What's in demand, not really requiring experience?

Dr_Atomic

I'm curious if there's an IT area which is either in big demand or in short supply, not so much requiring/demanding experience? Something which can pay well if one applies himself and studies hard through self-study.

L0gicB0mb508

I don't really think there is an area in IT that doesnt require experience period . I don't think there is a quick fix to getting into a good job especially in today's market. You'll just have to start at the bottom and work your way up.

grunjhed

Qualified and experience DBAs and SQL Devs are always in short supply. But as above, the requirements are always stacked towards experience and relevant certification. No quick fix for a job though, and it can be tough to break into.

exampasser

I'm in the same boat as you Dr Atomic. I have my associates(and working on my bachelor's) and a certification but zero job experience. I've only had two part time jobs, so when employers see that I have very little general work experience, it might be a struggle just to get a simple entry-level job. I hope I don't end up being forced to work somewhere like at a restaurant again just for general work experience.

NetworkingStudent

Dr_Atomic wrote: »

I'm curious if there's an IT area which is either in big demand or in short supply, not so much requiring/demanding experience? Something which can pay well if one applies himself and studies hard through self-study.

The one part of IT that you can break into is help desk. I have seen requirements ranging from requiring a B.A., to just having an A.A.S degree in IT. I have seen some companies ask for certain certs, and that might just be enough to get your foot in the door. I imagine that with an A+ and Network+ certification, that you would have a better shot at getting a help desk job. Also, I would try to get your resume together, and give it to these agencies Have you tired the following Job search engine websites?
Type Tek systems.com in the google search bar(this foroum wouldn't let me post the link,sorry)
Robert Half Technology - Home
Dice.com - Job Search for Technology Professionals
CareerBuilder.com Jobs - The Largest Job Search, Employment & Careers Site
Find Jobs. Build a Better Career. Find Your Calling. | Monster.com
Good luck

JoJoCal19

exampasser wrote: »

I'm in the same boat as you Dr Atomic. I have my associates(and working on my bachelor's) and a certification but zero job experience. I've only had two part time jobs, so when employers see that I have very little general work experience, it might be a struggle just to get a simple entry-level job. I hope I don't end up being forced to work somewhere like at a restaurant again just for general work experience.

Yes that is the biggest challenge facing people new to IT. IT favors experience no matter what the job is and the trouble is, getting that experience. I always tell people, IT can be very hard to break into, but once you do your possibilities are only limited by what you put into it. The problems of breaking into IT are only compounded by the economy and jobs market right now.

The most common route in is picking up an entry level Help Desk or Desktop support role after you have a degree and/or basic certs like A+/Network+.

exampasser

JoJoCal19 wrote: »

Yes that is the biggest challenge facing people new to IT. IT favors experience no matter what the job is and the trouble is, getting that experience. I always tell people, IT can be very hard to break into, but once you do your possibilities are only limited by what you put into it. The problems of breaking into IT are only compounded by the economy and jobs market right now.

The most common route in is picking up an entry level Help Desk or Desktop support role after you have a degree and/or basic certs like A+/Network+.

A help desk/support job would be my best bet.
I really don't want to have to shell out around $400 on the A+ if I don't have too. At least I can brag that I graduated with a 4.0 gpa for my associates degree .

L0gicB0mb508

You're just goina have to do your time in the trenches. There is no way really around it.

vCole

exampasser wrote: »

A help desk/support job would be my best bet.
I really don't want to have to shell out around $400 on the A+ if I don't have too. At least I can brag that I graduated with a 4.0 gpa for my associates degree .

You can get you MCDST for $120 (Two exams @ $60/each) which would be a safe bet + your Associates.

Dr_Atomic

L0gicB0mb508 wrote: »

You're just goina have to do your time in the trenches. There is no way really around it.

Not necessarily. I have a bachelor's degree already (non-IT), and I haven't decided if I want to go back and get my master's or try IT - or even do nursing. At least in these, when an employer sees you've completed the training, you can be reasonably sure to get a job that pays fairly decently without having to accumulate years of low-paying experience first. After all, I have a family to support.

