Frame Relay Hub & spoke subinterface ??

monkey_ninja3

Hewwo, I am ruddy fuwstwated with this - its got me talking chinese 'cause its like a foreign language!

I am using the sim notes from http://www.techexams.net/techlabs/ccna/lab_fr.shtml

I am trying to set up a basic frame relay, on my sim (packet tracer v3.2) and I noticed they only go up to a maximum iof 2 serial interfaces on each one.

Ive read the cisco books thoroughly, so I know thetheory, but its applying it to the sim thats the problem.

As I dont have 3 serial interfaces, cant I set up a subinterface on the frame relay router (acting like a switch) .. to be connected to the DTE routers.

If you can assist in this, so I can get 1 working frame-relay on my sim .. then I can try setting up another 1's from scratch, from my memory with different scenarios.

NinjaMonkey : oops:

Paul Boz

Of course you can subinterface serial connections! That's how you do hub/spoke frame relay

Step 1 - Set the encapsulation type to frame relay on your serial interface. Do this with the following command:

LOLROUTERS(config)#int s0
LOLROUTERS(config-if)#encapsulation frame-relay
LOLROUTERS(config-if)#no shutdown
LOLROUTERS(config-if)

Then you want to create a subinterface for each spoke in your topology. Do this by creating the subinterface and assigning the type of connection, then specify the frame relay DLCI information and the IP address and subnet info for the connection.

LOLROUTERS(config)#int s0/0.1 point-to-point
LOLROUTERS(config-subif)#frame-relay interface-dlci 102
LOLROUTERS(config-subif)#ip address 192.168.10.2 255.255.255.252

For your spokes, just set the encapsulation on the serial interfaces to frame-relay and set the DLCI and IP addresses, do a no shut, and you should be in business.

Also notice that I used a /30 address for the point to point link. This is to minimize wasting valuable address space, and is a practical knowledge type of question that I can almost guarantee you'll see on some form of Cisco test.

Sorry if this is vague, I'm on the tail end of a 12 hour shift (1 to go, and 6am can't come sooner!). Let me know if I can help further

EdTheLad

monkey_ninja3 wrote:

Hewwo, I am ruddy fuwstwated with this - its got me talking chinese 'cause its like a foreign language!

I am using the sim notes from http://www.techexams.net/techlabs/ccna/lab_fr.shtml

I am trying to set up a basic frame relay, on my sim (packet tracer v3.2) and I noticed they only go up to a maximum iof 2 serial interfaces on each one.

Ive read the cisco books thoroughly, so I know thetheory, but its applying it to the sim thats the problem.

As I dont have 3 serial interfaces, cant I set up a subinterface on the frame relay router (acting like a switch) .. to be connected to the DTE routers.

If you can assist in this, so I can get 1 working frame-relay on my sim .. then I can try setting up another 1's from scratch, from my memory with different scenarios.

NinjaMonkey : oops:

What your asking doesn't make sense, your FR switch has 2 physical interfaces, creating subinterfaces on the FR switch isn't going to change anything.The FR switch will just map a dlci on one port to a dlci on another port.If you were using subinterfaces the same thing is happening and the physical port will still send out the same dlci info.
Why dont you just use the 2 ports you have, so have routerA---FRswitch---routerB , it doesnt matter is you are missing one stub, if you can configure one stub you can config 100 as its the same thing again and again.
Paul, i think you got the wrong end of the stick, also hub and spoke frame-relay can use physical interfaces, subinterfaces or a mixture of both.

monkey_ninja3

hey Paul Boz, thanks a lot for your help!!
It's clarified some fundamentals for me .. im going to spend all day tommorow doing it, so i'm sure i will unfortunately need to ask another question, as I have my exam this Friday and i'm starting to think I better get baptised quick!

Frame-relay is right at the end of ccna4 .. so it is one of the harder parts to get.

Ed, How doesnt it make sense ? if you look at the link I posted you'll notice there are 4 routers. 3 connections, only 2 physical serial interfaces available on my sim, so I needed to know about subinterfaces inevitably, even if it was just for 1 ..

http://www.techexams.net/techlabs/ccna/lab_fr.shtml

If ive misunderstood you, please let me know man - and I hope youre right once ive configured it, I will be able to do it again with ease.

But what would be more appropiate , to utilize all the physical interfaces initally and then make subinterfaces if nessesary, or just make subinterfaces on 1 physical one, even if you have a spare physical interface?

