Odd result of recent Interview

Rikku

I recently interviewed for a Senior Systems Admin Position for an well known global environmental engineering company. The job description was a text book Systems Admin description for server systems, networking and administration. In the description it said at least 5 years experience in systems/networks. I have about 10+ more years experience.

So, during the interview..it was the normal give and take..whats your background experience, what kind of work did you do with your last employer..etc...etc. It was a very relaxed hour long interview with 3 guys, the Computer Systems Director, Computer Systems Manager and another System Resource Analyst (which is basically there description for Admin/Helpdesk.)

So, from the interview, I got that they were more concerned with internal support/customer service..they described the position as a "multitask/multi-hat" position, where I could be configuring a server or cluster and at other times support application rollout to thousands of users or just be available to provide general system support.

So, all around pretty basic.

A few days later I got a call back from the recruiter who stated that thier reply was that they liked me a lot; but felt that I would feel "restricted" in this position based on the type of work I would be doing and that they felt I would fit better into a developmental systems role. I really do not get any idea where they got the idea to label me as a developer as I have limited programming/scripting skill and the subject was not even discussed during the interview.

So, I really do not know what to take from this response to my interview. Are they just trying to cop out with the response that I would not be happy in this position? I requested 72K annual minimum and the recruiter said that the asking price was well within the proposed salary budget from the employer. If this was just a helpdesk position as they seemed to describe the position as geared toward more customer service/systems support....why in the hell did it advertise the position as a Senior System Admin position? I mean, this is not a small company; but a well established privately owned global engineering firm. They should know what they are doing and what they are looking for.

Just a very odd response in my opinion. Anyone had similiar responses that do not make sense to them from thier interviews?

-Rikku

empc4000xl

yeah I had a situation like that. I got a call from a company looking for a network design engineer. After I did the preliminary interview, I did the actual tech interview where they told me about the job and what it required. The told me they were looking for somebody who monitored the network Routers/firewalls/switches. Then Passed the tickets onto field engineer's or another NOC if there was a problem. I asked during the interview why is this advertised as a network design position when you are basically looking for a tier 1 NOC technician. They didn't know and I told them I wasn't interested in the position because it was going backwards from where I was at.

savior faire

Just a very odd response in my opinion. Anyone had similiar responses that do not make sense to them from thier interviews

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This does not surprise me. I have systems development experience going all the way back to 1973. When I was doing consulting work back in 1999 thru 2001, I had applied for a consulting gig that required Cobol programming and other skills that I had decades of experience with.

The headhunter I was going through told me the company looking for a consultant said that I had no programming experience on my resume, when clearly, there was 30 years of experience indicated on my paperwork.

In my humble opinion, the IT industry has been on a steady and slow downhill slide for roughly the last 10 or so years. It used to be a good career to get into. There is a lot of dishonesty, deceit and corruption in it now. I would never recommend it to anyone at this point.

darkerosxx

savior faire wrote:

There is a lot of dishonesty, deceit and corruption in it now.

So it's like all the others?

Aldur

savior faire wrote:

In my humble opinion, the IT industry has been on a steady and slow downhill slide for roughly the last 10 or so years. It used to be a good career to get into. There is a lot of dishonesty, deceit and corruption in it now. I would never recommend it to anyone at this point.

Any field of work that is growing is going to attract dishonest people, it's just something that you have to deal with and not try to get caught up in. A phrase that I was told when I was younger comes to mind, "We have to live in the world, not of the world.", which means that we are here, in a corrupt world, but that doesn't mean we have to be corrupt like the world around us. Having corrupt people in the IT field was bound to happen, when there is large amount of money involved they will come like sharks to the sent of blood.

I'm sure that I am like most people here that just want to have a good life and provide for their family. Since IT is growing and there is money to be made in something I enjoy doing, I am going to pursue it as a career and deal with or hopefully avoid the corruption that is in it.

Slowhand

You know, I've had the same response from hiring managers and recruiters alike. They talk to me, I tell them about my experience, and they push me off onto some job that I wouldn't have applied for in the first place. I applied for a systems administrator position at one company, and they kept trying to get me to talk to the Unix admin, despite the fact that 90% of my background is with Windows. I got roped into talking to the manager for a database development group when interviewing for a web design position. And, the most common, I keep getting offered sales positions, based on having a technical background and the ability to chat and talk with people comfortably.

