Military Reserves

gojericho0

I was thinking about joining the reserves and I was wondering if anyone who has had any experience or insight would have any recommendations on which branch to consider. I have just begun doing some research, but would like any jobs that do with networking or systems administration.

Is there a particular branch that you would recommend for IT duties?

Is there a branch that anyone would recommend avoiding?

What types of job titles might be of interest?

Would any of the branches let you enroll as an officer if you have a four year degree?

Any insight would be appreciated

Kevin10686

Go Air Force or Coast Guard. However at a time like now you might as well enlisted full-time. and be willing to deploy.

sliptmickey

This is right up my alley as I just came off of Navy active duty and am now in the Navy Reserves.

As far as the Navy, if you came in as enlisted your best bet would be to come in as an Information System Technician (IT), but last I had heard it was really over manned. Everyone wants to be a keyboard jockey. If you've never been in the military before you would have to go to boot camp then to basic IT school for training. You wouldn't have to do it all at once, but IMHO it would be best to knock it all out in one stretch to avoid as much disruption to your civilian life/career as possible. The Navy does have some good follow on schools that you could probably pick up later down the road as one of your Active Training (AT) duties. I've heard the new Sys Admin school is good, but hard and you can come away from it with either A+ or CCNA. Not sure which as I attended when it was an NT 4 class and not it's current form. There's a chance you could be called up for duty in Iraq or Afghanistan, but you could also get the call for Kuwait, Qatar, or Bahrain. Same benefits and pay as Iraq, but no bullets and bomb.

In the Army Reserve you could come in as a 25B or Information System Specialist I think is what the title is. Same kind of gig as a Navy IT as far as boot camp and basic IT school or AIT as they call it. I'm not sure that they have any good follow on schools though other than the required leadership/job class courses they require you to go to. I would avoid the Army Reserve unless you feel like going to Iraq or Afghanistan any time soon.

Won't even go into the Marine Corps as I'm certain you'll go to boot camp, follow on school, and then either to Iraq or Afghanistan straight away. I'm not familiar with the Marine Corps reserve though, so you may want to contact a recruiter for more info.

And then there's the Air Force Reserve. I don't know much about them, you would be best to contract a recruiter for more info. If you have tattoo's they'll probably tell you to talk to someone else because the Air Force are a bunch of elitists.

If you have a four year degree, I believe the Navy does allow you to come in as an officer. If you have an IT type degree you'll come in as an Information Professional (IP) officer. IP's are typically ADP officers or serve in some kind of IT officer role.

If you want to join the Reserves, I recommend the Navy. I'm biased though because I'm a Navy Reservist, but you can't beat the opportunity for travel you get with the Navy. I'm looking to go to Spain for my Active Training next summer, but there are bunch of other possibilities out there either abroad or close to home wherever that might be. Your best bet is to contact an enlisted recruiter if you want to come in an enlisted sailor, or an officer recruiter if you want to come in as an Officer. Hope this help. If you have questions, ask. Cheers.

LarryDaMan

Kevin10686 wrote:

However at a time like now you might as well enlisted full-time. and be willing to deploy.

I would echo these sentiments. Everyone is stretched thin and undermanned, couple that with the potential reignition of the Cold War... and there is a HIGH probablity of being deployed as a reserve. Depending on what you do, you may be deployed more often than not during your enlistment.

Recruiters and those in lucky units may tell you otherwise, but do not believe them. A lot of people are being deployed. If you can consider it, do a tour of active duty and get that new GI Bill, you can use it for graduate school too.

Tyrant1919

If you're looking for a specific job being in the military, I wouldn't join. Your job specialty can include anything computer related. ADPE anyone? The military will put you where they need you, not where you want to go. Not that you won't get to play with some cool systems, don't look at it as a guaranteed Sys Admin job.

Air force 3C0X1 or 3C2X1...

sliptmickey

LarryDaMan wrote:

Kevin10686 wrote:

However at a time like now you might as well enlisted full-time. and be willing to deploy.

