Overachieving?

drkat

I was going through my career history this week; thinking about "where I might have gone wrong" and it dawned on me.....

Whenever I would be hired for a position; whether it be a desktop support or helpdesk position or even my NOC jobs, I would always "over do it" perfect example:

Hired into an IT department 9/2008 - This was considered an entry level position but I already had 4 years exp at the time. My job role was supporting end users via phone with typical desktop/software issues as well as provisioning user accounts etc etc.

Well after I was in the role a few months anything I wasn't familiar with I'd learn like the back of my hand. The inner workings of these systems whether it be scripting, or registry values that are pulled or what-not. Well fast forward 2 years later and another guy in the department ended up as a team lead. He was of average grade but did his job to a T - his numbers were good (stats) and just focused on his job no more and no less.

This always seems to be the case with ALL of my positions. No matter how technical I am or how well I can fix a problem or come up with great fixes or implementations; I'm always passed up for promotions, or I feel as if I'm disliked. I don't know if it's because when I talk I explain things too technical? Do I not play well with others? Do I overlook my position and try to excel and it's frowned upon?

I honestly don't know! Quite frankly I'm sick and tired of it - It's gotten to the point where I don't even wanna be a "techie" any more and just go living my life with an "ignorance is bliss" attitude. It seems to work for all the upper-level IT Management. A lot of my former boss's were either non-tech or just technical enough (20 years ago) to where they "kind of got it" but otherwise didn't care.

Has anyone ran into this type of employee? or perhaps are one yourself? What's a good way of "fixing" this. I always find myself going above and beyond my job description to try to "prove" myself as a knowledgeable tech (I try to be the most knowledgeable in the dept) and it ends up earning me a bad reputation.

Just as a closer for the position reference above:

I ended up on bad terms with my department due to me voicing my opinions. I ended up moving into the NOC and worked there for a year and a half until I moved to my current company as a VoIP guy.

Any ideas?

MrRyte

Hard to say without knowing you or seeing you in the workplace.
That said; have you DIRECTLY asked those above you what exactly you need to do to move upwards?

drkat

I have occasionally yes. That's why I think it all comes down to keeping your nose to the grindstone; versus becoming a "SME" on a topic

Forsaken_GA

drkat wrote: »

I have occasionally yes. That's why I think it all comes down to keeping your nose to the grindstone; versus becoming a "SME" on a topic

Well, you may be running into one of two things -

#1 The Curse of Competence. Are you training other folks to be as good as you? If you can't be replaced, you can't be promoted

#2 Being the IT Jerk. You've got to play the politics game. It doesn't matter how right you are, they will not love you for telling them the truth. How you present things counts for a whole lot, and if you get a reputation for being difficult to work with, that will limit your upward career mobility

drkat

are there any resources for playing the politics games and presenting things appropriately?

CodeBlox

I am sort of experiencing something similar to what you mention in your thread presently. This is my first IT job at a helpdesk and I've only been here 4 months. I have been trying to do the best I can. I wont lie though, I'm not some helpdesk god who knows everything so I do have to consult the leads some times. In return, I get a single failing QA leaving me with a horrible failing average while everyone else gets several passing QAs with an excellent average... Its looking like they waited until I finally "slipped up" to give me that failing score and will not QA me again. With a failing score, my chances of moving up with this company have pretty much been crippled. Despite the fact that they claim it's random, there's just way too many conveniences for me to believe that. I get ignored by some of the leads so it seems too when i come for some help on a tough problem which has really just made me a lot more independent in problem solving. Shame it has to be this way and all I ever tried to do was do my best at this job. My stats are wonderful and I don't escalate calls that should not even get escalated.

MrRyte

If they still don't want to give you a chance to move up at your current company, you may have to move on to someplace that will.

