Masters Degree

votek

Hello everyone,

I've been on a forum for a short time now, I've found so many great resources, so it's good to be here. I did a quick search to see if there were any existing topics on getting your masters, hopefully I didn't miss a thread.

Anyway- getting to the point, I'm trying to figure out if it's worthwhile of continuing my education and getting my masters in Information Assurance. I'm looking for ways to improve myself as an individual and sort of making myself recession proof in the event I do lose my job, I have the education and credentials to find a new job easily. Right now I'm in an entry level position for a small company where I deal with systems engineering, networking hardware, supporting work machines and coming up with business processes.

What do you guys/gals think? Does anyone have their masters and care to share how getting a masters helped them career wise?

Thanks

tpatt100

It depends on many things. If you do a search on this forum there have been many topics created that deal with your question about a masters degree

jgiambr

I'm am pretty cynical about this issue because I think my decision several years ago really hurt my career. Six years ago, I took out a $25k loan so I could get a Masters degree in Computer\Network security. I got my degree but now six years later I still cannot break into the security field. The problem, I believe, is that HR screeners are so fixated on certifications. If you don't have Security+, SANS, or CISSP you won't make it it passed them. Six years ago Security+ was not as well known as it is today and for CISSP you had to have security exp so I chose the degree route. SANS, of course, were very expensive.

Looking back, I wish I would have taken that 25k and built my own networking\security lab at home with it and pursued SANS certifications. Frankly, I don't think my Masters counts for much. So here I am today studying for a Security+ exam. Studying again the exact same stuff I did for my masters only now I have a 25k loan to pay off.

The main thing you need is hands-on experience and security certs. I have been able to beg for some hands-on here an there but without certs you don't get a 2nd look and HR people who don't understand what the certs mean (or a Masters for that matter) they just look for that all important acronym.

For 25k I could have built myself a sweet lab and pursued as many certs as I wanted too. This would have put me in a better situation then a Masters degree.

Sorry to be such a downer but I cringe when I see people ask this question here. I just don't think a masters degree means that much in this industry. Build a lab, get hands-on experience and go for a well respected cert instead. That is my cynical opinion anyway.

chrisone

Dead on the spot for previous post^^^

I do not think a masters in IT is worth it. I am not down playing the title of a masters degree and its worth in society, just questioning its worth in a field driven by certifications and experience. After one completes his masters you will still study for certifications as employers will be looking for that stuff, its just reality. If anyone believe IT hiring managers do not care or dont look for certifications you are truely mistaken.

The second problem with this scenario is that you will end up oweing more than 80 grand or more depending on what school you goto. I only got my A.S in computer science, i owed like 25 and i hate life because of it right now. When my bills started i was paying 400+ every month just on student loans. I am almost done with the student loans but you have no idea how many checks i litterally recieved and then gave away to pay off student loans. Geez my certifications got me my past two jobs anyways, i just got the degree just to show the family and my future kids that i went to school and graduated.

tpatt100

Getting a masters degree to "get a job" will usually get you nothing but disappointment. A degree like certs is and I said this before a multiplier . If you have no to little experience in security then it's zero times the degree. I only started a masters in security after working in the security field for 6 years or so and only did certs which was the Security+ and CISSP.

Now the reason I want a masters is because I am getting more project management type roles in my current job where I go to a lot of meetings, plan budgets for equipment and labor costs as well as implementation.

I hope that a masters will help me later when I get into project management full time

Cherper

chrisone wrote: »

I do not think a masters in IT is worth it. I am not down playing the title of a masters degree and its worth in society, just questioning its worth in a field driven by certifications and experience.

A masters in IT is probably not the best way to go. I have been looking into getting my masters and looked at getting one in IT, but it just didn't seem to be something that would really move you ahead. I am still looking at a masters, but now I am really looking at an MBA with an emphasis on IT. The program is your standard MBA type program, but the electives and projects focus on IT.

