Gen Eds, a waste of time?

exampasser

During my current path to complete my 4-year degree I've questioned the various general education requirements. Based on what general education classes that I've taken, I have found most of them boring, a repeat of subjects that I've already learned in grade school, and irrelevant to my career path. I've also seen some of the instructors that teach these courses simply not bothering to teach at all and simply use a department course web site.


I'm not saying that all general education courses are bad but a lot of them feel useless to me. I feel that one purpose of general education requirements are to generate more revenue for universities. I also feel that some gen ed classes have an indoctrination aspect to some subjects taught in some classes (modern health is one such course). Bachelor's degrees would be more appealing to more people if the general education requirements were significantly slashed.

I'm attending to gain further knowledge about various subjects dealing with IT, not to learn about all the mental disorders people have and to be indoctrinated yet again with ***-ed in health classes.

Wasn't the purpose of grade school general education?

What are your thoughts?

earweed

The gen eds classes are suposed to be there to give you a well grounded education. Considering the lack of adequate education a lot of high school graduates actually have colleges require it and more importantly the accrediting bodies require all the gen ed classes. The accredidation is what makes your degree valuable.

powerfool

"Gen Eds, a waste of time?"

My knee-jerk reaction is "yes, especially if it takes you five years." However, my thought was that this was GenEd or GenStudies degree... and I had a bad experience with a former co-worker that had a GedStudies degree and it took her 5 years to complete... as a full-time student.

But, more specifically, as courses within your degree: absolutely not. These are to help make you a rounded educated person. Sure, the courses may not be as appealing to you and you would rather get to the meat of your studies, but they help to prepare you. Enduring these courses and even embracing them has its perks.

I am currently in a graduate program for cybersecurity. We essentially write two papers every week, and there is no remediation for writing, nor time to do it myself. I am expected to write at a graduate level, both in terms of content, style, grammar, spelling, and ability to make a valid point and support it with evidence.

The key for me was to take general ed courses my first semester as I go acclimated to school. Then, I just made sure that I took one or two every semester so that I didn't fall behind on them.

Honestly, I don't recall many GedEd courses being required... I was think English 1 & 2, a math course, sociology, and some history. Beyond that, I had to take an additional math course for my degree, and then my degree was from a business school, so I had to take all of the early level business courses and econ/finance.

Hang in there, you will be better for it.

erpadmin

There is a reason why general education classes are required at liberal arts schools and are the difference between something like ITT, Devry, etc.

People want to see a liberal arts graduate with a well-rounded background. Ideally, this person has an opinion about SOMETHING in his surroundings, and does not have only vocational knowledge.

It isn't for everyone, but I for one would never invalidate a liberal arts education...especially if you want to pursue a higher level degree like a Masters.

Otherwise, places like ITT or other vocational schools would be a good fit for folks who don't want to go through liberal arts.

exampasser

earweed wrote: »

The gen eds classes are suposed to be there to give you a well grounded education. Considering the lack of adequate education a lot of high school graduates actually have colleges require it and more importantly the accrediting bodies require all the gen ed classes. The accredidation is what makes your degree valuable.

You do have a valid point about about the poor education given in grade school.

Devilsbane

They feel like it to me. I don't think I learned anything that I didn't learn in high school.

eansdad

I think in college they just want to make sure you can conceive and portray coherent thoughts to other people and on paper (English), use reasoning to solve a problem (math) and understand the course and nature of things (science/history). I can truly say that kids coming out of high school (and some community colleges) can't do this. For IT a basic (and for some a slightly higher) understanding is needed to get the job done. That is one thing I'm liking about WGU's competency based approach...If I know the subject well enough to pass I can just take the final assessment and focus on my IT and/or harder subjects.

Slowhand

This is a topic I've written fairly extensive posts on, this thread containing the latest one: Do You Agree?

My opinion on general education classes in college boils down to one basic thing: you get as much out of them as you put into them, much like certs or even a whole academic degree. There are a lot of times, both at work and in school, we have to do things we don't necessarily consider "fun", but may be necessary. It's up to us to decide whether or not our ultimate goal is worth risking an easier path or not.

The long and the short of it: "you find yourself in it." Getting through the parts you find tedious can be made much more bearable if you can figure out 1) what it is you can take enjoyment from within the class/assignment you may not be loving, and 2) finding aspects of that class/assignment you can learn from and maybe even develop some skills you never knew you were interested in before. This stuff is all about being mentally prepared, especially when it comes to the workload and staying focused.

kiki1579

Sure, a lot of those classes are going to be usless to you...for instance like Accounting, or Macro and Microeconomic courses. Right now I have to take a stupid Office 2007 course as part of my degree along with some Criminal Justice.

