How important is MCTS for jobs??

som.nitk

Hi,
I have a question related to MCTS, although it is not related to the preparation or FAQ's..

I have just started preparing for the 70-536 exam around a week ago and from what I can see, this exam expects you to remember the Base Class library and its methods and functionalities.

It does not stress on the logic development or the intricacies and internal working of the technology. So if a person memorises the Library, its methods and the basic working of the classes, I think he will pass the test..
Am I wrong??

I have seen the Sun Java Certification questions and with all due respect to Microsoft, I feel that the Sun Certifications have much more depth than Microsoft Certifications, which only require to skim the surface.

This leads me to ask: How relevant is this certification in the industry?
I mean, u pass the test, and I am certain that after a month u would forget all those tons and tons of classes that you have memorized..

So, does having this certification help in getting better jobs? Because u just know the technology but you need not go deep to pass this test.

That is my question..
Thank you.

tjcasser

As I frequently say, it all depends on who is placing the value on the exams.

Having both of the credentials you've mentioned - SCJP (multiple versions) and the various MCTS certs in .Net 2.0... I don't know that I'd say, per se, that I think that Microsoft's are more easily passed by brute-force studying. I think both of these credentials certainly hold out the possibility that someone with sufficient recall could memorize and pass, but I don't know that it really accomplishes anything to do so. (You end up running into a wall when it comes to proving your ability with the underlying technology.) Plus, and let's be honest here, we all sit down and look at the documentation now and again while working, none of us are expected to have ALL of the language memorized for immediate recall while writing code.

The fact is this - no multiple choice exam, I feel, is going to adequately address the development of logic or intricacies of technologies. That requires a practical exam, which is a more subjective testing of one's grasp on a technology which can be biased by any number of factors. Sun does, for instance, offer a practical exam for Java programmers (SCJD), and I know that I saw, at some point, discussion of putting 'simulation' questions onto the MCPD exams for .Net. Do I know that it's going to help? Not one iota - it would all depend on the format.

All that said... are the certifications relevant? Do they help landing a job?

To the former... definitely. I think they give at least some form of an objective qualification of your potential grasp of the technologies. (I couch that very hesitantly because I'm still a believer that knowledge needs to be validated, whether we're talking certifications or degrees.) I think it demonstrates that you've achieved in some fashion or another some form of mastery with the objectives.

To the latter... that's harder to address. I know that certifications have helped my company to land clients, on the basis of increasing the client's comfort level with the use of a given technology in their situations. And I landed my current job, in part due to my certifications at the time. I wouldn't hold it out as a hard-and-fast rule that such is the case in the industry at large, though.

JDMurray

If you want to know what employers desire, go to the popular job boards (dice.com, monster.com, hotjobs.com, etc.) and search on the terms "MCTS" and "MCPD". Of the thousands of jobs offered for .NET programmers, note how many mention these certs and report back here.

som.nitk

JDMurray wrote:

If you want to know what employers desire, go to the popular job boards (dice.com, monster.com, hotjobs.com, etc.) and search on the terms "MCTS" and "MCPD". Of the thousands of jobs offered for .NET programmers, note how many mention these certs and report back here.

Well I did goto some of the sites you listed, and I noticed not too many big organizations keep certifications as a requirement.
So I guess this is just an added advantage, and it helps individually to know the language better..

bcairns

I my humble experience, there are two "types" of computer jobs:

1 - Programmers (.Net, Java, C / C++, Python, PHP, Ruby, etc) these range from entry level web design to high end network programming. Most of these types of jobs have a "show me what you have done" mentality - where it is more important for the employer to see your past work. Certifications obviously won't hurt to have (and may get your foot in the door) but really the employer is looking for proof that you can indeed write code.

2 - Non Programmers (Network Admins, DBAs, Security, Telecom, etc) these range from entry level help desk to penitration testing and Enterprise level Domain Admins. These types of jobs have a "show me your certifications" mentality - and many of these jobs will not even grant you an interview until you have the certifications they desire.

In this day and age I find that most employers seem to be seeking a jack-of-all-trades, they love to have employees that can move seemlessly from #1 to #2, and this holds true of programmers...for example how can you write an application that uses strong encyption if you have no idea what any of the industry standards and best practices are?

Most programmers tend to write their own (weak) cipher or find some code on google and just assume it is strong enough. Having a certification like MCAD or MCPD will tell the employer you are smart enough to know beter

JDMurray

som.nitk wrote:

JDMurray wrote:

If you want to know what employers desire, go to the popular job boards (dice.com, monster.com, hotjobs.com, etc.) and search on the terms "MCTS" and "MCPD". Of the thousands of jobs offered for .NET programmers, note how many mention these certs and report back here.

Well I did goto some of the sites you listed, and I noticed not too many big organizations keep certifications as a requirement.
So I guess this is just an added advantage, and it helps individually to know the language better..

This is exactly the case. Programming certifications have never been as popular as IT certifications. This is largely due to the cert vendors (Sun, Microsoft) not putting enough marketing behind their certs to promote their value to the software development industry. Programming certs are an excellent syllabus for learning a programming language and testing your knowledge. It is also unlikely that listing programming certs on your resume will hurt your chances of getting a job interview regardless if they are not recognized by an employer.