What type of College degrees are required?

Mikozee

I'm only 17, but I plan on earning my MCSA, MCSE, and MCITP degree by the time I'm 19 and I already plan on having a career in the IT field.

Certifications are great and all, but what type of degree should I aim for in College? I was thinking maybe MBA but I'm not sure yet.

As a matter of fact, do you even need to go to College to get into the IT field? Would certifications suffice?

undomiel

You are going to get a wide variety of opinions on this. This is from my experience. You can get into IT without a college degree. I have certainly done so. Certifications definitely help, but remember they are just a tool to open the door to the interview. They don't automatically guarantee you anything of a job. Most important is putting in lots of hard work so that you're an expert at what you can do, and then be able to sell yourself. Get as much experience as you can early on as that will smooth the path in later years when you are moving up the ladder. Work on those networking skills, and I am reviewing to the human variety.

By the way, if you do decide to go to college make sure to get work experience during it in the field. And try not to take out any loans. Debt is evil.

phantasm

One thing I've noticed is that all the Network Engineers I know have B.S. degrees in either Comp Sci or som type of engineering. On the other hand, 80% of the Tier I techs I know don't have a B.S. degree.

I in the crowd that says get a B.S. degree and certs. Most importantly get experience.

shednik

undomiel wrote: »

By the way, if you do decide to go to college make sure to get work experience during it in the field. And try not to take out any loans. Debt is evil.

Typical undomiel response

I will throw my vote to do the exact opposite if needed...like many others have said throughout the forum. Student loans are not a bad thing within reason ie taking out only what is needed. I could go on and on but I think linking to eMeS's post. He sums it up perfectly and always gives great advice, give it a look. http://www.techexams.net/forums/jobs-degrees/44013-looking-accredited-online-universities-2.html#post324114

I'm a big fan for education...I wouldn't be making what I'm making today if I didn't have my BS and I wouldn't be working on a 90% free masters either, my company generally requires a BS degree to get hired unless you have been working for a very very long time. Bets of luck to whatever you decide. CompSci usually will get my vote for someone to stay technical, Information Systems for a mix of business and technology. I know alot of people who also have gotten something like a business management/criminology degree with a minor in comp sci. Really there are a lot of beneficial degrees that can pertain to IT.

Forsaken_GA

I agree with Undomiel 100%. Work your ass off to get grant or scholarship money, avoid debt at all costs. There's alot of free money out there, and you should apply for everything. You may get rejected 97% of the time, but depending on the volume you do, that 3% might pay for your entire ride. Barring that, make sure you have a job and work your behind off to pay for your own tuition. You will be much better if you come out of school with a degree and no debt than a degree and student loan debt that you're going to take 10 to 20 years to pay off because 'the payments and interest rate is so low!'

the_Grinch

I have loans....avoid them at all costs. With this economy my student loans take up most of my paycheck. Minus the job I just got, I could have gotten all of my other jobs without a degree. That being said, get the degree. Most jobs I see want a 4 year degree plus certs. If I could do it all over again this is what I would have done. First, go to a community college. Get the AS or AA and then transfer to a 4 year school. Everybody offers a BS in IS, IT, or CS. While in community college work as close to full time in the field as you can. I'd even go as far as to say get a full time job and take 2 course a semester, more if you can. Let's say you follow this plan (use Summer time and college breaks to get certifications) and we'll put your graduation time at 6 years (for the BS). You'd have 6 years of experience, two degrees, and certifications. That would allow you probably avoid helpdesk related roles most likely.

If I could go back and do it all over I would have joined the National Guard. I was going to join, but my parents freaked and went on the "you will die" and "we won't support you" blah blah blah. New Jersey has a very nice setup where you can take up to 15 credits a semester completely free (you buy books) if your in the National Guard. They will cover all the way to the PhD, JD, and MD levels. It basically would have worked out that I would have made about $1200 a month while in school. Which means, no working beyond the one weekend a month and two weeks a year. Plus I would have gotten some hands on technical training to go with my schooling and a security clearance. I would have also been to Iraq at least twice, but wouldn't have the student loans I have now!

Good luck!

apd123

phantasm wrote: »

One thing I've noticed is that all the Network Engineers I know have B.S. degrees in either Comp Sci or som type of engineering. On the other hand, 80% of the Tier I techs I know don't have a B.S. degree.

I in the crowd that says get a B.S. degree and certs. Most importantly get experience.

The evidence presented here is presumptuous and anecdotal yet I agree with the major points. I would argue that the success of the individuals mentioned has many variables such as the motivation and commitment they demonstrated by pursuing a degree.

sagewalkinthere

I found this article yesterday by accident: Is a college degree worthless? - MSN Money

Mikozee, I would encourage you to at least get an associate's degree. A bachelor's would be even better. But I also advise you to avoid school debt. Work through college if you have to - that's how I got my AAS degree. And I am VERY glad I didn't have to go into debt for that. Maybe if you can't get through a BS degree right now, get an associate's and then get some experiance and go to school and work at the same time to finish you BS.

