Should I lie?

I've been unemployed since August 2008. Almost 3 years. I've lost out on so many job offers lately because of it. Had an interview last Thursday, I knew the person, knew the company, even did contract work for them few times, BUT as soon as I mentioned I haven't worked in a few years I got pushed off the list.

This morning I applied for a very good job, my dream job at that. I had every qualification except the BS degree but I put in the resume/CV that I was 90% done and would be graduating within a few months. Got a call back right away. About 10 minutes into the call "Oh sorry but due to not working since 2008 there is stronger candidates than you. Have a nice day."

It wasn't like it really was fault, I had 5 back surgeries that kept pushing back getting back to work. But I can't/won't tell people that, that's worse than saying I haven't worked in 3 years. When asked what I have done for the last 3 years I just say working on school and doing my best to find employment in the current economy.

Should I just change my dates and say I have worked? Change the date from August 08 to say August 10? Normally I'd have a bunch of contract/pt jobs I could group under my business name but this time I don't, I have nothing.

Any ideas?

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Comments

Plantwiz

I'd recommend against lying, truth stretching or any other deceptive method.

If you chose not to disclose your back surgery's, it is possible that will come up in a pre-employment physical or any insurance that the company offers.

It is up to you how you wish to be perceived. Some companies are large enough they can handle a few employees with 'exceptions' in their past (work gaps and or medically). Some smaller companies may indeed shy away (legal or not) from taking on someone with a physical medical history...IF the job they might hire you for would put the candidate at further risk. Certainly, they don't wish to have you become re-injured or worse.

As mentioned, and likely the best option, is work as an independent and than don't worry about the blanks in your past, your medical limitations (if any) and anything else you might have a concern with. It is the companies prerogative to hire the best candidate who fits THEIR team and can execute their objective...not being hired, while difficult, is a blessing...you really don't wish to be where you are not wanted do you?

I'd strongly agree with the "Do NOT lie", particularly for a job.

it_consultant

You will probably start having better luck when you actually complete your BS degree, the 3 years unemployed certainly hurts, but I would not necessarily rule out mentioning the medical reason you were unemployed. If you don't mention it, then people will automatically assume that you are just lazy.

I will differ a little in my advice to you. Your first priority is to you and the people who rely on you. If you think you need to bend the truth to get yourself a job then that is what you have to do. I know a couple of people with criminal records who don't dare mention their past until they actually get hired and they are about to do the background check. Its a risk but its better then being automatically disqualified.

ArabianKnight

It's ok to lie if they cannot verify anything, for example.. (I was in the Amazon doing charity work for the locals, moving out of retirement from Bora Bora due to boredom, traveled the world, etc......)

Or just tell them you worked for a certain gov agency doing certain things that you cannot discuss and that there are no records for!

eansdad

With a 3 year gap in employment, even due to medical injury, is looked as a BIG negative. Your best bet might be to sign up as a substitute tech for local school districts, IT based volunteer work (if you can afford it) and/or contracting companies. Once you have a job it is easier to get a better job. In IT 3 years is a long time and I've seen places toss good resumes because of shorter gaps.

If you really want to look into it I do think some states and maybe the federal government have started passing laws about discrimination against the unemployed.

Keep your head up, something always comes along.

bigmantenor

ArabianKnight wrote: »

It's ok to lie if they cannot verify anything, for example.. (I was in the Amazon doing charity work for the locals, moving out of retirement from Bora Bora due to boredom, traveled the world, etc......)

Or just tell them you worked for a certain gov agency doing certain things that you cannot discuss and that there are no records for!

I don't believe it's OK to lie like this, especially lying about charitable works. If you want to do something to make the world a better place, then go do it; don't lie about it to fluff your resume. Sorry if that comes off as rude, but it irks me when people lie like this.

themagicone

eansdad wrote: »

With a 3 year gap in employment, even due to medical injury, is looked as a BIG negative. Your best bet might be to sign up as a substitute tech for local school districts, IT based volunteer work (if you can afford it) and/or contracting companies. Once you have a job it is easier to get a better job. In IT 3 years is a long time and I've seen places toss good resumes because of shorter gaps.

If you really want to look into it I do think some states and maybe the federal government have started passing laws about discrimination against the unemployed.