Turgon

Forsaken_GA wrote: »

Well, you may be running into one of two things -

#1 The Curse of Competence. Are you training other folks to be as good as you? If you can't be replaced, you can't be promoted

#2 Being the IT Jerk. You've got to play the politics game. It doesn't matter how right you are, they will not love you for telling them the truth. How you present things counts for a whole lot, and if you get a reputation for being difficult to work with, that will limit your upward career mobility

Forsaken speaks the truth. How you handle yourself counts for a lot as well as technical smarts. I know of one example were a very good AS400 programmer was passed up twice for the Head of Department job. They essentially needed him where he was. All the users and his peers in the IT Department respected him but he really didn't get into enough senior meetings to develop a different profile with the financial and non IT senior management and didn't present well. He ended up leaving to go contracting after 15 years service which was a shame. We also have to be findful of falling into the talk trap. Those of us who know a good deal about technology have a lot to say, but the senior management and commercial people really dont have time or the experience to work with a lot of technical output. Just a fact of business life Im afraid. Techs who are good at communicating up get promoted because their output is *useful*. There are no certifications to help you learn this skill on planet Earth.

drkat

I've definitely noticed this. I may be talking to my boss about a solution for a customer and well it goes in one ear and out the other unless you tie a bow on it. I guess I have a hard time "leaving out the details" and still proving a valid point.

Here's an example which just irritated the living p**s outta me.

We had a customer who was consistently maxing bandwidth - they have a MLPPP with a combined total bandwidth of 3.0mbps

Well they were complaining about voice quality. I looked the qos policy and determined we were dropping ef packets - I verified our settings with global crossing who provides the point to point and they said that our ef queue was lower than what we were sending so we were maxing out our queue and discarding packets. I said OK and had them investigate because our bill showed billing at a higher queue limit.

Well this customer is pretty visible and our president (who i mind you tries to talk all technical) asked me what was going on and I simply advised that we're dropping ef packets and we need to adjust the qos scheme. Well let me tell you this didn't go over well as he started to explain to me how qos "works" which in his mind that we "carved" up bandwidth and that the "priority" queue could never max out.

Now I tried to explain to him that our settings and the provider settings needed to match and we needed to re-engineer what we were tagging and matching so that everything would be in alignment; and that we should utilized our additional queues for other services on the customers lan.

Well that opened up a BIGGER can of worms as they tried telling me I could "carve" up the priority queue (ef) and I quote "simply put each of these services in a different priority" - clearly he has read some text books and is trying to interpret the information without clear knowledge of the subject- I mean that's why he's the business guy and I'm the tech? - but trying to even remotely have these discussions is a chore especially when you're treated as if you dont have the slightest idea.

All in all after a few days of going back and forth with the higher ups I eventually re-engineered a stricter queue and was able to stop the over flows along with some throttling of the customers site replication to conserve bandwidth. All is well now. However this shouldn't have been a CHORE. I somehow feel like I don't get through to people no matter how simplistic or technical I try to relay it to them.

Maybe it comes down to leave me alone and let me do my job lol

stuh84

In my experience, while it can take a few emails, if you are quite vague to begin with to the non-technical people more often than not they don't delve further. A lot of the time they merely are after an update they can feed back to either their higher ups, or to their contact at the customer (a director or an account manager or something like that at the customer).

Obviously if they ask more questions, get more specific, but a lot of the time its a case of telling them what they need to know. Why do they need to know that packets are being dropped because of the QoS scheme? Simply telling them that there seems to be an issue on the link via Global Crossing would be enough.

Also, did you back up what you were saying with examples from say, Ciscos website (if thats what you are using) or merely using your own knowledge? Even if you know it like the back of your hand, it's always best to show clear examples and proof as well.

drkat

I agree but unfortunately in this particular situation just saying there is a "problem" on the link wouldn't have yielded the desired results. We're a small outfit (8 employees including owner) so when something isnt working right he wants to know why.

I'm honestly used to working for companies with 1000+ employees where if I update my manager - HE updates the uppers

NetworkingStudent

drkat wrote: »

I was going through my career history this week; thinking about "where I might have gone wrong" and it dawned on me.....

Whenever I would be hired for a position; whether it be a desktop support or helpdesk position or even my NOC jobs, I would always "over do it" perfect example:

Hired into an IT department 9/2008 - This was considered an entry level position but I already had 4 years exp at the time. My job role was supporting end users via phone with typical desktop/software issues as well as provisioning user accounts etc etc.