Just my 2 cents.

P.S. I expect to go back and finish my BS after a couple of years of saving up, so I can afford it.

skrpune

wow, um, wow. Who knew this was such a controversial subject?!

Anywho, I'll try to not be inflammatory here. There is nothing required per se to work in any field. But the more ammo you have, the better prepared you'll be for the tasks ahead of you. If you can get degrees and certs, then you're a step ahead of people with just a degree or just certs. And any edge you can get over the competition is helpful.

What type of degree you go after really depends on what you want to do and who you want to work for. If you're going for a large corporate environment, you may need a bachelors. If you want to move up into management, you might need a masters (probably an MBA more so than an MS). If you want to teach or do research, then the MS (or hell, even Ph.d.!) path would be most appropriate.

I say take some time to figure out what interests you and start small and work up from there. Start perusing job listings & see which jobs sound like something you'd want to do & see what the requirements are. Of course, requirements and software and technology will change over time, but it will give you a starting point and will get your wheels turning.

If you do want to get a bachelors, you can save yourself OODLES of money in the long run by going to a community college for an associates, then moving on to a university for your bachelors. Just check with universities first to see if they have certain "preferred" associates programs that will transfer over...it would suck big time to go through a two year program at a community college only to find that you've got to redo a bunch of classes.

Nuwin

skrpune wrote: »

If you do want to get a bachelors, you can save yourself OODLES of money in the long run by going to a community college for an associates, then moving on to a university for your bachelors. Just check with universities first to see if they have certain "preferred" associates programs that will transfer over...it would suck big time to go through a two year program at a community college only to find that you've got to redo a bunch of classes.

+1 on this advice. Find the university of your choice and find out what they will accept for transfer credits. In my area, the local community colleges have dedicated transfer programs to the state universities. You won't get an associates out of the deal, but you will get all of your general education credits knocked out at a much cheaper rate and still have a degree from a respectable school in the end.

As for worth of a degree, who really knows. It probably goes more to what you put into it than the paper itself. I have peers on both sides of the fence with degrees. Those who have done well and those who haven't gotten much return from their school. I also have peers with no formal education who are doing quite well for themselves. However, when it boils down to two resumes side by side, having a trifecta of education, certs, and experience can only help you get the interview over the other who may only have 1/3 or 2/3 of the equation. Especially early in your career as I believe experience can carry the heaviest weight.

skrpune

jryantech wrote: »

That Article is only relevant if you start with $16,594 in the bank. And it talks about investing it in the stock market via mutual fund. When in this day and age laddering CDs is safer and might actually earn you more.

If you want to literally interpret the article, then yes, fine, you're right. But it is just an example and the author says as much and says it's a crude one at that. If the author had stated "each saves exactly $4,532.." or $8,675" or any other dollar figure instead, then it would still be the same article with the same point, just with different final numbers.

And not that I'm some investment guru, but CD's kinda suck for long term earnings. As crazy as it sounds, the stock market is a great investment in the long term and historically will give you higher returns.

Nuwin

I was able to make decent cash before I even finished my associates. I think my path towards my degree follows msteinhilber's more than the one prescribed to me by my high school guidance counselors. I dropped out of college on my first attempt and got going in the working world for a while, got married, bought the house, etc. I am forever grateful for this because if I would have finished the first time, I'd have a degree that is basically useless because I realized it wasn't what I really wanted to do.

The path is different for everyone, so blanket statements are tough to quantify.

One thing I think we're neglecting to mention is that sometimes, it has nothing to do with what you know, but who you know. Never underestimate the value of a good network of peers and colleagues. They can be like the hidden doors & levels in a video game. They're not visible to the general public.

skrpune

Nuwin wrote: »

The path is different for everyone, so blanket statements are tough to quantify.

One thing I think we're neglecting to mention is that sometimes, it has nothing to do with what you know, but who you know. Never underestimate the value of a good network of peers and colleges. They can be like the hidden doors & levels in a video game. They're not visible to the general public.

I couldn't agree more with these statements. There are many different paths to the same destination, and who you know can be the difference between getting a job and not even knowing the position existed in the first place.

eMeS

You managed to plant one of the "land mine" topics here...there are just as many opinions as there are a-holes...maybe more.

Here's the good news. You're probably young, which means you have time to think about all of this and figure out what is right for you. You also have time to make some bad decisions and recover from them (we all do). I applaud you for doing the research and asking about it. If I had this to do over again, the advice that I would like most of all to have received would be something along the lines of "Finish your undergrad from as good a school as you can get into (and afford) in as little time as possible". This one decision can then drive all other decisions about loans, work, etc...

