MCDST or MCITP:EDST7? or Both?

Cisco Inferno

Hey everyone, i'm currently studying for my Network+ which i plan on completing before new years. After that, i was planning on getting a desktop support certification to snag a helpdesk job or any entry level job to break into IT(even pc repair). (life goal is in networking)
I am 21yrs old and currently in college. I've just recently read from Microsoft that for being a student, they are willing to give me 52% off vouchers with a free second shot till June 30, 2011! That comes down to $60 each! Great incentive to get certified huh?

Ok, all fun stuff aside, I'm concerned about jobs in the future, and having a nice resume and all that jazz. I do know that XP is most likely going to be used for a while(3-5yrs?) or even till end of life. I know that MCDST testing ends on March 31, 2011. So with this in mind, I'm wondering if it is worth it to get it before that date. I fear that if i skip out on it and just get the MCITP, my resume might be tossed or filtered for someone with both MCDST and MCITP:EDST7! (I hear HR can be dumb when it comes to all this alphabet soup)

Ok Techexams! help me out with some reasoning!
1. Should i get my MCDST? or go with MCITP:EDST7?
2. Will MCDST hold any value in the future?
3. If I should, do you guys think i can study and pass 271 and 272 before the end of March with only A+ and Network+ experience?
4. If I should, how hard would studying for the MCITP:EDST7 tests be in comparison? (I want to take both and not the upgrade because the upgrade wont count for EA7 [if i ever want to get that]and I get to list MCTS for passing the 680(win7)

PS. I do plan on getting the EDST7 cert(preferably while i still have the discount), this is mostly about being more marketable and desirable when it comes down to the hiring process. Would it even matter in the future?

THANK YOU GUYS!

RobertKaucher

Cisco Inferno wrote: »

Ok, all fun stuff aside, I'm concerned about jobs in the future, and having a nice resume and all that jazz. I do know that XP is most likely going to be used for a while(3-5yrs?) or even till end of life. I know that MCDST testing ends on March 31, 2011. So with this in mind, I'm wondering if it is worth it to get it before that date. I fear that if i skip out on it and just get the MCITP, my resume might be tossed or filtered for someone with both MCDST and MCITP:EDST7! (I hear HR can be dumb when it comes to all this alphabet soup)

I'm not a big fan of people getting the MCDST at this juncture. But it is not a bad cert. You should consider it is XP, IE6, and Office 2003. It's 2 versions of the OS and of Office and we are almost on IE9 now. Companies are still working with these older versions, except of maybe IE, and having someone who can support the new versions of Office would be important. You have to remember that MS is not removing features from the OS and Office. In general they are adding features. So much of what you learn will be applicable to Windows XP. If you already know XP to a decent degree getting the Win 7 certs would be the best path.

Cisco Inferno wrote: »

Ok Techexams! help me out with some reasoning!
1. Should i get my MCDST? or go with MCITP:EDST7?
2. Will MCDST hold any value in the future?
3. If I should, do you guys think i can study and pass 271 and 272 before the end of March with only A+ and Network+ experience?
4. If I should, how hard would studying for the MCITP:EDST7 tests be in comparison? (I want to take both and not the upgrade because the upgrade wont count for EA7 [if i ever want to get that]and I get to list MCTS for passing the 680(win7)

PS. I do plan on getting the EDST7 cert(preferably while i still have the discount), this is mostly about being more marketable and desirable when it comes down to the hiring process. Would it even matter in the future?

THANK YOU GUYS!

MCDST is dead after March, so if you have the time and money to get both, then why not do it? You could get the MCDST and I think there is then a single exam upgrade to EDST7. And then you could take one exam to get the Enterprise Desktop Admin cert, which goes the next step beyond support.

Bl8ckr0uter

Disclaimer: I have no MS certs

RobertKaucher wrote: »

I'm not a big fan of people getting the MCDST at this juncture. .

I agree with this 100%. I think that many large firms are headed to Windows 7, if they aren't already there. XP will be around forever but if you are short on cash/time, just read an XP book and go for the Windows 7 stuff. Those extra two test could be an extra MCTS, like 640 or 680 (or both). Then you would be one (or two) steps closer to the MCITP SA or EA (which is where you want to be, right?).

How much experience do you have? Are you still looking for that first IT gig? If so then go for the MCITP. If you have tons of experience with XP and could knock both test out in a month, then do the MCDST and then upgrade. Have you thought about cisco?(hint, hint). Instead of the two MCDST then upgrading, you could pick up a CCENT or Security+. IMO either one of those would look better than an MCDST.

za3bour

I think one is enough ( MCITP:EDST7) just make sure you know Win XP well in addition to this cert and it should be just fine. I don't honestly see the point in doing any XP related exam even though it's still widely used.

earweed

XP is still strong out there so if you have the $$ and can complete them in time get the MCDST AND the Windows 7 MCITP.I wouldnt worry about getting both the Windows 7 MCITPs though.
You didn't mention if you have any work experience yet as you may want to start looking now for that first IT job.