I would echo these sentiments. Everyone is stretched thin and undermanned, couple that with the potential reignition of the Cold War... and there is a HIGH probablity of being deployed as a reserve. Depending on what you do, you may be deployed more often than not during your enlistment.

Recruiters and those in lucky units may tell you otherwise, but do not believe them. A lot of people are being deployed. If you can consider it, do a tour of active duty and get that new GI Bill, you can use it for graduate school too.

I'd have to agree with those sentiments. Alot of Reservists do deploy as I stated before. Those who tell you they don't deploy are either lying, or they're like me and are deferred from being mobilized for all or a part of their Reserve enlistment because we've come off of active duty and went straight into the Reserves. The new GI bill is sweet though, and if it works like it's supposed to, will cover all costs. You can go to http:\\www.va.gov for more information I believe.

sliptmickey

Tyrant1919 wrote:

If you're looking for a specific job being in the military, I wouldn't join. Your job specialty can include anything computer related. ADPE anyone? The military will put you where they need you, not where you want to go. Not that you won't get to play with some cool systems, don't look at it as a guaranteed Sys Admin job.

Air force 3C0X1 or 3C2X1...

Not sure about the other branches, but assuming you score well enough on the Armed Services Vocational Aptitude Battery (ASVAB) you can select a technical job in the Navy. Whether it's as an Information System Technician, Cryptologic Technician Technical (They do Electronic Warfare like radar jamming and anti-missile tech), Crytologic Technician Network (They do the same thing as IT's do, but in a different classified environment.) If they don't have what you want, or can't get you into the field you want simply walk away. They tried to get me to come back in the Reserves as an Operation Specialist (they watch radar screens all day and keep track of where the ship has been and where it's going) but told them no thanks. About 2 hours later they called back and said you can be an IT, we got you a billet.

LarryDaMan

Tyrant1919 wrote:

The military will put you where they need you, not where you want to go....

Not true. If you have the requisite test scores and if they want you bad enough (and they do)... you will be able to pick your speciality... and it will be guaranteed, because you sign a contract. People have successfully gotten out of the military because their contracts were not fulfilled. Just do your homework and read ALL of the paperwork before signing.

LarryDaMan

One last comment:

A dirty trick that recruiters often play goes something like this:

"There are no IT slots, but it is no problem! Sign up to be in the infantry, and after bootcamp you can put in the paperwork to have your job changed to IT"

Yes, you can put in the paperwork after bootcamp.

BUT, the people in charge at your infantry unit will laugh really really hard as they rip it up and throw it in the trash!

Read the contract carefully, recruiters are worse than used car salesmen.

sliptmickey

LarryDaMan wrote:

One last comment:

A dirty trick that recruiters often play goes something like this:

"There are no IT slots, but it is no problem! Sign up to be in the infantry, and after bootcamp you can put in the paperwork to have your job changed to IT"

Yes, you can put in the paperwork after bootcamp.

BUT, the people in charge at your infantry unit will laugh really really hard as they rip it up and throw it in the trash!

Read the contract carefully, recruiters are worse than used car salesmen.

I heard the same line years ago when I first enlisted active duty. Sign up as an undesignated seaman and you can pick your job once you get to your first ship. Luckily I had my stepdad with me, who was a Radioman in the Navy for some number of years. He pulled me aside and said, "I know it's your decision, but if you go with undesignated seaman, I'll slap the **** out of you." I turned back to the recruiter and said. Computers. What've you got that is computer heavy.....

Every branch does this to some extent, especially the Army because they so desparately need 11B (11bodybags as we call them) and it's so hard to retrain once the Army gets you into a job.

Mrock4

LarryDaMan wrote:

Tyrant1919 wrote:

The military will put you where they need you, not where you want to go....

Not true. If you have the requisite test scores and if they want you bad enough (and they do)... you will be able to pick your speciality... and it will be guaranteed, because you sign a contract. People have successfully gotten out of the military because their contracts were not fulfilled. Just do your homework and read ALL of the paperwork before signing.

I've seen Air Force, and Navy chime in..so here I go reppin' for the Army...