It's not unusual, so stick to your guns and decline the offer for the development position. If they're serious about hiring you for the Sr. systems administrator position, they will. If they have some ulterior motive, like having found someone else at a lower salary, then you'll find out when they keep pushing you away from that job. Hell, maybe they're even worried that you have too much experience and that you'll leave for a job somewhere else for six figures, who knows? Don't let them screw with your head, and don't let them push you around too much. The worst that'll happen is that you'll thank them for your time, and walk out the door in exactly the same situation you are right now.

scheistermeister

Slowhand wrote:

You know, I've had the same response from hiring managers and recruiters alike. They talk to me, I tell them about my experience, and they push me off onto some job that I wouldn't have applied for in the first place. I applied for a systems administrator position at one company, and they kept trying to get me to talk to the Unix admin, despite the fact that 90% of my background is with Windows. I got roped into talking to the manager for a database development group when interviewing for a web design position. And, the most common, I keep getting offered sales positions, based on having a technical background and the ability to chat and talk with people comfortably.

Exact same thing here! Except slightly reversed. I talk to recruiters and tell them my experience and knowledge is with Cisco and Linux they bring me a job for a 7+ years experience Sr. Windows Systems Admin job... WTF, can these people read?

Also had a similar deal with the sales. I am very comfortable talking to people because at one point I was a used car salesman. The consulting company I recently had an interview with for a LN position (which I didn't really want and didn't get) during the interview kept talking about bringing me in on sales calls when they start offering Cisco services in the area and contacted me again for a different position and while talking to me about it hammered away at "We think you can sell them your services." Now if I get a job that I get to work directly with things and sell I can live with that, just not complete sales.

Daniel333

They had to post online and on our company site to hire my replacement. I read over the job description and told them is was laughably bad, and gave them an updated version. It had things like, "knowledge of IPX" and a bunch of business junk that was not accurate. It also made no mention you would need to know SQL and VB. Important thing to mention I think.

The next day they came back and said that they could not update the job posting wording, as that would require an audit from HR and it's possible that payroll would not approve it. While if they made no changes to the wording, they would keep the funds.

Dumb dumb dumb

ilcram19-2

thats why you dont use recruiters they always miss guide people

shednik

I have to agree my experience with recruiters has been nothing short of horrible.

Rikku

Thanks for the replies. Interesting posts.

There is a lot of dishonesty, deceit and corruption in it now. I would never recommend it to anyone at this point.

I kind of had the same feeling, but a lot of companies in the states are simply asking for too much in my opinion. We all know the story. When the industry was hot and the bubble was bloated anyone and his grandmas boyfriends sister could get a job in IT even with a friggen Art degree and a little bit of computer experience. (no really..I saw it first hand..) Yeah, everyone got greedy and corrupt. But, I think the key was to wait for all the posers to jump ship after the bubble burst and then when the industry levels off again hit the ground running. Lets all kick ass and take names based on our experience, skill and talent.

Let's say you want to pay a states side multi-qualified, multi-talented individual that is easily worth 100K based on his degrees/certs and experience and then ask him to accept 50K for a salary position. Then when he and no one else locally accepts the company offer, they offshore the position to a guy in India who performs 40% of that positions services and at best the work is crappy with a management/communication nightmare to boot...but they accept it for the fact that they are paying this guy peanuts and saving in money and benefits until the cost benefit is outweighing itself and they bring the job back stateside. I have experienced and also heard about a lot of IT and Development service jobs brought back just for these reasons.

I had lunch the other day with my boss from the last big company I worked for. He is an IT Services Director for his company and he said he is going for his CISSP. He recommended that maybe I should stay away from small companies (my last position) and suggested I think about becomming a DBA versus an Wintel Sys Admin for now. The company he is working for is downsizing its IT services group and offshoring some of these services to IBM based in China/India.