Turgon

Dr_Atomic wrote: »

Not necessarily. I have a bachelor's degree already (non-IT), and I haven't decided if I want to go back and get my master's or try IT - or even do nursing. At least in these, when an employer sees you've completed the training, you can be reasonably sure to get a job that pays fairly decently without having to accumulate years of low-paying experience first. After all, I have a family to support.

I don't know what the rates are for nurses in the US but in the UK they are shocking if you qualify and dont have experience.

L0gicB0mb508

Dr_Atomic wrote: »

Not necessarily. I have a bachelor's degree already (non-IT), and I haven't decided if I want to go back and get my master's or try IT - or even do nursing. At least in these, when an employer sees you've completed the training, you can be reasonably sure to get a job that pays fairly decently without having to accumulate years of low-paying experience first. After all, I have a family to support.

The degree is a piece of paper. It looks great, but it's not going to help you perform on the job. I'm not saying you can't move up in IT quickly. I'm just saying that to start out, you'll probably be doing some lower level pc support. If IT is really what you want to do, then stick with it and move up. I really don't want to discourage you, but I also dont want you to have super high expectations to be let down. I know some employers will hire you based on some certs and a degree, but you are going to get in over your head really quickly if you get some upper-level engineer position. Sometimes you have to take a step back, to get where you want to go in your job/life. Please don't take any of this as flaming you or anything else, I'm just giving you my opinion.

Turgon

L0gicB0mb508 wrote: »

The degree is a piece of paper. It looks great, but it's not going to help you perform on the job. I'm not saying you can't move up in IT quickly. I'm just saying that to start out, you'll probably be doing some lower level pc support. If IT is really what you want to do, then stick with it and move up. I really don't want to discourage you, but I also dont want you to have super high expectations to be let down. I know some employers will hire you based on some certs and a degree, but you are going to get in over your head really quickly if you get some upper-level engineer position. Sometimes you have to take a step back, to get where you want to go in your job/life. Please don't take any of this as flaming you or anything else, I'm just giving you my opinion.

To be honest with degrees and post graduate degrees (I have both), I found that they could help you a little bit to get your first job in IT. You either went one of two ways with them. If you had exceptional grades from good schools, or knew the right people who could open doors and push your paperwork along or you were lucky, or some or all of these, you could be taken on by a big firm and fast tracked into managerial positions. You kind of bypassed the technical details in some senses there as you would have specialists to call upon who took care of the detail for you while you tried to impress the company with your ability to handle things. Junior Project Manager postions Im talking about here. Alternatively you started in the grunt support ranks and had to learn everything on the job. That's how I started and really what was learned at University was not a good fit *practically* for the sorts of things I had to do in my first job. I had to learn everything. That said, as my career has escalated the University background has really added more and more value because it's there and many companies like to see a graduate footprint for more senior roles. I find more *application* for some of the theory as well as I went more high level and in some cases for the low level networking I moved towards. It's funny, there I was in my first job and I had received hours of instruction at University on how ISDN, Token Ring, Ethernet and TCP worked and sat examinations in it, I was miles ahead of my peers at work on all the theory which they were oblivious to, and yet I needed lots of help from them to learn the practical *clicky clicky* to get an IBM PC with Windows 3.11 and an Olicom T/R card hooked up properly to the Novell network.

Dr_Atomic

Turgon wrote: »

To be honest with degrees and post graduate degrees (I have both), I found that they could help you a little bit to get your first job in IT. You either went one of two ways with them. If you had exceptional grades from good schools, or knew the right people who could open doors and push your paperwork along or you were lucky, or some or all of these, you could be taken on by a big firm and fast tracked into managerial positions. You kind of bypassed the technical details in some senses there as you would have specialists to call upon who took care of the detail for you while you tried to impress the company with your ability to handle things. Junior Project Manager postions Im talking about here. Alternatively you started in the grunt support ranks and had to learn everything on the job. That's how I started and really what was learned at University was not a good fit *practically* for the sorts of things I had to do in my first job. I had to learn everything. That said, as my career has escalated the University background has really added more and more value because it's there and many companies like to see a graduate footprint for more senior roles. I find more *application* for some of the theory as well as I went more high level and in some cases for the low level networking I moved towards. It's funny, there I was in my first job and I had received hours of instruction at University on how ISDN, Token Ring, Ethernet and TCP worked and sat examinations in it, I was miles ahead of my peers at work on all the theory which they were oblivious to, and yet I needed lots of help from them to learn the practical *clicky clicky* to get an IBM PC with Windows 3.11 and an Olicom T/R card hooked up properly to the Novell network.