In the back of my mind I have the same thought as you...why am I taking this??? Well because I have to, and it's required. It sucks but I have to get it done. Once you get into your 3rd and 4th year, you'll more into the "cool" classes...the ones you really went to college for.

My university has classes that do mini-semester courses (7 weeks) instead of the normal full semesters. Those classes make it bearable to get my degree over with faster. You'll find some of those courses interesting or useful down the road. But for now you have to suck it up as they say, and get it done.

eansdad

kiki1579 wrote: »

Sure, a lot of those classes are going to be usless to you...for instance like Accounting, or Macro and Microeconomic courses. Right now I have to take a stupid Office 2007 course as part of my degree along with some Criminal Justice.

In the back of my mind I have the same thought as you...why am I taking this??? Well because I have to, and it's required. It sucks but I have to get it done. Once you get into your 3rd and 4th year, you'll more into the "cool" classes...the ones you really went to college for.

My university has classes that do mini-semester courses (7 weeks) instead of the normal full semesters. Those classes make it bearable to get my degree over with faster. You'll find some of those courses interesting or useful down the road. But for now you have to suck it up as they say, and get it done.

Interesting mix of classes...what's your major?

gosh1976

I have this thought to add to the good reasoning behind the core curriculum/ gen ed classes at any University: Just think of how many people out there are completely incapable of composing a coherent email with correct spelling, grammar, and punctuation. It is skill s like this that the core curriculum addresses.

At the school I am attending the track I am on is like this: certificate > associates > bachelors. So, from the very beginning you are taking IT courses. You aren't doing 2 years of mostly English, history, and math and then 2 years of degree classes. In my state you can also take the vast majority of the core classes online for a reduced cost.

By the time I finish the certificate I will have taken classes on webdesign, database design, programming, and I will have my CCNA, CCNA: voice, and CCNA: wireless. Then two ,more classes a history and math and I will have my A.A.S. Then I can continue on and get a B.I.T. or B.A.S. in Technology Management.

The general education courses are kind of spread out and there are fewer of them than in many other degrees. I don't mind them. One way or the other I am learning skills I will use in my career. For some of those courses the only thing that I may take away from a course that I will use later on is a honing of my critical thinking skills. In others I will learn things that are directly valuable to a career such as public speaking skills or the ability to convey ideas in the written word.

jamesleecoleman

It depends on the classes. If it's stuff that I've learned in high school then I would believe it would be a waste of time and money. By taking the same classes over in college that I did in highschool makes me feel that people are saying that the highschool degree that I recieved doesn't mean anything. I have taken some very interesting classes, like Physics. Now thats stuff I can use in real life. I've also taken foreign languages classes that will be very helpful later on. It would be nice if colleges/universities had less general education requiresments and focused more classes on the program of study.

brad-

2 things

1 - well roundedness, as mentioned
2 - college is a business. more classes = more tuition, fees, books etc

The roundedness you wont really appreciate until later, when you meet someone that has no ability to carry on a regular conversation about something other than anything techy.

NetworkingStudent

exampasser wrote: »

During my current path to complete my 4-year degree I've questioned the various general education requirements. Based on what general education classes that I've taken, I have found most of them boring, a repeat of subjects that I've already learned in grade school, and irrelevant to my career path. I've also seen some of the instructors that teach these courses simply not bothering to teach at all and simply use a department course web site.


I'm not saying that all general education courses are bad but a lot of them feel useless to me. I feel that one purpose of general education requirements are to generate more revenue for universities. I also feel that some gen ed classes have an indoctrination aspect to some subjects taught in some classes (modern health is one such course). Bachelor's degrees would be more appealing to more people if the general education requirements were significantly slashed.

I'm attending to gain further knowledge about various subjects dealing with IT, not to learn about all the mental disorders people have and to be indoctrinated yet again with ***-ed in health classes.

Wasn't the purpose of grade school general education?

What are your thoughts?

I think general ed courses should be required, but some classes are just plain silly. I had a class called Interpersonal Relations, and it was all these communication skills that I learned in grade school. Most of the terms had scientific terms attached to these simple definitions. Another class I had to take was called Modern Art( it was an elective). This class was interesting, but I had to tak it to fill a elective. I don’t see myself evaluating art work any time soon. Ahahaha…….
Some of the general ed classes that I enjoyed were psychology and Speech. At first I hated speech, but it helped me become more confident talking in front of people.

erpadmin

I like how folks say "I learned this in grade school...."

There are things I learned in high school that others have not.....stuff that I always thought was taught elsewhere at a 9th grade level, like who the heck Machiavelli was. Some of you guys probably never heard of The Prince until college (if that). That was required reading in my 10th grade Western Civ I class. (I went to a college prep Catholic high school...).

