against me, I get asked about it, I explain that new opportunities came up, I move up or there's simply a restructure.

    The pros:
    - Compared to my colleagues who were with me say 5 years ago, my career took off and I'm on more senior roles now.

    - Exposure, I know a lot about so many topics and it made a better professional.


    The cons:
    - I'm sure I get rejected from jobs because of this
    - only one of my colleagues who remained in one company for 5+ yrs managed to progress his career. The majority stay exactly where they are.




    I'd like to stay put but most companies suck. My last job was sooo good, but the pay was bad. I got offered literally DOUBLE my salary so I took it. This current job pays good but then again there are issues. There's always issues though so I'm going to try and tolerate it.

    It's all a game, specially at the management level (that's where I'm at now). I see so many people who are in positions they don't deserve. A lot pf people just blow their CV up and talk themselves up and it's all smoke and mirror. You will never be able to please all the hiring managers all the time every where. I'm 100% certain I got rejected from jobs simply due to my last name, ethnicity, age, gender, skin colour, etc. Humans are flawed so do your best but know that you wont please everyone.



    For the record, I get approached on a weekly basis by recruiters & personal contacts for new jobs, so I'm getting opportunities and the job market (for cyber) is good.
    Certs: GPEN, GCFA, CISM, CRISC, RHCE
    In Progress: MBA
  • DatabaseHeadDatabaseHead Teradata Assc 16, Querying Microsoft SQL Server 2012/2014, CSM Member Posts: 2,646 ■■■■■■■■■□
    @Moon Child

    Really good information.  Now that I am older (relatively speaking in IT) I try to keep some commonalities with my roles to keep building that experience and keeping myself out there as a senior.  For instance, I am very heavily data-focused and experienced.  I find this helps me keep jobs and get jobs due to my programming/data skills.   With that said....   It comes with a cost.  I find myself sometimes landing in financial analyst positions, other business-centric positions outside the IT space.  I find myself only last 1 - 2 years in these positions and as previously stated one time only 3 months due to a heavy bait and switch.  

    @UnixGuy

    Your resume sounds like mine a little, I have some shorter stints and longer ones.   My current role is 1.2 years and to be honest, I can't see myself staying here longer than 3 years.....  The pay is too low but the job is pretty good, it's not crazy busy but has its moments.  I feel like I am so overqualified that job security is really strong.  And with my short-term contracts and 3-month bait and switch, I really need a 3-year block on my resume. I subscribe to the Jeff Bezos regret mitigation framework.  I am forced to 3 years due to this.  

    With that said, I am working on developing my Python skills along with maintaining my SQL, Database etc.. skills (in my current role).  There is always of course the possibility of upward mobility.  This organization does believe in that, which is really good for myself, I think.  lol

  • Fulcrum45Fulcrum45 Member Posts: 619 ■■■■■□□□□□
    I would have thought a year was the bare minimum - but maybe that's just me. The longest I've held an IT role was for 4 years. Having worked a few overseas contracts tends to make me look like a job hopper on my CV. For that reason I try to make it clear that these were contracts located in generally inhospitable locations in hopes that I don't get dinged for it. Thankfully I haven't yet. 
  • beadsbeads Senior Member Member Posts: 1,520 ■■■■■■■■■□
    For very senior roles, doesn't appear to affect your prospects much other than some people will challenge you a bit. Career consultants and contractors often have shorter, more intense schedules. Particularly, if your in a fast moving field where outdated skills sets are killer or you outgrow the role in general. A year of Cassandra security was interesting at first then I stopped learning and had to move on. Preferably up and out.
  • DatabaseHeadDatabaseHead Teradata Assc 16, Querying Microsoft SQL Server 2012/2014, CSM Member Posts: 2,646 ■■■■■■■■■□
    beads said:
    For very senior roles, doesn't appear to affect your prospects much other than some people will challenge you a bit. Career consultants and contractors often have shorter, more intense schedules. Particularly, if your in a fast moving field where outdated skills sets are killer or you outgrow the role in general. A year of Cassandra security was interesting at first then I stopped learning and had to move on. Preferably up and out.
    Cassandra as in the NoSQL database?
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