It IS true they'll put you where they need you...but it also is true you are guaranteed a job. Who's to say you will be guaranteed as a Network tech, but get assigned a position that needs you to do Systems Admin work on servers? It's happened. I did it...

It all depends on where you go, and the assignment. You can pick to a certain degree, what you'll be trained in, but you will almost surely do some cross-training, and take on additional duties as they see fit.

That all being said..that's a great thing. I've been exposed to a ridiculous amount of technology, that I otherwise wouldn't have gotten to.


I am a 25B in the Army.."information systems analyst/operator". Basically, the MOS is intended to do mostly desktop support/troubleshooting, and server admin stuff. I have done almost exclusively network tech/engineering in my career...why? Because they saw I excelled at that, and as a result, I am working in the ROLE of a different job..although I still hold the job I enlisted for.

Simple: Reserves suck if you want experience. I was a reservist too at one time. Active duty (or deployment as a reservist) will gain you a ridiculous amount of experience in your chosen job.

Oh, and before I hear "the X is different", I'm the only Army guy in an AF unit at the moment..and we currently have cable guys working at the network management office, and server guys running cable.


slipt- by the way..I'm in tampa too..at SOCOM/6CS..where are you?

sliptmickey

Mrock4 wrote:

LarryDaMan wrote:

Tyrant1919 wrote:

The military will put you where they need you, not where you want to go....

Not true. If you have the requisite test scores and if they want you bad enough (and they do)... you will be able to pick your speciality... and it will be guaranteed, because you sign a contract. People have successfully gotten out of the military because their contracts were not fulfilled. Just do your homework and read ALL of the paperwork before signing.

I've seen Air Force, and Navy chime in..so here I go reppin' for the Army...


It IS true they'll put you where they need you...but it also is true you are guaranteed a job. Who's to say you will be guaranteed as a Network tech, but get assigned a position that needs you to do Systems Admin work on servers? It's happened. I did it...

It all depends on where you go, and the assignment. You can pick to a certain degree, what you'll be trained in, but you will almost surely do some cross-training, and take on additional duties as they see fit.

That all being said..that's a great thing. I've been exposed to a ridiculous amount of technology, that I otherwise wouldn't have gotten to.


I am a 25B in the Army.."information systems analyst/operator". Basically, the MOS is intended to do mostly desktop support/troubleshooting, and server admin stuff. I have done almost exclusively network tech/engineering in my career...why? Because they saw I excelled at that, and as a result, I am working in the ROLE of a different job..although I still hold the job I enlisted for.

Simple: Reserves suck if you want experience. I was a reservist too at one time. Active duty (or deployment as a reservist) will gain you a ridiculous amount of experience in your chosen job.

Oh, and before I hear "the X is different", I'm the only Army guy in an AF unit at the moment..and we currently have cable guys working at the network management office, and server guys running cable.


slipt- by the way..I'm in tampa too..at SOCOM/6CS..where are you?

Once they get my clearance thing worked out, I'll be working CENTCOM J2/J3 for ITT.

famosbrown

Well I guess I will chime in for Army too.

My entire military career was Army Reserve with the majority being active duty due to training and deployment in support of IEF and OEF. 25B is the MOS for I.T. in the Army.

The military placing you where they need you really only applies at the Active Duty level. In the Army Reserve, you will not have a choice of MOS's if it isn't offered at a Army Reserve unit that is within a 50 mile radius of your current residence unless you make it clear that you are willing to relocate. You will go to Basic Training with everyone else and then go to AIT and live life good. I didn't go in as a 25B, but I was told by many that their school was very lax just like the Intel school is.

Again...with the war now, although you will get the training and have a permanent slot with a REserve unit, you could get called up, cross trained for about a couple of weeks, and find yourself on a convoy with some other 31B's (MP). Actually, most of the convoys are being manned by support personnel (MOS's other than 31B and 11B's). You might be the Network admin for your weekends and annual training, but if you get orders for deployment outside of your unit, they will use you for what they need you for...but it's not usually that way since they scan for MOS qualified candidates first, then they go into the pool of IRR, then they start picking any MOS to cross-train.