Maybe you misunderstood. When I mentioned getting a graduate degree, I meant something in a non-IT area (that I could build on from my B.A.) For now, although I got my CCNA and a NOC job with it, it's only taking me so far, and I had wanted to go into voice (like a CCVP), but there's absolutely no use for it at my current job, and if I got a VP, I'd be applying for jobs with zero paid voice experience. And from looking at the job boards, working toward such a difficult goal would be a colossal waste of time, since they all *really* want a CCIE *and* 5-7 years of experience - buuuuuuutttt they'll grudgingly take a CCVP with 10 years experience and a laundy list of other certs scrolling down my arm, all seemingly "required" for the job.

So - I need to learn something more than the CCNA that I have now. I have no problem studying, but I've been studying hard now for over 3 years, and I don't want to waste any more time studying a topic that won't get me any return on my hard work (and money) and where employers won't be sighing and looking on the back of my one-sided resume searchingly, asking me "So you don't have *any* experience with this certiification?"

Turgon

Dr_Atomic wrote: »

Maybe you misunderstood. When I mentioned getting a graduate degree, I meant something in a non-IT area (that I could build on from my B.A.) For now, although I got my CCNA and a NOC job with it, it's only taking me so far, and I had wanted to go into voice (like a CCVP), but there's absolutely no use for it at my current job, and if I got a VP, I'd be applying for jobs with zero paid voice experience. And from looking at the job boards, working toward such a difficult goal would be a colossal waste of time, since they all *really* want a CCIE *and* 5-7 years of experience - buuuuuuutttt they'll grudgingly take a CCVP with 10 years experience and a laundy list of other certs scrolling down my arm, all seemingly "required" for the job.

So - I need to learn something more than the CCNA that I have now. I have no problem studying, but I've been studying hard now for over 3 years, and I don't want to waste any more time studying a topic that won't get me any return on my hard work (and money) and where employers won't be sighing and looking on the back of my one-sided resume searchingly, asking me "So you don't have *any* experience with this certiification?"

To be honest with you I agree it's very easy to burn a lot of time and money getting through tracks. Use what you have and your desire to work at the advanced certifications in Voice as a lever to get a start in a company that *is* doing it. I fully appreciate the problem of companies asking for the earth but to be honest there isn't anything new in that. There's quite a lot of hopes pinned on voice at present as a means of getting costs down so *everyone* is trying to pass themselves off as being a provider of voice services.

The fact is there is a lot of activity going on within companies to get those skills either by bringing them in or by rapidly training the people they have. So there may be an opportunity for you to get your foot in the door somewhere providing you can sell your potential even without a CCVP. You just have to come up with the goods in the interview and when you get a start.

Getting a graduate degree isn't a bad idea so long as you have the time and the finance and you are sure it will either lead you where you wish to go or if not that, it is something you really want to do.

Dr_Atomic

Turgon wrote: »

Use what you have and your desire to work at the advanced certifications in Voice as a lever to get a start in a company that *is* doing it. I fully appreciate the problem of companies asking for the earth but to be honest there isn't anything new in that. There's quite a lot of hopes pinned on voice at present as a means of getting costs down so *everyone* is trying to pass themselves off as being a provider of voice services.

The fact is there is a lot of activity going on within companies to get those skills either by bringing them in or by rapidly training the people they have. So there may be an opportunity for you to get your foot in the door somewhere providing you can sell your potential even without a CCVP. You just have to come up with the goods in the interview and when you get a start.

I hope you're right, but so far I've had no success with my resume. Up to now, no one wants anyone in voice without experience. After months of looking, I've not seen a single job opening in voice where they either said they'd train or it was "entry level." You'd think with VoIP opening up like it is, there would be tons of jobs in it, but the economy has seemingly driven all the experienced, certified (and oftentimes umemployed) people into the arms of the low-paying or jr. level jobs. All the employers are expecting their voice applicants to have experience already - and at least a CCVP.