Getting a masters won't necessarily get you a job, but if you have a job, a masters can help you move into management.

votek

Thank you for the feedback guys. I will definitely take the input to heart.

darkerosxx

A masters degree, on a whole, can't do anything but help you in the long run. Where people get jaded about it is in thinking that it's a meal ticket. It's not and never will be, just like no single cert will ever be, either. You need to be a well-rounded candidate for it to really mean something and leverage its' worth.

historian1974

I agree. I wouldn't focus on an IT-centric Masters (maybe an exception being software engineering). I suggest pursuing an MBA. While that may not be IT focused, you're not limiting your options. An MBA can broaden the opportunites for you while you work to get to where you want to be. I'm certainly not suggesting an MBA will automatically punch your ticket, but again, you won't be limiting your options.

phantasm

I work with a guy with a Master's degree in Net Com. He sits two chairs over in Tier 1 with the rest of us. Food for thought.

GAngel

Depends where you go for your masters, where you live, the type of company you want to work for, and how much experience you already have. 30 years of schooling does not count as work experience.

You use a masters to enhance your "current skillset" especially IT degrees since you basically re-learn what you've been doing on the job all that time.

If universities wern't such money grubbing mercenary's all masters degrees would have an x amount of significant work experience to get in and there values would increase exponentially.

erpadmin

Based on my own personal experience, and talking with one of my younger friends who just graduated with a B.A., a Masters Degree will open some doors that previously may not have been available to you. His mommy and daddy work for the UN and provide him with above average means. He was telling me that you have to have a Masters in order to even get an interview with the UN. Not sure if that's true, but I'm inclined to take him at his word since both parents are there.

I have two certs (which aren't even relevant to what I currently do), and no degree. I have 13+ years of IT experience. I am fairly certain that if I wanted a job, I could get it if I were looking, but many jobs are now looking for a BS, at minimum. That whole "equivalent experience" is IMHO becoming irrelevant. You have to really prove you know what you're doing, or know someone prior to going for it for that to fly. (With the economy the way it is, the BS guy would probably BS his way into a job I could have gotten 3-5 years ago.)

An MBA would no doubt be worth it if you're looking into management at some point in your career. At that point, it's going to be what tier school you graduate from. Obviously, one from Harvard will look sweet than one from a tier-3 state school, but then some programs from those programs may fly. Getting a Masters Degree to break into sys/network (or even security!) admin work is definitely a complete waste of money and/or time. To get into management (even junior management)...not so much.

tpatt100

@phantasm check the Dept of Labor statistics for actual facts vs what is going around you which is ancedotal evidence

veritas_libertas

tpatt100 wrote: »

@phantasm check the Dept of Labor statistics for actual facts vs what is going around you which is ancedotal evidence

Do you have a suggested location on the Dept of Labor's web site? You got me curious so I have started searching through the site to find stats.

earweed

One of the things a lot of the major schools do is to REQUIRE you to have experience in the field you are seeking your masters in. This is a good policy because without experience in the field that Masters degree is just a piece of paper.
As tpatt100 said above the degree is a multiplier, if you're multiplying by 0 it's still 0. Get experience before getting that masters.

BradleyHU

darkerosxx wrote: »

A masters degree, on a whole, can't do anything but help you in the long run. Where people get jaded about it is in thinking that it's a meal ticket. It's not and never will be, just like no single cert will ever be, either. You need to be a well-rounded candidate for it to really mean something and leverage its' worth.

EGG-ZACTLY!!!

I'm already in the IT field...so for me to get a master's makes sense. and actually, i think MBAs are for those who want to go past mgmnt level position, and into exec/sr. exec level positions.

tpatt100

veritas_libertas wrote: »

Do you have a suggested location on the Dept of Labor's web site? You got me curious so I have started searching through the site to find stats.

Actually the Bureau of Labor statistics site is pretty interesting:

U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics

And the US Census Bureau is pretty interesting as well:

Data Access Tools from the Census Bureau

Usual Weekly Earnings Summary This is the first quarter report

By educational attainment, full-time workers age 25 and over without a high school diploma had median weekly earnings of $448, compared with $624 for high school graduates (no college) and $1,140 for those holding at least a bachelor's degree. Among college graduates with advanced degrees (professional or master's degree and above), the highest earning 10 percent of male workers made $3,319 or more per week, compared with $2,277 or more for their female counterparts. (See table 4.)

nel

its like the usual argument of certs vs degrees etc imo. individually they dont guarantee anything but when combined they grow to become that mighty force haha.

i too are at the stage where im thinking of a masters and i know in the long run it will be worth it as a 4 year degree is becoming the standard nowadays. A masters is best supplimented by experiance imo. Personally i dont see any harm in it being in an IT related field whether it be networking or security or something else etc - especially if you want to stay on a tech side. hell even if you want to go management it still proves you can work at a high level academically. i know several big companies in finance which dont employ folk in certain area's if they dont have a minimum academic experiance.