G.I. Bill and tuition assistance has improved for REservist, as well as the bonuses. After service or after serving active duty for a conflict, you'd also have some preferential hiring when applying for Federal Government jobs.

Being a soldier, I would not recommend the Army Reserve. I recommend either going AirForce or Navy due to the level of training and the lack of "individual" combat they see during today's war. I am not sure what additional benefits they offer, but the Army is offering A LOT for a reason...they need bodies.

As far as officer candidate, most services will take you in as an officer, but there are some benefits not available like enlistment bonuses, etc. since it isn't an enlistment, but a commision. Not too long ago, the AirForce was pushing a lot of it's officers out because they had too many. Many of them came Army. The Army is ACTIVELY recruiting officers and would welcome you with open arms. Another cool way to do it if you plan on staying in a for a little bit is to go in enlisted, get your enlisted benefits, then get a direct commission after finding the slot you want. You will also get a little bit more respect being an officer who is prior enlisted since you will have an idea of what both lower and senior enlisted members go through. Of course, Westpoint officers are usually the most respected since they lived and breathe military 24/7 throughout college, unlike the ROTC at your common state schools.

I could go on forever, but I won't. The military was one of the best decisions I made alomost 8 years ago, although I didn't think so many times throughout, and I wouldn't change it. I probably would have went AirForce though.

Good luck and if you have any more questions, let us know.

gojericho0

Thanks for the info guys! I am really not doing it for the experience as I have a pretty good job now. I was just interested in serving in order to help give back and see it as a challenge. I'd prefer an IT job since that is what I am passionate about, but would not mind learning something new as well.

I will do some more research on all the branches, particularity about the programs/jobs mentioned. Once I do some more research and talk to some recruiters I will probably have more questions. This is something I have been wanting to do for awhile and my wife is finally warming up to the idea a little bit.

oo_snoopy

I've seen the military side of IT, and just in my opinion, it's very unpleasant.

E.G. You have a problem, you know to fix this problem you perform step G.


Sorry, you're in the military, you must first to steps A. B. C. D. E. F. F-sub a F-sub b. then G.

It all depends on who your work with and who your commanding officer is though.

Mrock4

oo_snoopy wrote:

I've seen the military side of IT, and just in my opinion, it's very unpleasant.

E.G. You have a problem, you know to fix this problem you perform step G.


Sorry, you're in the military, you must first to steps A. B. C. D. E. F. F-sub a F-sub b. then G.

It all depends on who your work with and who your commanding officer is though.

ummm..May I ask what exactly you've seen in the military? Did you serve? Contract? I ask this, because that is a pretty incredibly inaccurate description of what I do, and many other soldiers/sailors/airmen/marines do. I have been in the military a minute or two, and I have NEVER seen things the way you describe them. If anything, I've seen some of the most innovative people come from the military side of IT. They do whatever they have to do to restore/establish communication, and complete the mission. Please elaborate on your experience that you draw that conclusion from. I think an example of this "you know how to fix it, but you have to complete all these steps before it" would be very fitting too. When we have issues, the only thing that's said is "fix it. Do whatever you have to do..get it up"

sliptmickey

The only time in my military career I've ever had a situation like that is when conducting preventative maintenance on equipment. They outline the steps that need to be taken in order to ensure that the equipment is properly inspected, serviced, and returned to operation. When it comes to fixing something broken, it gets fixed. No questions asked.

Mrock4

sliptmickey wrote:

The only time in my military career I've ever had a situation like that is when conducting preventative maintenance on equipment. They outline the steps that need to be taken in order to ensure that the equipment is properly inspected, serviced, and returned to operation. When it comes to fixing something broken, it gets fixed. No questions asked.