NinjaMonkey

EdTheLad

In the link you posted there are 4 routers, one of these routers is not acting as a router it is a FR switch.The FR switch does not use ip, it's interfaces do not have ip addresses, so creating subinterfaces on the FR switch will achieve nothing.
If you want to create subinterfaces on the spoke routers, go for it, but your original question was regarding the FR switch.Anyway once to start playing around with the config you will understand what i mean.

monkey_ninja3

ok I'll just stick to the 1 branch first ... then when ive done that i'll try the two branches on both serial interfaces..

But what happens if I need 3 branches, on the frame relay router that only has 2 physicial serial interfaces?

NinjaMonkey

EdTheLad

monkey_ninja3 wrote:

But what happens if I need 3 branches, on the frame relay router that only has 2 physicial serial interfaces?

NinjaMonkey

If you need 3 branches, you download dynamips and forget about silly simulators.

Paul Boz

Ed that's not true at all. There's no need to get into dynamips for a CCNA study. You can simulate frame relay hub and spoke no problem with most decent sims.

Monkey Ninja, are you sure you mean to be saying "frame relay switch" and not substituting "Frame relay switch" for router?

Ideally, your simulated lab will look like this: One router at the top, with 3 other routers connected to it via frame relay. You can then subinterface them exactly like I told you

markzab

Paul's right Ninja. I think you might just have your terminology mixed up. You could have as many branches conected as you had routers by the use of multiple subinterfaces on your serial interface.

markzab

By the way, every time I see your name Ninja, I get reminded of this image on the internet...

mikej412

monkey_ninja3 wrote:

I am trying to set up a basic frame relay, on my sim (packet tracer v3.2)

You're trying to configure a packet tracer 3.2 router to act as a frame relay switch?

Packet Tracer?



In packet tracer 4.0 you can define a "cloud" that will work with modem or serial connections.... and I think you can configure the "cloud" with DLCIs and LMI type.... and then connect your 1 or 100 (or whatever the PT device limit is) spoke routers to your hub router.

Dynamips/Dynagen is another option.... I think one of the sample Dynagen lab configurations is a Frame Relay scenario.

You could add a 4th router to the dynagen net file with 4 serial ports and configure it to be a frame relay switch rather than rely on the "cloud" configuration.

Packet Tracer is more limited than even Boson NetSim.

tech-airman

monkey_ninja3 wrote:

Hewwo, I am ruddy fuwstwated with this - its got me talking chinese 'cause its like a foreign language!

I am using the sim notes from http://www.techexams.net/techlabs/ccna/lab_fr.shtml

I am trying to set up a basic frame relay, on my sim (packet tracer v3.2) and I noticed they only go up to a maximum iof 2 serial interfaces on each one.

Ive read the cisco books thoroughly, so I know thetheory, but its applying it to the sim thats the problem.

As I dont have 3 serial interfaces, cant I set up a subinterface on the frame relay router (acting like a switch) .. to be connected to the DTE routers.

If you can assist in this, so I can get 1 working frame-relay on my sim .. then I can try setting up another 1's from scratch, from my memory with different scenarios.

NinjaMonkey : oops:

monkey_ninja3,

To "setup basic frame relay", you're going to need another router acting as a frame relay switch.

sculler

I think the part that is missing here is the nature of Frame Relay. You should think of Frame relay as a cloud. Each office has a router and the serial port connects to the CSU/DSU that connects to the Frame Relay cloud.

If your company has 10 offices, each will have one physical connection to the cloud.

You can then set up several virutal connections for the office using subinterfaces on the serial interface. You can also set up RIP and OSPF routing. In the real world you would probably set up multiple physical connections to provide redundancy. In many cases you would you different vendors so a failure on one provider will not crash your network. You can also balance to the load to provide efficency.

When I took the CCNA exam, the simulations seemed to stick to single interfaces. The key items where interface set up, routing and trouble shooting. So you would have three offices connected by Point to Point connections. I believe that you will find that Frame relay is stressed more in the higher level exams.

I would recommend that you make sure you understand Frame relay well enough to answer the multiple choice question and make sure you know how to set up a single interface name, IP, netmask, routing (RIP and OSPF), telnet to another router and configure it.

Sculler

monkey_ninja3

Thanks for the help yew wuddy wyde eyes guys. For a while I got more confused than before I asked the question ..

