What should I chose, an education in Sharepoint or Cisco Networking?

TheSwede86

Hi!

This might be a quite odd post but I'll love to get your input.
Well let's first introduce myself, my name is Karl, 24 soon to be 25 years old living i Sweden.

My prior experience in IT is around 45 ECTS-credits (30+15 in two different unfinished bachelor programs) and around 6 months working as a IT-technician for a major retail company here in Sweden, my work was what I can assume "Geek Squad" does in the US, reinstall OS, backup files from damaged HDD's, solve problems, upgrade RAM etc.

My goal in life is to work and live in the US and in my future profession I would like to combine working with people (since I love it and are really good at it) and something to do with computers. I am not very skilled and would not really like to work very much with programming and math. I hate math, I do really hate it. I have scored 8.0 of 9.0 in IELTS and a B of A/B/C in Cambridge CAE test. (IELTS is the latest test taken).

Now I am looking at two different choices for my education and would like to make the most informed decision regarding:

- Which choice do you think would make it easiest for me when looking for work? (taking into account what little experience I have prior to the education and which seems most coveted by employers).
- What do you think I would earn (salary) after completing either of my choices?
- Since I described a little about my strong sides and weak sides can you "easily" rule out the one or the other?
- Which choice would be the wisest when thinking about working in the US?
(My plan here is working in a US/International company in Sweden and after a while request transfer and hunt for positions within the company in the US)

If you think of anything else please feel free to write that or ask questions if I am being vague.

Both my choices are 2 year education and 1/3 of that time is spent on internships at different (or the same) company(ies). The educations themselves are not in the same "grade" as a university education since they (my type of education) are often more specialized and niched into specific fields.

The first choice "Network" [w=weeks]:
"IT-Essentials" (should be able to obtain a "A+" certificate), 5w
CCNA Exploration 1-4, 5w each = 20w total 1 through 4
CCNA Exploration seems to qualify you for 2 certifications:
640-822 ICND1 (CCENT) and 640-816 ICND2.
CCNA Security, 5w, Cert: 642-637
CCNP Route, 7w, Cert: 642-902
CCNP Switch, 7w, Cert: 642-813
CCNP Tshoot, 6w, Cert: 642-832

+:
Seems to be A LOT OF certifications.
As I understand it, little of math and programming (at least when comparing it to Java etc.)
-:
People seem to write that without experience CCNP is useless, persons with CCNP without experience seems to take CCNA jobs and then work up experience and then be able to qualify for CCNP jobs.
Are the certifications really "so good" and impressive and "worth something" to employers? I am not "in the know" so I don't know.

The second choice "Sharepoint" [don't have any weeks here but the only things that are left out are the internship periods/"courses")
Web-design
Basic Sharepoint administration (Sharepoint 2010)
Handeling documents
Programming part 1 (C# 2010)
Projectmanagement
Quality and development of processes
Programming part 2 (think its C# 2010 here again)
Network and computer communication
Project in development using Sharepoint

+:
Seems to be in good demand
High entry salary(?)
-:
No certifications, it might be in the works though according to the school
Involves programming and that would to some extent include math
Again it involves programming and math to some extent

Then again I don't know how hard C# is and if you have to code all the time since Sharepoint is a program and you have to be able to work with the GUI once in a while?

Anyway a LONG post and I am so grateful if somebody could help me make an informed decision. Sorry for any mistypes, its quite late here and just wanted to take everything "off my chest".

Thanks in advance - TheSwede86

Priston

Your going to have to learn to like math either way...

Cisco Inferno

Priston wrote: »

Your going to have to learn to like math either way...

yes. at least calculus I for a CIS degree.
for a CS Degree, you better love it along with physics.

lordy

You should NOT make learning choices on either demand or supposed salary.

IT is in ever-changing field so whatever is in demand today might be obsolete one or two years from now. Therefore I would highly suggest to study something that you are actually interested in. This will make studying and working a lot easier.

Looking at the two programs you described neither seem very good to me. A CCNP certification is indeed pretty worthless if you don't have any experience to back it up. You would probably have to start at CCNA level anyway and work your way up. Sharepoint, on the other hand, is a buzzword right now so you might be able to land a job with that but again without experience there is usually no huge paycheck. Additionally I would expect my Sharepoint-Administator to also be able to take care of things like Active Directory and maybe Exchange so you would be kind of one-sided with just Sharepoint knowledge.