Devilsbane

RobertKaucher wrote: »

I'm not a big fan of people getting the MCDST at this juncture. But it is not a bad cert. You should consider it is XP, IE6, and Office 2003. It's 2 versions of the OS and of Office and we are almost on IE9 now. Companies are still working with these older versions, except of maybe IE, and having someone who can support the new versions of Office would be important.

I have to disagree with this. (But keep in mind that Robert is responsible for doing some hirings where he is at, and I am not).

I believe there is still a lot of value with the MCDST, especially since it can be later upgraded. I think I was hearing that XP still has over 60% of the market share (the remaining going to Windows 7, Windows Vista, Apple, and Linux). Yes companies are starting to implement Windows 7, but the MCDST has very little about implemeting, its purpose is maintnance and supporting users. If your company is still on XP, then this cert is valuable.

Another thing that I would consider is the exams. The MCITP: EDST7 requires 2 exams. But if you already have the MCDST (also 2 exams) then you only need the 70-682 to upgrade it. 2 certifications with 3 tests is a pretty good deal. And in June of next year you will have a certification that sets you aside from all of the new guys coming into the field because they can no longer get it.

RobertKaucher

Devilsbane wrote: »

I have to disagree with this. (But keep in mind that Robert is responsible for doing some hirings where he is at, and I am not).

I believe there is still a lot of value with the MCDST, especially since it can be later upgraded. I think I was hearing that XP still has over 60% of the market share (the remaining going to Windows 7, Windows Vista, Apple, and Linux). Yes companies are starting to implement Windows 7, but the MCDST has very little about implemeting, its purpose is maintnance and supporting users. If your company is still on XP, then this cert is valuable.

Another thing that I would consider is the exams. The MCITP: EDST7 requires 2 exams. But if you already have the MCDST (also 2 exams) then you only need the 70-682 to upgrade it. 2 certifications with 3 tests is a pretty good deal. And in June of next year you will have a certification that sets you aside from all of the new guys coming into the field because they can no longer get it.

We're only disagreeeing in degree, not really on the point. I agree with the bolded statement, but I have to argue to what degree it is valuable.

1. I believe the 70-271 is *objectively* less valuable than the Windows 7 Configuring exam because it is far less technical.

2. The 271 exam gets you an MCP and the MCDST (2 exams) can be used as an elective for the MCSA -But the Win 7 Configuing can be used as an elective in the MICTP EA and counts for MCITP EDA7 and EDST7. Meaning it has more value in the long run to the candidate.

I'm not saying don't do it. I'm saying if it is coming down to a choice betweeen one or the other (budget or time) go for the Windows 7 certs. If you have the time and money to take the MCDST exams and the upgrade to EDST 7 (which also gives you the MCTS Win 7 Configuring) then do it. That's a no brainer. 3 exams for 4 credentials? Sounds good to me! It also sounds like the OP can get the student prices as well. So heck, why not get both? But if you have to choose one over the other - MCDST is probably not worth it.

RobertKaucher

Devilsbane wrote: »

2 certifications with 3 tests is a pretty good deal. And in June of next year you will have a certification that sets you aside from all of the new guys coming into the field because they can no longer get it.

4! He has no other MS certs. So MCP, MCDST, MCTS, MCIPT:EDST7! Makes it even better.

Claymoore

Neither. If you want to take a couple of tests that will almost guarantee you a job, take 680 and 681.

I have worked on two RFP responses in the last couple of months that were large national Windows 7 deployments where we needed to include some subcontracting resources for coverage. Our national staffing folks had very few Win7 resources overall and no resources with specific Win7 deployment skills. Meanwhile, they have XP support folks lined up around the block looking for work.

The large Win7 deployments are starting and there will be contracting opportunities on the deployment teams. Contract deployment work isn't glamorous, but it will give you experience to list on your resume for that next full-time position.

Devilsbane

RobertKaucher wrote: »

4! He has no other MS certs. So MCP, MCDST, MCTS, MCIPT:EDST7! Makes it even better.

Just more reasons why I am right and you are wrong

RobertKaucher

Devilsbane wrote: »

Just more reasons why I am right and you are wrong

LOL. Not sure I would go that far. Check Claymoore's post. 3 tests and EDST and EDA7 for the win! Then you have the cert that gets you in the door and the cert that might get them to keep you to support what you deployed.

Cisco Inferno

RobertKaucher wrote: »

4! He has no other MS certs. So MCP, MCDST, MCTS, MCIPT:EDST7! Makes it even better.

Devilsbane wrote:

Another thing that I would consider is the exams. The MCITP: EDST7 requires 2 exams. But if you already have the MCDST (also 2 exams) then you only need the 70-682 to upgrade it. 2 certifications with 3 tests is a pretty good deal. And in June of next year you will have a certification that sets you aside from all of the new guys coming into the field because they can no longer get it.

i read up that the upgrade test doesn't give a MCTS(680) and elective for the EA:7. is this true?
Also, I do wanna stand out from others come march. was just wondering if its worth it in the long run.

No formal IT experience though, i guess i can dualboot xp onto my pc and network some old xp boxes i have for exp? any proper lab setup required?

Devilsbane

Cisco Inferno wrote: »

i read up that the upgrade test doesn't give a MCTS(680) and elective for the EA:7. is this true?