One thing I learned early on in school was to load up on hours during the summer sessions.

I finished undergrad in just about 4 years, but I could have definitely done undergrad in 3 years with the right guidance, and at a lower cost. I also worked full-time in IT, and generally kept very busy. Not that I'm some superman or something, but I really think that if you know what your goals are and stay focused on them, then undergrad can be completed relatively quickly...I've known several people that have done it, including my wife, who did her degree in right at 3 years.

Best of luck,

MS

networker050184

What is required will very depending on the position. The more qualifications you have under your belt the more positions you will qualify for.

Nuwin

After watching this thread deteriorate, there is a hidden, but very valuable lesson here that hopefully all of us can learn from.

The written word is one of the most difficult mediums for communication. Once the words are written, that is all you have to pass your message. Verbal (telephone) or face-to-face communications all have secondary methods for conveying a message. Voice inflection and/or body posture & language can help express meaning and intent with a message. Especially when the topic may be considered controversial.

Agree or disagree aside, jryantech has provided a valid opinion on this subject. However, the tone of his posts come across very strong, harsh, and cocky. Perhaps he even intends to do this. However, if you post or write something that you may seem as just another opinion and people jump all over you for it (repeatedly), perhaps you need to step back and evaluate just how you are writing.

It is a lesson I learned the hard way. I was very confident in myself and took a strong tone early in life. Regardless of how right (or wrong) I was, the senior members of the team did not appreciate my tone and quickly jumped on me for it.

As much as I hated them, I got a lot out of all of my writing classes throughout my education. Because of the difficulty the written medium presents, it takes time and lots of practice to master. It can be very difficult to effectively present an opinion in a neutral, intimidating fashion. Especially if it contradicts what others are saying. Unlike your friends, the "average joe" isn't going to know your writing style or personality. They may interpret your words differently than you intended.

Keep this in mind, not only here on these forums, but in all aspects of life. We seem to be moving more towards written communication by e-mail, so this isn't a skill that can be brushed aside lightly.

If nothing else, hopefully it can keep things much more civil. I hate to see a new member have a thread get crapped on by our own disdain for other members. As in life, not everyone will get along. It doesn't mean we should be disrespectful.

Well, that's my rant for the day. Take it for what it's worth. I've yet to master the written word myself.

sagewalkinthere

Nuwin wrote: »

After watching this thread deteriorate, there is a hidden, but very valuable lesson here that hopefully all of us can learn from....

Well, that's my rant for the day. Take it for what it's worth. I've yet to master the written word myself.

Awesome post man.

eMeS

HeroPsycho wrote: »

Dude, eMes if you noticed in the previous post where a lot of people ended up slamming you didn't, and now even he's pretty much had it with you, too.

I got nothing against you personally either, despite my post in that thread telling you to uh... stop , but you seriously make it really hard for people to interact with you in a positive manner.

You can keep attempting to frame this as a problem with other people not accepting healthy debate from you, or you could realize that the way you're communicating isn't healthy.

Actually I don't think that jryan's thoughts are necessarily totally out of whack in all cases...I think (and this will mirror what Hero and others have said), it's more in the way that the ideas are presented that seems to set people off....

I have nothing personally against anyone here either. We're all going to be different and we're all going to have different thoughts. The original topic of this thread was education, and part of the value of education is being able to logically synthesize different thoughts in order to accomplish things and achieve value.

I can tell you all, I took a class once in undergrad as a junior-level elective, primarily because I thought it was going to be easy. It was called "Philosophy of Law". I hated the class. We read really exciting crap like Richard Posner. One reason I hated the class was because it was a M-W-F class, and on Friday's were tough because Thursday nights was $1 drink night at a nearby bar where I would chase skirts....Another reason was because it was a total beatdown.

However, I learned something really valuable in this class, that I have regularly used since then. It's called the Hegelian Dialectic ( Dialectic ). I end up in many contentious situations regularly in my work. One of the things where I see people fail quite a bit in business is having to always be "right". The dialectic technique, when used properly, is one of the best ways to come to a shared understanding that everyone can accept. Some people intuitively know this and know how to do it. Others like me had to explicitly learn it.

My point is, I probably could have done well in my career without having attended college. There would have likely been some limitations, but there are ways around all of that. However, because I did attend college, not only did I get a piece of paper that happens to be a pre-requisite for many jobs, I also learned some valuable things that I do apply, such as the dialectic. This can be one of the most useful systems analysis/business analysis/requirements gathering techniques out there, and without having attended college and taking a class that I really hated, I wouldn't have learned it.

MS