Definitely. PMCS'ing something is the one true exception. But that's not any real part of the troubleshooting process..thus the "preventative" part of the word. In the end, as you said, it's all about getting it fixed. Generals don't care how it gets fixed..just do it.

networker050184

Mrock4 wrote:

ummm..May I ask what exactly you've seen in the military? Did you serve? Contract? I ask this, because that is a pretty incredibly inaccurate description of what I do, and many other soldiers/sailors/airmen/marines do. I have been in the military a minute or two, and I have NEVER seen things the way you describe them. If anything, I've seen some of the most innovative people come from the military side of IT. They do whatever they have to do to restore/establish communication, and complete the mission. Please elaborate on your experience that you draw that conclusion from. I think an example of this "you know how to fix it, but you have to complete all these steps before it" would be very fitting too. When we have issues, the only thing that's said is "fix it. Do whatever you have to do..get it up"

I agree 100% I have ran into way more yellow tape in the civilian world. In all my time in the military it was always "make it happen" which meant do what ever you have to do.

flares2

I've seen all the other branches, so I may as well mention the Marine Corps. For as much I loved the Corps, for IT...no go man. The USMC over the past few years has implemented NMCI (Navy-Marine Corps Intranet), a contracted group of civilians who control the network stateside so more geeky-warriors like myself can run the networks overseas.

Stateside is a lot of time to train on new hardware/software, study, get an education, but actual hands on time is minimal, except in test environments of only a few servers, switches, and workstations.

Overseas is a lot of hands on experience on very high speed, low drag systems. Downside...you're overseas, away from friends and family, and usually getting shot at.

oo_snoopy

Mrock4 wrote:

oo_snoopy wrote:

I've seen the military side of IT, and just in my opinion, it's very unpleasant.

E.G. You have a problem, you know to fix this problem you perform step G.


Sorry, you're in the military, you must first to steps A. B. C. D. E. F. F-sub a F-sub b. then G.

It all depends on who your work with and who your commanding officer is though.

ummm..May I ask what exactly you've seen in the military? Did you serve? Contract? I ask this, because that is a pretty incredibly inaccurate description of what I do, and many other soldiers/sailors/airmen/marines do. I have been in the military a minute or two, and I have NEVER seen things the way you describe them. If anything, I've seen some of the most innovative people come from the military side of IT. They do whatever they have to do to restore/establish communication, and complete the mission. Please elaborate on your experience that you draw that conclusion from. I think an example of this "you know how to fix it, but you have to complete all these steps before it" would be very fitting too. When we have issues, the only thing that's said is "fix it. Do whatever you have to do..get it up"

I've worked with countless military people at Sprint, worked for Northrop Grumman on post closely with military IT people, and have a friends who served numbers of years.

First a disclaimer: NOT ALL MILITARY PEOPLE ARE LIKE THIS. (E.G. YOU)

However, most military I've worked with are. Don't get me wrong, they're great people but they have trouble thinking outside the box. They follow rules to the T. and when given orders they do it.

If my boss tells me do to something and I don't agree, I'll work with him on it. From what I've seen, when a person in the military gets an order they do it, even if it's a really bad order, but that's the chain of command. There are good leaders and good IT people in the military though!

famosbrown

oo_snoopy wrote:

I've seen the military side of IT, and just in my opinion, it's very unpleasant.

E.G. You have a problem, you know to fix this problem you perform step G.


Sorry, you're in the military, you must first to steps A. B. C. D. E. F. F-sub a F-sub b. then G.

It all depends on who your work with and who your commanding officer is though.

sorry dude. I can't agree with this either. As a soldier coming up and as a current leader, when orders are received or given, I will rely on your training and expertise to get it done...period. I may train the first couple of times, but if you find a more efficient way of doing something, that is always good.

I do agree...when it comes to PMCS'ing equipment like vehicles Pro mask, M-16, etc. there are TM's available that go step by step to ensure the equipment is functional before, during, and after use. I've never seen it in military I.T. though.


To the OP, the most important and useful thing you could do now is research all Reserve branches close to your area and see what slots are available. If you want to go I.T., check to see if any of the reserve units have that slot. If you want to be a Combat Medic, check the units for that. In the Reserves, your MOS selection will be based on a slot available at a unit. For instance, if you find an all Admin unit or Headquarters unit, you might not find any 11B (Infantry) slots available. However, after you attained that MOS with another unit, and decide to switch units, they will send you to school for a slot that you will be filling. This is what I did when I was in an E-8 G-6 slot. I wasn't MOS qualified, but they were working on either using my education/experience to award me the MOS or send me to school to get the MOS. I still held the slot though. Unfortunately, if the unit would have been deployed, I would have had to be slotted in a position that I was MOS qualified in unless the powers that be did some Muster manipulating.