Just my € 0.02

N2IT

lordy wrote: »

You should NOT make learning choices on either demand or supposed salary.

IT is in ever-changing field so whatever is in demand today might be obsolete one or two years from now. Therefore I would highly suggest to study something that you are actually interested in. This will make studying and working a lot easier.

+1

I couldn't agree with you more.

drew726

I took calculus III, Physics II, Linear algebra, and Discrete mathematics. Then when I transfered to WGU they gave me trouble when I asked to waive the math classes

phantasm

lordy wrote: »

You should NOT make learning choices on either demand or supposed salary.

Restated and made bold to reiterate the point.

Chasing a degree or career field for supposed financial gain will lead you to heartache and disappointment. Math is a fact of life... I suck at it, but I made it through the classes I needed to.

Essendon

phantasm wrote: »

Restated and made bold to reiterate the point.

Chasing a degree or career field for supposed financial gain will lead you to heartache and disappointment. Math is a fact of life... I suck at it, but I made it through the classes I needed to.

^^ Sage advice. Follow it and you will not err.

Forsaken_GA

I think I'm going to need to write a standard disclaimer for when I'm about to post something potentially inflammatory....

Before I begin, please understand, I am not calling you names, saying mean things about your mother, nor do I want to kick your kitten.

The impression I'm getting is that you're seeking the path of least resistance to the biggest paycheck.

It doesn't work like that.

What I would sincerely recommend is that you decide what you want to do, what you enjoy, and then pursue that, regardless of the effort, or the potential payoff. If you pursue what you enjoy, your longterm benefit will far outweigh anything else. Seek to become a recognized expert in your chosen field.

Speaking for the networking side of things... it's a difficult game to break into. It requires alot of commitment. The curriculum you've laid out is not going to prevent you from starting at the bottom, not unless you get lucky, or you know someone. network engineering isn't something you read about and then become good at, it's something you have to experience, because there is plenty of crap that the books will never teach you.

higherho

Networking will open up more doors for you and I think you will be more obtain more knowledge than sticking with sharepoint.

TheSwede86

Thank you VERY MUCH guys/girls for your replies.
The amount of answers and the quality of them blew me away.
Sorry I haven't written back earlier but the email notifications seemed to not work properly (my email was hacked and I deleted all of my mail, might have been something to do with that).
I will not quote individual answers since much cover the same matter but rather comment/ask for more information regarding the different matters the answers relate to (Math etc.).

Regarding the matter of math (hah, it almost rhymes):
Some of you have written that math is a matter of fact and I can't hide from it regardless if I chose Sharepoint (C# programming etc.) or Cisco networking.
Can anyone please elaborate about what kind of math you mean when talking about Sharepoint/C#/ASP.net and Cisco?

I'm out on a limb here but I talked to a friend and he said there was a minimal amount of math and a pretty easy type of math that involved counting subnets (or something like that) in Cisco?

Which one do you think would involve the most amount of math when working with it for a living?

Regarding chosing what I want to do and not where the latest hype lies right now, its.....complicated.

I have to this date tried various fields (uni. programs) that include:
IT-Forensics, Computer Science, Criminology, Political Science and Mobile Application Development.

In the beginning I was all over it and told friends and family "THIS is really me, I've found the right thing that fits me perfectly". But after a time there has always been courses that I found uninteresting and irrelevant to the program and then bailed.

I've now come to terms with that not all courses are fun and not everything is relevant but you have to "suck it up" and just do it. I'm so old now (at least in my view - 24 to be 25 without having completed a higher level education - university etc.) that regardless of what I chose I WILL complete it.

So I don't know, I guess I'm....almost jaded in a way.

Whats important for me is of course that I find the education and future work interesting but in another way I really value:
* Good prospects of finding qualified work in the field I have been educated in.
* Moderate/Good entry-level salary
* Possibility to advance overseas (US) later on in my career or work in Europe or just work internationally
* Not just code but have some involvement with people as well and not so much math.

Well I guess this didn't advance the post very much, at least this part regarding why I am interested in whats "in" right now.

The thing is, I don't know if Cisco is the right thing for me until I try it and the same goes for Sharepoint but I would really like to find it out before chosing an education so I don't chose "wrong" - I don't have time for any more mistakes. I know I'm somewhat young but I feel that feeling "for myself". Its important for me to find the right one this time and complete it.