Keep your head up, something always comes along.

I tried a few places for internships, paid and unpaid. They even turned me down. (Had a post about this last week). I'd try military or government work but first I'm banned from working for them (long story) and my back. Just put it this way, I've pissed off a lot of people in 14 years.

Just keep trying that is all I can do. In all my life I have never had an issue getting a job like I am right now. Before the economy crashed I could walk into a place and have a job, now it's "No Phone calls or walk in - put your resume in the pile with the other 10k".

Last night I came to conclusion that I will have to move most likely. I applied for jobs in Washington state, NC, SC and Atalanta.

One final note, I think a big reason places don't hire people with medical conditions (not saying its right or wrong not to) is medical insurance rates are based on claims. My back has racked up around $300,000 in claims in 2 years. For a small company that could easily double their premiums the next year.

it_consultant

You should move, Minneapolis is too damn cold. Come to Denver, we have a position that needs filling.

Devilsbane

it_consultant wrote: »

You should move, Minneapolis is too damn cold. Come to Denver, we have a position that needs filling.

Funny you say that, it's been high 90's with 70% humidity all week. It honestly feels worse than a sauna outside. Last night I had a class cancelled because their AC died and the classrooms were boiling.

Mishra

If they literally come out and say you haven't worked in 3 years you can't have the job, just pressure them.

Explain you keep up on your skills and qualify for the position. Explain that this job sounds very exciting and hiring you will be a perfect fit.

When you have been out of work for 3 years, you will need to go above and beyond to get interviews.

I suggest building a portfolio. When scoring an interview, write a paper based on their job posting explaining why you fit each bullet point they require. Be very formal and confident. Try your best and read all the 'how to interview' sites on the internet and practice as much as you can.

Plantwiz

Mishra wrote: »

If they literally come out and say you haven't worked in 3 years you can't have the job, just pressure them.

Explain you keep up on your skills and qualify for the position. Explain that this job sounds very exciting and hiring you will be a perfect fit.

When you have been out of work for 3 years, you will need to go above and beyond to get interviews.

I suggest building a portfolio. When scoring an interview, write a paper based on their job posting explaining why you fit each bullet point they require. Be very formal and confident. Try your best and read all the 'how to interview' sites on the internet and practice as much as you can.

EXACTLY!

Here (for example) is a great time to offer a 'free' trial or a lower pay trial...They probably will not go for the 'free' part (liability) but they may accept you at a lower wage for 'x' time (say 30 days-90days) and after this point, re-evaluate and if you are not blowing them away, they can dismiss you or you can continue at the lower wage. So the pressure is on you to really show them all you are capabale of and if they like you after this trial, continue working just as hard so they know they didn't hire a loser!

it_consultant

I didn't even think about it, you could offer contract to hire.

Psoasman

Mishra wrote: »

If they literally come out and say you haven't worked in 3 years you can't have the job, just pressure them.

Explain you keep up on your skills and qualify for the position. Explain that this job sounds very exciting and hiring you will be a perfect fit.

When you have been out of work for 3 years, you will need to go above and beyond to get interviews.

I suggest building a portfolio. When scoring an interview, write a paper based on their job posting explaining why you fit each bullet point they require. Be very formal and confident. Try your best and read all the 'how to interview' sites on the internet and practice as much as you can.

Very good post! Sometimes you have to sell yourself to the company.

themagicone

Well I took the advice a few posts up. I just shot off an email to the hiring manager that I would take half or even less of their lowest starting salary just to get myself in the door. In the email I just expressed my desire for the position, how I would be a great fit and that I just need a chance to prove myself to them. If I can do that I said I am willing to take half or even less that your lowest offer as long as once I complete my degree and they are happy I get raise. In the end I offered even to work for min wage for 2 weeks just get my foot in the door. We'll see what happens.

erpadmin

themagicone wrote: »

Well I took the advice a few posts up. I just shot off an email to the hiring manager that I would take half or even less of their lowest starting salary just to get myself in the door. In the email I just expressed my desire for the position, how I would be a great fit and that I just need a chance to prove myself to them. If I can do that I said I am willing to take half or even less that your lowest offer as long as once I complete my degree and they are happy I get raise. In the end I offered even to work for min wage for 2 weeks just get my foot in the door. We'll see what happens.