Also, everyone suggests a mba - which is something i strongly considered. after speaking to many many higher level folk both technical and management it became apparent it would mean jack (or very little at least) if i were young and without management experiance to have an MBA. again its something one usually attains once they are on the job. plus the HUGE cost of an MBA is another thing to consider.

just a few things for thought really...besides im not sure of your situation but i would rather do a masters at a reasonable age without a family than to realise you have to do one later with 10 kids running around

Good luck, i hope it works out for you!

veritas_libertas

tpatt100 wrote: »

Actually the Bureau of Labor statistics site is pretty interesting:

U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics

And the US Census Bureau is pretty interesting as well:

Data Access Tools from the Census Bureau

Usual Weekly Earnings Summary This is the first quarter report

Oh, I agree! I was just wondering where you found the statistics on the web site.

Thanks

colemic

Something to think about as well - it very much matters if you have a degree when it comes to being a DoD contractor - not about the job, but about what labor category you can be billed under against the contract... a Master's will let the company charge more, and *generally* means that that you will get a little bit more than the guy with just an associate's, or bachelor's degree. You are more valuable to them with a master's.

edit:

I also remembered, it will have a HUGE impact if you are DoD overseas in Germany, for TESA (most positions require you to have 'technical expert' status that a German citizen cannot ordinarily fill) or you will not be exempt from German income tax. A master's degree in the field you are working will almost always satisfy that.

networker050184

By educational attainment, full-time workers age 25 and over without a high school diploma had median weekly earnings of $448, compared with $624 for high school graduates (no college) and $1,140 for those holding at least a bachelor's degree. Among college graduates with advanced degrees (professional or master's degree and above), the highest earning 10 percent of male workers made $3,319 or more per week, compared with $2,277 or more for their female counterparts. (See table 4.)

Am I reading this wrong or does this quote seem kind of misleading? It sites the median earnings for high school and bachelors, but sites only the highest earning 10% of people with masters. Seems like that would definitely raise the earning numbers if you are only looking at the highest paid compared to the average. I wonder what the highest paid 10% of the other categories are.....

veritas_libertas

networker050184 wrote: »

Am I reading this wrong or does this quote seem kind of misleading? It sites the median earnings for high school and bachelors, but sites only the highest earning 10% of people with masters. Seems like that would definitely raise the earning numbers if you are only looking at the highest paid compared to the average. I wonder what the highest paid 10% of the other categories are.....

Well, it's government statistics that I would assume come from the census. I would hope that they are making valid statements.

AlexMR

The highest paid IT pros I know dont have a Master's or are not making money or got to their position because of the master's.

They are not useless obviously, but their ROI is far inferior to other options like advanced certifications.

How useful is a master's in IT from Stanford University from 1990? The only thing it says about you is that you are or were a very determined and maybe bright student, but it doesnt say anything about what you can do NOW for the potential employer. The nature of the field indicates that university degrees will have to evolve to work with vendors, at theiir speed, or simply disappear. IMHO. Even catching up doesnt guarantee their survival, because even though they dont come with an expiration date, they do have one and some people are in denial about this fact...

AlexMR

For those who think say of have heard that an MBA "means jack" without experience, well, get a grip and do some more research. About 70% of MBA students are from 26-31 years old, and more than 30% dont have any management or business background, and this nummber keeps growing every year.

Not engaging in some studies because you dont have any experience is absurd. It mmight not be the optimal solution but it's the only thing that you have total control of. You cant give yourself employment, but you can educate yourself.

phantasm

tpatt100 wrote: »

Actually the Bureau of Labor statistics site is pretty interesting:

U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics

And the US Census Bureau is pretty interesting as well:

Data Access Tools from the Census Bureau

Usual Weekly Earnings Summary This is the first quarter report

Thank you for the links. I agree with you as well, I'm just stating that someone with a Masters and 0 experience should not expect the world be handed to them. I plan on going back for an M.S. at some point, It all depends though.