Finding a slot is also important if you decide to enter as a commisioned officer. Without a slot, the Army will choose your Branch...could by Combat Arms, could be Signal, could be Finance...depending on where they want you. If you find a Signal (I.T.) slot beforehand, you are guaranteed that branch insignia. this only works for Reservist though...Active Duty usually don't get that luxury since they are much more mobile.

motogpman

Fisrt and foremost.... Looking at the military for a career/training and not wanting to be deployed has me . It can and possibly will happen. I come from an infantry/techinical background... which was the best of both worlds IMO. If you wear a uniform, YOU ARE A SOLDIER. Of course IT jobs, or non combat MOS's ( REMF's) would make a person feel that they should be relatively safe, there is more than getting the GI Bill or IT skills involved.

Snoopy.... Soldiers following orders is what soldiers do. Agreed that there are some real walking cluster's around, but since you do not wear a uniform and probably not with the soldiers 24/7, then there may be more going on in the background that you are not aware of. It is hard for non miliary individuals to comprehend why things are done to a "T." There are procedures to follow and a reason for it. Communication is the key and if a soldier can't speak up then he shouldn't be wearing the uniform or basic didn't issue a pair of balls to that soldier. Not trying to be an ass, but when a civi who has not actually earned the right to wear any service uniform makes statements similar to yours, I just can't get the reasoning behind it. Two different worlds. If you civi boss explicitly told you to do something and you disagreed, does that mean you would quit your job if he didn't budge? Or would you end up doing as told?

My best suggestion for the OP is to look at your options.. from all branches GET EVERYTHING spelled out in writing, if you look into the Army reserves, look at also getting other training after basic or IT and get them out of the way. It's easier that way. Not sure if AB or Air Assault training is offered to non combat MOS's, but it adds to promo points and badges/insignia/tabs/berets are bragging rights as well.

Not trying to dis my fellow ARMY brothers, but Air Force and NAVY were always impressive with their tech schools.....

famosbrown

yes...Airbourne and Air Assault are offered for non-combat MOS's. It's just up to the command if they are willing to fund it and who gets it. This is from the Army Reserve perspective. They are now offereing it to almost anyone because it is making those soldier more deployable in combat areas and makes the cross-training easier when a Chairbourne 42L goes grunting with the 11B or 13B's for a year in the Middle East .

networker050184

Airborne! Former 82nd guy here so you know I'm seconding the suggestion to go that route

motogpman

OOOHHH Rah! Nothin like the Airborne shuffle 24/7.... Agreed with above statements. If you don't have those types of schools written in before you get to your first duty station, unless things have changed that much, you will probably be SOL since it comes out of the unit's "party" funds. Not to mention, that after basic you should still be in the frame of mind and physical shape to take the abuse and love from the cadre. God, I miss those days..gettin old sucks!

Either way, just make sure that it is what you REALLY want to do and not for just one reason.

PS... Air force and Navy Basic are NOT the same as the ARMY basic in terms of difficulty, as someone basically stated earlier. I have seen prior AF and Navy personnel break and get out of basic for various reasons. Not knocking the other branches, just wanted to clear that up, mainly due to the roles of each branch being different. ChairBorne.... LOL, haven't heard that in awhile.

oo_snoopy

motogpman wrote:

Snoopy.... Soldiers following orders is what soldiers do. Agreed that there are some real walking cluster's around, but since you do not wear a uniform and probably not with the soldiers 24/7, then there may be more going on in the background that you are not aware of. It is hard for non miliary individuals to comprehend why things are done to a "T." There are procedures to follow and a reason for it. Communication is the key and if a soldier can't speak up then he shouldn't be wearing the uniform or basic didn't issue a pair of balls to that soldier. Not trying to be an ass, but when a civi who has not actually earned the right to wear any service uniform makes statements similar to yours, I just can't get the reasoning behind it. Two different worlds. If you civi boss explicitly told you to do something and you disagreed, does that mean you would quit your job if he didn't budge? Or would you end up doing as told?