Well after I was in the role a few months anything I wasn't familiar with I'd learn like the back of my hand. The inner workings of these systems whether it be scripting, or registry values that are pulled or what-not. Well fast forward 2 years later and another guy in the department ended up as a team lead. He was of average grade but did his job to a T - his numbers were good (stats) and just focused on his job no more and no less.

This always seems to be the case with ALL of my positions. No matter how technical I am or how well I can fix a problem or come up with great fixes or implementations; I'm always passed up for promotions, or I feel as if I'm disliked. I don't know if it's because when I talk I explain things too technical? Do I not play well with others? Do I overlook my position and try to excel and it's frowned upon?

I honestly don't know! Quite frankly I'm sick and tired of it - It's gotten to the point where I don't even wanna be a "techie" any more and just go living my life with an "ignorance is bliss" attitude. It seems to work for all the upper-level IT Management. A lot of my former boss's were either non-tech or just technical enough (20 years ago) to where they "kind of got it" but otherwise didn't care.

Has anyone ran into this type of employee? or perhaps are one yourself? What's a good way of "fixing" this. I always find myself going above and beyond my job description to try to "prove" myself as a knowledgeable tech (I try to be the most knowledgeable in the dept) and it ends up earning me a bad reputation.

Just as a closer for the position reference above:

I ended up on bad terms with my department due to me voicing my opinions. I ended up moving into the NOC and worked there for a year and a half until I moved to my current company as a VoIP guy.

Any ideas?

don’t work in IT yet, but I’m looking for an IT job. However, I can tell you that at my work(print shop) the guys that are on good terms and even friends with management are the ones that get promoted faster. At least this is my experience. I have asked a few operators at my work, how they got promoted, and what it takes, and they did mention that the managers got to like you.
Another thing I have heard before at my work, and other companies. You can train someone to support a technology, or run a machine, but you can’t train a certain personality, or fit. I think managers are going to hire for personality and fit first, rather than technical skills. This is only my opinion though.

simonmoon

drkat wrote: »

Well this customer is pretty visible and our president (who i mind you tries to talk all technical) asked me what was going on and I simply advised that we're dropping ef packets and we need to adjust the qos scheme. Well let me tell you this didn't go over well as he started to explain to me how qos "works" which in his mind that we "carved" up bandwidth and that the "priority" queue could never max out.

Now I tried to explain to him that our settings and the provider settings needed to match and we needed to re-engineer what we were tagging and matching so that everything would be in alignment; and that we should utilized our additional queues for other services on the customers lan.

Well that opened up a BIGGER can of worms as they tried telling me I could "carve" up the priority queue (ef) and I quote "simply put each of these services in a different priority" - clearly he has read some text books and is trying to interpret the information without clear knowledge of the subject- I mean that's why he's the business guy and I'm the tech? - but trying to even remotely have these discussions is a chore especially when you're treated as if you dont have the slightest idea.

You need to learn how to talk to management. Probably also customers.

drkat wrote: »

Maybe it comes down to leave me alone and let me do my job lol

Completely wrong attitude to have. Communicating with human beings is a vital and central part of your job.

TLeTourneau

Have you thought about joining something like Toastmasters? It may help.

drkat

I have not, but I will look into it.

with regard to simonmoon's comments - I've been working with customers over 6 years - never had a problem, it's management rather.

Before anything else - my attitude towards a given job is exactly that... Mine; I believe if you hire someone within a technical position it is not up to the "sales" force to try to tell the tech guy how he does his job or whether or not he's competent when the sales guy has no idea. That doesn't fly with me very well. If I'm working on a project - I can update the management etc - what I don't need is some higher up telling me he knows more about it than I do.