Well packet tracer 3.4 doesnt even allow any other encapsulation apart from the default hdlc

I downloaded packetracer 4.1 which does allow frame-relay encapsulation..
the 'WAN' Cloud was available as you mentioned, but when it came to step 4 of the tutorial, of applying the Data link Control Interface (DLCI) the sim doesnt let you script it in, you have to use this really homo GUI on it.. which I didnt get.

You had to select the serials, add teh cldi's then use the mappting option on it, but I didnt get it working.

you can get the sim from www.isohunt.com if you wanna try it out yourself and see if you get more success.

Well i'm sure I can set up 1 branch, if I had real requipment, and I know the commands for troubleshooting, so I guess that's all I need for the exam.

Fortunately I found out my exam isnt 'till Monday - So an extra 3 days to cram in the revision.

Im gonna move on from frame-relay, thanks again for your help .. I will check out this forum to see if anyone else has maanged to master it on the shitty sim.

NinjaMonkey ..

Paul Boz

It sounds to me like your sim is actually being counter productive to your studies. I would perhaps either invest in buying the Boson Netsim for CCNA (it's significantly cheaper than buying a real lab) or renting some rack time.

monkey_ninja3

True, I might just do that, but my piece of junk is 400mhz (enough for porno, downloading, pllayin music/videos and rippin) ... and connected to my tv, so I gotta squint to read stuff. I'd probably save up for some parts to upgrade it.

I needed to learn about subinterfaces anyway so split horizon on a packet switched frame relay wouldnt screw up -- so I still got somethin' from it.

You know when youre learning all this stuff, it's suppose to just one day, all click so it's all connected and you can paint a picture, but i'm still waiting for that. day

Ive pretty much learnt everything in past 2 weeks, ive had no life revising 10 hours a day, I dont wany anything to do with cisco for a while after exam. If I fail, i'll re-take it at christmas, with all the proper sims and stuff.

NinjaMonkey

markzab

monkey_ninja3 wrote:

Ive pretty much learnt everything in past 2 weeks, ive had no life revising 10 hours a day, I dont wany anything to do with cisco for a while after exam. If I fail, i'll re-take it at christmas, with all the proper sims and stuff.

If you don't LOVE what your doing now then might as well not go on.

Also, god forbid you do fail...if you have nothing to do with Cisco afterwards, and then restart around Christmas, I can almost guarantee you'll have forgotten most of what you'd learned already.

mikej412

monkey_ninja3 wrote:

I downloaded packetracer 4.1 which does allow frame-relay encapsulation..

The 4.0 "shipped" with labs for the CCNA Academy Semesters... if you have the labs, check out the CCNA4 subdirectory and see if you have a pre-made topology/labs for frame relay.

Paul Boz

Yeah man, pace yourself. If you feel that you're getting burned out from studying ease back a little bit. I work full time and go to LSU full time as well. Between working, studying for my degree, and trying to live life like any other college student, I study Cisco stuff for several hours a day. When I took the INTRO I got a 1000/1000 because I studied like you are now - 10 hours a day, every day. I crammed my head full of as much stuff as possible and wound up burning out and working on school stuff since I was tired of Cisco. I took the INTRO at the end of last year and I could have and should have taken the ICND soon after, but I over worked my pace and lost the motivation to do so.

You want this stuff to sink in, so rather than trying to cram it all, take your time and understand it. Get the right tools to further your learning, and until you do, focus on things that don't need simulation. You'll be very thankful when you decide to pursue a career in networking or start on the CCNP and you don't have to reference books to find what you need.

monkey_ninja3

Dont get me wrong - I DO LOVE IT!

I like the lifestyle attatched to it, you are judged on what you do, not on how you kiss asss like most other careers. You can tend to wear your own clothes to work, and usually youre talkn' to smart people.
Its got diveristy to it, and good pay!

I gotta cram it all in 1 go, it's how I operate.. Im much better at self-study.

When youve done 10 hours a day for 2 weeks, you sorta feel mentally, physically and emotionally exhausteed ... feel sick from it. (everything takes longer than you think).

I'm doing two cisco wireless and security courses in september - April, so that's why i'd leave ccna until christmas, i'd be more prepared, and pass from confident knowledge not lucky educated guesses.

Where else would you find people who help each other like this? This community is tight!

Will check out thoise lab options later - thanks!

markzab

Paul Boz wrote:

Yeah man, pace yourself. If you feel that you're getting burned out from studying ease back a little bit. I work full time and go to LSU full time as well. Between working, studying for my degree, and trying to live life like any other college student, I study Cisco stuff for several hours a day. When I took the INTRO I got a 1000/1000 because I studied like you are now - 10 hours a day, every day. I crammed my head full of as much stuff as possible and wound up burning out and working on school stuff since I was tired of Cisco. I took the INTRO at the end of last year and I could have and should have taken the ICND soon after, but I over worked my pace and lost the motivation to do so.