Maybe I'm wrong with all of this, but I haven't seen it yet. Which is why I'm looking outside of voice for something possibly less demanding.

Kasor

Programmer and developer are the only two area that I know always looking for entry level.

shodown

L0gicB0mb508 wrote: »

The degree is a piece of paper. It looks great, but it's not going to help you perform on the job. I'm not saying you can't move up in IT quickly. I'm just saying that to start out, you'll probably be doing some lower level pc support. If IT is really what you want to do, then stick with it and move up. I really don't want to discourage you, but I also dont want you to have super high expectations to be let down. I know some employers will hire you based on some certs and a degree, but you are going to get in over your head really quickly if you get some upper-level engineer position. Sometimes you have to take a step back, to get where you want to go in your job/life. Please don't take any of this as flaming you or anything else, I'm just giving you my opinion.

My dad warned me about this in general and he has only worked a general labor his entire life. I was applying for a position that would have been too much. It came down to me and some other guy. I ended up telling HR I would take the support engineer position and the other guy took the position as a level 1 network engineer. He messed up on his first few deployments and when lay off time came around needless to say he was easy to get rid of as he wasn't what they expected. That could have just as easily been me. As it has already been said there are very few ways to get somewhere without putting in the work and time.

Dr_Atomic

Kasor wrote: »

Programmer and developer are the only two area that I know always looking for entry level.

I had considered programming, but I've heard that it's too easy for employers to just outsource the needed code to India or somewhere, and get it emailed back? It's entirely possible I could be wrong on that. However, what do you know about programming? Is it possible to be self-taught in programming without getting the degree (it would be a very long, expensive path for me)? I know it would be better to have the sheepskin, but I couldn't afford it. But the idea of it being in demand enough for employers to hire without experience (possibly) is an attractive suggestion.

Turgon

Dr_Atomic wrote: »

I hope you're right, but so far I've had no success with my resume. Up to now, no one wants anyone in voice without experience. After months of looking, I've not seen a single job opening in voice where they either said they'd train or it was "entry level." You'd think with VoIP opening up like it is, there would be tons of jobs in it, but the economy has seemingly driven all the experienced, certified (and oftentimes umemployed) people into the arms of the low-paying or jr. level jobs. All the employers are expecting their voice applicants to have experience already - and at least a CCVP.

Maybe I'm wrong with all of this, but I haven't seen it yet. Which is why I'm looking outside of voice for something possibly less demanding.

Try a covering letter and write directly to all the Cisco Partners in your area and beyond. Of course everyone is looking for experienced people but you may still get a start. I saw a job advertised in the UK by one company that needed someone to visit site and install IP telephones. Little money but it's a way in.

BigTex71

Don't forget the IT recruiting firms.

etbjr182

FadeToBright wrote: »

You can get you MCDST for $120 (Two exams @ $60/each) which would be a safe bet + your Associates.

How did you find the MCDST exams for $60 each? The lowest I found was $109. Unless ebay? Also are they still offering this cert? I couldn't find it on the prometric site?? Thanks in advance

veritas_libertas

The MCDST is made up of two certifications.

http://www.microsoft.com/learning/en/us/certification/mcdst.aspx?#tab2

TheShadow

etbjr182 wrote: »

How did you find the MCDST exams for $60 each? The lowest I found was $109. Unless ebay? Also are they still offering this cert? I couldn't find it on the prometric site?? Thanks in advance

You have to wait for the deals, they just had a two for one sale last month on selected exams. The current discounts for the end of the year are here.

Microsoft Career Offer: Get up to 25% off Select Microsoft Certification Exams

etbjr182

TheShadow wrote: »

You have to wait for the deals, they just had a two for one sale last month on selected exams. The current discounts for the end of the year are here.

Microsoft Career Offer: Get up to 25% off Select Microsoft Certification Exams

Oh awesome thanks! do you know how long they are going to have this exam?? One would think they will still be around for awhile...I want to do the MCDST after I get my A+