Sure I may have a bit of alpha-geek in me; I know I need to work on my communication.

joehalford01

You definitely don't want to look at it that way; your attitude is an attitude that trips up people in all sorts of professions from restaurant to welder to mechanic. You need to answer their questions without trying to show that you know it like the back of your hand and you need to change your perspective from tech to manager. If you have time, pick up a book on business management, I took a class on it before I ever got into computers and that one class completely changed how I saw things and how I interacted with people. It made a huge difference. It's not about proving you're right, it's about leading people to make the choices you want them to make.

drkat wrote: »

I have not, but I will look into it.

with regard to simonmoon's comments - I've been working with customers over 6 years - never had a problem, it's management rather.

Before anything else - my attitude towards a given job is exactly that... Mine; I believe if you hire someone within a technical position it is not up to the "sales" force to try to tell the tech guy how he does his job or whether or not he's competent when the sales guy has no idea. That doesn't fly with me very well. If I'm working on a project - I can update the management etc - what I don't need is some higher up telling me he knows more about it than I do.

Sure I may have a bit of alpha-geek in me; I know I need to work on my communication.

apr911

From the example you gave with the QOS issue, it sounds like the biggest issue hold you back is trying to point out where management is wrong and getting into a **** match. You need to pick and choose your battles.

Here are a few things that I have found that works for me (I have been promoted multiple times despite both good and bad relationships with my managers and having told several of my managers on multiple occasions point-blank that something was unacceptable to me)

1. Start general, explain the problem in overview "We're dropping packets on our uplink" and explain what you're doing to correct it "but I am working with the ISP to fix the problem" for most, this is enough as they are only looking to find out what you're doing to fix it. If its not be prepared with a more in-depth response.

2. When you give the detailed explanation, dont take responsibility for the issue. Let it be an issue with the ISP (They arent matching our queue size) or some other entity, even an act of god. If you accept responsibility be prepared for the "I-know-more-than-you response" whereby the manager tries to explain why it should work (as in your example) and its not the companies fault. Remember, when you accept responsibility you are accepting responsibility for the entirety of the company which usually means cost expenditures to fix and maybe credit memos to customers (both of which may still occur anyway but at least its not the companies fault, image matters).

3. Provide a generalized solution but avoid terms like reconfigure or re-engineer. "I am working with the ISP to ensure our configurations match." If pressed for more detail, you can correctly state you dont have all the information but it looks like a configuration mismatch is causing packets to be dropped. Try to lead them in the direction you want - "we may need to make some configuration changes on our end to make it all work but Ill let you know after Ive talked things out with the ISP."

4. If you get the "I-know-more-than-you" response, listen to the manager's response. Dont interrupt.

5. When the manager is finished, choose your angle of attack. You can:

a. Nod your head appropriately and tell them you're on top of it. Then go off, ignore everything the manager just said and fix it the right way
b. Regeneralize the problem. Dont go into further detail or explain how the manager is wrong (the manager isnt wrong, even if what they just said makes absolutely no sense whatsoever), instead regeneralize the problem into a way that makes it so their response doesnt apply. Again, dont accept responsibility.
c. Dig in and prepare to fight it out, getting into a **** match as you did <-- Not Recommended, you are likely to waste your time and breath on an argument you are unlikely to win and even more unlikely to win any favors from (even if by some chance you do win
d. Put it in your manager's lap "you clearly know more about this situation than me, the person you hired to do this job. Id like to watch how you fix this so I know how in the future" <- Caution with this one. I have had great success with this in the past but it requires balls of steel and a willingness to quite possibly find yourself out on the street. Also, you better be sure you're right.

6. If you need management approval for changes, again dont accept responsibility. "So I worked out the issue with our ISP and we need to make changes XYZ which need your approval"

Nobody likes a show-off, no manager likes to hear they're wrong from an underling (just as much as IT People dont want to hear their wrong from a non-tech or even fellow tech for that matter), no company wants to hear its their fault or that the system they've have in place is in someway lacking.

Bottom line is you want to avoid going deeper and deeper into the rabbit hole. Keep trying to regeneralize and keep the situation broad. Details tend to hurt your argument more than they help. Avoid blame and how the company or manager is somehow wrong or at fault.

Turgon

apr911 wrote: »

From the example you gave with the QOS issue, it sounds like the biggest issue hold you back is trying to point out where management is wrong and getting into a **** match. You need to pick and choose your battles.