If my boss did something that was very detrimental to our network, yes I would refuse to do it, and I would take it to his boss. If he happens to run the company and I don't agree with what's he's doing I probably need to find a new place to work. Doing that in the military could get you court marshaled, no?

I'm not trying to be an ass, but most people learn how to be soldiers in the service, most people in the private sector learn how to be innovate and think for themselves, something soldiers are not trained to do, and for good reasons. I have a lot of respect for anyone who serves this country, but from my many experiences, I find that most service members have trouble thinking outside the box.

networker050184

oo_snoopy wrote:

If my boss did something that was very detrimental to our network, yes I would refuse to do it, and I would take it to his boss. If he happens to run the company and I don't agree with what's he's doing I probably need to find a new place to work. Doing that in the military could get you court marshaled, no?

I'm not trying to be an ass, but most people learn how to be soldiers in the service, most people in the private sector learn how to be innovate and think for themselves, something soldiers are not trained to do, and for good reasons. I have a lot of respect for anyone who serves this country, but from my many experiences, I find that most service members have trouble thinking outside the box.

You have obviously never served with a view about the military as obscured as yours. Soldiers are trained to be very innovative and trained to think for themselves in the most stressful situations. Serving as an IT soldier, especially over seas, you run into a lot of IT issues that you would never see in the civilian world. On top of that they must be solved or a work around implemented immediately or lives could be on the line!

Your views of the differences between the military and civilian world are dead wrong my friend. Take it from someone who has walked in both shoes.

Mrock4

networker050184 wrote:

Airborne! Former 82nd guy here so you know I'm seconding the suggestion to go that route

"Back at bragg..."


The former/current Army people will get that...especially prior 82nd guys

famosbrown

oo_snoopy wrote:

If my boss did something that was very detrimental to our network, yes I would refuse to do it, and I would take it to his boss. If he happens to run the company and I don't agree with what's he's doing I probably need to find a new place to work. Doing that in the military could get you court marshaled, no?

I'm not trying to be an ass, but most people learn how to be soldiers in the service, most people in the private sector learn how to be innovate and think for themselves, something soldiers are not trained to do, and for good reasons. I have a lot of respect for anyone who serves this country, but from my many experiences, I find that most service members have trouble thinking outside the box.

I actually understand where you are coming from either if you have heard it or seen it as a civilian. Through Basic Training, soldiers are broken down and learn to do and not think. This is due to the break down to get the training needed in the soldier. Sometimes prior experiences, thoughts, etc. can hinder proper training, learning new protocols and procedures, and taking orders. However, there would be NO leadership if they continued throughout the military service not thinking. After we get you broken down, we now build you back up. There are plenty of opportunities to think outside the box even through Basic Training when you are on an obstacle course where you are given material or scenarios that as a team or individual you have to overcome. It is amazing how there are so many different solutions to certain problems and you see that when soldiers are given the opportunity to think and create. After training, soldiers are definitely thinking...especially if they have a thinking type of job like I.T. Even 11B's have to think and not always go by what a FM says...should you go in Assault, Recon, shoot first mission, artillary support, flanking methods, camo methods, etc., etc. I could go on forever, but hopefully you've got the point.

I do see some soldiers that still just do and not think, but in my experience, it has been due to lack of confidence. I've resolved this by ensuring the soldiers ability, given he/she an opportunity to lead, and provide a little mentoring. This do and not think is sometimes the result of a leader who is very Authoritative and Direct, so the soldier has no choice unless it violates an AR or something else not right that can be proved in court through writing. An example of scenarios like this is a Butter Bar right out of some college ROTC who thinks he knows everything and don't need the NCO's...you let him/her fall on their face once and then they realize that seasoned NCO's might know what they are doing...just an example .

Just like anywhere else, you shouldn't be working to go against everything your leadership is doing...that isn't thinking outside the box, but it's trying to compete. Learn to follow, so you can learn to lead.