I know that I would not like to work much with programming / math so when taking that into account I guess that the Sharepoint education wouldnt be the best choice. On the other hand I've never really 100% applied myself to learning programming and it might be easy programming and easy (and a little part of the daily work involving) math.

When regarding Cisco I REALLY don't know.
I find configuring routers pretty fun but I guess its a far cry from working with networking professionally.

Well if you have read this post (and the thread) then - thanks very much
I would really love some more input but I am really greatful for the input and comments I have gotten.

EDIT:

Just to clarify regarding the Cisco choice (it might be obvious to you but I just wanted to put it in writing):
According to the school its a very "hands-on" type of education and the school has extensive Cisco hardware so you will be able to not just read about it but "do it".
Then (this goes for both) 1/3 of the 2years are spent "out on the field" - working and learning in actual companies to get experience. These 8 months are in no way somewhere near lets say 5 years but at least they are 8 months comparing to university programs which often has nothing whatsoever.

phantasm

Ok. Cisco. THe math needed to earn your CCNA will involve base 2, 10 and 16 math. In other words, binary (0 and 1's), normal numbers (1-10) and hex (0-F). You will learn how to move around in these number systems and convert numbers in your head. When subnetting you use binary with IPv4. IPv6 now includes hex numbers as well. You need to know base 2 to base 10 conversions and be able to do them in your head in a short amount of time. Practice is key.

The CCNA is only the beginning. You can earn one in 6months of self study, but getting a Cisco job with no experience is tough to impossible. Most NOC jobs involve answering phones and working tickets. Your access to Cisco routers and Switches may be limited and only provide you with read access which means you cant do anything in the device.

After a few years of experience and after you've proven yourself you'll get a chance to actually work on routers and switches and make configuration changes. But getting to this point takes a few years of experience and doing menial work.

No one will just give you the keys to the kingdom.

ehnde

Maybe your education system in Sweden works differently than what I know. Your posts in this thread make me wonder why are you so focused on Cisco or Sharepoint?

Your choices are very, very specific. What if Cisco makes bad business decisions and some other networking company is the de facto standard? What if Microsoft ditches development of Sharepoint in favor of something completely different? You are obsolete!

What you need is a strong foundation. Become an IT professional. If you can direct your education along a path that grants you a more general type of IT degree, you will find more job opportunities this way. Go to school to get a degree (as quickly as possible). You can learn very specific technologies on your own.

Priston

I have little experience with programming and no experience with sharepoint, but I when I had to make even simple programs I used multiple different forms of math. While with Cisco almost all the math you do is subnetting. (which some people take along time to learn)


Edit: I have to agree with ehnde

TheSwede86

Regarding the talk about the nisched educations I have chosen I can give a reply.

We have ordinary university and college educations which in the field of computer science (for instance the BSc in Computer and System Science I studied earlier) covers a wide amount of subjects/fields and give a general foundation in the field.

The education form I have described here is a form of higher education / third level education / education that is much more specialized and nisched and is more practical and focused towards a specific field then a university education that is wide and broad. This type of education also gives you a placement with companies in the field for 1/3 of the time of the education.

The reason I have chosen this type of education is that around 90% have qualified jobs after completing the education. The students often get jobs from the companies they do their "internship" at. Also that they are shorter (1y-2y) and give you the possibility to get "real-life" training with companies.

You are right of course that the drawback is that you are specialized in a certain product or products and if they fail or become obsolete then you become obsolete. Although instead of having a general knowledge of much you have specific knowledge in a specific product/field which which translate in an easier time getting a qualified job since you have deep knowledge in just that product/products.

I will take this into account though.
Why must there be so many different types of education, gaaah.

EDIT:

Math with Cisco seems to be on that level that I can handle it, I am not daunted by it anyway when reading about it here. I have converted binary to decimal before and I didn't find that hard. Although then I just wrote a chart and "translated" the numbers. The same goes for hexadecimal. To do it in my head fast will be harder but not impossible.

Turgon

Forsaken_GA wrote: »

network engineering isn't something you read about and then become good at, it's something you have to experience, because there is plenty of crap that the books will never teach you.

This is very true. Keeping a platform running, rescuing a platform, integration and migration and designing the *right* solution isn't something you learn at net academy or in Cisco Press books. Field experience matters. It was always so, but I think today with so many Cisco technologies bedded in and so many experienced people gainfully employed in the genre the expectations of most people you will work alongside are high.