Now mind you, there's probably stuff I didn't learn in high school that you might have, but colleges around the country probably figured that folks all over the world have learned different things at different stages, so they had to have a standard curriculum that everyone has to follow.

tpatt100

I try not to disrespect grade school and high school teachers by blaming the schools. I think they try and do the best they can with what they get. But when schools hold parent teacher conferences and hardly anybody attends I tend to look at the parents. I remember my parents sitting down with me to make sure I did my stuff. I had attention issues though its not like I was dumb.

Devilsbane

tpatt100 wrote: »

But when schools hold parent teacher conferences and hardly anybody attends I tend to look at the parents. I remember my parents sitting down with me to make sure I did my stuff. I had attention issues though its not like I was dumb.

My parents went to every conference, regardless of my grades up until High school. In highschool they decided that if I'm getting A's and B's, then there really isn't much reason to go waste the night talking to teachers. He's (me) a big boy now.

Mike-Mike

I used to think Gen ed was a waste of time, but now that I am back in school, I realize there are lots of people that really need it.. personally I feel they waste my time, but there are lots of people on that campus that butcher the language and have horrendous math skills... Some seem very intelligent, I think they will benefit from the structure of college before they are thrust into the real world...

ssampier

You guys must have had a great high school. I remember taking Biology in high school. I don't remember anything about it other than dissecting a worm and how jelly fish mate. Trust me the latter has been extremely useful.

The rest of my high school classes was mostly boring lectures that everyone ignored and the assigned homework that nearly everyone completed in class. The aforementioned biology class the teacher often gave us the assignment for the day and then left.

Not the most ideal environment to really learn in. I did take a lot of vocational business classes, though, so it wasn't a complete waste of time. I just wish I used them for something.

If you guys really know the material, can't you CLEP those classes?

erpadmin

ssampier wrote: »

You guys must have had a great high school. I remember taking Biology in high school. I don't remember anything about it other than dissecting a worm and how jelly fish mate. Trust me the latter has been extremely useful.

Unless you know you're going to medical school, then yes, biology is terribly useless for people like us.

But at the same time, I have many acquaintances and friends who are not in IT. Having a gen ed background at the very least means I can hold a decent conversation. Even if one doesn't know a topic off-hand, gen-ed gives you a good basis on how to question stuff you don't know, which is where the Socratic Method comes from.... .

I've never been a strictly vocational kinda person to begin with. I do have a variety of interests...chess being one of them. My profession, contrary to what anyone thinks, does not, nor will it ever, define me. That's why even though I may hate certain classes (like the research paper class I just [hopefully] finished), but I understand the value of having a well-rounded background.

Cert Poor

In general, a waste of time and money, especially if they are taught at or below the high school level.

If you go to a top university, the gen ed classes will actually be taught at university level, and you'll enjoy them. If you go to a regular university, the Gen Eds will be a repeat of high school.

It all depends on your own background and motivation. Personally, I'm a transfer student and have already taken a lot of junior/senior level courses. Now I have to go back and take freshman courses. Going backwards is not a cool feeling. *grumble*

A lot of college is a "game": either play it and graduate or don't play it and don't get the piece of paper with "Bachelor" on it.

---

I feel like I can learn more by self studying than by going to a lot of Gen Ed classes. Go to Amazon and buy a $50 textbook rather than spend $1000 on a class, you know?

Devilsbane

Cert Poor wrote: »

I feel like I can learn more by self studying than by going to a lot of Gen Ed classes. Go to Amazon and buy a $50 textbook rather than spend $1000 on a class, you know?

I've learned far more in a few months of private study than I did in 2 years of college.

ssampier

Cert Poor wrote: »

In general, a waste of time and money, especially if they are taught at or below the high school level.

If you go to a top university, the gen ed classes will actually be taught at university level, and you'll enjoy them. If you go to a regular university, the Gen Eds will be a repeat of high school.

It all depends on your own background and motivation. Personally, I'm a transfer student and have already taken a lot of junior/senior level courses. Now I have to go back and take freshman courses. Going backwards is not a cool feeling. *grumble*

A lot of college is a "game": either play it and graduate or don't play it and don't get the piece of paper with "Bachelor" on it.

---

I feel like I can learn more by self studying than by going to a lot of Gen Ed classes. Go to Amazon and buy a $50 textbook rather than spend $1000 on a class, you know?

Taking freshmen courses when you're upper division doesn't make a whole lot of sense. I am guessing some of your lower divisions didn't transfer? Ouch!

I may be in the same boat though. I am really considering getting my graduate degree (probably in MIS) and I will have to take many prerequisite lower-division business classes.

It shouldn't be too hard, though, I'm just more used to reading and writing.