You want this stuff to sink in, so rather than trying to cram it all, take your time and understand it. Get the right tools to further your learning, and until you do, focus on things that don't need simulation. You'll be very thankful when you decide to pursue a career in networking or start on the CCNP and you don't have to reference books to find what you need.

Excellent post.

You read about guys who say they take only a week to study for and pass their tests. Many of these guys don't have working experience. I would be very skeptical as to someone's abilities if I found out that they only just started on the concepts behind the position I was hiring for about a week ago. Don't jam it in there (man, I could think of some non-PG analogies for this), ease it in so your mind expands and is able to process and retain new info.

Phew...that took discipline not writing the ending analogy I wanted to.

monkey_ninja3

Im working in america for 5 weeks from around May and travellin for a month - that's why i'm short on time.

I also got fired from my call centre job 3 weeks ago 'cause it was like a prison, you could never get promoted, nor would you learn anything ... was just rotting away at that place.

So I decided to use all my spare time to do this cisco course., I'll have to get a shitty job next week to pay bills for a month ... I cant study whilst i'm working .. I need to get drunk and high to deal with the shitty job.... but when i get a good job from this - I wont need to do that so I'll be able to study along side it.

I hear what youre saying and I think youre right, no big deal if I fail .. i'll just study it 30 mins a day when I get back from america and re-take it.

NinjaMonkey

tech-airman

monkey_ninja3 wrote:

Im working in america for 5 weeks from around May and travellin for a month - that's why i'm short on time.

I also got fired from my call centre job 3 weeks ago 'cause it was like a prison, you could never get promoted, nor would you learn anything ... was just rotting away at that place.

So I decided to use all my spare time to do this cisco course., I'll have to get a shitty job next week to pay bills for a month ... I cant study whilst i'm working .. I need to get drunk and high to deal with the shitty job.... but when i get a good job from this - I wont need to do that so I'll be able to study along side it.

I hear what youre saying and I think youre right, no big deal if I fail .. i'll just study it 30 mins a day when I get back from america and re-take it.

NinjaMonkey

monkey_ninja3,

Have you thought of taking the exam while you're in America?

monkey_ninja3

I'm gonna be working at some remote summer camp for kids, so I wont really have the opputunity to study

The last thing I wanna do is be studying when i'm travellin after ... From what I hear, american chicks are easy and dig british accents.

NinjaMonkey

Rigg

monkey_ninja3 wrote:

The last thing I wanna do is be studying when i'm travellin after ... From what I hear, american chicks are easy and dig british accents.

NinjaMonkey

It's the same in the UK for Americans

Deadmaster200

All chicks are easy if you know how to handle them.

markzab

Deadmaster200 wrote:

All chicks are easy if you know how to handle them.

ccnacertified2000

mikej412 wrote:

monkey_ninja3 wrote:

I am trying to set up a basic frame relay, on my sim (packet tracer v3.2)

You're trying to configure a packet tracer 3.2 router to act as a frame relay switch?

Packet Tracer?



In packet tracer 4.0 you can define a "cloud" that will work with modem or serial connections.... and I think you can configure the "cloud" with DLCIs and LMI type.... and then connect your 1 or 100 (or whatever the PT device limit is) spoke routers to your hub router.

Dynamips/Dynagen is another option.... I think one of the sample Dynagen lab configurations is a Frame Relay scenario.

You could add a 4th router to the dynagen net file with 4 serial ports and configure it to be a frame relay switch rather than rely on the "cloud" configuration.

Packet Tracer is more limited than even Boson NetSim.

I think you are forgetting to realize that the real world doesn't use routers with many serial ports to act as a frame relay switch. If they did, they will be extremely limited in the number of connections per router. Instead phone companies have dedicated frame relay switches to do this job.

EdTheLad

ccnacertified2000 wrote:

I think you are forgetting to realize that the real world doesn't use routers with many serial ports to act as a frame relay switch. If they did, they will be extremely limited in the number of connections per router. Instead phone companies have dedicated frame relay switches to do this job.

I think Mike is well aware that routers are not meant to work like FR switches.The fact is we cant all afford to buy a dedicated FR switch for a lab environment when we can easily make do with a router emulating a FR switch.