Here are a few things that I have found that works for me (I have been promoted multiple times despite both good and bad relationships with my managers and having told several of my managers on multiple occasions point-blank that something was unacceptable to me)

1. Start general, explain the problem in overview "We're dropping packets on our uplink" and explain what you're doing to correct it "but I am working with the ISP to fix the problem" for most, this is enough as they are only looking to find out what you're doing to fix it. If its not be prepared with a more in-depth response.

2. When you give the detailed explanation, dont take responsibility for the issue. Let it be an issue with the ISP (They arent matching our queue size) or some other entity, even an act of god. If you accept responsibility be prepared for the "I-know-more-than-you response" whereby the manager tries to explain why it should work (as in your example) and its not the companies fault. Remember, when you accept responsibility you are accepting responsibility for the entirety of the company which usually means cost expenditures to fix and maybe credit memos to customers (both of which may still occur anyway but at least its not the companies fault, image matters).

3. Provide a generalized solution but avoid terms like reconfigure or re-engineer. "I am working with the ISP to ensure our configurations match." If pressed for more detail, you can correctly state you dont have all the information but it looks like a configuration mismatch is causing packets to be dropped. Try to lead them in the direction you want - "we may need to make some configuration changes on our end to make it all work but Ill let you know after Ive talked things out with the ISP."

4. If you get the "I-know-more-than-you" response, listen to the manager's response. Dont interrupt.

5. When the manager is finished, choose your angle of attack. You can:

a. Nod your head appropriately and tell them you're on top of it. Then go off, ignore everything the manager just said and fix it the right way
b. Regeneralize the problem. Dont go into further detail or explain how the manager is wrong (the manager isnt wrong, even if what they just said makes absolutely no sense whatsoever), instead regeneralize the problem into a way that makes it so their response doesnt apply. Again, dont accept responsibility.
c. Dig in and prepare to fight it out, getting into a **** match as you did <-- Not Recommended, you are likely to waste your time and breath on an argument you are unlikely to win and even more unlikely to win any favors from (even if by some chance you do win
d. Put it in your manager's lap "you clearly know more about this situation than me, the person you hired to do this job. Id like to watch how you fix this so I know how in the future" <- Caution with this one. I have had great success with this in the past but it requires balls of steel and a willingness to quite possibly find yourself out on the street. Also, you better be sure you're right.

6. If you need management approval for changes, again dont accept responsibility. "So I worked out the issue with our ISP and we need to make changes XYZ which need your approval"

Nobody likes a show-off, no manager likes to hear they're wrong from an underling (just as much as IT People dont want to hear their wrong from a non-tech or even fellow tech for that matter), no company wants to hear its their fault or that the system they've have in place is in someway lacking.

Bottom line is you want to avoid going deeper and deeper into the rabbit hole. Keep trying to regeneralize and keep the situation broad. Details tend to hurt your argument more than they help. Avoid blame and how the company or manager is somehow wrong or at fault.

Some sound advice there and not learned at college or through certifications.

astrogeek

drkat wrote: »

Sure I may have a bit of alpha-geek in me; I know I need to work on my communication.

I don't think it's your communication skills that need work, but more your attitude. As long as you hold onto a negative attitude with management it doesn't matter how you talk to them, your attitude will shine through and they aren't going to promote you.

The job of management isn't to be a technical expert, it's managing people. You shouldn't resent them just because their job is different than yours. Managing people is an entirely different beast than what you're used to, even if you were the ultimate tech expert that doesn't mean you could do their job better than they can.

The best thing you can do is put yourself in their shoes, try to understand their concerns. The more you realize how stressful their position is maybe you will resent them less and have a more respectful attitude towards their difficult job role. A lot of people like to sit back and talk about how lazy management is and how they don't know anything, etc., etc. Well the truth is it really isn't easy and they really aren't going to respect, (or promote), anyone who believes it is.