I'm not positive on this.

No formal IT experience though, i guess i can dualboot xp onto my pc and network some old xp boxes i have for exp? any proper lab setup required?

Thats fine, the test is about maintaining and supporting a computer. So if you have been doing your windows updates, and using word, and changing your resolution then you have already covered lots of material. There will be some new things that you probably haven't done, like backups, and maybe the recovery console if it is on these tests.

If you are an admin at home then you shouldn't find the transition too difficult.

Cisco Inferno

Devilsbane wrote: »

Thats fine, the test is about maintaining and supporting a computer. So if you have been doing your windows updates, and using word, and changing your resolution then you have already covered lots of material. There will be some new things that you probably haven't done, like backups, and maybe the recovery console if it is on these tests.

ha yea very true but im also trying to not underestimate this test. I wouldnt even be able to retake it after march31st(worst case scenario) and would have studied for nothing.
How long would you guys think it would take to study for the two tests? Think i can nail both in January Feb and march?
Planning on using Microsoft press or Sybex and CBT Nuggets maybe.:

RobertKaucher

Cisco Inferno wrote: »

i read up that the upgrade test doesn't give a MCTS(680) and elective for the EA:7. is this true?

That is incorrect:
Does 70-682 = 2 Certificates?

You get both the MCTS on Win 7 and the MCITP.

RobertKaucher

Cisco Inferno wrote: »

ha yea very true but im also trying to not underestimate this test. I wouldnt even be able to retake it after march31st(worst case scenario) and would have studied for nothing.
How long would you guys think it would take to study for the two tests? Think i can nail both in January Feb and march?
Planning on using Microsoft press or Sybex and CBT Nuggets maybe.:

This really deppends on your experience. If you have been working for 6 months in a corporate helpdesk and have been using Win 7 you might be able to pass each exam with just 30 days of prep.

Cisco Inferno

RobertKaucher wrote: »

This really deppends on your experience. If you have been working for 6 months in a corporate helpdesk and have been using Win 7 you might be able to pass each exam with just 30 days of prep.

whoa! i was actually just referring to 271 and 272. sorry

za3bour

Most of MS exams can be studied in about a month given the needed time/effort so If you can dedicate at least 4 hours/day I think you can do both exams in 2 months.

Of course you need to lab in addition to reading

Cisco Inferno

za3bour wrote: »

Most of MS exams can be studied in about a month given the needed time/effort so If you can dedicate at least 4 hours/day I think you can do both exams in 2 months.

Of course you need to lab in addition to reading

thank you. i plan on using ms press books with the included cds. not sure whats on it though.

also in regards to labbing, how do i set that up? or are you talking about the included disc?

RobertKaucher

Cisco Inferno wrote: »

whoa! i was actually just referring to 271 and 272. sorry

Same diff. If you have the experience then you can do it in that time frame. If you know a technology already spending more than 30 days to prep for a single test is a waste.

If you are new to the field, completely new, then I would skip MCDST as it is just cutting it too close.

If you don't know the technology then it is much harder to make a suggestion. Maybe 60 to 90 days (30-60 for study another 30 for prep).

They are not really hard exams. The 270 I passed in the low 800s but only did about 30 days of prep. 271 I passed in 900s but I did a lot of studying - more than I needed. But I had two years of support experience to back it up. And doing some admin work as a side line. Just make sure you use test prep software to help you judge how well you know the material.

My suggested prep method is as follows (notice I make a difference between study and prep):

4 weeks - You Need two test prep suites. Use MeasureUp that comes withthe MS press book and then Transcender or SelfTest.

Week 1 Take the test quickly. If you don't know the answer for sure skip it. Print your errors and go back to your study material. Perform labs based on these questions. 2 to 3 practice tests is all you should be able to do between review sessions.

Week 2 Repeat

Week 3 Take the tests more slowly using the second test prep (Transcender or SelfTest). Imagine you are actually taking the exam. Mark any questions you are unsure of. This time you should be scoring in the mid 700s+. Review any questions you get wrong or don't understand. Do full study reviews of the objectives you are failing and make sure you do labs for things you find difficult.

Week 4 Repeat. If you are scoring in the high 900s on the practice tests you should be ready.

The key is constant review of what you study before the prep period and lab work.

za3bour

Cisco Inferno wrote: »

thank you. i plan on using ms press books with the included cds. not sure whats on it though.

also in regards to labbing, how do i set that up? or are you talking about the included disc?

I'm talking about actually setting your own lab using Virtual Machine whether by using Microsoft Virtual PC or VMware player or Virtual Box or other software (mostly free).

By this you can have your own mini network that has server, PCs ...etc which you can practice on the material because no matter how you read it's when you do stuff by hand that will really help you memorize all those ugly commands or remember the steps you need to do something complicated.

QHalo

I find that as I read the chapters of the books that I make out a list of possible labs that I could come up with to reinforce the topics. Attempt the labs without reading the book and see how much you can recall to make the lab work and be complete. Go all the way through and then recreate the labs again. Anything you're not sure on read up again and re-lab it. That's my approach to things like DISM and other topics where there's a lot of command line stuff you need to remember.