Professional level cert vs. CCIE

GA1

Question: Suppose you obtained, say, a CCSP because you really enjoyed security, but never got a chance to use it on-the-job. Then you got a job doing routing and switching, and you never really were able to get your hands on anything security-related there (again, hypothetically, because I'm looking down the road). You decided to get your CCNP as a matter of practicality, hoping to one day use your CCSP, somehow, someway.

So, you're really wanting to move your career ahead, and you're thinking of either going after a CCIE in either R&S or Security, or really boning up on your rusting CCSP to the point where you can find a job elsewhere which would value someone with both a CCSP and a CCNP. The only issue is would a company be willing to hire a security person with no practical "real world" security experience - even with two professional level certs?

My other thought is that a CCIE is going to be a lot more responsibility than a mere CCXP (generally speaking). Yes, the money would be good with a CCIE, but with a family, I'm not sure that that's the right path, as the time demands are - I've heard - significant. Perhaps someone who has an IE could enlighten me.

millworx

I am not a CCIE (yet) but I am the only team member on an all CCIE Design/Implementation team so I think I may be able to adequately answer this question.

The workload difference really depends on your place of employment and responsibilities they expect of you. I work on the project management office, so I work heavily on the design team rolling out new implementations. The workload is not really very light. Some weeks I may only work 20 hours, other weeks I can work upwards of 70 if we are tight on our timelines.

The amount of responsibility is indeed greater, but I think once you reach CCIE status, if you are good, things get a lot easier once you have an even deeper understanding. Every large enterprise that employs CCIE's will demand a lot from them, but most are flexible and accommodating at the same time. If you do end up getting your IE, just be mindful of the responsibilites the company expects you to perform and see if that is something you feel you can accomplish

chrisone

IMO, a multi CCNP (security, design, R&S, etc, etc) is more valuable and skilled than having one CCIE with no other professional level certs.

Another comment i would like to make on your CCSP, i would say if you get a network engineer job, chances are 99% you will be handling the security portion as well. Its very hard to find a pure routing and switching environment where you will never focus on security. Security is part of all good network engineers tasks and concentration. I just dont see anyone with a network engineer title getting away with not having to worry about security in the network.

millworx

chrisone wrote: »

Its very hard to find a pure routing and switching environment where you will never focus on security. Security is part of all good network engineers tasks and concentration. I just dont see anyone with a network engineer title getting away with not having to worry about security in the network.

I agree with you 100% here. My primary job involves R&S but as an engineer there are a lot of PIX/ASA's in the design, and I am just as involved in those configurations despite being a routing switching guy. Most engineer roles are somewhat hybrid.

networker050184

What I think the issue is that makes your question hard to answer is that certification A doesn't necessarily translate to job A. So will someone with a CCIE work harder than someone with a CCNP? I really doubt the amount of work has much to do with their certification. You might have the highest, hardest working engineer in the company with no certification and the people under them with CCIEs with less work load. The certifications just help you find employment, they don't determine what you will do.

As far as security without experience, its highly unlikely IMO unless you shoot for something very low level.

networker050184

chrisone wrote: »

. Its very hard to find a pure routing and switching environment where you will never focus on security. Security is part of all good network engineers tasks and concentration. I just dont see anyone with a network engineer title getting away with not having to worry about security in the network.

Depends on the size of the company really and how much they segregate roles. My last job there was an entire group dedicated to just security and the routing engineers didn't touch any of that. My role before that there were only four engineers and we basically did everything. It all just depends on the place you work.

instant000

networker050184 wrote: »

.... You might have the highest, hardest working engineer in the company with no certification and the people under them with CCIEs with less work load. ....

LOL, you just described Turgon

GA1

networker050184 wrote: »

What I think the issue is that makes your question hard to answer is that certification A doesn't necessarily translate to job A. So will someone with a CCIE work harder than someone with a CCNP? I really doubt the amount of work has much to do with their certification. You might have the highest, hardest working engineer in the company with no certification and the people under them with CCIEs with less work load. The certifications just help you find employment, they don't determine what you will do.

As far as security without experience, its highly unlikely IMO unless you shoot for something very low level.

I think a good approach might be that while you're working as a CCNP at your job, look within the company (either locally or not, if the company is spread out) and see if they have a need for someone with security specialization. It's easier to move intra-company than find a brand new job elsewhere where you're unproven and unknown. But if you can't find something within the company, your only alternative may be to take a pay cut and take that security specialization job elsewhere in order to do what you really want to do (in this scenario). That, or be content in R&S. In this economy, just having a decent job is reward enough.