With that said it's usually best to avoid management as much as possible. If you can deal directly with your boss and let him pass anything further up the chain that's best, but in small companies like yours that may not be possible.

gorebrush

Forsaken_GA wrote: »

Well, you may be running into one of two things -

#2 Being the IT Jerk. You've got to play the politics game. It doesn't matter how right you are, they will not love you for telling them the truth. How you present things counts for a whole lot, and if you get a reputation for being difficult to work with, that will limit your upward career mobility

I learned this one VERY quickly. I suggest anyone else do the same, otherwise you won't be going anywhere.

DevilWAH

One thing I have learnt from taking a managers role, and taking on service managment responsibilities, is just how much depth there are in these areas.

And just like if i tell a mamber of my staff to follow a process for a customer, I would not expect to go though every detail of the contract and company finances to expalin why it is nessusary to follow it. Not becasue they can't understand, or don't want to, but becasue it has taken my months to get familuar with the ideas and unfortuantly there is not time for every one to do the same. They have to trust what I am asking, and i must be reay to answer questions if they have them.

The same is true talking to managers, you give an over view, high level, no experince needed from them.This X isn't working/ is an issue. This is what problems it casuing, Finincial or buisness inpacts. Would you like to hear my suggestion to resolve it?

Yes/No.

Always relate issues to the buisness, not to technology. If you go to a boss saying "doing this will give a 10% better proformance" that means nothing. The first question they will want answered is do we care about a 10% hit, is it affecting our buisness?? no point in giveing a outpouring of "What" you are going to do, unless you first get the go ahead to do it.

If you want to move on, not only must you be tecnicaly skilled, but you have to be able to relate your skills to the buisness, and present suggestions to the buisness that put your skills in demand.

My favriot way to get my foot in the door with stuff at my lat place was presenting the buisness case and issue alone, getting the managers to buy in to the fact there was a problem, or we did want to look in to a new area. Once I had there attention and backing, I would "just happen" to have the solution worked out and ready to go after they had had a quick review.

Remember you know your systems much better than any one else, and jsut like if I came and fired of with some issue with coustomer X, at site Y, network B..... I am sure you would quickly get lost, and frustrated.


Its a bit like an old dangrous substance notice to describe a common stubance....

1. it can cause excessive sweating and vomiting
2. it is a major component in acid rain
3. it can cause severe burns in its gaseous state
4. accidental inhalation can kill you
5. it contributes to erosion
6. it decreases effectiveness of automobile brakes
7. it has been found in tumors of terminal cancer patients

Presented like this requires some thought,

Simple describing it as water makes every thing much clearer.

Its all about knowing who you are talking to, waht is there skill level, what is there day to day experince, and matching you aproach appropratly. My current manager is a Microsoft wizard, but knows sod all about networks. So I have to baby feed it to him, but we both know that the other way round its me that needs the spoonfeeding.

Its just like my dad taught me, start of polite to every one you meet, and work down to there level.

Start of at the highest level, and work down as far as they want. Jsut because you know all the answers, dosn't mean any one needs to hear them. Make them ask, they will like it as it makes them feel like they are driving the discussion. and be prepared to make compromisies.

drkat

Thanks guys for the honest responses. I definitely need to work on my attitude and my offerings. I will take this advice and see how it works out.

WillTech105

Amazon.com: How to Win Friends & Influence People (9780671723651): Dale Carnegie: Books

Something I was never taught in college or HS was people skills. People skills and relationships is ESSENTIAL no matter what field you are in.

My boss keeps toting that he got in IT so he wouldnt have to deal with people. Alas, no matter what job you have, your going to deal with some people, and in order to get ahead you need people skills.

I ditto everyones posting here, but if I can add anything else, I'd say pick up the book - "how to win friends and influence people".

Turgon

drkat wrote: »

Thanks guys for the honest responses. I definitely need to work on my attitude and my offerings. I will take this advice and see how it works out.

Engineers make the world work. Managers run it. Remember that and you will be fine.

MrRyte

WillTech105 wrote: »

My boss keeps toting that he got in IT so he wouldnt have to deal with people.

Yet he's a supervisor. Hmmm......