The funny thing is that at the last company we both worked at (Fortune 500 Company) we had the same type of downsizing proposal happen and it completely backfired. We had a big shot CIO come in and do a hack and slash and cut it's IT and Development staff from 11 Data Centers to 5 Data Centers and provide remote administration from 1 or 2 of the other offices. The CIO got her big bonuses (millions) for the job and then when the company started to see long term loss versus the short term gains... They ended up firing the CIO 6 months later and they reversed about 80% of the downsizing and changes they had made. It was a complete failure even though it looked good on paper to the shareholders. My previous boss tried to indicate that this is along a similiar path at his current company; but he said management is not listening to the benifit of his experience. He also indicated the U.S. is supposed to pass a bill at some point that is supposed to demand that all US based companies keep 70% of thier workforce here in the States and that they cannot export/offshore services by more then 30%. I don't know all the details of this Bill; except form what he indicated. But, that would defenetly level the playing field a bit..unless all these companies just say the hell with it and leave the States.

As for me, my position is to stay with it. Keep positive and sell myself well and also my goal is to be a bilingual engineer. You would not believe how many times I have been contacted to fill mulitple engineering and management roles that required Japanese language skill next to English. I turned them down for now because I am not up to the level I need to be at yet. But, I know I will get there in time.

-Rikku

Technowiz

..unless all these companies just say the hell with it and leave the States.

Which is exactly what many would do.

JDMurray

ilcram19-2 wrote:

thats why you dont use recruiters they always miss guide people

They have a bunch of jobs to fill, a quota imposed upon them by their boss(es), and they get a commission ($$$) for each person placed. A "chop shop" recruiter will try to take any round peg and fit it into any square hole. A professional recruiter will actually work to place you in the correct position.

Recruiters have it extra tough because they have two customers that they must sell to: the employer and the employee. A retail salesman doesn't need to convince a car or a blender to agree to be purchased by a customer, but a recruiter must sell both the employer and employee to each other.

My main complaint with most recruiters that I've worked with is that if you aren't hired by the first place that interviews you, the recruiter will never call you back again. I've seen this pattern time and time again and I'm not sure why.

1MeanAdmin

JDMurray wrote:

My main complaint with most recruiters that I've worked with is that if you aren't hired by the first place that interviews you, the recruiter will never call you back again. I've seen this pattern time and time again and I'm not sure why.

+1.
One recruiter I worked with took it even further. I was chosen by the company (and I had a feeling I would) and was told that the interviews are over - I've got the job, but a week later the position was not approved by an executive. I've never heard from the guy again. If I was easy to sell, why not make a quick buck on me somewhere else?

undomiel

I stopped going out and seeing all the recruiters around here a while ago. I may start again now that I've stepped up the job search but we'll see. I think it is absolutely ridiculous that a recruiter won't work with you until you go in and say "Hi!" at their main office. Then they never talk to you ever again. I only had one who actually worked with me a bit, she couldn't meet with me but she had a co-worker who drove down by my area going back to his home. So we met up at a bagel shop parking lot on the way. Heard from them again after 3 months about a different job. On the other hand Robert Half keeps insisting I need to go to their office for the 3rd or 4th time to meet them and to take some tests. I agree that it is ridiculous. I also feel far more like a commodity with recruiters than a 2nd customer. The one they're trying to please is the employer they're working with.

Rikku

On the other hand Robert Half keeps insisting I need to go to their office for the 3rd or 4th time to meet them and to take some tests.

I had the same issue. I had to go "meet" and fill out some paperwork. They had me take an odd 2003 Server test that had a bunch of Novell questions on it. Then the recruiter said that they do not usually if ever get permanent placement as opposed to contract positions or even contract to permanent if ever. The recruiter said that thier selling point is for contract only positions for local companies.

I have delt with Robert Half on both sides. I feel only slightly positive about thier placement assistance and I have never filled a contract position for them. When I was at my last company; we used them to try to fill a DBA position. We had a bunch of canidates that did not exactly fit the bill. Then, we had well rounded DBA get hired on in a full time permanent position from them. Then about 3 weeks or so into the position, he started not showing up to work and then we heard he was not happy with the "negotiated salary" he had and felt he was underpaid.

The thing was he did not even try to talk to us about it, he just up and left and told Robert Half his concerns and they did not contact us until we managed to reach him by phone. Then, Robert Half tried to charge for a week or so after his disappearing act when he was not there. The CEO had to threaten to sue them before they gave up that argument.

My whole arguement for using recruiters is just use them for the exposure. Get yourself out there on as many job sites and recruiting services as possible and follow up with your sources on your availability. The rest is a waiting game and using your time constuctively I think. (and positive thinking )

-Rikku