At the risk of sounding harsh (and I don't mean to; you [should] know me better than that), that reeked of desperation and one of two possible outcomes can occur:

1) You are permanently in the denial bin with this employer (and you are probably better off, but more on that later)

2) They say ok and hire you...to only work you tirelessly and without mercy at the permanent pay decrease you begged for until you can find something better. While you may think this is great because you need a job....when time goes on in that job, you'll be screaming to get out.

I would suggest using LinkedIn and finding fellow WGU students to network with. There are 100s of helpdesk jobs throughout the country that are out there. I'm not saying don't work for minimum wage but don't sell yourself short either. Someone somewhere has a lead, and leads exists if you know where to look. Definitely don't lie about your experience (that much is clear). If an employer isn't willing to give you a shot, I would say ---- 'em and move on. Believe me, I've been there...I know what it's like to make that phone call and answer yes, yes, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, yes (or something like that...) and I vowed never to do that again if it could be helped. You will persevere my friend....only because you must. Just don't give up hope.

Bl8ckr0uter

themagicone wrote: »

Well I took the advice a few posts up. I just shot off an email to the hiring manager that I would take half or even less of their lowest starting salary just to get myself in the door. In the email I just expressed my desire for the position, how I would be a great fit and that I just need a chance to prove myself to them. If I can do that I said I am willing to take half or even less that your lowest offer as long as once I complete my degree and they are happy I get raise. In the end I offered even to work for min wage for 2 weeks just get my foot in the door. We'll see what happens.

Yea you were like a step short of offering a sexual favor and honestly I mean this in a good way. Because I know if it came down to getting a job and eating vs not, a lie would be the least of the "bad" things I would do. Truthfully. I tend to look at things like this:

File:Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs.svg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Look at where food and water are on the hierarchy, then look at morality. 'nuff said.

Back to your response, it shows how serious your are. It does sound pretty desperate and some people will be turned off by it but some will take advantage of it and right now you want to be taken advantage of. You want to allow someone to use you now so you can sit pretty in a few years. Do whatever you have to do (that's legal) to get legitimate experience.

I wish you the best in your search.

Essendon

Everyone's said what needed to be said, I dont have much input into this thread. I wish you all the luck you need to secure a job. God speed.

ArabianKnight

bigmantenor wrote: »

I don't believe it's OK to lie like this, especially lying about charitable works. If you want to do something to make the world a better place, then go do it; don't lie about it to fluff your resume. Sorry if that comes off as rude, but it irks me when people lie like this.

It was meant as a comical post, guess I should have put a

at the end. Just

ing around!

powerfool

Just seems like a weird situation.... by creating stories, you are setting yourself up for lots of gymnastics when it comes to explaining things later. Keep things simple and truthful. Heck, you could just say that you helped people out doing odd-jobs or something. I think you need to relax a little bit, as you are too tense from being desperate. Just sit back and think about things for a while. You are trying to get a job, they shouldn't fault you for that.

jahsoul

This is kind of hard to approach. As a Christian, I'm not the one to say lie but at the same point, I am not about to condemn you for doing what you have to do but you will probably do the right thing. I think that it is an injustice for not hiring someone because of unemployment, especially considering your situation.

Not to sound harsh, but a lot of people here are in comfortable situations, so they are going to give you advice from where they sitting. It's one thing to currently have a job and another to be in a position of unemployment. (I've been there with a family, so I know how it feels). Kind of easy to view the world from the mountain top.

Just stay patient and something good is bound to happen.

shodown

I come back in here everyday and just say

Damned if you do, Damned if you don't.

Do what you have to do to get Paid Its a shark tank out here. Don't hurt others, but do what you have to do.

jahsoul

shodown wrote: »

I come back in here everyday and just say

Damned if you do, Damned if you don't.

Do what you have to do to get Paid Its a shark tank out here. Don't hurt others, but do what you have to do.

It's crazy because it seems like he can't do anything without getting scrutinized. He opts out of lying now he is desperate to get what WE have. It's really messed up because he's not doing this to get a huge promotion and more money. He is doing this do get a job. Funny thing, if he got welfare, we would say he is taking our tax dollars.