WillTech105

MrRyte wrote: »

Yet he's a supervisor. Hmmm......

Haha -- he likes US (2 people in our deparment, network engineer and systems admin) but hates everyone else. Go figure

KrisA

I have to say this concept is foreign to me. I can't recall every really being micro-managed at any point.

Maybe it comes down to leave me alone and let me do my job lol

That is how I have looked at the situation. Now there was a 10 Thing Bad Bosses Say can't remember where, but one of them was " Don't bring me problems, bring me solutions".. The best manager I ever had said this all time, he was also fond of saying "That's what I hired you for".. He would support you and give you everything within his power even going to bat with Higher Ups. He was confident in our (the 9 "Help-Desk" employees below him) abilities to get things done. At the same time he was on our level, he was doing Desk-side support at his location.

drkat

Yeah I always enjoyed having a technical boss. I'm constantly looking for new work honestly

Forsaken_GA

drkat wrote: »

Well this customer is pretty visible and our president (who i mind you tries to talk all technical) asked me what was going on and I simply advised that we're dropping ef packets and we need to adjust the qos scheme. Well let me tell you this didn't go over well as he started to explain to me how qos "works" which in his mind that we "carved" up bandwidth and that the "priority" queue could never max out.

I'm sure this has already been addressed, but I'll give my take on this situation. I would have said that there was a mismatch between us and the provider, and that I was sorting it out. That tells the boss that A) I've identified the problem I'm handling it, which is usually a sign they don't need to get involved. Most of the time, the boss will tell you to carry on, or hurry up, or something equally harmless and innocuous (all depends on how severe the problem is) and go on their way. If they want more detail, they'll ask for it, and that's when it's ok to get technical. You may still have ended up in a debate over how the technology works, but it may have been a bit more cordial.

However, if any result would have brought you to the point where the boss is telling you how it is (whether it is or not), don't argue with him/her. Do what they say, even if you know it's wrong. If they stick around and their solution doesn't work, don't approach anything like 'I told you so' word choice. Instead, ask them if they mind if you try something you had in mind to see if it'll help (ie, the right answer). It may seem silly to ask for permission to do what you hired to do, but it tends to go over well, and diffuses any tension in the situation, because you're very visibly conceding that they have the authority, which makes them less likely to get their hackles up. Everyone always talks about managing people from the bosses perspective, it takes most folks awhile to figure out that they have to manage their boss too.

If they tell you to do it their way, and then walk away.... just fix the damn problem. If you get it right, they probably aren't going to follow up on it, and even if they do, they're not likely to dress you down for fixing the problem, even if it wasn't quite their way. For bonus points, next time you see the boss, sincerely thank them for their advice, whether it was helpful or no.

One of the best ways to gain power and influence is the appearance of giving it up. If people don't feel threatened by you, they don't keep their guard up quite as much.

If you want to learn how to screw with peoples minds, go pick up a copy of Machiavelli's The Prince. If you'd rather be a kinder, gentler player, pick up Carnegie's How to win friend and influence people.

I personally recommend reading both, as different situations call for different responses. I'd also recommend tossing Sun Tzu's the Art of War in as well, it's useful on any battlefield, whether it be the hills of ancient china, or the halls of corporate america.

pham0329

^^ What he said. I've worked with techs who likes to show up their boss, especially in emails (I don't know why) and it never goes over well. Whether I'm communicating with the user or my superior, I always try to word it so that I'm not pointing fingers or placing the blame on them. For example, rather than saying "you configured this wrong", I'll say something like "we probably misconfigured it"

On a side note, Forsaken, how do you know about all these different books and how do you have time to read them all??

Forsaken_GA

pham0329 wrote: »

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On a side note, Forsaken, how do you know about all these different books and how do you have time to read them all??

I've been reading almost my entire life. During 1st grade, my teacher had to take my books away, because I was getting too far ahead of the class. At 12 years old, I was a fixture in my local library, and people started coming to me for help finding books instead of the librarians. It helps that I'm a speed reader, but I pay attention to recommendations from others, and if I see a book that I think might interest me, I'll read it.