I'm hoping you get a good report back man. I'm rooting for ya!

Verruckt

shodown wrote: »

I come back in here everyday and just say

Damned if you do, Damned if you don't.

Do what you have to do to get Paid Its a shark tank out here. Don't hurt others, but do what you have to do.

This. You do what you have to do to make it by.

But two words: "Independent Contractor". If you have been doing on and off contracting for the past few years then fill that gap with the above title and basic description of the things you did.

If questioned in detail state you did contracting because of health issues at the time but those have since been taken care of.

Mishra

Verruckt wrote: »

This. You do what you have to do to make it by.

But two words: "Independent Contractor". If you have been doing on and off contracting for the past few years then fill that gap with the above title and basic description of the things you did.

If questioned in detail state you did contracting because of health issues at the time but those have since been taken care of.

I would just like to say that when I'm browsing resumes and I see the "worked for myself" thing with hardly any explanation of what they did, I instantly know you have been out of work.

jahsoul

Mishra wrote: »

I would just like to say that when I'm browsing resumes and I see the "worked for myself" thing with hardly any explanation of what they did, I instantly know you have been out of work.

shodown wrote: »

Damned if you do, Damned if you don't.

Can't win for losing

themagicone

Well my idea of offering to work for basically nothing was well received. But he said that the company won't even talk to me due to the fact I'm not 100% done with my degree. I'm 99% there but that isn't good enough I guess. I applied for 5 more today, bringing the total to around 20 this week.

Devilsbane

themagicone wrote: »

Well my idea of offering to work for basically nothing was well received. But he said that the company won't even talk to me due to the fact I'm not 100% done with my degree. I'm 99% there but that isn't good enough I guess. I applied for 5 more today, bringing the total to around 20 this week.

Some companies have this policy, others will wave it. I'm currently working in a job that says it requires a bachelor's degree. It was never even brought up that I didn't have it.

Keep applying and keep trying. Settle for a part time gig at the supermarket or something if you have to.

All of us here are rooting for you.

Bl8ckr0uter

themagicone wrote: »

Well my idea of offering to work for basically nothing was well received. But he said that the company won't even talk to me due to the fact I'm not 100% done with my degree. I'm 99% there but that isn't good enough I guess. I applied for 5 more today, bringing the total to around 20 this week.

That's bullshit. It isn't like you are going to magically (no pun intended) be more l337 after you earn your degree. I am really sorry to hear that.

Did you consider asking them for an internship until your are done with your degree?

jibbajabba

If your alternative to a lie is living on a street, then I don't think there is much to say but you answered your own question whether to lie or not.

I am not sure about the US, but in the UK you have to provide 1-3 references from previous employers so even if you consider "it" coming out and losing your job as a result, it might bite you in the backside with future employer.

Having said all that - what have you got to lose ?

kiki162

I've come across unemployment discrimination like that before, but it wasn't that long of a gap. I know a few people that have their degrees but haven't been able to find work yet (for over a year). Problem with them was they were looking for something similiar like what they had before, and that type of work just isn't available (like working from home - HR stuff). I think at this point it's safe to say that you may have to find a job outside of the IT field, like retail...something where you can AT LEAST get your foot back in the door for a little while. So I agree with Devilsbane on that part.

Being out of work for 3 years due to a medical issue will NOT look good on most resumes. As far as your last job, did you leave because of back surgery, quit..or get fired? If you left, you can just tell a future employer that you left because you wanted to focus on school full time. Most places will get a background check of your employment and not always your schooling so keep that in mind. DO NOT EVER tell them about your back issues. And try not to call or send follow up e-mails sounding like you are desparate, that will always put you on the black list. However you can tell them about any side work that you have done in between that time, make sure you have specifics, and if you have references on that, then that would be good.

As far as lying, you will get caught one way or the other...so dont. One other note you can put in your resume is a summary detailing that you have been working on your degree and finishing that up and looking for a IT position....something along those lines. If your dates of your schooling add up, then that will help you. But if you haven't been going to school for a while, then it probably won't help much. Either way if you get an interview, you can tell them that you are either working on finishing up your degree, or will be once you get hired.